In that case ashton (and you should get paid imo) I'll just disagree with you. If Eldrazi deserve to see play still, so does Twin. Its no less warping, and many would say its more so.
"If Twin is not safe then the format is busted" seems fallacious to me. Again, I have never heard of a deck having such a devout following that two years after it gets nuked there is still this vocal minority who seems to think Modern's health, enjoyment and future rest on an infinite combo entering the format.
Thats fine, we are all entitled to our opinions.
I dont think getting Twin back, matters as much as getting rid of Eldrazi, however Twin's banning was always under false pretense. Wizards knows this.
~Eldrazi Tron is the most played deck, it's just being hated out to not make results
~Jeskai is a bad deck, but so many people are playing it, that's why it's seeing results
Which one is it guys?
Eldrazi Tron barely saw top 32 this Open
We had an INTERACTIVE mirror in the last Open featuring two Jeskai Geist decks (with no ETron in the top 8)
We had Grixis Shadow and Storm in the finals before that one, again, No Etron in the top 8
The triple GP saw a ton of Eldrazi players, but again, no ETron in the top 8. We had a ton of Titanshift to hate the deck out
So, where's your factual basis on the Etron, guys? The deck isn't skinny on results, but it's nowhere near as dominant as you're all claiming. In fact, Storm and Grixis Shadow have been doing better. Grixis Shadow hasn't not seen any top 8 in nearly every paper tournament of 2017.
Ktkenshin seemed to allude storm could see a ban before the pro-tour, which I could see, WOTC despises the Storm mechanic. I'm not really sure what the two decks he alluded to skirting the rules.
I'm looking on mttgoldfish and it's modern meta
The diversity and numbers look fantastic; just a minority of disgruntled players in this thread, from my perspective.
Its not about the decks in isolation. Its the environment those decks form. Eldrazi, more than any deck before it, deserved to be nuked from orbit. Forsythe was wrong about its 'interesting lines of play', comically so. There is nothing that it does that is interesting.
Its just a terrible deck, and makes for a meta that either prey's on it, or loses to it.
I'm not saying its too good. I'm saying its (in my very publicly open and biased opinion) a terrible deck to have around at any level of success.
It's been like this for months idSurge. I think some people really expected some of those mediocre tier 2 decks that popped up here and there to be something more than mediocre tier 2 decks.
Which brings us to the crux of the question, how to fix this? Assuming bans are a possibility (they might not):
- You 100% can't touch GDS, that would make Storm crush the format
- You can't really touch Storm, which is what keeps Titanshift down, mostly
- You can't touch Affinity, which keeps E-Tron and possibly Titanshift down
- You can't touch Titanshift, which keeps E Tron down (citation needed)
- You can't touch E Tron, which... well I don't know what E Tron does right now
So you know where this is going.
I know, thats why my time here has dropped considerably, and I havent played even on MTGO in...a long time.
You ban Temple, and you unban Twin.
Thats what you start with.
If people like this over a Twin/Jund meta, then we simply agree to disagree, because any meta with ETron, or even Tron, as a Tier 1 deck is disgusting to me.
You have to attribute Grixis Death invalidating midrange decks, too.
On a personal note, E-Tron doesn't motivate me to play Junk, I can't justify playing a midrange deck that feels significantly weaker, outside of mixing things up for funs sake.
Sure, but it doesnt feel nearly as stupid as ETron.
If they dont ban Temple, or unban Twin, nothing changes. The format is stuck with a broken ass deck that pushes out any other midrange strat, and the decks that rotate around it.
Yep, there will always be complaining, the day there isnt is the day the format has gone belly up. Any attempts at figuring out a way to have a better format in this thread are just a waste of keystrokes as there will never be agreement.
We can all keep on stating our opinions, but its pointless, it really is.
I will say this. If you think this Tier 1 (ETron, GDS, Affinity, Storm, Titanshift) is deeper, and more engaging than the old Tier 1 of Jund, Twin, Affinity, Burn, and Junk, well I dont know what to say other than, no way.
I'll be back with the next ban (unban hah!) announcement or the next set...
Storm is a symptom, not the disease itself. The problem is we are given incentive to play past each other again, instead of against each other. Everyone has their own level of tolerance about interaction, decks that solitare, big mana, whatever.
Storm is not the issue though, neither is Titanshift.
People dont like it when interactive decks rule the house.
Other people dont like it when non-interactive decks rule the house.
What is better game play, is down to the individual.
This threads outlived its value, when we dont even have true metrics anymore. Tier's are whatever is going on in your local shop + Etron and the best non-interactive decks.
"OH NOS I CANNOT TAP OUT ON TURN 3?!"
The horror.
Spirits
Spirits
Twin was a good deck. Its pretty simple. I wont be feeding you clicks today ashton.
Twin has no reason to be on the banned list, and the format is making a mockery of itself with it on there.
Spirits
Spirits
Spirits
Thats fine, we are all entitled to our opinions.
I dont think getting Twin back, matters as much as getting rid of Eldrazi, however Twin's banning was always under false pretense. Wizards knows this.
Spirits
Its not about the decks in isolation. Its the environment those decks form. Eldrazi, more than any deck before it, deserved to be nuked from orbit. Forsythe was wrong about its 'interesting lines of play', comically so. There is nothing that it does that is interesting.
Its just a terrible deck, and makes for a meta that either prey's on it, or loses to it.
I'm not saying its too good. I'm saying its (in my very publicly open and biased opinion) a terrible deck to have around at any level of success.
Spirits
Spirits
I know, thats why my time here has dropped considerably, and I havent played even on MTGO in...a long time.
You ban Temple, and you unban Twin.
Thats what you start with.
If people like this over a Twin/Jund meta, then we simply agree to disagree, because any meta with ETron, or even Tron, as a Tier 1 deck is disgusting to me.
100% biased, but at least I'm honest.
Spirits
Thats Modern, you play ETron, or the decks that beat ETron.
If not for some bans/unbans on Monday, its time for me to pack up or sell, or both. This tier 1 is zzz.
Spirits
Sure, but it doesnt feel nearly as stupid as ETron.
Spirits
Spirits
We can all keep on stating our opinions, but its pointless, it really is.
I will say this. If you think this Tier 1 (ETron, GDS, Affinity, Storm, Titanshift) is deeper, and more engaging than the old Tier 1 of Jund, Twin, Affinity, Burn, and Junk, well I dont know what to say other than, no way.
I'll be back with the next ban (unban hah!) announcement or the next set...
Spirits
Storm is not the issue though, neither is Titanshift.
People dont like it when interactive decks rule the house.
Other people dont like it when non-interactive decks rule the house.
What is better game play, is down to the individual.
This threads outlived its value, when we dont even have true metrics anymore. Tier's are whatever is going on in your local shop + Etron and the best non-interactive decks.
/done
Spirits
Spirits