There are a couple of bits I’m tossing up, although I don’t have a huge pile of money to throw at anything right now. I’m tossing up Deep Forest Hermit (9 mana for 3GG is decent), and depending on price come release Yawgmoth, Thran Physician possibly. Not sure if Yawg is perfect here, but I'd like a copy nonetheless and it's worth seeing how it plays out. I hadn’t really looked at Scrapyard Recombiner but it’s not at all bad.
Reliquary Tower is a funny one. It’s easy enough to drop in, but you don’t often realize how rarely it’s actually relevant. I definitely support reluctant usage of it.
The feedback did give me some food for thought. I’m going to try a Salvaging Station package again and see how it goes. I think the issue previously was having so few eggs that actually cantripped meant the engine sort of just didn’t pick up momentum. Add in the fact that most of them only ramped to my hand and it made for a slow engine indeed. I'll try with more spellbombs and such and see how it plays out.
The other area I’m looking at that came up as a suggestion is Protean Hulk. I’d run it as a value add, but even without combo it’s a solid add. With Pod in play it’d be great to sac it for some board presence and chain End-Raze Forerunners in to swing for impact. If I do add this it’d be good to add a few value ETB adds like Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Phyrexian Delver and the aforementioned Deep Forest Hermit. I’ve also got a couple of good stuff adds I’ve been considering like Eldritch Evolution and Diabolic Intent.
Having said all of this there’s only so much room in the deck so again I find myself in the position of not knowing where to make cuts. If you’ve any suggestions I’d be glad to hear them.
Oh! Also, I got to try out Massacre Girl over the weekend. She’s devastating in terms of clearing house. Really solid board wipe if you can drop her into the right place.
Oh yeah, Survival is no doubt a more solid pick than Arkbow. Arkbow seems like it'd fit well in something like Selvala Brostorm, where you can sink a LOT of mana reliably and hit straight up monsters turn by turn. While there's a high creature count here, it's better served by Birthing Pod for specificity.
In terms of other considerations at present, I picked up a copy of Finale of Eternity the other day. I think it could fit well in here, but I honestly can't find a good cut for it. Aside from that, found a copy of Bojuka Bog in my collection, so that was an easy swap in for a basic swamp.
I actually didn’t pick up a copy yet, if at all. I see it less as a mana sink and more as an accelerator/graveyard filler personally, but mostly my updates were dependent on pulls. My wife likes to get a box rather singles - I know it’s not as reliable as singles, but it is more fun, and I like to keep her engaged in the game. So yeah, Arkbow just didn’t come up. That being said, I get how it’d be a little conditional. There’s bound to be like an upper limit to its reliability, and an optimal number of mana to throw at it before you see diminishing returns. Maybe I’ll see playtest it online before I pick up a copy and see how it plays out. I suspect I won’t ever have the mana floating to make it do what it’s designed to do, but I guess I’ll find out one way or another.
I was stoked to pick up Blast Zone and Massacre Girl, they'll both do just fine here. Seedborn Muse was easy enough to pull - great card, but she fits better in another deck than here. Golden Guardian never really got off the ground, and Dictate of Erebos is one of those cards that sits in your hand not being cast. Without going all in on attrition and adding Grave Pact and a ton of sacrifice outlets I can leave it and still do just fine. Ulvenwald Tracker has been a little lackluster too, so it was an easy swap to track down Hangarback Walker for a slot. Walking Ballista would've been nice too, but that thing is not cheap these days. Deathsprout I like as a tempo/control add. It can do either/or/both, so there's a reasonable amount of utility there.
I've still got a few new cards to pick up, and at least one or two will see consideration here; Finale of Devastation and Finale of Eternity are both cards that could see a slot here, and I've got a copy of Command the Dreadhorde on the way too - I don't think it'll see play here, but it's a toss up.
I like both. My wife wanted to buy a box - it's more fun than singles, albeit a much more expensive and risky way to try to acquire the cards you want. However, it's nice to share a hobby regardless.
I like both. Massacre Girl is going to kill all of the things. I think it'd be a solid add here. Finale of Devastation I'm torn about. Not because it's not awesome, it clearly is. I just want to windmill slam it into both this deck and my Nissa build, so it'll be a toss up. I also like Vivien's Arkbow here. It's not perfect, but it does a couple of things this deck wants to do - vomit creatures onto the board and fill the yard. It's a good early drop, and could do decent things. Deathsprout is nice too - weird mix of effects, but at instant speed and those two specific things on it, it's really good value.
God-Eternal Bontu could be good too. It's a bit of a weird card, in that it's going to need a really specific build to be good. It could fit here, I'm not overly sure. Walker wise, if I happen to pull Liliana, Dreadhorde General it almost certainly gets in here.
Things got a little messy with my playtesting of Glissa. I had a few bits and pieces picked up from my LGS over the weekend, and resolved to take the deck apart, do an overhaul and focus down on something that doesn't wander off the path so much. With that in mind I've rewritten the original post, and the decklist is now as follows:
I tried to make sure my Pod curve was on point, likewise with Trawler. There's a small sacrifice subtheme, and a small amount of reanimation. I didn't want to go too deep on either of these as they're not entirely relevant to Glissa, but supplements to keep things rolling.
Have yet to playtest in current iteration, but fingers crossed it'll do nice things.
I tossed up heavily adding Nim Deathmantle and Ashnod's Altar, as well as Tooth and Nail - at the end of it, I decided against these. In the first case they're too far down the combo line, and in the latter because there's no immediately obvious tutor choices from an entwined cast. I'd be happy to be convinced otherwise, or see feedback on the list otherwise.
So, it's been a little while since I updated the list here, but I've been busy playtesting in the meantime. As well as this, I've taken apart a Ghave, Guru of Spores. There isn't a whole lot that becomes available for here, but there are some juicy bits that have been in rotation.
On top of these, Filigree Familiar is back in, and so is Krosan Grip. I'm trying without Decree of Pain and Smokestack for these. I'm looking to cement all of these changes for better or worse over the next week or so, it's just hard to play test this much at once.
Ghave also freed up a copy of Tooth and Nail and Ghoulcaller Gisa. T&N could be strong here, but I'm not 100% sure. There's no insta-win in the deck for it to abuse, and if there were I wouldn't even consider it. Gisa could be ok, I think I'd prefer her elsewhere though.
I just can't really cut Krosan Grip it's saved me so many times, it is basically the problem solver in commander.
Lighthouse is a meta thing, I have very low mana requirements so my deck is loaded with utility lands but if you are playing obliterator...
I often get plinked to death from a lot of life loss over the course of a game from random attacks and AoE damage and self-inflicted from black card draw I just find myself in lethal range randomly so I just want some life gain from somewhere Familiar does that but if you have something like Vampire Nighthawk or other lifelinkers.
The disk is a classic but yeah it's super annoying, being low cost is nice though.
Arcane Lighthouse has literally done nothing for me other than produce 1.
I find myself in the same boat with DoT, my life total does slip away incrementally. Filigree Familiar was another hard cut, and I think it will maybe make a return. I was hesitant to add Phyrexian Reclamation for the same reason in terms of life loss, but I need some sort of non-artifact recursion. I had thought of adding something like Blood Artist or Zulaport Cutthroat to compensate for life loss, but I really didn't think it would be a good fit. I guess there's Whip of Erebos to hit both requirements? I don't really like that reanimation clause though, there is no way around the exile. Or I could run Sangromancer I guess.
Yeah, disk and stone are tough in the list. Stone takes a ton of mana, but I can manage that somewhat.
Wave of Vitriol seems counterintuitive. It'll either do really well as a finisher or really poorly. I guess the idea is to make a huge impact with Disciple of the Vault, Marionette Master and Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest. It will either work or it won't, no harm done if playtests go poorly; it's easy enough to swap the disk back in.
The lands are an obvious upgrade from random utility to solid adds. I added Deathreap Ritual back in and Phyrexian Reclamation for consistency - I've found running with an early Pod keeping a reasonable board presence is difficult. Nevinyrral's Disk entering tapped is a little problematic, so Wave of Vitriol is a reasonable substitute. It's been devastating in my Nissa build, and it pairs tremendously with Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest. It should be a pretty solid add. Mind Stone comes in as a decent ramp/draw option that gives me a little curve with which to bring stuff back with Scrap Trawler.
Have you considered Animation Module? It plays nice with Mazirek and Marionette Master. Another thing I found is that you might want to change one of your 1 mana ramp artifacts to something with a higher CC (like mind stone), just to make it easier to recur those sweet 1 CC artifacts (because you lack 0 CC artifacts, Hangarback is really nice!).
And yes, I know Animation Module is 1 CC so my suggestions are countering each other
I hadn't considered it, but now that you mention it, Animation Module is not a bad choice by any stretch. I used to run it in Ghave, Guru of Spores to good effect. Also plays nicely with Verdurous Gearhulk. I'd been looking at easy ways to get a ton of artifact tokens in play to make good use of Marionetter Master and Disciple of the Vault. Had been looking at Genesis Chamber. This could do pretty decent as well. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try to track one down.
And yes, my Scrap Trawler curve does need some work. I'd looked at Hangarback Walker - still looking at it - I'm just a little hesitant because I don't have a ton of ways of making big mana. I guess it doesn't need to be enormous. As far as 2 drops go, Mind Stone would be a decent add I guess. Thaumatic Compass could do well, too.
In addition, added End-Raze Forerunners into the build, removing Deathreap Ritual...hesitantly. I've got great draw options here, but this one did do well. The list is sort of at the point where any further changes I don't know which pieces deserve to stay more than others. That's probably a good sign, but it does make refining the list difficult.
Ah, you're right. Whoops. To be fair, both players were pretty close to sweeping anyway.
It does bring up the point that it'd be good to have some sac outlets in here to prevent this happening. I could probably dig up a Carrion Feeder, Viscera Seer or a Claws of Gix. I've been thinking about adding Claws as a way to get rid of permanents that could turn on me anyway - Phyrexian Arena, Necropotence, Smokestack and such, and it'd be nice to have another 1-drop in the chain.
Craterhoof Behemoth I probably don't have the money for at the moment, so the end of my chain is definitely more disruptive than anything in terms of leveraging ETB effects. I guess there's options for the end of the chain that aren't THAT expensive - Razaketh, the Foulblooded could be a decent finisher (and sac outlet), Pestilence Demon could help with Glissa triggers, Stonehoof Chieftain could be cool, or if I wanna get really griefy there's Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger - I probably wouldn't get that mean though.
A little after this (I think it might have been somewhere around turn 10 or 12) both opponents swept. They were both having trouble with drawing into answers, and I had a full grip with Sheoldred, Whispering One, Beast Within, Decree of Pain and a couple of other decent tricks. I guess it was a bit of a goldfish, but it's nice to know I've got some good synergy going.
I've been trying out a couple of other changes in the last week or so, too:
So far, so good with these changes - there seems a bit more consistency in the deck and it has plans to aim for; I can land genuine threats, I don't have to contend in combat to make Glissa's triggers work, and if I need to swing with her I can make her bigger. I was a bit hesitant to add Smokestack, but I guess it's as griefy as you let it be. I had it in hand last game and didn't play it. Likewise with Jester's Cap - card is great for neutering combo decks - I'd like to think it might come back at some point. Otherwise, pretty happy with how it's looking.
Reliquary Tower is a funny one. It’s easy enough to drop in, but you don’t often realize how rarely it’s actually relevant. I definitely support reluctant usage of it.
The feedback did give me some food for thought. I’m going to try a Salvaging Station package again and see how it goes. I think the issue previously was having so few eggs that actually cantripped meant the engine sort of just didn’t pick up momentum. Add in the fact that most of them only ramped to my hand and it made for a slow engine indeed. I'll try with more spellbombs and such and see how it plays out.
The other area I’m looking at that came up as a suggestion is Protean Hulk. I’d run it as a value add, but even without combo it’s a solid add. With Pod in play it’d be great to sac it for some board presence and chain End-Raze Forerunners in to swing for impact. If I do add this it’d be good to add a few value ETB adds like Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Phyrexian Delver and the aforementioned Deep Forest Hermit. I’ve also got a couple of good stuff adds I’ve been considering like Eldritch Evolution and Diabolic Intent.
Having said all of this there’s only so much room in the deck so again I find myself in the position of not knowing where to make cuts. If you’ve any suggestions I’d be glad to hear them.
Oh! Also, I got to try out Massacre Girl over the weekend. She’s devastating in terms of clearing house. Really solid board wipe if you can drop her into the right place.
In:
Grave Titan
Ashnod's Altar
Out:
Executioner's Capsule
Expedition Map
In terms of other considerations at present, I picked up a copy of Finale of Eternity the other day. I think it could fit well in here, but I honestly can't find a good cut for it. Aside from that, found a copy of Bojuka Bog in my collection, so that was an easy swap in for a basic swamp.
In:
Blast Zone
Hangarback Walker
Mimic Vat
Deathsprout
Massacre Girl
Out:
Llanowar Wastes
Ulvenwald Tracker
Golden Guardian
Dictate of Erebos
Seedborn Muse
I was stoked to pick up Blast Zone and Massacre Girl, they'll both do just fine here. Seedborn Muse was easy enough to pull - great card, but she fits better in another deck than here. Golden Guardian never really got off the ground, and Dictate of Erebos is one of those cards that sits in your hand not being cast. Without going all in on attrition and adding Grave Pact and a ton of sacrifice outlets I can leave it and still do just fine. Ulvenwald Tracker has been a little lackluster too, so it was an easy swap to track down Hangarback Walker for a slot. Walking Ballista would've been nice too, but that thing is not cheap these days. Deathsprout I like as a tempo/control add. It can do either/or/both, so there's a reasonable amount of utility there.
I've still got a few new cards to pick up, and at least one or two will see consideration here; Finale of Devastation and Finale of Eternity are both cards that could see a slot here, and I've got a copy of Command the Dreadhorde on the way too - I don't think it'll see play here, but it's a toss up.
I like both. Massacre Girl is going to kill all of the things. I think it'd be a solid add here. Finale of Devastation I'm torn about. Not because it's not awesome, it clearly is. I just want to windmill slam it into both this deck and my Nissa build, so it'll be a toss up. I also like Vivien's Arkbow here. It's not perfect, but it does a couple of things this deck wants to do - vomit creatures onto the board and fill the yard. It's a good early drop, and could do decent things. Deathsprout is nice too - weird mix of effects, but at instant speed and those two specific things on it, it's really good value.
God-Eternal Bontu could be good too. It's a bit of a weird card, in that it's going to need a really specific build to be good. It could fit here, I'm not overly sure. Walker wise, if I happen to pull Liliana, Dreadhorde General it almost certainly gets in here.
3 Glissa, the Traitor
Creatures
1 Deathrite Shaman
1 Ulvenwald Tracker
2 Myr Retriever
2 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eternal Witness
3 Filigree Familiar
3 Fleshbag Marauder
3 Scarecrone
3 Scrap Trawler
3 Sylvok Replica
3 Wood Elves
4 Golden Guardian
4 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
4 Phyrexian Obliterator
4 Pitiless Plunderer
4 Ravenous Chupacabra
4 Solemn Simulacrum
5 Lord of Extinction
5 Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest
5 Seedborn Muse
5 Sidisi, Undead Vizier
5 Verdurous Gearhulk
6 Duplicant
6 Marionette Master
6 Noxious Gearhulk
6 Wurmcoil Engine
7 Myr Battlesphere
7 Rune-Scarred Demon
7 Sheoldred, Whispering One
8 End-Raze Forerunners
8 Terastodon
8 Woodfall Primus
3 Beast Within
3 Krosan Grip
Sorceries
2 Torment of Hailfire
3 Maelstrom Pulse
5 Living Death
7 All is Dust
Artifacts
1 Executioner's Capsule
1 Expedition Map
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Skullclamp
1 Sol Ring
2 Fellwar Stone
2 Lightning Greaves
2 Mind Stone
2 Swiftfoot Boots
3 Oblivion Stone
4 Birthing Pod
4 Hedron Archive
4 Nevinyrral's Disk
4 Smokestack
4 Thran Dynamo
4 Trading Post
Enchantments
3 Journey to Eternity
3 Necropotence
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Phyrexian Arena
4 Deathreap Ritual
4 Greater Good
5 Dictate of Erebos
5 Revel in Riches
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Inventor's Fair
1 Buried Ruin
1 Woodland Cemetery
1 Command Tower
1 Llanowar Wastes
1 Tree of Tales
1 Vault of Whispers
1 Hissing Quagmire
1 Tainted Wood
1 Forbidden Orchard
1 Temple of Malady
1 Twilight Mire
9 Forest
13 Swamp
I tried to make sure my Pod curve was on point, likewise with Trawler. There's a small sacrifice subtheme, and a small amount of reanimation. I didn't want to go too deep on either of these as they're not entirely relevant to Glissa, but supplements to keep things rolling.
Have yet to playtest in current iteration, but fingers crossed it'll do nice things.
I tossed up heavily adding Nim Deathmantle and Ashnod's Altar, as well as Tooth and Nail - at the end of it, I decided against these. In the first case they're too far down the combo line, and in the latter because there's no immediately obvious tutor choices from an entwined cast. I'd be happy to be convinced otherwise, or see feedback on the list otherwise.
Wave of Vitriol ended up not being a great add, so it came out and Nevinyrral's Disk came back in.
As well as this:
Mycosynth Lattice leaves for Meren of Clan Nel Toth - thanks Ghave!
Revel in Riches leaves for Pitiless Plunderer
Cauldron of Souls leaves for Journey to Atzal
Phyrexian Reclamation leaves for Torment of Hailfire
On top of these, Filigree Familiar is back in, and so is Krosan Grip. I'm trying without Decree of Pain and Smokestack for these. I'm looking to cement all of these changes for better or worse over the next week or so, it's just hard to play test this much at once.
Ghave also freed up a copy of Tooth and Nail and Ghoulcaller Gisa. T&N could be strong here, but I'm not 100% sure. There's no insta-win in the deck for it to abuse, and if there were I wouldn't even consider it. Gisa could be ok, I think I'd prefer her elsewhere though.
In:
Twilight Mire
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Phyrexian Obliterator
Phyrexian Reclamation
Deathreap Ritual
Mind Stone
Wave of Vitriol
Out:
Reliquary Tower
Arcane Lighthouse
Phyrexia's Core
Wayfarer's Bauble
Filigree Familiar
Nevinyrral's Disk
Krosan Grip
The lands are an obvious upgrade from random utility to solid adds. I added Deathreap Ritual back in and Phyrexian Reclamation for consistency - I've found running with an early Pod keeping a reasonable board presence is difficult. Nevinyrral's Disk entering tapped is a little problematic, so Wave of Vitriol is a reasonable substitute. It's been devastating in my Nissa build, and it pairs tremendously with Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest. It should be a pretty solid add. Mind Stone comes in as a decent ramp/draw option that gives me a little curve with which to bring stuff back with Scrap Trawler.
I hadn't considered it, but now that you mention it, Animation Module is not a bad choice by any stretch. I used to run it in Ghave, Guru of Spores to good effect. Also plays nicely with Verdurous Gearhulk. I'd been looking at easy ways to get a ton of artifact tokens in play to make good use of Marionetter Master and Disciple of the Vault. Had been looking at Genesis Chamber. This could do pretty decent as well. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try to track one down.
And yes, my Scrap Trawler curve does need some work. I'd looked at Hangarback Walker - still looking at it - I'm just a little hesitant because I don't have a ton of ways of making big mana. I guess it doesn't need to be enormous. As far as 2 drops go, Mind Stone would be a decent add I guess. Thaumatic Compass could do well, too.
I've also just picked up a Phyrexian Obliterator. It'll likely come in here, which makes me wonder about switching out Executioner's Capsule for Triangle of War for extra nastiness. There's at least a couple of creatures that could benefit from the fight mechanic in Glissa, the Traitor, Sidisi, Undead Vizier, Wurmcoil Engine and Obliterator.
1 Filigree Familiar
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Verdurous Gearhulk
1 Smokestack
1 Ulvenwald Tracker
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Burnished Hart
1 Jester's Cap
1 Acidic Slime
1 Unwinding CLock
1 Batterskull
1 Golgari Signet
In addition, added End-Raze Forerunners into the build, removing Deathreap Ritual...hesitantly. I've got great draw options here, but this one did do well. The list is sort of at the point where any further changes I don't know which pieces deserve to stay more than others. That's probably a good sign, but it does make refining the list difficult.
Oh damn! War Pigs looks legit! That could totally be in the plans.
Yeah, Mox Opal is way outta my budget, unfortunately.
It does bring up the point that it'd be good to have some sac outlets in here to prevent this happening. I could probably dig up a Carrion Feeder, Viscera Seer or a Claws of Gix. I've been thinking about adding Claws as a way to get rid of permanents that could turn on me anyway - Phyrexian Arena, Necropotence, Smokestack and such, and it'd be nice to have another 1-drop in the chain.
My chain sort of bottlenecks around 4-5 too, but I've found it sort of good. There's a lot of vaule in that range and it can shoot you ahead pretty quick. Imagine Eternal Witness, picking up Myr Retriever into Solemn Simulacrum into Sidisi, Undead Vizier or Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest.
Craterhoof Behemoth I probably don't have the money for at the moment, so the end of my chain is definitely more disruptive than anything in terms of leveraging ETB effects. I guess there's options for the end of the chain that aren't THAT expensive - Razaketh, the Foulblooded could be a decent finisher (and sac outlet), Pestilence Demon could help with Glissa triggers, Stonehoof Chieftain could be cool, or if I wanna get really griefy there's Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger - I probably wouldn't get that mean though.
A little after this (I think it might have been somewhere around turn 10 or 12) both opponents swept. They were both having trouble with drawing into answers, and I had a full grip with Sheoldred, Whispering One, Beast Within, Decree of Pain and a couple of other decent tricks. I guess it was a bit of a goldfish, but it's nice to know I've got some good synergy going.
I've been trying out a couple of other changes in the last week or so, too:
1 Filigree Familiar
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Verdurous Gearhulk
1 Smokestack
1 Ulvenwald Tracker
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Burnished Hart
1 Jester's Cap
1 Acidic Slime
1 Unwinding CLock
1 Batterskull
1 Golgari Signet
So far, so good with these changes - there seems a bit more consistency in the deck and it has plans to aim for; I can land genuine threats, I don't have to contend in combat to make Glissa's triggers work, and if I need to swing with her I can make her bigger. I was a bit hesitant to add Smokestack, but I guess it's as griefy as you let it be. I had it in hand last game and didn't play it. Likewise with Jester's Cap - card is great for neutering combo decks - I'd like to think it might come back at some point. Otherwise, pretty happy with how it's looking.