I do not think we should be banning it, however, there is a difference and careful study would be a nerfed version if they wanted to hit the decks that abuse it without annihilating the decks.
On how it would affect my decks.. careful Study would be a much worse version of looting, simply because it is U. Hard to imagine splashing blue to Mardu Pyro, just to be able use a worse looting. MP is a moon deck... the manabase is hard enough to maintain at three colors, adding a 4th color strains it to the point I won't be able to use moons anymore. If looting is banned I would either shelve the deck, or try to go for tormenting voice as a looting replacement.
Looting, by design, fuels decks that try to win the game quickly and with little interaction by trading (conventional) card disadvantage for brutal efficiency and should be banned as it is an engine card that gets more broken with new cards being printed, and Arclight Phoenix was the tipping point.
That's not 100% accurate, one of the most fair decks, Mardu midrange, was one of the first to play Faithless Looting to big success, and I don't think that it can be describe as a deck with little interaction that tries to win fast. Faithless looting has more applications that you give it credit for. Now, this might be an extra reason to ban it for some people, I just think this clarification was required.
Still, those kind of decks had Jace, Terminus, Field, opt, abrade, teferi and many other answers. Also, they are getting more in Modern horizons!
Just some nitpicking: When Jeskai was one of the pillars in Modern (and won those things), all those cards (sans Terminus) were either not printed or unbanned yet.
Greetings,
Kathal
I believe he meant that they have received new tools/toys like all decks.
At this point, this calling out modern as the worst since Eldrazi winter is just ridiculous in many levels and has been proven at several different points. The vast majority of people bashing it in this thread, have been doing so in literally EVERY point of its life.
I mean, we literally are going to have an INFLUX of playable cards and the first virtual "rotation" and people are still complaining. What's the point really? In a few months for all we know we might have a completely different modern landscape, with new powerful cards, new decks and a brand new mulligan rule which will make MORE games matter.
So why not tune down the bashing a bit, enjoy the March modern madness and the following mythic championship, and see what the spoiler season brings up.
You'd think whoever compiles these for CFB, of all places, would know how to tell the difference between Jund and The Rock. I was pleasantly surprised until I wasn't.
You mean like the UW control which is actually an Esper deck?
Also interesting to note that there is only 1 control deck (2 if you count faeries) in the top 32 but also only 1 Dredge deck. These 14 copies in Day 2 didn't really help its conversion rate!
I see a lot of posts on the "people are not getting it" line and I am not sure if it's true. Now, I am not saying it is UNtrue, but rather, we would need some data for it.
For example the Faeries master went X-3 yet again missing on another top 8 by a match, and he was packing 6 pieces of GY hate in the SB. How much more than that does one need to go and where is the line that says that GY strategies are a bit too wrapping?
Again, I am not claiming that that's the case, but if we see control decks packing main-deck GY hate, decks with 6+ GY hate SB cards, doesn't it become all too much? What's the silver line here on GY hate vs meta wrapping? What are the data that prove that people are just unprepared?
Let the baseless speculation commence! I will give my speculations/predictions/wishes:
Counterspell: We've talked about this for years and how it should be modern legal and probably won't event impact that much. I think it only makes sense to introduce it now in the format. Stifle: Would create very interesting gameplay, they tried several toned down version (3 mana mostly) in standard and now see even remotely any play. I think it wouldn't break anything, and give some options especially against unfair decks. Baleful Strix: This might be a bit over the top since it is an INSANELY good creature in Legacy, and would make UBx controld decks probably too dominant over aggro decks, but I think there is a possibility. Fact or Fiction: Too good for Standard, sweet card otherwise. I don't see why not. Psychatog: Just please, do it. Containment Priest: We've discussed extensively that modern needs this kind of card. Either priest, or another flash creature similar to Priest should be in there.
Madness cards (aka: Circular Logic and Basking Rootwalla): Too good to had been reprinted for Standard, would go a long way in modern. Nimble Mongoose: Also in the "why not" category
Flashback cards (namely: Chainer's Edict and Moment's Peace): For the former, it would be nice to get a sacrifice creature card that's actually good. For the latter, there is currently no good fog card, maybe moment's peace will be a good addition. Toxic Deluge: A good cheap mass removal which is currently lacking.
At the same time, there should be a land cycle in there. I honestly have no clue which land cycle they can reprint, or whether there will be a new land cycle. I hope there won't be a new one, as, if it's actually good, it will be INSANELY expensive.
I mean presumably you start by doing the important cards in modern first and gradually add the rest.
Even then, you'd need an objective means to deem certain cards in Modern more important than others. The most immediate answer would be decks that placed above a certain position in a major tournament or tournaments, but we also need to keep project length in mind. Taking competitive snapshots of now and a year ago reveals many changes, new decks, and decks that have bounced in and out of tier 1. Standard cards that turn into modern all-stars are a given, but what about the older cards given new life? My point here is that cherry-picking cards ignores flux, which means even an Arena format that has ported in a bunch of modern's most important cards will create a very different format than paper modern.
I mean, an idea would be to crowdsource it. Add say, the 20-30 most popular modern decks in terms of cards, and add a feature where a player can add a card legal in the modern format that does not exist. The have a verification process linked with Gatherer to verify the validity of the card, and once this is done, the card is added in the system. If you have already added the coding behind every mechanism, then adding the card can be something done by the players.
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
I think it is important for people discussing the topic to watch this video, if anything, just for the calm approach they have to the discussion.
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
I mean, we literally are going to have an INFLUX of playable cards and the first virtual "rotation" and people are still complaining. What's the point really? In a few months for all we know we might have a completely different modern landscape, with new powerful cards, new decks and a brand new mulligan rule which will make MORE games matter.
So why not tune down the bashing a bit, enjoy the March modern madness and the following mythic championship, and see what the spoiler season brings up.
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
Also interesting to note that there is only 1 control deck (2 if you count faeries) in the top 32 but also only 1 Dredge deck. These 14 copies in Day 2 didn't really help its conversion rate!
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
For example the Faeries master went X-3 yet again missing on another top 8 by a match, and he was packing 6 pieces of GY hate in the SB. How much more than that does one need to go and where is the line that says that GY strategies are a bit too wrapping?
Again, I am not claiming that that's the case, but if we see control decks packing main-deck GY hate, decks with 6+ GY hate SB cards, doesn't it become all too much? What's the silver line here on GY hate vs meta wrapping? What are the data that prove that people are just unprepared?
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
Counterspell: We've talked about this for years and how it should be modern legal and probably won't event impact that much. I think it only makes sense to introduce it now in the format.
Stifle: Would create very interesting gameplay, they tried several toned down version (3 mana mostly) in standard and now see even remotely any play. I think it wouldn't break anything, and give some options especially against unfair decks.
Baleful Strix: This might be a bit over the top since it is an INSANELY good creature in Legacy, and would make UBx controld decks probably too dominant over aggro decks, but I think there is a possibility.
Fact or Fiction: Too good for Standard, sweet card otherwise. I don't see why not.
Psychatog: Just please, do it.
Containment Priest: We've discussed extensively that modern needs this kind of card. Either priest, or another flash creature similar to Priest should be in there.
Madness cards (aka: Circular Logic and Basking Rootwalla): Too good to had been reprinted for Standard, would go a long way in modern.
Nimble Mongoose: Also in the "why not" category
Flashback cards (namely: Chainer's Edict and Moment's Peace): For the former, it would be nice to get a sacrifice creature card that's actually good. For the latter, there is currently no good fog card, maybe moment's peace will be a good addition.
Toxic Deluge: A good cheap mass removal which is currently lacking.
At the same time, there should be a land cycle in there. I honestly have no clue which land cycle they can reprint, or whether there will be a new land cycle. I hope there won't be a new one, as, if it's actually good, it will be INSANELY expensive.
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past
UB Faeries (15-6-0)
UWR Control (10-5-1)/Kiki Control/Midrange/Harbinger
UBR Cruel Control (6-4-0)/Grixis Control/Delver/Blue Jund
UWB Control/Mentor
UW Miracles/Control (currently active, 14-2-0)
BW Eldrazi & Taxes
RW Burn (9-1-0)
I do (academic) research on video games and archaeology! You can check out my open access book here: https://www.sidestone.com/books/the-interactive-past