Moving along...we need black mana (BBB for Doomsday) and nothing is more black than Urborg. 2 of them since we do want to draw it, but not in multiples as it is Legendary.
ok, ideally we ritual turn 1 into doomsday and win turn 2. That means we need land that can produce both blue and black mana, I'm putting in some underground rivers
Edit: Do we have a budget for these? Pact is listed at 15+ so can we splurge a bit on our lands?
ok, ideally we ritual turn 1 into doomsday and win turn 2. That means we need land that can produce both blue and black mana, I'm putting in some underground rivers
Edit: Do we have a budget for these? Pact is listed at 15+ so can we splurge a bit on our lands?
that said, 4 Tainted Isle... with the Tomb (another budget-bender), we're bound to get black out of it regardless, but we need the :symu:.
I vote the remaining lands are left for basics- as i don't like heavy non-basic mana bases for fear of a random Ruination, Back to Basics, or the nigh forgotten Pale Moon.
I'm kinda torn over Yawqmoth's Bargain... we could run Colfenor's Plans but that's iffy; we could run Null Profusion (if we can play the Library after it to overrule the "Max Handsize of 2" of the profusion) and still draw when we play cards...
SELVAXRI! King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers "Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can." 375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev) Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
I'd be willing to trade Yawgmoth's Bargain for Null Profusion. Both are similar so both can work.
I am trying to figure out how fast we can actually win with this deck. I cant seem to judge how fast it would actually be. 1/2 feels too fast, yet the other 1/2 is too slow.
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"Ask the right questions in the right way and truth is inevitable."
—Lazav
So, we're relatively far from the cutting phase, and I'm always a fan of mana accel in artifact form. I'm adding two Talisman of Dominance. Still plenty of time to vote out if you don't agree.
I've been doing some testing and we need more combo protection (and tutor as well, but we cannot do that on a budget in our format)
Cheap/free counters are needed in the earlier turns. If the combo goes off, it goes off turn 4 in my tests. Thats a long time when dealing with aggro and even longer in a format saturated with counterspell and duress.
I am adding 4 spell pierce to help out. Voting up maniac and credit voucher
I see we've let this fall by the wayside. I guess people are divided. Let's just finish the deck and move on.
I agree with upping win-cons. That makes sense.
Also, since we're removing most of our library anyway, I'm adding Demonic Consultation to go search for the card we want. Only one copy because it is Restricted.
Upvote Bargain because we need to hit 75 before the culling and its freaking Bargain! Jawesome card that even goes with the 'strategy' of the deck in case we want to not draw cards or draw our library post-Doomsday.
Upvoting Griffin to get closer to 75 and it is useful in theory. Its also synergistic with Consultation. Pass, +3 copies.
Edit: As I was writing this IamBob posted, which after combing votes brings out deck to 75! Cutting phase, completely accidentally.
I see we've let this fall by the wayside. I guess people are divided. Let's just finish the deck and move on.
Weekends tend to do that to GMAD.
I'll start the cutting. Vote to remove Gitaxian Probe. I'm not exactly sure we need to see our opponent's hand. I see why we included it at first, but for cutting purposes I don't see it as essential to the deck.
Voting against Brainstorm because as a singleton, we won't see it early game when we need it most.
I agree with the Probe. We aren't trying to ramp up a Storm count.
Leyline of Anticipation is a singleton and doesn't really add much to the overall deck. Vote to cut.
A single Brainstorm doesn't do much of anything. Vote to cut.
I dislike Credit Voucher. It distills the desire to win. Vote to cut.
I don't like the Hellcarver Demon. I also think it dilutes the purpose of the deck. Furthermore, sacrificing permanents kills out Maniac win-con. Vote to cut.
I don't think Library of Leng does that much for us. Vote to cut.
I think bob voted against our only early game defense... he was cut off.
Voting out-
Leyline of Singularity- no point, gone.
Demonic Consultation- we don't want to exile our wincons trying to find something. it's only synergistic with the Griffin, but nothing else.
Pact of Negation- so, we loose if we can't pay it, right? i'll stick with Spell Pierce, Daze, Mana Leak, Force Spike and other assorted cheaper counter spells without the conditions. oh, UNDERMINE!
Amulet of Dominance- and why could we use Drake-skull Cameo or Mistvein Borderpost instead?
SELVAXRI! King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers "Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can." 375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev) Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
I just got a verification on the Rulings board that the combo with Demonic Consultation and Laboratory Maniac works. Just remember to cast Demonic Consultation on you upkeep so that you win on your draw phase
Credit Voucher is not necessary. Voting against, gone. Library of Leng seems to go against our wincons. Voting against, gone.
OK, fine, nobody wants Talisman of Dominance. I'll put it out of its misery. Gone.
Adding basic lands for the remaining ten.
EDIT: Vote to KEEP Wall of Souls because we want to stay alive. Right?
Vote against Meditate. Its not quite what we want. If we miss our turn, we might miss the opportunity to deck ourselves for the win. We're not playing Stax or a combo-engine like that, so I don't think Meditate is that great.
I already voted against Hellcarver Demon. If these two get voted out, we have our 60 card deck.
The one problem with this deck is it is too early according to Mayan predictions. The card should have been chosen in December since we all know 12/21/12 is obv the end of the world.
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I am looking for Date Stamped promos from Khans of Tarkir block so I can finish my set. Check my wants if you have any.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
The one problem with this deck is it is too early according to Mayan predictions. The card should have been chosen in December since we all know 12/21/12 is obv the end of the world.
i think the only changes i'm going to make in my personal version on magic workstation is removing the pact of negations and putting in 4 misdirection, that way i can exile a griffin and cast it later.
I like it. I'm going to build one of these on lackey. Probably going to go legacy rules though for a full set of Brainstorms and Ponders. Swap Wall of Souls for the Augur of Bolas guy.
So who rolls to determine the next GMAD creator?
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4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain (1 @ -all)
Creatures: 9
1 Laboratory Maniac
1 Hellcarver Demon
1 Misthollow Griffin (1@+3)
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm
1 Meditate
Artifacts: 2
2 Credit Voucher (1 @ +2)
2 library of leng
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
18 Placeholder
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
Edit: Do we have a budget for these? Pact is listed at 15+ so can we splurge a bit on our lands?
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain (1 @ -all)
Creatures: 9
1 Laboratory Maniac
1 Hellcarver Demon
1 Misthollow Griffin (1@+3)
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm
1 Meditate
2 Credit Voucher (1 @ +2)
2 library of leng
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
14 Placeholder
I'd rather use Underground Rivers than over-extend our wallets with a full playest of Underground Seas...
that said, 4 Tainted Isle... with the Tomb (another budget-bender), we're bound to get black out of it regardless, but we need the :symu:.
I vote the remaining lands are left for basics- as i don't like heavy non-basic mana bases for fear of a random Ruination, Back to Basics, or the nigh forgotten Pale Moon.
I'm kinda torn over Yawqmoth's Bargain... we could run Colfenor's Plans but that's iffy; we could run Null Profusion (if we can play the Library after it to overrule the "Max Handsize of 2" of the profusion) and still draw when we play cards...
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain (1 @ -all)
Creatures: 9
1 Laboratory Maniac
1 Hellcarver Demon
1 Misthollow Griffin (1@+3)
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm
1 Meditate
2 Credit Voucher (1 @ +2)
2 library of leng
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder
King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers
"Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can."
375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev)
Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
I am trying to figure out how fast we can actually win with this deck. I cant seem to judge how fast it would actually be. 1/2 feels too fast, yet the other 1/2 is too slow.
—Lazav
_______________________________________________
Mafia Stats
Summary:
Total Win %: 40%
Total Scum Win %: 60%
Total Town Win %: 20%
Total Neutral Win %: 0%
Just something I picked up testing a less budget version of this deck idea....
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyI'm voting to add one each of:
I'm not comfortable relying simply on singletons. We're screwed if our opponents (inevitably) deal with them.
I am also seconding the vote to increase Misthollow Griffin for the same reason.
Updating deck numbers (for a change).:-/
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain (1 @ -all)
Creatures: 9
1 Laboratory Maniac (1 @ +1)
1 Hellcarver Demon (1 @ +1)
1 Misthollow Griffin (2 @+3)
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm
1 Meditate
Artifacts: 6
2 Credit Voucher (1 @ +2)
2 Library of Leng
2 Talisman of Dominance
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder
Thanks to GR @ Yavin IV Studios for the signature!
Cheap/free counters are needed in the earlier turns. If the combo goes off, it goes off turn 4 in my tests. Thats a long time when dealing with aggro and even longer in a format saturated with counterspell and duress.
I am adding 4 spell pierce to help out. Voting up maniac and credit voucher
69 Cards
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain (1 @ -all)
Creatures: 9
1 Laboratory Maniac (2 @ +1)
1 Hellcarver Demon (1 @ +1)
1 Misthollow Griffin (2 @+3)
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm
1 Meditate
4 spell pierce
Artifacts: 6
2 Credit Voucher (2 @ +2)
2 Library of Leng
2 Talisman of Dominance
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder
edit: how do i put a card count in the deck tags?
I agree with upping win-cons. That makes sense.
Also, since we're removing most of our library anyway, I'm adding Demonic Consultation to go search for the card we want. Only one copy because it is Restricted.
Upvote Bargain because we need to hit 75 before the culling and its freaking Bargain! Jawesome card that even goes with the 'strategy' of the deck in case we want to not draw cards or draw our library post-Doomsday.
Upvoting Griffin to get closer to 75 and it is useful in theory. Its also synergistic with Consultation. Pass, +3 copies.
Edit: As I was writing this IamBob posted, which after combing votes brings out deck to 75! Cutting phase, completely accidentally.
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm
1 Meditate
Artifacts: 6
2 Credit Voucher (2 @ +2)
2 Library of Leng
2 Talisman of Dominance
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs
Weekends tend to do that to GMAD.
I'll start the cutting. Vote to remove Gitaxian Probe. I'm not exactly sure we need to see our opponent's hand. I see why we included it at first, but for cutting purposes I don't see it as essential to the deck.
Voting against Brainstorm because as a singleton, we won't see it early game when we need it most.
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe (-1)
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm (-1)
1 Meditate
Artifacts: 6
2 Credit Voucher (2 @ +2)
2 Library of Leng
2 Talisman of Dominance
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder
Thanks to GR @ Yavin IV Studios for the signature!
Leyline of Anticipation is a singleton and doesn't really add much to the overall deck. Vote to cut.
A single Brainstorm doesn't do much of anything. Vote to cut.
I dislike Credit Voucher. It distills the desire to win. Vote to cut.
I don't like the Hellcarver Demon. I also think it dilutes the purpose of the deck. Furthermore, sacrificing permanents kills out Maniac win-con. Vote to cut.
I don't think Library of Leng does that much for us. Vote to cut.
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
4 Gitaxian Probe (-2)
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation (-1)
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon (-1)
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Brainstorm (-2)
1 Meditate
Artifacts: 6
2 Credit Voucher (2 @ +2, 1 @ -all)
2 Library of Leng (-1)
2 Talisman of Dominance
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs
I cant get most feature on my phone, so...
Edit, some agreement on probe and brainstorm, gone
Rescindind vote to add voucher, voting against
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
Enchantments: 2
1 Leyline of Anticipation (-2 all)
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon (-1)
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls (-1 all)
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Meditate
2 Credit Voucher (1 @ +2, 2@-all)
2 Library of Leng (-2 all)
2 Talisman of Dominance (-1 all)
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder
clan sig by me
twitch.tv/TheBlueMuzzy
@thebluemuzzy
Voting out-
Leyline of Singularity- no point, gone.
Demonic Consultation- we don't want to exile our wincons trying to find something. it's only synergistic with the Griffin, but nothing else.
Pact of Negation- so, we loose if we can't pay it, right? i'll stick with Spell Pierce, Daze, Mana Leak, Force Spike and other assorted cheaper counter spells without the conditions. oh, UNDERMINE!
Amulet of Dominance- and why could we use Drake-skull Cameo or Mistvein Borderpost instead?
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
Enchantments: 1
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon (-1)
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls (-1 all)
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation (-1)
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation (-1)
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Meditate
2 Credit Voucher (1 @ +2, 2@-all)
2 Library of Leng (-2)
2 Talisman of Dominance (-2)
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
10 Placeholder (+1 @basics only)
King of Misfortune & Master of Rocket Launchers
"Do ya feel lucky? Because you'd better start runnin' while you still can."
375 Misfortune {+3 signed AP's} & 104 Rocket Launcher (41 AQ/ 63 Rev)
Edgar Rice Burroughs, forgotten legend of the word.
Library of Leng seems to go against our wincons. Voting against, gone.
OK, fine, nobody wants Talisman of Dominance. I'll put it out of its misery. Gone.
Adding basic lands for the remaining ten.
EDIT: Vote to KEEP Wall of Souls because we want to stay alive. Right?
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
Enchantments: 1
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon (-1)
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Meditate
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
5 Island
5 Swamp
Thanks to GR @ Yavin IV Studios for the signature!
I already voted against Hellcarver Demon. If these two get voted out, we have our 60 card deck.
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
Enchantments: 1
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon (-1)
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Meditate (-1)
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
5 Island
5 Swamp
Mid-Tier: Marchesa Aggro Rose Asmadi Get Dire Tymna Ikra Woke Women Tiana Aura Angel Ruric Thar SMASH Smasher Kraum Mana Positivity Zur Slides
Filthy Casual: WUBRG Jodah WUBRG WUBRG Fatties WUBRG Gahiji Vigilant Vengeance Ezuri Mysterious Morphs
Hellcarver Demon is too slow. Voting against.
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
Enchantments: 1
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 14
2 Laboratory Maniac
2 Hellcarver Demon (-2)
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Meditate (-2)
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
5 Island
5 Swamp
Thanks to GR @ Yavin IV Studios for the signature!
Diminishing Returns seems hilarious after a Doomsday if you have Maniac in play.
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
Down to 60. Done.
4 Doomsday
1 Demonic Tutor
Enchantments: 1
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
Creatures: 12
2 Laboratory Maniac
4 Misthollow Griffin
1 Emrakul, the Aeon Torn
4 Wall of Souls
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Spell Pierce
1 Demonic Consultation
4 Dark Ritual
4 Pact of Negation
4 Frantic Search
1 Mystical Tutor
Lands: 24
2 Shelldock Isle
2 Sunken Ruins
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Underground River
4 Tainted Isle
5 Island
5 Swamp
Currently offering 2 non-foil Kolighan's Command for a Date Stamped foil!
convert bulk into good cards? PucaTrade - https://pucatrade.com/invite/gift/21195
Ebay - decks/Promos/DVDs
Trade thread (constantly updated)
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/337-pokerbob1s-casual-trading-emporium
That's true, but we can settle for Apocalypse or Wrath of God in December.
Thanks to GR @ Yavin IV Studios for the signature!
clan sig by me
twitch.tv/TheBlueMuzzy
@thebluemuzzy
So who rolls to determine the next GMAD creator?