Hello, this is Stairc speaking - competitive deck designer extraordinaire! I love making decks, cool decks, fun decks, decks with personality and that are out to do awesome things and not just win - but win with style. Competitive design is fun, but let's be honest - nothing beats the sheer greatness of building for casual playgroups.
And I know I'm not the only one who feels this way.
So, need a deck or deck ideas? Post here! Tell us what you want, what your budget (if any) is, the kind of deck you want to play and maybe the kind of decks you'll want to beat (like your annoying friend's elf deck that keeps killing everyone at the table or that irritating affinity powerhouse you're SURE is unfair!). We'll gladly get back to you with a deluge of ideas and deck designs. Stairc and company are at your disposal.
Post away.
Disclaimer: Unless otherwise requested, I shall be approaching casual deckbuilding in the spirit of casual - focusing on cool things and fun whenever possible as well as being strong. If you just want the deck to be as strong as possible and don't care as much about cool things happening beyond the request you've made - let me know in your request.
Disclaimer 2: Due to the incredible demand, from lots of different directions - I'll be mostly building the ideas that sound fun, challenging or just inspire me at the moment that people request. I'll try to go in rough chronological order and spread decklists around to different people before building two for the same person (under two different requests) but who knows what will happen? If you feel you've been waiting a while, feel free to send me a PM and I'll try to move you up the ladder or explain why it's simply not feasible to make your deck (like asking for a mono-blue sliver deck that plays no more than 2 copies of each card).
Notes: I'll build for any casual format, whether multiplay or duels, except EDH. I've been building a lot of EDH lately and I want to work on some other things.
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Astoundingly, it now seems that this thread has become the most popular (both in total posts and number of views) in the history of the Casual Forum that I have observed. There may be archived threads or those far back I haven't seen yet but of those I have - we're far and away the top. Thanks to everyone for making "Need a Deck" what it has become!
Due to the astounding success of this thread and growing number of regular readers, I am considering turning this into an article series (I am still technically a writer for MTGS - even though I haven't written a real article since The Greatest Underdog Story Ever Told). However, I'm not sure what I would name the series. Any thoughts? I'll gather suggested names and put them in a poll on the top of the thread.
Well, like I mentioned in the previous thread, Lethal Vapors would be a cool deck to see.
There are two other cards, which I bought playsets of, that I haven't bee able to use. They are Spawnwrithe and Thundermare. I'd like to see what you can do.
Well, like I mentioned in the previous thread, Lethal Vapors would be a cool deck to see.
There are two other cards, which I bought playsets of, that I haven't bee able to use. They are Spawnwrithe and Thundermare. I'd like to see what you can do.
Hello, this is Stairc speaking - competitive deck designer extraordinaire! I love making decks, cool decks, fun decks, decks with personality and that are out to do awesome things and now just win - but win with style. Competitive design is fun, but let's be honest - nothing beats the sheer greatness of building for casual playgroups.
And I know I'm not the only one who feels this way.
So, need a deck or deck ideas? Post here! Tell us what you want, what your budget (if any) is, the kind of deck you want to play and maybe the kind of decks you'll want to beat (like your annoying friend's elf deck that keeps killing everyone at the table or that irritating affinity powerhouse you're SURE is unfair!). We'll gladly get back to you with a deluge of ideas and deck designs. Stairc and company are at your disposal.
1) Lethal Vapors is one of those cards that looks absolutely unfair but is crippled by its slot on the mana curve. By turn 4, aggressive decks, the kind that play the most creatures, will have emptied most of their hand anyway. This makes the Vapors a very awkward card. However, its effect is a very nasty creature lock-out when it comes down. So the answer is to either accelerate into a Lethal Vapors or use spells that delay the opponent's spellcasting (like Remand or Memory Lapse) until we can get a Vapors in play.
2) This is better in multiplayer by far. But we'll leave that aside for now - since I assume you're requesting for duels. Besides, if this was multiplayer the deck would be too easy to build. Just slip it into a mono-black control style to make everyone cry.
3) Mana acceleration is good here but black's style (Dark Ritual and similar) wouldn't be enough of a swing. It creates card disadvantage when one of the major things we want from the enchantment is card advantage - plus some serious tempo. Making them skip an earlier turn isn't as appealing either, but if we do go mana acceleration anyway - we'd want a more permanent kind. Like Everflowing Chalice or Dimir Signet.
4) Our own creatures are vulnerable to the vapors, meaning we'll be playing with creatures that never really come into play (like Gengu of the Fens) or are indestructible and thus immune to the destroy effect (Darksteel anything). Indestructible creatures tend to be ridiculously overcosted, except for the most expensive ones, so we'll ignore them for now. We'll be winning with fake creatures, like the Gengu, or big non-creature spells. Planeswalkers are begging to be played here - but since that would make things too easy, we'll continue on without them. If you have planeswalkers - you can certainly pimp your deck with them.
5) This is definitely a control deck. Since we'll be playing without many creatures, green's acceleration isn't needed (there's lots of great artifact acceleration anyway). This leaves blue or white as a secondary color - as they have far superior control elements than red. Between the two of them white has more boardsweepers (kill all creatures) and blue has more delay. You could go in either direction but the delay effects of Remand and Memory Lapse in addition to the counterspells you'll have sitting around are far more appealing than white's options at the moment. Blue/Black is also an allied color combination and will have far more options in general to use. Blue is also great at dealing with non-creature spells, while white and black are weaker at this, making blue the preferred choice in all realistic sense. However, white has lots of ways to play with enchantments. If you'd rather get your Johnny on, white/black could be an excellent way for you to go (Idylic Tutor finds the Vapors, Auramancer gets it back after they've finally skipped a turn to destroy it...). Color choice is up to you. However, I think I'd like to take the the Blue/Black route at first. It's more versatile and more fluid, not to mention it has answers for everything - and why play with Lethal Vapors if you weren't going to screw with your opponent in the most satisfying ways possible? If you REALLY hate creatures though, don't like counterspells or really want to see a Lethal Vapors every single game - white could well be the color for you.
6) Let's start adding cards. Here's what we know we'll be playing.
The card behind the deck. Seems silly not to put it in. It can shut down your opponent's strategies singlehandedly, unless they timewalk themselves. Awesomeness on a stick.
This spell might not look like much at first, but it's a Time Walk in disguise. What does a Time Walk do? It gives you a turn. What's in a turn? A drawn card, a played spell and a combat phase. You don't care about the combat phase most times, so that doesn't matter. You care about drawing an extra card and taking away an opponent's chance to play something. Remand = Time Walk here for nearly all intents and purposes... And it's even better at keeping the opponent's early creatures that would drop down before the vapors in their hand. And the best thing? You get to play with a full playset.
Memory Lapse
This is the alpha version of Time Walk. You get to skip their turn. You deny them a draw and prevent them from casting. Sure, they get a combat phase but if your deck is doing things right that phase won't matter at all. You're playing with even more time walks now... How is that fair? Short answer... It isn't. But it sure is fun.
Warning - You might not want to run all 4 Memory Lapse. Opponents may cry. However, the spell does seem fairer than a counterspell to most opponents. This is their mistake. After all, putting the card you counter back on top of their deck prevents them from drawing deeper, hoping to find their few pieces of enchantment destruction (if they have any at all). Putting a mediocre spell back on top of their deck is far better than putting it into their graveyard - as it prevents them from getting more chances to draw their very best spells.
Dimir Signet
Mana acceleration is always nice and if you're playing against a deck that doesn't cast things early, you can comfortably drop the signet on turn 2 instead of leaving mana open for a counter-spell. The fact it fixes our mana too, giving us what we need of any color, is just gravy. We'll want a full playset of these.
Now, we have a host of early game disruption that will delay the opponent further and further. But what if they, gasp, actually get creatures on the board?!?
Let's deal with that idea, shall we?
Black Sun's Zenith
If the opponent gets anybody on the board it's likely to be a few tiny creatures. We can deal with them easily enough. Damnation is the best black wrath available for duels in multicolor decks - but I'll assume that you might not have access to that killer card. Black Sun's Zenith is in a current set, not heavily played and easy to trade for at a few dollars. It'll handle the role of the Wrath very well, and can even come down on turn 3 (especially with Dimir Signet accelerating it) to wipe a board clean of pesky elves. Who needs Infest when you have Black Sun's Zenith?
Innocent Blood
Now, we could use some more cheap creature kill. Condemn would be gold here, but it's not an option for UB players. We'll be running something a little different. Say hello to Innocent Blood. This card is incredible, making the opponent sacrifice a creature for 1 mana. Protection from Black doesn't save them. Indestructible doesn't save them. Very useful to have. It is worth noting that Chainer's Edict would work very well here too - but I like how Innocent Blood costs less.
Now, for some targeted removal. Let's bring in everyone's favorite spells, Doom Blade and Go for the Throat. With Innocent Blood and all your blue countermagic - you have lots of answers for any artifact creatures or black that pop up. We'll run a 2/2 split of these cards to make sure we have easy answers at our disposal and are unlikely to have dead cards in any matchup.
Now, we need some win conditions. There's lots of ways to do this, but for sheer style points I'd go with Gengu of the Falls. Again - perhaps not the strongest option but a very cool and budget one. It's a reliable finisher that can beat for 3 damage all day and comes back if they kill your island. What's not to like? We'll play 3 since we only need to draw one at a time.
Five slots left.
There is an unwritten rule that states one should never play control without card draw - and Foresee is some of the most powerful budget card draw in the game. Seriously, this spell is nuts. It lets you scry four, putting all junk on the bottom and saving you at least 2 turns of dead draws. Saving you from drawing useless cards in the late game is the same as card advantage. It's at its best when you have nothing but dead cards on top of your deck, letting you put them all on the bottom - effectively drawing you six cards for just four mana.
The spell is insane and should be played. To do otherwise is madness. Three copies. Now.
This leaves us with two more slots to do anything we want with. I'm not entirely comfortable with relying on Genju of the Fens as a kill of course, so let's add in something else. Once more, Planeswalkers would be amazing here - like Liliana Vess. However, I will continue to assume they aren't available to you. What I'd really like you to grab are 4 Creeping Tar Pit in the mana base as well, as they're basically a free win condition here, as well as a great color-fixer. If you have these cards - slap em in and call it a deck. Take it for preliminary testing and let me know how it does so we can start reworking it.
If you don't have those baddies, there are lots of things you can run instead... But let's go for maximum hilarity. Dovescape. This card is dirt cheap, you can pick up the foil at bulk prices even, and combined with Lethal Vapors - your opponent really can't do anything. You destroy all their creatures when they hit play and counter all non-creature spells in exchange for birds... Which are then also destroyed! Your opponent is utterly locked out of the game unless they timewalk themselves by killing your vapors, at which point all your many, many non-creature spells are transformed into bird-creating factories. That's just funny.
Whew! Okay, that's my first take on the rough deck. Adding a bit of money to the matter could make it stronger and some of the card choices I'm going with (notable on the win conditions) are more about style than raw power but this should give you a good base to go off of. And a very fun one too.
I hate tribal decks, like elves and stuff, but I love weird tribal decks. I'd love to see a functional human deck that had an actual theme to it and just wasn't a bunch of humans thrown together.
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311 "Who's Got the Herb"
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Can you help with maybe a deck that plays underworld dreams, trade secrets and some other form of fun draw? I would like to build a comboey kind of deck using underworld dreams. As for my budget, this is just a casual deck so I dont want to spend a fortune on it. I would also like it to be fun in multiplayer (doesnt have to be if it just wont work). Do you think you can help?
Hey I just posted this on the Legacy Board, but I think you could help me a bit more. Legacy legal cards aren't required. I'd be using this more for casual anyways. Feel free to PM me and advice you have for me. I really don't want to have to spend more than $20 on this deck. $10 or $15 is preferred if necessary.
Basically I'd like to make a deck around Dark Depths without having to spend very much money. I understand it's not going to be nearly as competitive as other Legacy Depths decks (probably not competitive at all), but that's okay. I just want to make some use of this card and have a fairly well rounded deck.
Basically I have 1 Dark Depths and can't afford anymore right now. Because of this hindrance, I'm going to need some alternate win-cons, I just can't think of any that could go well here.
As you can see it's not much, that's why I seek advice. I can't afford any $10+ cards right now (Urborg, Dark Conf., etc.) but I am open to suggestions.
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Now, Golems have basically no tribal support. Any deck playing golems needs a very good reason behind them. However, we can do this via Precursor Golem, Blade Splicer and Wing Splicer. All like having golems around and all are very solid cards in their own.
Let's begin.
Precursor Golem
This card is everything in one. It's a great golem, nine power and can let us do truly degenerate things with our golems. It makes them really vulnerable to spot removal, true, but hey - if you weren't willing to take a risk, why would you be playing a golem deck? A super crush under the weight of golems is worth a lot more than just losing everything to a removal spell now and then... And again, we can work around that too.
Now, it's just silly to use Precursor Golem without some way to abuse its power. Let's go with fan favorites Distortion Strike and Emerge Unscathed. Each of these cards are sweet on their own, but put them together with Precursor Golem and you have two ways to utterly bury your enemy. Distortion Strike will make all your Golems unblockable for two turns (provided you're targeting Precursor Golem) and Emerge Unscathed can save them all from removal spells or give them all protection from anything you like... Twice. That's incredible value and wicked fun too.
Now, we need some more golems. Blade Splicer is not only a Golem, but a Golem Lord, giving everyone first strike. Wingsplicer is just the same and fits nicely into your curve, plus gives all your golems flying. All your golems having flying and first strike? Sounds good to me.
+4 Bladesplicer
+4 Wingsplicer
So far so good. We have a 3 drop, a 4 drop and a 5 drop - plus two sweet instants that are good on their own and just nuts when we have Precursor Golem on the field. But I'm not satisfied yet. Precursor Golem's ability is still crying out to be abused...
Cast that on your Precursor Golem and things will never, ever be the same. A good card on its own, this thing can copy every single golem you control with the precursor and do it in style. If you ever cast the kicked version of the spell on the golem... Well, here's a challenge to all readers!
Let's say you have a Precursor Golem out along with its two tokens and a Wing Splicer out with its own 3/3 golem token. That's the Precursor Golem and three 3/3 tokens (plus the Splicer itself as a 1/1 not-golem). Now, you cast a kicked Rite of Replication - targeting Precursor Golem.
How many flying golems do you have now?
Honorable mention in this post for the first person to calculate that correctly!
But a curve shouldn't start on turn 3, should it? No, no, no. Let's grab some more nasties. Shapesharer is a great card on its own, copying the best thing on the board (and acting as a removal spell for legends). It's a bit mana intensive though, so let's not add more than 3.
And we could use some more things in the 3 drop slot too. Why not add in some Mirror Entity? They're definitely golems and they can act as a psudeo lord, giving your whole army +huge/+huge.
Now we still want some quick card draw. A great card for this is Glassdusk Hulk. You cycle him away in the early game (always cycle him unless you really need a blocker or attacker, he'll be fine chilling in the grave) to draw more cards. Plus, when you do have him on the field, dropping a Precursor Golem gives him a masisve boost. And did I mention? He's a golem!
Let's get some more deck manipulation in there. We don't have quite enough artifacts to run Thirst for Knowledge but since we're using most of our mana each turn anyway, why not play a few copies of Preordain? It's cheap, we can use it easy and it'll help us find what we want. Gotta love that card.
Hey, that's 36 cards exactly! Well then, all we need is the lands. Let's see... Blue is most of the spells (22 blue mana symbols to 10 white spells) so let's go with a 1.5 to 1 ratio of blue to white (you always veer toward the middle when you have the option). I'd say 15 Islands and 9 Plains is just what the doctor ordered.
But wait, there's more... A bonus idea for golem deckbuilders everywhere absolutely free!
If you want to play with less changelings and go more machine now than man - look for Open the Vaults. This card is insane, available at bulk rare prices, and even better with Glassdust Hulk. If you go full artifacts, you can swing mono-white for Razor Golem and crush your enemies with high quality beats like Lodestone Golem... Or stay multicolored to enjoy filling your grave with artifacts via Thirst for Knowledge. That deck would be wicked strong as well, just a little too obvious for me - hence my above approach.
Hey I just posted this on the Legacy Board, but I think you could help me a bit more. Legacy legal cards aren't required. I'd be using this more for casual anyways. Feel free to PM me and advice you have for me. I really don't want to have to spend more than $20 on this deck. $10 or $15 is preferred if necessary.
Basically I'd like to make a deck around Dark Depths without having to spend very much money. I understand it's not going to be nearly as competitive as other Legacy Depths decks (probably not competitive at all), but that's okay. I just want to make some use of this card and have a fairly well rounded deck.
Basically I have 1 Dark Depths and can't afford anymore right now. Because of this hindrance, I'm going to need some alternate win-cons, I just can't think of any that could go well here.
As you can see it's not much, that's why I seek advice. I can't afford any $10+ cards right now (Urborg, Dark Conf., etc.) but I am open to suggestions.
I can certainly help you, but I think all you need is a single suggestion to get your brain rolling.
Thopter Foundry + Sword of the Meek is a great combo that lets you sacrifice the sword to get 1 life and a 1/1 flier... Which also brings back the sword to do it again. You can tap 5 lands gain gain 5 life, plus five 1/1 fliers... And do it as many times as you want. Few decks can hope to power through that.
Muddle the Mixture finds the foundry, the sword and even vampire hexmage to put together your killer combos. Since you only have 1 dark depths, Tolaria West will give you a way to search it out at will. It's a sweet land and costs only 1/20th of what Dark Depths does - and you can often get them as throw-ins while trading or even for free.
Hi, I'm glad you're game in the exact time i need to finish my deck Let's say i have one free spot so fat, i don't know how to fill it. But I'm posting here maybe to get another ideas how to improve this deck, so I'll appriciate any advice A few criteria :
1) My meta : mirror deck, a lot of discard decks, 10 land stompy, Elves (like not legacy competitive), mono blue aggro will be the new addition.
2) Budget : no extra-expensive cards like Jitte, Swords, Mystic etc, Let's say nothing expensive than the most expensive card already in the deck.
3) Mutliplayer with sideboard to quickly switch the deck to singleplayer.
4) Synergies, the only thing which matters I have a lot of little combos so far, and i will welcome any other.
So do whatever you want with the deck, but keep it's essence Thanks, if you find some time, please take a look.
I'll be happy to help (though I should answer some other requests first) - but before I get into it, I feel I should point out something.
If you like cool combos and your playgroup is silly enough to let you play with skullclamp, you can do SO many evil things. Would you like some suggestions in that direction or just a deck-tuneup here?
I would love to do some evil things with Skullclamp I'd like to say both, but Skullcamp combos can be the priority here, no matter if i'll need bigger changes.
Awesome. Then let's go unfair.
First, Skullclamp is going to be the center of the deck. The card was one of the very few in recent years to be banned and it is utterly evil. Let's play four.
Now, we'll want a way to find the skullclamp. Luckily, it costs 1 mana - making it easy. Trinket Mage will grab up the evil equipment no problem. A playset of the mages and it's like we're running 8 copies of the equipment. Come to papa.
Now skullclamp is bad enough when it's just drawing you lots of free cards... But when you really build for it it's disturbing. Green decks make lots of little guys, so those are our colors. We're blue/green and loving it.
Of all the cheap green guys, elves are best at swarming the field - so we know what we're doing. As long as we have elves, we can kill them to skullclamp to draw lots of new cards. And as long as we have mana, we can keep drawing elves and keep playing them to draw more and more cards. That sounds fun.
Now, only a few elves can tap for mana without worrying about summoning sickness. The best ones are Heritage Druid and Birchlore Rangers. We'll want four of each.
From that point, we'll want to grab a gem from shadowmoor - Nettle Sentinel. This hard worker gets inspired whenever another one of his buddies comes out to play - which lets him tap for the druid or rangers multiple times to keep producing mana. If you have one druid and two sentinels out, you can tap them for GGG, equip skullclamp, play the elf you just drew and untap them all to make another GGG. Not bad at all.
*grins* I'll leave it at that for now. How would you like to continue? Naturally you'll want lots of cheap elves and some way to make use of all these creatures being drawn, played then dying.
Bonus Ideas - Etherium Sculptor could shave the cost of all 1 mana artifact creatures to 0 and shave Skullclamp to 0 as well. Something to bear in mind if you'd rather go that way.
Note to Readers: The above skullclamp decks WILL be unfair. However, that was what was requested. Don't worry, I'm more than happy to stick with the fun and laid back brews for you.
Excellent advice! Those will definitely help my deck. I'm gonna go through my collection and see if I have any of those cards and buy or trade what I don't.
I really appreciate the help, man.
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Excellent advice! Those will definitely help my deck. I'm gonna go through my collection and see if I have any of those cards and buy or trade what I don't.
I'd be happy to help you here, there's lots we can do with it. A question though, what precisely is your dream for the deck? If it could do anything you wanted to, what would it be? What draws you to it?
I hate tribal decks, like elves and stuff, but I love weird tribal decks. I'd love to see a functional human deck that had an actual theme to it and just wasn't a bunch of humans thrown together.
I accept!
In working on what theme would be appropriate for humans, I was constantly struck by the versatility, the adaptability and the comprehensive nature of the race. Ultimately, this quote will be the guiding line when I do build the deck.
“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, and die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.”
I'd be happy to help you here, there's lots we can do with it. A question though, what precisely is your dream for the deck? If it could do anything you wanted to, what would it be? What draws you to it?
I accept!
In working on what theme would be appropriate for humans, I was constantly struck by the versatility, the adaptability and the comprehensive nature of the race. Ultimately, this quote will be the guiding line when I do build the deck.
“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, and die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.”
My dream? To have Jin-Giax out with 4 Psychosis Crawlers haha. Actually, having any combo of the creatures excluding the demons would be pretty damn cool.
What draws me to it is how quick and easy I can bring out big creatures like It That Betrays. Bringing that out on turn 2 is possible, and I've done that using sim programs. Combine that with how I get to choose whatever creatures I want to, with my 'tutors' in the demons and dimir machinations, I can pretty much do whatever I want.
Random Question: Is Tainted Pact any good to use in black decks? I discovered it today and it seems like it's pretty useful until you draw a basic land. It seems like it could be combined well with Magus of the Future until you basically re-stock your entire hand.
I hate tribal decks, like elves and stuff, but I love weird tribal decks. I'd love to see a functional human deck that had an actual theme to it and just wasn't a bunch of humans thrown together.
I accept!
In working on what theme would be appropriate for humans, I was constantly struck by the versatility, the adaptability and the comprehensive nature of the race. Ultimately, this quote will be the guiding line when I do build the deck.
“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, and die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.”
I have a Tribal Human deck with humans that have "artifact" in the rules text. Mishra is the leader of those humans. In case it helps...
Green/White/Blue... the Lures can go on either the Leprechauns (to spread green) or the Basilisks (to spread death). Either one should get a Gaseous ASAP.
I've tried a few iterations with a few different types of support -- green mana ramp, blue card draw... nothing seems to work.
Help?
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Current Favorite Decks: Creatureless Bolas Control with Lethal Vapors, Green Enchantress/Kavu Lair card draw, and Shriekmaw/Mulldrifter/Dignitary Flicker.
These types of threads usually get flooded and the original poster leaves or they get no responses at all. Anyway, if you are looking to help, I could use some...
I've searched already and nothing quite hits the spot. I am planning a combo deck of Prismatic Omen and Last Stand. The learning is more combo oriented and the support is via Turn Aside (to protect Omen) and/or Noxious Revival (or Reclaim) (to recur Stands or bring back destroyed Omens) and possibly Worldly Counsel (to dig for combo pieces, but could be anything like this, Impulse, scry cards, etc.) I'm also considering Protective Sphere, but not sure.
I have a general idea that I was planning and an almost done list, but I'd really like to see what some one else thinks.
My dream? To have Jin-Giax out with 4 Psychosis Crawlers haha. Actually, having any combo of the creatures excluding the demons would be pretty damn cool.
What draws me to it is how quick and easy I can bring out big creatures like It That Betrays. Bringing that out on turn 2 is possible, and I've done that using sim programs. Combine that with how I get to choose whatever creatures I want to, with my 'tutors' in the demons and dimir machinations, I can pretty much do whatever I want.
A nice dream!
Okay, what I'm getting is that you love the idea of cheating huge creatures into play fast. We can definitely work with this. However, the strategy doesn't really fit with the Psychosis Crawler kill. Would you rather focus on reanimator and cheating your It That Betrays into play, or focusing on killing with Psychosis Crawler?
Green/White/Blue... the Lures can go on either the Leprechauns (to spread green) or the Basilisks (to spread death). Either one should get a Gaseous ASAP.
I've tried a few iterations with a few different types of support -- green mana ramp, blue card draw... nothing seems to work.
Help?
Sure thing!
Now, what you're running into is a deck that does cool things - but only does them in a specific way, where a lot of things need to go right and where, even if they do go right, you don't automatically win.
This is asking for troubles.
First, you're building around Auras mostly (enchant creature cards). These spells are a deckbuilder's trap for the most part - they're begging for card disadvantage. If your opponent hits your guy with one spell - you just lost two cards. Not at all cool for you.
Second, even if the combo goes right - you don't automatically win the game. Most combo decks give themselves a massive advantage that means they can't lose - but even if all your pieces come together all you get is a guy who has 'protection from creatures' or, if you're lucky, you destroy all theirs. It would be far easier to play Beloved Chaplain or Commander Eesha if you want the first ability on a guy. Destroying all your opponent's creatures is far better - but it's still an iffy thing to put together and all it takes for them is to find one removal spell before they start rebuilding their board. Fragile combo decks need to get a huge advantage once they get everything running. When even your best case doesn't win you the game automatically, you're bound to run into problems.
I can sure help you fix the deck, but we'll need to examine the core strategy I expect. What attracts you most to the deck idea? If we can capture its essence in a more powerful way, that would be awesome.
These types of threads usually get flooded and the original poster leaves or they get no responses at all. Anyway, if you are looking to help, I could use some...
I've searched already and nothing quite hits the spot. I am planning a combo deck of Prismatic Omen and Last Stand. The learning is more combo oriented and the support is via Turn Aside (to protect Omen) and/or Noxious Revival (or Reclaim) (to recur Stands or bring back destroyed Omens) and possibly Worldly Counsel (to dig for combo pieces, but could be anything like this, Impulse, scry cards, etc.) I'm also considering Protective Sphere, but not sure.
I have a general idea that I was planning and an almost done list, but I'd really like to see what some one else thinks.
No rush. Thanks in advance.
This is a very cool deck idea. There's lots of ways we can run this, but I'm most inclined to start with aYavimaya Enchantress style to draw tons and tons of cards - picking up the Prismatic Omen along the way and powering out a win via Last Stand. However, a Green-based five color control deck would be easy as pie too - with Idylic Tutor to find the Omen (letting you effectively run eight) and then ramping up your lands so that Last Stand will truly be game over. Which idea do you like better?
Random Question: Is Tainted Pact any good to use in black decks? I discovered it today and it seems like it's pretty useful until you draw a basic land. It seems like it could be combined well with Magus of the Future until you basically re-stock your entire hand.
I don't feel for the Tainted Pact really. I'm sure it's of use, but you'd have to build a no-basic-land manabase to make it really good... Which monoblack hates (they love their swamps). There are probably better options for you available, but why not take the card for a spin and test it out? If it's good, let us know.
1 Precursor Golem + Rite: 3 Golems (Precursor and 2 Tokens) x 5 copies = 15 Golems
3 Tokens + Rite: 3 Golems x 5 Copies = 15
So add the 30 Golems to the original 4 Golems and you have 34... Unless I got something wrong somewhere.
Sounds about right! But now it gets fun...
Let's say you do that, then cast another kicked Rite of Replication on the Golems (now numbering the above 6 Precursor Golems and the many tokens). How many do you have now?
Okay, what I'm getting is that you love the idea of cheating huge creatures into play fast. We can definitely work with this. However, the strategy doesn't really fit with the Psychosis Crawler kill. Would you rather focus on reanimator and cheating your It That Betrays into play, or focusing on killing with Psychosis Crawler?
Sure thing!
Now, what you're running into is a deck that does cool things - but only does them in a specific way, where a lot of things need to go right and where, even if they do go right, you don't automatically win.
This is asking for troubles.
First, you're building around Auras mostly (enchant creature cards). These spells are a deckbuilder's trap for the most part - they're begging for card disadvantage. If your opponent hits your guy with one spell - you just lost two cards. Not at all cool for you.
Second, even if the combo goes right - you don't automatically win the game. Most combo decks give themselves a massive advantage that means they can't lose - but even if all your pieces come together all you get is a guy who has 'protection from creatures' or, if you're lucky, you destroy all theirs. It would be far easier to play Beloved Chaplain or Commander Eesha if you want the first ability on a guy. Destroying all your opponent's creatures is far better - but it's still an iffy thing to put together and all it takes for them is to find one removal spell before they start rebuilding their board. Fragile combo decks need to get a huge advantage once they get everything running. When even your best case doesn't win you the game automatically, you're bound to run into problems.
I can sure help you fix the deck, but we'll need to examine the core strategy I expect. What attracts you most to the deck idea? If we can capture its essence in a more powerful way, that would be awesome.
This is a very cool deck idea. There's lots of ways we can run this, but I'm most inclined to start with aYavimaya Enchantress style to draw tons and tons of cards - picking up the Prismatic Omen along the way and powering out a win via Last Stand. However, a Green-based five color control deck would be easy as pie too - with Idylic Tutor to find the Omen (letting you effectively run eight) and then ramping up your lands so that Last Stand will truly be game over. Which idea do you like better?
I don't feel for the Tainted Pact really. I'm sure it's of use, but you'd have to build a no-basic-land manabase to make it really good... Which monoblack hates (they love their swamps). There are probably better options for you available, but why not take the card for a spin and test it out? If it's good, let us know.
Sounds about right! But now it gets fun...
Let's say you do that, then cast another kicked Rite of Replication on the Golems (now numbering the above 6 Precursor Golems and the many tokens). How many do you have now?
Hint, it's over 9,000.
Well over 9,000.
Thanks. I enjoyed it.
That's exactly right. Most of my decks have been based on the idea of bringing in big guys really fast, but then it got really one-dimensioned and boring. Also, my friends have caught on to my strategy, so I've incorporated the draw/damage approach.
So pretty much, I have two ways of getting the win. One is to overrun the opponent with It That Betrays, and should that fail, the Crawlers/Jin will be the backup. To be honest, this was my way of 'proofing' my deck so that if one way fails, the other will pick up easily, since both strategies use the same mechanics (tutor+reanimate).
That's exactly right. Most of my decks have been based on the idea of bringing in big guys really fast, but then it got really one-dimensioned and boring. Also, my friends have caught on to my strategy, so I've incorporated the draw/damage approach.
So pretty much, I have two ways of getting the win. One is to overrun the opponent with It That Betrays, and should that fail, the Crawlers/Jin will be the backup. To be honest, this was my way of 'proofing' my deck so that if one way fails, the other will pick up easily, since both strategies use the same mechanics (tutor+reanimate).
How about this then? You like casting really big effects but want an interesting deck with a versatile strategy...
I bet we can build something utterly awesome with Vesuva.
So, how's all the mana in the world sound to you for fun to do whatever you want with? It's a different methodology than your classic reanimator but still lets you play with huge effects very fast.
So, how's all the mana in the world sound to you for fun to do whatever you want with? It's a different methodology than your classic reanimator but still lets you play with huge effects very fast.
Like? Or want to stick with reanimator?
That is an awesome idea that I'll be saving for the future but right now, I'm pretty infatuated with the reanimation strategy so let's stick with that if you wouldn't mind.
By the way, what is recursion? I'm not that up to date with the lingo because I just got back into magic after a four year break. haha
That is an awesome idea that I'll be saving for the future but right now, I'm pretty infatuated with the reanimation strategy so let's stick with that if you wouldn't mind.
By the way, what is recursion? I'm not that up to date with the lingo because I just got back into magic after a four year break. haha
Sure thing. Let's keep bringing things back from the dead.
As for recursion, it means any way to get things you've spent back. For Mindslaver, recursion might be Academy Ruins. For creatures, Genesis.
Now, let's talk about your list.
The main issue is that your Psychosis Crawlers really aren't needed. A basic rule of magic is that if you draw 3+ free cards in a solid deck against your opponent... You're probably going to win. Card advantage matters enormously. Now, with the Core Augur, you're not drawing 3 cards. You're drawing seven. And you're drawing them each turn. What does this mean? Basically - you don't need the crawlers. You will win this game. And that's without even factoring the Augur's second ability to make the opponent discard their hand each turn.
Any game you stick Gitaxis, you will win... Unless something absolutely insane happens. Psychosis Crawler's presence is irrelevant. Trimming the crawler will vastly improve the performance of your deck, I guarantee it.
And I know I'm not the only one who feels this way.
So, need a deck or deck ideas? Post here! Tell us what you want, what your budget (if any) is, the kind of deck you want to play and maybe the kind of decks you'll want to beat (like your annoying friend's elf deck that keeps killing everyone at the table or that irritating affinity powerhouse you're SURE is unfair!). We'll gladly get back to you with a deluge of ideas and deck designs. Stairc and company are at your disposal.
Post away.
Disclaimer: Unless otherwise requested, I shall be approaching casual deckbuilding in the spirit of casual - focusing on cool things and fun whenever possible as well as being strong. If you just want the deck to be as strong as possible and don't care as much about cool things happening beyond the request you've made - let me know in your request.
Disclaimer 2: Due to the incredible demand, from lots of different directions - I'll be mostly building the ideas that sound fun, challenging or just inspire me at the moment that people request. I'll try to go in rough chronological order and spread decklists around to different people before building two for the same person (under two different requests) but who knows what will happen? If you feel you've been waiting a while, feel free to send me a PM and I'll try to move you up the ladder or explain why it's simply not feasible to make your deck (like asking for a mono-blue sliver deck that plays no more than 2 copies of each card).
Notes: I'll build for any casual format, whether multiplay or duels, except EDH. I've been building a lot of EDH lately and I want to work on some other things.
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Updates and Current Events
Astoundingly, it now seems that this thread has become the most popular (both in total posts and number of views) in the history of the Casual Forum that I have observed. There may be archived threads or those far back I haven't seen yet but of those I have - we're far and away the top. Thanks to everyone for making "Need a Deck" what it has become!
Due to the astounding success of this thread and growing number of regular readers, I am considering turning this into an article series (I am still technically a writer for MTGS - even though I haven't written a real article since The Greatest Underdog Story Ever Told). However, I'm not sure what I would name the series. Any thoughts? I'll gather suggested names and put them in a poll on the top of the thread.
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There are two other cards, which I bought playsets of, that I haven't bee able to use. They are Spawnwrithe and Thundermare. I'd like to see what you can do.
RGGruul Aggro
WSoul Sisters
WBTokens
BUGRRestore Balance
BMono-Black Infect
EDH:
RGWMayael, the Anima
GWURoon of the Hidden Realm
BDrana, Kalastria Bloodchief
Alright, let's get cracking!
1) Lethal Vapors is one of those cards that looks absolutely unfair but is crippled by its slot on the mana curve. By turn 4, aggressive decks, the kind that play the most creatures, will have emptied most of their hand anyway. This makes the Vapors a very awkward card. However, its effect is a very nasty creature lock-out when it comes down. So the answer is to either accelerate into a Lethal Vapors or use spells that delay the opponent's spellcasting (like Remand or Memory Lapse) until we can get a Vapors in play.
2) This is better in multiplayer by far. But we'll leave that aside for now - since I assume you're requesting for duels. Besides, if this was multiplayer the deck would be too easy to build. Just slip it into a mono-black control style to make everyone cry.
3) Mana acceleration is good here but black's style (Dark Ritual and similar) wouldn't be enough of a swing. It creates card disadvantage when one of the major things we want from the enchantment is card advantage - plus some serious tempo. Making them skip an earlier turn isn't as appealing either, but if we do go mana acceleration anyway - we'd want a more permanent kind. Like Everflowing Chalice or Dimir Signet.
4) Our own creatures are vulnerable to the vapors, meaning we'll be playing with creatures that never really come into play (like Gengu of the Fens) or are indestructible and thus immune to the destroy effect (Darksteel anything). Indestructible creatures tend to be ridiculously overcosted, except for the most expensive ones, so we'll ignore them for now. We'll be winning with fake creatures, like the Gengu, or big non-creature spells. Planeswalkers are begging to be played here - but since that would make things too easy, we'll continue on without them. If you have planeswalkers - you can certainly pimp your deck with them.
5) This is definitely a control deck. Since we'll be playing without many creatures, green's acceleration isn't needed (there's lots of great artifact acceleration anyway). This leaves blue or white as a secondary color - as they have far superior control elements than red. Between the two of them white has more boardsweepers (kill all creatures) and blue has more delay. You could go in either direction but the delay effects of Remand and Memory Lapse in addition to the counterspells you'll have sitting around are far more appealing than white's options at the moment. Blue/Black is also an allied color combination and will have far more options in general to use. Blue is also great at dealing with non-creature spells, while white and black are weaker at this, making blue the preferred choice in all realistic sense. However, white has lots of ways to play with enchantments. If you'd rather get your Johnny on, white/black could be an excellent way for you to go (Idylic Tutor finds the Vapors, Auramancer gets it back after they've finally skipped a turn to destroy it...). Color choice is up to you. However, I think I'd like to take the the Blue/Black route at first. It's more versatile and more fluid, not to mention it has answers for everything - and why play with Lethal Vapors if you weren't going to screw with your opponent in the most satisfying ways possible? If you REALLY hate creatures though, don't like counterspells or really want to see a Lethal Vapors every single game - white could well be the color for you.
6) Let's start adding cards. Here's what we know we'll be playing.
Lethal Vapors
The card behind the deck. Seems silly not to put it in. It can shut down your opponent's strategies singlehandedly, unless they timewalk themselves. Awesomeness on a stick.
Remand
This spell might not look like much at first, but it's a Time Walk in disguise. What does a Time Walk do? It gives you a turn. What's in a turn? A drawn card, a played spell and a combat phase. You don't care about the combat phase most times, so that doesn't matter. You care about drawing an extra card and taking away an opponent's chance to play something. Remand = Time Walk here for nearly all intents and purposes... And it's even better at keeping the opponent's early creatures that would drop down before the vapors in their hand. And the best thing? You get to play with a full playset.
Memory Lapse
This is the alpha version of Time Walk. You get to skip their turn. You deny them a draw and prevent them from casting. Sure, they get a combat phase but if your deck is doing things right that phase won't matter at all. You're playing with even more time walks now... How is that fair? Short answer... It isn't. But it sure is fun.
Warning - You might not want to run all 4 Memory Lapse. Opponents may cry. However, the spell does seem fairer than a counterspell to most opponents. This is their mistake. After all, putting the card you counter back on top of their deck prevents them from drawing deeper, hoping to find their few pieces of enchantment destruction (if they have any at all). Putting a mediocre spell back on top of their deck is far better than putting it into their graveyard - as it prevents them from getting more chances to draw their very best spells.
Dimir Signet
Mana acceleration is always nice and if you're playing against a deck that doesn't cast things early, you can comfortably drop the signet on turn 2 instead of leaving mana open for a counter-spell. The fact it fixes our mana too, giving us what we need of any color, is just gravy. We'll want a full playset of these.
Now, we have a host of early game disruption that will delay the opponent further and further. But what if they, gasp, actually get creatures on the board?!?
Let's deal with that idea, shall we?
Black Sun's Zenith
If the opponent gets anybody on the board it's likely to be a few tiny creatures. We can deal with them easily enough. Damnation is the best black wrath available for duels in multicolor decks - but I'll assume that you might not have access to that killer card. Black Sun's Zenith is in a current set, not heavily played and easy to trade for at a few dollars. It'll handle the role of the Wrath very well, and can even come down on turn 3 (especially with Dimir Signet accelerating it) to wipe a board clean of pesky elves. Who needs Infest when you have Black Sun's Zenith?
Innocent Blood
Now, we could use some more cheap creature kill. Condemn would be gold here, but it's not an option for UB players. We'll be running something a little different. Say hello to Innocent Blood. This card is incredible, making the opponent sacrifice a creature for 1 mana. Protection from Black doesn't save them. Indestructible doesn't save them. Very useful to have. It is worth noting that Chainer's Edict would work very well here too - but I like how Innocent Blood costs less.
Now, for some targeted removal. Let's bring in everyone's favorite spells, Doom Blade and Go for the Throat. With Innocent Blood and all your blue countermagic - you have lots of answers for any artifact creatures or black that pop up. We'll run a 2/2 split of these cards to make sure we have easy answers at our disposal and are unlikely to have dead cards in any matchup.
So, what do we have so far?
4 Remand
4 Memory Lapse
4 Innocent Blood
2 Doom Blade
2 Go for the Throat
4 Lethal Vapors
4 Black Sun's Zenith
4 Dimir Signet
Now, we need some win conditions. There's lots of ways to do this, but for sheer style points I'd go with Gengu of the Falls. Again - perhaps not the strongest option but a very cool and budget one. It's a reliable finisher that can beat for 3 damage all day and comes back if they kill your island. What's not to like? We'll play 3 since we only need to draw one at a time.
Five slots left.
There is an unwritten rule that states one should never play control without card draw - and Foresee is some of the most powerful budget card draw in the game. Seriously, this spell is nuts. It lets you scry four, putting all junk on the bottom and saving you at least 2 turns of dead draws. Saving you from drawing useless cards in the late game is the same as card advantage. It's at its best when you have nothing but dead cards on top of your deck, letting you put them all on the bottom - effectively drawing you six cards for just four mana.
The spell is insane and should be played. To do otherwise is madness. Three copies. Now.
This leaves us with two more slots to do anything we want with. I'm not entirely comfortable with relying on Genju of the Fens as a kill of course, so let's add in something else. Once more, Planeswalkers would be amazing here - like Liliana Vess. However, I will continue to assume they aren't available to you. What I'd really like you to grab are 4 Creeping Tar Pit in the mana base as well, as they're basically a free win condition here, as well as a great color-fixer. If you have these cards - slap em in and call it a deck. Take it for preliminary testing and let me know how it does so we can start reworking it.
If you don't have those baddies, there are lots of things you can run instead... But let's go for maximum hilarity. Dovescape. This card is dirt cheap, you can pick up the foil at bulk prices even, and combined with Lethal Vapors - your opponent really can't do anything. You destroy all their creatures when they hit play and counter all non-creature spells in exchange for birds... Which are then also destroyed! Your opponent is utterly locked out of the game unless they timewalk themselves by killing your vapors, at which point all your many, many non-creature spells are transformed into bird-creating factories. That's just funny.
Whew! Okay, that's my first take on the rough deck. Adding a bit of money to the matter could make it stronger and some of the card choices I'm going with (notable on the win conditions) are more about style than raw power but this should give you a good base to go off of. And a very fun one too.
4 Dimir Signet
Delay
4 Remand
4 Memory Lapse
4 Innocent Blood
2 Doom Blade
2 Go for the Throat
4 Lethal Vapors
4 Black Sun's Zenith
Card Draw
3 Foresee
3 Gengu of the Falls
2 Dovescape
Note: Building this as mono-black control for multiplayer could make things less timewalky but even eviler. Very fun indeed.
Spawnwrithe and Thundermare decks, coming soon!
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"STAY CLEAR OF WHITE POWDER"
311 "Who's Got the Herb"
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Sig by SGT_Chubbz. Thanks for the signature.
GYisan Toolbox Combo/ControlG
1x It That Betrays" target="blank">It That Betrays
1x Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur" target="blank">Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur
3x Psychosis Crawler" target="blank">Psychosis Crawler
3x Putrid Imp" target="blank">Putrid Imp
2x Rune-Scarred Demon
3x Skirk Ridge Exhumer" target="blank">Skirk Ridge Exhumer
3x Dark Ritual" target="blank">Dark Ritual
1x Doom Blade" target="blank">Doom Blade
2x Go For the Throat
1x Rend Flesh" target="blank">Rend Flesh
3x Animate Dead" target="blank">Animate Dead
3x Necromancy" target="blank">Necromancy
3x Recurring Nightmare" target="blank">Recurring Nightmare
3x Buried Alive" target="blank">Buried Alive
1x Damnation" target="blank">Damnation
3x Dimir Machinations
2x Dread Return
22x Swamp" target="blank">Swamp
24 Lands
Artifacts: 12
4 Howling Mine
4 Font of Mythos
4 Black Vise
4 Fog Bank
4 Guard Gomazoa
4 Wall of Frost
4 Underworld Dreams
Instants: 6
4 Go for the Throat
2 Brainstorm
2 Prosperity
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"STAY CLEAR OF WHITE POWDER"
311 "Who's Got the Herb"
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Basically I'd like to make a deck around Dark Depths without having to spend very much money. I understand it's not going to be nearly as competitive as other Legacy Depths decks (probably not competitive at all), but that's okay. I just want to make some use of this card and have a fairly well rounded deck.
Basically I have 1 Dark Depths and can't afford anymore right now. Because of this hindrance, I'm going to need some alternate win-cons, I just can't think of any that could go well here.
So this is my idea so far:
4 Vampire Hexmage
2 Power Conduit
1 Hex Parasite
4 Into the North
4 Grim Discovery
1 Fate Transfer
1 Dark Depths
12 Snow-Covered Swamp
8 Snow-Covered Forest
As you can see it's not much, that's why I seek advice. I can't afford any $10+ cards right now (Urborg, Dark Conf., etc.) but I am open to suggestions.
Spread the word.
Accepted!
Now, Golems have basically no tribal support. Any deck playing golems needs a very good reason behind them. However, we can do this via Precursor Golem, Blade Splicer and Wing Splicer. All like having golems around and all are very solid cards in their own.
Let's begin.
Precursor Golem
This card is everything in one. It's a great golem, nine power and can let us do truly degenerate things with our golems. It makes them really vulnerable to spot removal, true, but hey - if you weren't willing to take a risk, why would you be playing a golem deck? A super crush under the weight of golems is worth a lot more than just losing everything to a removal spell now and then... And again, we can work around that too.
+4 Precursor Golem
Now, it's just silly to use Precursor Golem without some way to abuse its power. Let's go with fan favorites Distortion Strike and Emerge Unscathed. Each of these cards are sweet on their own, but put them together with Precursor Golem and you have two ways to utterly bury your enemy. Distortion Strike will make all your Golems unblockable for two turns (provided you're targeting Precursor Golem) and Emerge Unscathed can save them all from removal spells or give them all protection from anything you like... Twice. That's incredible value and wicked fun too.
+4 Distortion Strike, +3 Emerge Unscathed.
Now, we need some more golems. Blade Splicer is not only a Golem, but a Golem Lord, giving everyone first strike. Wingsplicer is just the same and fits nicely into your curve, plus gives all your golems flying. All your golems having flying and first strike? Sounds good to me.
+4 Bladesplicer
+4 Wingsplicer
So far so good. We have a 3 drop, a 4 drop and a 5 drop - plus two sweet instants that are good on their own and just nuts when we have Precursor Golem on the field. But I'm not satisfied yet. Precursor Golem's ability is still crying out to be abused...
Ladies and gentlemen, Rite of Replication.
Cast that on your Precursor Golem and things will never, ever be the same. A good card on its own, this thing can copy every single golem you control with the precursor and do it in style. If you ever cast the kicked version of the spell on the golem... Well, here's a challenge to all readers!
Let's say you have a Precursor Golem out along with its two tokens and a Wing Splicer out with its own 3/3 golem token. That's the Precursor Golem and three 3/3 tokens (plus the Splicer itself as a 1/1 not-golem). Now, you cast a kicked Rite of Replication - targeting Precursor Golem.
How many flying golems do you have now?
Honorable mention in this post for the first person to calculate that correctly!
+4 Rite of Replication
But a curve shouldn't start on turn 3, should it? No, no, no. Let's grab some more nasties. Shapesharer is a great card on its own, copying the best thing on the board (and acting as a removal spell for legends). It's a bit mana intensive though, so let's not add more than 3.
+3 Shapesharer
And we could use some more things in the 3 drop slot too. Why not add in some Mirror Entity? They're definitely golems and they can act as a psudeo lord, giving your whole army +huge/+huge.
+3 Mirror Entity
Now we still want some quick card draw. A great card for this is Glassdusk Hulk. You cycle him away in the early game (always cycle him unless you really need a blocker or attacker, he'll be fine chilling in the grave) to draw more cards. Plus, when you do have him on the field, dropping a Precursor Golem gives him a masisve boost. And did I mention? He's a golem!
+4 Glassdust Hulk
Let's get some more deck manipulation in there. We don't have quite enough artifacts to run Thirst for Knowledge but since we're using most of our mana each turn anyway, why not play a few copies of Preordain? It's cheap, we can use it easy and it'll help us find what we want. Gotta love that card.
+3 Preordain.
So, what do we have so far?
3 Shapesharer
4 Blade Splicer
3 Mirror Entity
4 Wing Splicer
4 Precursor Golem
4 Glassdust Hulk
3 Preordain
4 Distortion Strike
3 Emerge Unscathed
4 Rite of Replication
Hey, that's 36 cards exactly! Well then, all we need is the lands. Let's see... Blue is most of the spells (22 blue mana symbols to 10 white spells) so let's go with a 1.5 to 1 ratio of blue to white (you always veer toward the middle when you have the option). I'd say 15 Islands and 9 Plains is just what the doctor ordered.
3 Shapesharer
4 Blade Splicer
3 Mirror Entity
4 Wing Splicer
4 Precursor Golem
4 Glassdust Hulk
3 Preordain
4 Distortion Strike
3 Emerge Unscathed
4 Rite of Replication
15 Islands
9 Plains
And there we have it, a golem deck!
But wait, there's more... A bonus idea for golem deckbuilders everywhere absolutely free!
If you want to play with less changelings and go more machine now than man - look for Open the Vaults. This card is insane, available at bulk rare prices, and even better with Glassdust Hulk. If you go full artifacts, you can swing mono-white for Razor Golem and crush your enemies with high quality beats like Lodestone Golem... Or stay multicolored to enjoy filling your grave with artifacts via Thirst for Knowledge. That deck would be wicked strong as well, just a little too obvious for me - hence my above approach.
I can certainly help you, but I think all you need is a single suggestion to get your brain rolling.
Muddle the Mixture + Tolaria West + Thopter Foundry + Sword of the Meek.
Thopter Foundry + Sword of the Meek is a great combo that lets you sacrifice the sword to get 1 life and a 1/1 flier... Which also brings back the sword to do it again. You can tap 5 lands gain gain 5 life, plus five 1/1 fliers... And do it as many times as you want. Few decks can hope to power through that.
Muddle the Mixture finds the foundry, the sword and even vampire hexmage to put together your killer combos. Since you only have 1 dark depths, Tolaria West will give you a way to search it out at will. It's a sweet land and costs only 1/20th of what Dark Depths does - and you can often get them as throw-ins while trading or even for free.
Enjoy.
I'll be happy to help (though I should answer some other requests first) - but before I get into it, I feel I should point out something.
If you like cool combos and your playgroup is silly enough to let you play with skullclamp, you can do SO many evil things. Would you like some suggestions in that direction or just a deck-tuneup here?
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RGGruul Aggro
WSoul Sisters
WBTokens
BUGRRestore Balance
BMono-Black Infect
EDH:
RGWMayael, the Anima
GWURoon of the Hidden Realm
BDrana, Kalastria Bloodchief
*grins* Glad to help. It sure does look wicked fun... And wicked evil.
Awesome. Then let's go unfair.
First, Skullclamp is going to be the center of the deck. The card was one of the very few in recent years to be banned and it is utterly evil. Let's play four.
+4 Skullclamp
Now, we'll want a way to find the skullclamp. Luckily, it costs 1 mana - making it easy. Trinket Mage will grab up the evil equipment no problem. A playset of the mages and it's like we're running 8 copies of the equipment. Come to papa.
+4 Trinket Mage
Now skullclamp is bad enough when it's just drawing you lots of free cards... But when you really build for it it's disturbing. Green decks make lots of little guys, so those are our colors. We're blue/green and loving it.
Of all the cheap green guys, elves are best at swarming the field - so we know what we're doing. As long as we have elves, we can kill them to skullclamp to draw lots of new cards. And as long as we have mana, we can keep drawing elves and keep playing them to draw more and more cards. That sounds fun.
Now, only a few elves can tap for mana without worrying about summoning sickness. The best ones are Heritage Druid and Birchlore Rangers. We'll want four of each.
+4 Heritage Druid
+4 Birchlore Rangers
From that point, we'll want to grab a gem from shadowmoor - Nettle Sentinel. This hard worker gets inspired whenever another one of his buddies comes out to play - which lets him tap for the druid or rangers multiple times to keep producing mana. If you have one druid and two sentinels out, you can tap them for GGG, equip skullclamp, play the elf you just drew and untap them all to make another GGG. Not bad at all.
Now, we'll want to find our key creatures. Weird Harvest and Chord of Calling or Green Sun's Zenith are great ways to do this. What with Trinket Mage to find Skullclamp and the above spells to find your Heritage Druid, Nettle Sentinel or even (with some of them) Trinket Mage... You'll have tons of ways to find your combo.
*grins* I'll leave it at that for now. How would you like to continue? Naturally you'll want lots of cheap elves and some way to make use of all these creatures being drawn, played then dying.
Bonus Ideas - Etherium Sculptor could shave the cost of all 1 mana artifact creatures to 0 and shave Skullclamp to 0 as well. Something to bear in mind if you'd rather go that way.
Note to Readers: The above skullclamp decks WILL be unfair. However, that was what was requested. Don't worry, I'm more than happy to stick with the fun and laid back brews for you.
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I really appreciate the help, man.
Spread the word.
Glad to help.
I'd be happy to help you here, there's lots we can do with it. A question though, what precisely is your dream for the deck? If it could do anything you wanted to, what would it be? What draws you to it?
I accept!
In working on what theme would be appropriate for humans, I was constantly struck by the versatility, the adaptability and the comprehensive nature of the race. Ultimately, this quote will be the guiding line when I do build the deck.
“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, and die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.”
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My dream? To have Jin-Giax out with 4 Psychosis Crawlers haha. Actually, having any combo of the creatures excluding the demons would be pretty damn cool.
What draws me to it is how quick and easy I can bring out big creatures like It That Betrays. Bringing that out on turn 2 is possible, and I've done that using sim programs. Combine that with how I get to choose whatever creatures I want to, with my 'tutors' in the demons and dimir machinations, I can pretty much do whatever I want.
RGGruul Aggro
WSoul Sisters
WBTokens
BUGRRestore Balance
BMono-Black Infect
EDH:
RGWMayael, the Anima
GWURoon of the Hidden Realm
BDrana, Kalastria Bloodchief
I have a Tribal Human deck with humans that have "artifact" in the rules text. Mishra is the leader of those humans. In case it helps...
My YouTube Channel
Aisling Leprechaun
Thicket Basilisk
Gaseous Form
Green Ward
Cerulean Wyvern / Coast Watcher ???
Teferi's Moat
Circle of Protection: Green
Lure
Green/White/Blue... the Lures can go on either the Leprechauns (to spread green) or the Basilisks (to spread death). Either one should get a Gaseous ASAP.
I've tried a few iterations with a few different types of support -- green mana ramp, blue card draw... nothing seems to work.
Help?
1 Precursor Golem + Rite: 3 Golems (Precursor and 2 Tokens) x 5 copies = 15 Golems
3 Tokens + Rite: 3 Golems x 5 Copies = 15
So add the 30 Golems to the original 4 Golems and you have 34... Unless I got something wrong somewhere.
Also nice work on the Golem Deck.
I've searched already and nothing quite hits the spot. I am planning a combo deck of Prismatic Omen and Last Stand. The learning is more combo oriented and the support is via Turn Aside (to protect Omen) and/or Noxious Revival (or Reclaim) (to recur Stands or bring back destroyed Omens) and possibly Worldly Counsel (to dig for combo pieces, but could be anything like this, Impulse, scry cards, etc.) I'm also considering Protective Sphere, but not sure.
I have a general idea that I was planning and an almost done list, but I'd really like to see what some one else thinks.
No rush. Thanks in advance.
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A nice dream!
Okay, what I'm getting is that you love the idea of cheating huge creatures into play fast. We can definitely work with this. However, the strategy doesn't really fit with the Psychosis Crawler kill. Would you rather focus on reanimator and cheating your It That Betrays into play, or focusing on killing with Psychosis Crawler?
Sure thing!
Now, what you're running into is a deck that does cool things - but only does them in a specific way, where a lot of things need to go right and where, even if they do go right, you don't automatically win.
This is asking for troubles.
First, you're building around Auras mostly (enchant creature cards). These spells are a deckbuilder's trap for the most part - they're begging for card disadvantage. If your opponent hits your guy with one spell - you just lost two cards. Not at all cool for you.
Second, even if the combo goes right - you don't automatically win the game. Most combo decks give themselves a massive advantage that means they can't lose - but even if all your pieces come together all you get is a guy who has 'protection from creatures' or, if you're lucky, you destroy all theirs. It would be far easier to play Beloved Chaplain or Commander Eesha if you want the first ability on a guy. Destroying all your opponent's creatures is far better - but it's still an iffy thing to put together and all it takes for them is to find one removal spell before they start rebuilding their board. Fragile combo decks need to get a huge advantage once they get everything running. When even your best case doesn't win you the game automatically, you're bound to run into problems.
I can sure help you fix the deck, but we'll need to examine the core strategy I expect. What attracts you most to the deck idea? If we can capture its essence in a more powerful way, that would be awesome.
This is a very cool deck idea. There's lots of ways we can run this, but I'm most inclined to start with aYavimaya Enchantress style to draw tons and tons of cards - picking up the Prismatic Omen along the way and powering out a win via Last Stand. However, a Green-based five color control deck would be easy as pie too - with Idylic Tutor to find the Omen (letting you effectively run eight) and then ramping up your lands so that Last Stand will truly be game over. Which idea do you like better?
I don't feel for the Tainted Pact really. I'm sure it's of use, but you'd have to build a no-basic-land manabase to make it really good... Which monoblack hates (they love their swamps). There are probably better options for you available, but why not take the card for a spin and test it out? If it's good, let us know.
Sounds about right! But now it gets fun...
Let's say you do that, then cast another kicked Rite of Replication on the Golems (now numbering the above 6 Precursor Golems and the many tokens). How many do you have now?
Hint, it's over 9,000.
Well over 9,000.
Thanks. I enjoyed it.
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That's exactly right. Most of my decks have been based on the idea of bringing in big guys really fast, but then it got really one-dimensioned and boring. Also, my friends have caught on to my strategy, so I've incorporated the draw/damage approach.
So pretty much, I have two ways of getting the win. One is to overrun the opponent with It That Betrays, and should that fail, the Crawlers/Jin will be the backup. To be honest, this was my way of 'proofing' my deck so that if one way fails, the other will pick up easily, since both strategies use the same mechanics (tutor+reanimate).
How about this then? You like casting really big effects but want an interesting deck with a versatile strategy...
I bet we can build something utterly awesome with Vesuva.
Isn't that card nuts? Yes! Yes it is.
Why?
Cloudpost.
Two great cards, you can quickly power out anything from a huge Wurmcalling with Buyback to a Mindslaver with recursion. But how do we assemble them?
Scapeshift.
So, how's all the mana in the world sound to you for fun to do whatever you want with? It's a different methodology than your classic reanimator but still lets you play with huge effects very fast.
Like? Or want to stick with reanimator?
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That is an awesome idea that I'll be saving for the future but right now, I'm pretty infatuated with the reanimation strategy so let's stick with that if you wouldn't mind.
By the way, what is recursion? I'm not that up to date with the lingo because I just got back into magic after a four year break. haha
Sure thing. Let's keep bringing things back from the dead.
As for recursion, it means any way to get things you've spent back. For Mindslaver, recursion might be Academy Ruins. For creatures, Genesis.
Now, let's talk about your list.
The main issue is that your Psychosis Crawlers really aren't needed. A basic rule of magic is that if you draw 3+ free cards in a solid deck against your opponent... You're probably going to win. Card advantage matters enormously. Now, with the Core Augur, you're not drawing 3 cards. You're drawing seven. And you're drawing them each turn. What does this mean? Basically - you don't need the crawlers. You will win this game. And that's without even factoring the Augur's second ability to make the opponent discard their hand each turn.
Any game you stick Gitaxis, you will win... Unless something absolutely insane happens. Psychosis Crawler's presence is irrelevant. Trimming the crawler will vastly improve the performance of your deck, I guarantee it.
Does that make sense?
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