Just wondering for you guys out there who play 5 color decks, what types of cards do you use for mana ramp? Do you play stuff like Coalition Relic and Coldsteel Heart and Chromatic Lantern that give you access to mana of any color or do you bank on the fact that you're playing green to play more reliable mana ramp cards like Kodama's Reach and Skyshroud Claim?
My creatures are mainly devoted to color fixing. Arbor Elf is good because I run a full suite of ABU duals for him to untap, and Shaman and Cobra are fueled by a full suite of fetches. Bloom Tender has also been in and out of the deck a number of times so she deserves a mention as well as she has great ramp potential despite not being the best fixer.
This is where the real ramp appears. Ring and Crypt speak for themselves. Diamond both color fixes and puts you ahead (Chrome Mox is another good pick here do do some work in both areas). The deck is primarily GW but also runs Eldrazi Displacer so Talisman essentially works as a three color rock for two mana for me. Things like Fellwar Stone and Chromantic Lantern would also be quite viable here depending on your preferences.
Cradle needs a board to shine of course, but typically when I drop it it will tap for at least three and then just go up from there. Cavern functions much like Mox Diamond in its potential for an explosive start and Displacer's presence in the deck means that even if I don't start with it out it still provides a useful "color". Ancient Tomb is another highly viable choice in this category, as is the Cabal Coffers and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth combo if you can support it.
Also Crop Rotation which could fetch Phyrexian Tower, Thespian's Stage, or Vesuva, but normally I use it to fetch Glacial Chasm (fog), Bojuka Bog (instant grave-hate), Emeria, the Sky Ruin, or the last Plains I need to turn Emeria on.
The fact the the deck has 39 mana-producing lands, 10 fetchlands, and Life from the Loam also generally means I'm not missing land drops.
I don't run most mana rocks, because the deck is designed to recur and sacrifice Child repeatedly. Some games I'm capable of doing it every turn cycle. Or more!
My sliver overlord deck uses 10 duals, 10 fetches, and the various rainbow lands.
It also uses signets and ramp spells.
My most recent addition is shaman of forgotten ways. I'm also loving somberwald sage, and by far the best in a 5-color deck, bloom tender.
Thanks for the replies everyone. So it seems there's no general consensus, but creature-based ramp is popular, which kind of surprises me! I've always preferred spells that search out basic lands because it feels too easy to have your mana and ramp disrupted when you rely on creatures and artifacts. I've been building Tazri and I've crammed in several Cultivate-type effects, but I feel it may be a mistake to rely on green when my deck is pretty budget so I'm not running any fetches.
I'm new to 5 color decks but I think I can break it down a little from what I've experienced with my Sliver Overlord tribal.
I find that you need a little bit of everything to make 5 colors works. However, certain things do take a priority over others.
1. Land base. Land is your biggest resource. The best land base you can really get will include the 10 duals and 10 fetches. If that's a little too much money, get the 10 shocks and the 10 fetches. Throw in some rainbow lands and few basics and you'll be good. Getting a good land base is where you always need to start. It will go a very long way in improving the deck's consistency in the long run.
2. Mana creatures. Most mana creatures like Birds of Paradise, Bloom Tender and others listed above are cheap mana-wise and will help mana fixing. Their low mana cost also ensure that they can help you out early into the game. Creatures like Joiner Adept also help immensely.
3. Spell ramp is always good. Things like Kodama's Reach and Cultivate are simple but adaptable spells that allow you deal with the needs of the moment. A big spell for 5 colors that I don't see a lot of people mentioning is Shard Convergence. You can get 4 different lands right to your hand and doesn't have the basic restriction. If you're running the duals or the shocks, that thing will save you a few headaches.
4. Artifacts can be good. However, I find that the best ones to use are like Darksteel Ingot, something that can tap for any color mana the moment. Chromatic Lantern is king to providing an extra color of mana of your choice but also for giving you a complete land fixing. Something like Fellwar Stone is good only if you're playing multiplayer, which will allow you to get more out of it. Coldsteel Heart isn't bad but it comes in tapped and you must select a color. It's good short term but not you don't always know what you'll draw next, which really make the usefulness of it spotty,
All in all, I say that everything really comes down to preference. You're general, play-style and tactics will really decide what you need. I hope that some of this insight helped.
I like to spread out my ramp options both in type and CMC so that I'm not neutered by certain pieces of hate.
For example, if you only run mana rocks, your mana sources just die to a creeping corrosion. If you only run cards that fetch out lands, you lose to armageddon.
I am not running any fetch lands, but that is just because I am not the biggest fan of them in Commander. My mana base is fairly cheap, shocks, Dragonskull Summit cycle, some five color lands, and all the trilands (Savage Lands and friends). I seldom have mana problems, no more so than any of my other decks, and we all have those times when we keep a greedy hand hoping to draw a color source and just get boned.
Wayfarer's Bauble is a card I have been wanting to find a spot for, as some added insurance for hands that are lacking in the green mana department. It and Expedition Map might not be too much colorless ramp, but a little goes a long way.
Scion might be an odd case because you do not really need to cast many spells in the deck for it to be scary. You just need to be able to produce one of each color and your golden.
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You can go base green then load up on Kodama's Reach and other green goodies (very budget friendly route).
Or if you dont want to go base green just pick all the Darksteel Ingot variants. (affordable but venerable to artifact sweepers.
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Mana Creatures
Arbor Elf
Birds of Paradise
Deathrite Shaman
Noble Hierarch
Lotus Cobra
My creatures are mainly devoted to color fixing. Arbor Elf is good because I run a full suite of ABU duals for him to untap, and Shaman and Cobra are fueled by a full suite of fetches. Bloom Tender has also been in and out of the deck a number of times so she deserves a mention as well as she has great ramp potential despite not being the best fixer.
Mana Rocks
Mana Crypt
Sol Ring
Mox Diamond
Talisman of Unity
This is where the real ramp appears. Ring and Crypt speak for themselves. Diamond both color fixes and puts you ahead (Chrome Mox is another good pick here do do some work in both areas). The deck is primarily GW but also runs Eldrazi Displacer so Talisman essentially works as a three color rock for two mana for me. Things like Fellwar Stone and Chromantic Lantern would also be quite viable here depending on your preferences.
Lands
Gaea's Cradle
Gemstone Cavern
Cradle needs a board to shine of course, but typically when I drop it it will tap for at least three and then just go up from there. Cavern functions much like Mox Diamond in its potential for an explosive start and Displacer's presence in the deck means that even if I don't start with it out it still provides a useful "color". Ancient Tomb is another highly viable choice in this category, as is the Cabal Coffers and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth combo if you can support it.
Hope this gives you some ideas.
- Darksteel Ingot
- Farseek
- Krosan Verge
- Nature's Lore
- Phyrexian Tower
- Sun Titan (recurring fetchlands)
- Tempt with Discovery
- Thespian's Stage (copying land that produces more than 1 mana)
- Vesuva (same)
Also Crop Rotation which could fetch Phyrexian Tower, Thespian's Stage, or Vesuva, but normally I use it to fetch Glacial Chasm (fog), Bojuka Bog (instant grave-hate), Emeria, the Sky Ruin, or the last Plains I need to turn Emeria on.The fact the the deck has 39 mana-producing lands, 10 fetchlands, and Life from the Loam also generally means I'm not missing land drops.
I don't run most mana rocks, because the deck is designed to recur and sacrifice Child repeatedly. Some games I'm capable of doing it every turn cycle. Or more!
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It also uses signets and ramp spells.
My most recent addition is shaman of forgotten ways. I'm also loving somberwald sage, and by far the best in a 5-color deck, bloom tender.
My G Yisan, the Bard of Death G deck.
My BUGWR Hermit druid BUGWR deck.
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I find that you need a little bit of everything to make 5 colors works. However, certain things do take a priority over others.
1. Land base. Land is your biggest resource. The best land base you can really get will include the 10 duals and 10 fetches. If that's a little too much money, get the 10 shocks and the 10 fetches. Throw in some rainbow lands and few basics and you'll be good. Getting a good land base is where you always need to start. It will go a very long way in improving the deck's consistency in the long run.
2. Mana creatures. Most mana creatures like Birds of Paradise, Bloom Tender and others listed above are cheap mana-wise and will help mana fixing. Their low mana cost also ensure that they can help you out early into the game. Creatures like Joiner Adept also help immensely.
3. Spell ramp is always good. Things like Kodama's Reach and Cultivate are simple but adaptable spells that allow you deal with the needs of the moment. A big spell for 5 colors that I don't see a lot of people mentioning is Shard Convergence. You can get 4 different lands right to your hand and doesn't have the basic restriction. If you're running the duals or the shocks, that thing will save you a few headaches.
4. Artifacts can be good. However, I find that the best ones to use are like Darksteel Ingot, something that can tap for any color mana the moment. Chromatic Lantern is king to providing an extra color of mana of your choice but also for giving you a complete land fixing. Something like Fellwar Stone is good only if you're playing multiplayer, which will allow you to get more out of it. Coldsteel Heart isn't bad but it comes in tapped and you must select a color. It's good short term but not you don't always know what you'll draw next, which really make the usefulness of it spotty,
All in all, I say that everything really comes down to preference. You're general, play-style and tactics will really decide what you need. I hope that some of this insight helped.
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For example, if you only run mana rocks, your mana sources just die to a creeping corrosion. If you only run cards that fetch out lands, you lose to armageddon.
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BRGProssh, Skyraider of Kher ($100)
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I am not running any fetch lands, but that is just because I am not the biggest fan of them in Commander. My mana base is fairly cheap, shocks, Dragonskull Summit cycle, some five color lands, and all the trilands (Savage Lands and friends). I seldom have mana problems, no more so than any of my other decks, and we all have those times when we keep a greedy hand hoping to draw a color source and just get boned.
Wayfarer's Bauble is a card I have been wanting to find a spot for, as some added insurance for hands that are lacking in the green mana department. It and Expedition Map might not be too much colorless ramp, but a little goes a long way.
Scion might be an odd case because you do not really need to cast many spells in the deck for it to be scary. You just need to be able to produce one of each color and your golden.