MTG Salvation

I think Painful Truths, Dig Through Time, and Treasure Cruise are necessary - they create so much advantage for little mana. Electrolyze seems weaker after the banning of Yisan, but the other burn spells seem pretty good too.

Quote from capitacom »

I think Painful Truths, Dig Through Time, and Treasure Cruise are necessary - they create so much advantage for little mana. Electrolyze seems weaker after the banning of Yisan, but the other burn spells seem pretty good too.

Thx for the input, I think I'll try taking these out for em.

• 1 Swamp
  
• Immolating Souleater
  
• Thrill-Kill Assassin
  
• Wretched Anurid
  
• Hypnotic Specter
  
• Mirri the Cursed

I kinda want to give Homeward Path and Arcane Lighthouse a shot too. Think I can afford more colourless lands? What lands should I cut for em?

Quote from Sink-Error »

Per your request in the other thread, if you really want to shift over to beating Narset, take out all the targeted removal like terminate and replace it with lesser burn that can also go to the face like Lightning Strike, or sac effects like Diabolic Edict. Having terminate in your opener vs Narset is like starting on a 6 card hand. sink hole and Price of progress are also good. Inquisition of Kozilek is a must, as is wasteland. I would also drop cloudfin raptor, only great in turn 1. I would also consider Spellshock, Lava Hounds, Scab-Clan Berserker, Keldon Champion, Chandra's Phoenix and Sulfuric Vortex over cards like prophetic flamespeaker, which is slow, anemic and easy to remove. Avalance riders and Fulminator mage are ways of pressuring her manabase, which narset players typically don't like.

Thank you so much for taking the time to help me out! I gotta say most of those are EXCELLENT reccomendations. Here are my thoughts on em.

Will definately Include:

• Lightning Strike
  
• Sinkhole
  
• Price of Progress
  
• Spellshock
  
• Scab-Clan Berserker

Not quite sold on (yet):
Inquisition of Kosilek - Is it really that good? I hate that it can't grab 4mana wraths. Can't tell you how many times I'd play this and I'd see the *** about to ruin me next turn.

Chandra's Phoenix - I want to add this so badly, I just wonder if I have enough red burn to trigger the ability.

Sulfuric Vortex - Is this to slow for 3 mana?

Fulminator Mage - I used to run this and I suppose I could try it again. I just found it so underwhelming against the multitude of green decks.

Don't Like:
Cloudfin Raptor I'm gonna keep this guy in, he is such a house in this deck. Marchesa returns creatures to play triggering evolve. Outside of marchesa the deck has token generators, creatures that reanimate thenselves, Grenzo etc. It's pretty easy to trigger evolve.

Lava Hounds - Marchesa is my go to 4drop. I don't think I really need more then what I'm currently running.

Keldon Champion - Same as Lava Hounds

Avalanche Riders - Same as Lava hounds and Fulminator Mage.

I totally agree with taking out the non burn targeted removal for more burn. What other burn spells would you reccomend? What do you think of Incinerate and Burst Lightning?

Quote from Sink-Error »

Yes on incinerate and maybe Searing Spear. What sort of green strats are you fearing? Marath? Anafenza? I can see you struggling with Anafenza's toughness and I'm not sure about Marath, but with Yizan gone you shouldn't be in too much of a bind. IoK is a amazing, seriously, it takes cantrips, counterspells, removal and card draw. Not being able to take the wrath is often less important than you think, you know its there and can play around it.

Jenara, Marath, Anafenza. All of these guys can be jerks but I can beat em. These matchups aren't nearly as bad as Animar, Narset and Sidisi. I may have to fear the GW's more once I switch from targeted removal to burn. Anfenza is extra tough cause she turns off the reanimation part of Marchesa

Quote from Etienne »

lightning axe
... (secretly pushing the discard build ^^)

Lol, the point of these changes is to have burn that targets creature or player. That way when we face off against Narset (or Geist for that matter) we don't have dead cards in our hand. I've been having a really hard time against Narset.

So I made a few changes based on Sink-Error's suggestions.
In

• Lightning Strike
  
• Incinerate
  
• Burning Sperar
  
• Inquisition of Kosilek
  
• Scan-Clan Berserker

Out

• Terminate
  
• Ulcerate
  
• Dismember
  
• Prophetic Flamespeaker
  
• Gitaxian Probe

I can't quite seems to fit Sinkhole, Price of Progress or Spellshock in the list. Any idea's on what to take out or should I just leave the list alone?

Quote from Sink-Error »

I wouldn't cut Probe, as it gives you so much info and is free to cast. I would, however, consider cutting Wingcrafter, Viscera Seer and Prized Amalgam and squeezing Wasteland and Blighted Fen into your Manabase.

I guess I could try cutting a couple 1 drops. I need at least 15 T1 cards to have a decent chance of having a T1 play. I'm at 17 (if I count discard) so I could lose a couple. Wingrafter is a fairly easy cut so ill put git probe back in there. Viscera Seer has really strong synergy with marchesa but I have found him a bit win-more in that regard. Good call I'll cut him. Prized Amaglam? I havent even tried him yet to know how good he'd be. I kinda want to keep him in because he can't be countered or board wiped, at least not permanently. Currently my general plus 5 other creatures are able to trigger him, think that's enough or do you think I would need more? What do you think of Hellhole Flailer? I'd consider cutting him.

I'll cut the check lands for those 2 lands you mentioned. I want to try Arcane Lighthouse too. Im getting nervous of running to many colourless utility lands in tri colour. How much is to much?

Quote from Sink-Error »

Not sure what to think of Hellhole Flailer, but I look at him and can't help wishing he had haste for that manacost. I don't think 5 is anywhere near enough to trigger prized amalgam though. Mostly he'll be a disappointing 3/3 for 3. I don't often play 3 colour, but you have so much fixing I'm pretty sure you can drop the likes of Dragon skull summit for them.

Well I cut Hellhole Flailer to fit Spellshock in. Still don't like the Amalgam even with the Marchesa synergy eh? I want to compare him to Bloodghast but I guess haste puts it over the top value wise. Maybe I'll reconsider Fullminator Mage in his slot.

Edit: Actually I think I'd rather put Mardu Strike Leader back in. He was what I took out for the amalgam and I see him being used in Tymaret lists now.

On mtg top8 Tymaret seems to he seeing a fair bit of play lately. This list in particular has done quite well: http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=11405&d=264718&f=EDH

I was wondering what you guys think of the list and if there are any cards we should adopt? A few that catch my eye are Banefire, Captain's Claws and Grafted Wargear

Edit: I think I'll add in those two equipment spells. Not sure what to cut tho Maybe Char and Psyonic Blast. The Tymaret list isn't running Char eithor

a couple changes

Now that yisan is gone I find Hex Parasite pretty much useless without Marchesa and I dislike cards that require the general to be any good. I'm also cutting Grim Lavamamcer because I find it to be a simple 1/1 for 1 most of the time, especially when Marchesa is denying creatures from staying in the GY. Just putting in the rest of the 1cmc 2/2's I have access to in their place: Phantasmal Bear and Diregraf Ghoul.

Goblin Glory Chaser is also worth considering.

Finally an EMN card for Marchesa

http://mythicspoiler.com/emn/cards/mausoleumwanderer.html

Not sure whether to run this in addition to or intead of Cursecatcher. Probably instead of, I find cursecatcher just a bit underwhelming.

Oh and Hanweir Garrison.

http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=12987&d=275738&f=EDH

Woot, Marchesa Represent!

Looks VERY different from my current list and a lot more loke my old list. It's hard to argue with when it got 2nd out of 118 players.

I was about to post that exact link in case no one's seen it yet since it was under "other". The deck is actually a twin-exarch deck using grixis colors instead of the usual temur. It's got a lot less synergy with Marchesa at the helm but black gives it access to tutors and the very underrated Lim-Dul's Vault. Not exactly sure what Marchesa and dethrone brings to the table in that list though, but I can see people getting thrown off at tournaments. Very good use of the control aspect of grixis, with a surprise combo finish. I like it.

Quote from yujipooji »

I was about to post that exact link in case no one's seen it yet since it was under "other". The deck is actually a twin-exarch deck using grixis colors instead of the usual temur. It's got a lot less synergy with Marchesa at the helm but black gives it access to tutors and the very underrated Lim-Dul's Vault. Not exactly sure what Marchesa and dethrone brings to the table in that list though, but I can see people getting thrown off at tournaments. Very good use of the control aspect of grixis, with a surprise combo finish. I like it.

My thoughts exactly. If I'm being completely honest with myself the midrange and aggro lists I've run could not get second place out of 118. Marchesa and dethrone do bring a few things to the table. She is good at blinking creatures in and out of the GY such as Imperial Tutor, You can tutor both combo pieces this way. She is also decent at protecting your creatures from death which in twin could be useful for keeping that Exarch alive until you can play the Twin.

I haven't had time to test that list yet, but I have a feeling its the best direction to take with Marchesa. Especually considering seeing how well Alex Loskoutoff's list performed.

@kriggy Agreed about the interchangability. Tetsuo might actually even have more utility, and costs 1 less. But Marchesa's a nice decoy, since opponents might expect ETB shenanigans via dethrone but all they'll be getting is a very scary combo-control that can kill quite easily if the opponent is unprepared. And i guess marchesa can also turn glen elendra archmage into a soft lock of sorts.

@reaper I posted at the start of this thread that Grixis has amazing control muscle that would be a waste to flex, but at the time I couldn't reconcile the game plan.. Control, sure, then what? This guy answered that it seems. You can tutor for the pieces and protect it with counterspells and the like, add sweepers and removal to keep aggro in check and a small hand disrupt package against fellow combo decks.

You'll also want to consider the big picture:

1.) Matchup-wise, I don't like that it lost to Nin. I think that bit matters more than it seems because the top control decks in the meta Narset and Keranos use izzet colors and have been more successful than Nin in tournaments, so hopefully that loss was a a situational thing and not an actual mismatch.

2.) I'm trying to look at it objectively and see who rocks twin-exarch better.. Surrak or Marchesa? The combo revolves around creatures and Green has a lot of creature tutors, not to mention things like birthing pod, survival of the fittest and evolutionary leap. Surrak himself boasts undeniable synergy with the combo by making it more difficult to interact with.

Marhcesa on the other hand has black, so tutors are definitely there, with sweepers, hand disrupt and a better removal set as a plus. I feel like the list needed more tutors. I wouldn't mind losing even my own commander to diabolic intent if it meant finding that one piece that can just cause you to win. And speaking of finding the final piece to win, demonic consultation is legit here. If all those tutors are run, I think Grixis will definitely be able to deploy the combo more consistently than Temur can.
With treasure cruise and dig through time banned, I think there'll be room for more tutors.

...now that I think about it, Surrak also has bullsh*t like defense of the heart and chord of calling. That's tough to beat. Still though, can't argue with 2nd place. I agree that going this route will pay off.

Also consider how you may not permanently lose the creature you sac to Diabolic Intent or Sidisi, Undead Vizier.

Combining Marchesa with a creature with undying/unleash + contanimation provides a good soft lock for non-black decks

I've been taking a break from the black rose for a while. I still like the deck but I needed a change. No matter how fun or awesome a deck is I get bored after a while. Eventually I will come back and update the OP with my more current list. After seeing the Marchesa Exarch list on top 8 I want to try pushing the deck that direction too. I had more success going the aggro route than I did midrange but it's certainly inferior to decks like Zurgo and Thalia and I believe the combo list to be stronger.

On a side note Fretwork Colony looks pretty decent for the aggro lists. Not sure if it will make the cut for combo though.

Mine is multiplayer, but any thoughts on my list would be appreciated.

https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/chaotic-echo/

Quote from Ender666666 »

Mine is multiplayer, but any thoughts on my list would be appreciated.

https://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/chaotic-echo/

Massive Necro but sure why not
Haven't played the deck in years so I'm pretty rusty but I'll do my best.

Edit: I just responded on TappedOut. My username is Aphoticate