havent added mana crypt yet (will wait till i get home for that) but so far this is what i am running i just couldnt find a good use for the praetor's grasp so i just added the prejudice over it, took temple out for tundra and coliseum for the bazaar
Good idea! I don't have one yet. Never got around to trading for it. Planeswalker aren't very useful unless there are Nicol Bolas or Liliana Vess or Tezzeret or Sorrin Markov. Their abilities are more game changing compared the other 18.
+ City of Traitors
+ Fleshbag Marauder
+ Sword of Light and Shadow
+ Visions of Beyond
I will make space for Lim-Dul's Vault soon. It's won me so many games, it deserves a spot in my deck again.
How's your version treating you? I took out all my wrath effects :P. I almost never have to use Oblivion Stone, so that got the cut. Fleshbag Marauder has been a champ. It acts like a board wipe because most decks I play against have 1 or 2 creatures out.
so far i am only doing test draws at work due to work sched so i havent been able to test it out properly and i cant do a test vs my Zur EDH due to Zur being so cutthroat in comparison to this one and Zur is a much faster general to get out overall and sharuum just doesnt have that many answers for him once he does the first swing
but so far im still trying to figure out when to pull her into the field in comparison to the rest of the times since sometimes i just get lucky with the draws and get something real aggressive (stoneforge down with swords of fire/ice, war/peace and sculpting steel copying fire/ice) this really did happen while doing test draws...had them equipped on the trinket mage
Hmm if Zur is your issue add more Edict effects, take out some more expensive spot removal like Steel Hellkite. I updated my list for meta, check it out. It might give an insight on what I have to deal with.
She's not fast enough as Zur, but she can sure beat everyone else :P. It also takes practice, you'll be much better in a few weeks.
o i know once i get a chance to test it in its real environment (multiplayer) i will get a better idea of what to do but that might be till saturday or sunday
Greetings, interesting list you got here. I started my sharuum deck as traditional combo deck, but I've been turning it in to sort of voltron and I might aswell tune it bit more stax'y.
What do you think of Thopter Assembly? I'm already running Sword of the Meek + Thopter Foundry combination and was thinking if I should add Thopter Assembly and Time Sieve in the list.
Also, do you have any good suggestions for budget friendly stax cards?
why the change on the steel hellkite? just curious
city of traitors is kinda iffy due to the next land coming in killing it but it does give you 2 mana per tap so its good in a way but with 1 per deck its kinda hard to make it work properly
EDIT: i personally would have kept sunder its a good option for finishing up the game and locking all your opponents out (and making them discard alot >: D )
why the change on the steel hellkite? just curious
city of traitors is kinda iffy due to the next land coming in killing it but it does give you 2 mana per tap so its good in a way but with 1 per deck its kinda hard to make it work properly
EDIT: i personally would have kept sunder its a good option for finishing up the game and locking all your opponents out (and making them discard alot >: D )
I might space for Sunder once more, but Armageddon effects are sooo much more effect than Sunder. I don't have an Discard effects besides Windfall. I want more mass land destruction spells like Catastrophe and Desolation Angel first. I just need to make space.
Stell Hellkite is lackluster, better in a hardcore Stax build with little no win conditions. It looks good on paper, but under performs in practice.
City of Traitors depends on your style. My friend needed it for a deck, so I took it out for more basics. I don't want to totally lose to Blood Moon/Magus of the Moon :P.
well dont forget sunder does have the advantage over all the others being instant something that geddon lacks and sure it gets rid of the lands but if your up against ppl that can make them indistructible (rarely happens though) or has/uses anything with darksteel in its name (on the lands) its better to sunder the lands than to geddon/desolation angel (though the angel is also a beater after the effect so it can work)
catastrophe is different since it makes the caster choose what to keep and what goes (whether its lands or creatures) but for that i would rather do cataclysm but that too can be a double edged sword
PS too bad balance is not allowed in EDH/Commander
by far one of the best ways to wreck an opponents lands cheaply (mana wise) (if you combo it with zuran orb + crucible of worlds) since its a sacrifice rather than a destroy effect
Heya, I'm actually building a stax version of sharuum myself and if you wouldn't mind I'd like to post my list in your topic later to compare/avoid cluttering the board with duplicate topics.
Anyway, I'm building a slightly more combocentric/timmycentric build, kind of a mix of yours and bitterroot's.
Probably the biggest difference is my running lion's eye diamond and mana crypt which with paris mulling gives me good odds of hitting a T1 "fastmana" card (also includes sol ring, mana vault, grim monolith to a lesser extent, and ancient tomb)
With this, a T3/4 Sharuum looks possible.
I'm also using higher manacost stuff so no confidant - darksteel forge, lattice, et al - mainly because I plan to have many discard outlets, windfall, LED, artificer's intuition (all these will be cardtagged when I post my list probably in 60 hours or so, sometime sunday) and as such dumping DSF and casting sharuum in the same turn is always possible and very potent.
I'm also going to try 2 other strategies - tangle wire + other counter cards + proliferate (contagion engine so I can wipe token decks) and howling mine, static orb, and something that taps/untaps artifacts - my gut tells me clock of omens will be okay.
(also I'mma test unwinding clock, as it's seedborn muse in this deck essentially - that seems pretty sweet!) If I can find cards that love tapping and untapping (icy manipulator?) using unwinding clock could be ridiculous.
Of course these will dilute and weaken the deck - but I want to have something that can get a good lock on the board or play a non-super mean game if required.
Overall I do like your list - as said mana crypt, LED are the main cards not in the list, along with tundra et al, but I understand the price issue.
I'd take out nihil spellbomb and tormod's crypt - the only gravehates that are good IMO are bojuka bog and leyline of the void.
With leyline you can throw in helm of obedience to randomly kill one player very fast - excellent if total lockdown fails. Plus helm is so easy to revive for us. People say it's weak since it only kills 1 player and I can see why they feel that way, but I think it's underestimated. Quickly knocking out the most advanced player if you have an opening with leyline is cool. I mean - it is a douche card though and I'm sure it was mentioned earlier in the thread.
I really dislike tormod crypt and bomb because they're hate against a specific decktype, which even if grave decks are super prevelant, I think should be kept to the sideboard.
Further, the fact that they're uselees against nongravedecks - but yeah, that's just my opinion.
EDIT:
One more addition! Snapcaster Mage! I feel he's great for reusing tutors, draw cards, counters or whatever we need.
Heya, I'm actually building a stax version of sharuum myself and if you wouldn't mind I'd like to post my list in your topic later to compare/avoid cluttering the board with duplicate topics.
Anyway, I'm building a slightly more combocentric/timmycentric build, kind of a mix of yours and bitterroot's.
Probably the biggest difference is my running lion's eye diamond and mana crypt which with paris mulling gives me good odds of hitting a T1 "fastmana" card (also includes sol ring, mana vault, grim monolith to a lesser extent, and ancient tomb)
With this, a T3/4 Sharuum looks possible.
I'm also using higher manacost stuff so no confidant - darksteel forge, lattice, et al - mainly because I plan to have many discard outlets, windfall, LED, artificer's intuition (all these will be cardtagged when I post my list probably in 60 hours or so, sometime sunday) and as such dumping DSF and casting sharuum in the same turn is always possible and very potent.
I'm also going to try 2 other strategies - tangle wire + other counter cards + proliferate (contagion engine so I can wipe token decks) and howling mine, static orb, and something that taps/untaps artifacts - my gut tells me clock of omens will be okay.
(also I'mma test unwinding clock, as it's seedborn muse in this deck essentially - that seems pretty sweet!) If I can find cards that love tapping and untapping (icy manipulator?) using unwinding clock could be ridiculous.
Of course these will dilute and weaken the deck - but I want to have something that can get a good lock on the board or play a non-super mean game if required.
Overall I do like your list - as said mana crypt, LED are the main cards not in the list, along with tundra et al, but I understand the price issue.
I'd take out nihil spellbomb and tormod's crypt - the only gravehates that are good IMO are bojuka bog and leyline of the void.
With leyline you can throw in helm of obedience to randomly kill one player very fast - excellent if total lockdown fails. Plus helm is so easy to revive for us. People say it's weak since it only kills 1 player and I can see why they feel that way, but I think it's underestimated. Quickly knocking out the most advanced player if you have an opening with leyline is cool. I mean - it is a douche card though and I'm sure it was mentioned earlier in the thread.
I really dislike tormod crypt and bomb because they're hate against a specific decktype, which even if grave decks are super prevelant, I think should be kept to the sideboard.
Further, the fact that they're uselees against nongravedecks - but yeah, that's just my opinion.
EDIT:
One more addition! Snapcaster Mage! I feel he's great for reusing tutors, draw cards, counters or whatever we need.
- To answer your question about the cost of Mana Crypt, Tundra and LED. I have a Lion's Eye Diamond, but I need to practice with it more to learn how to properly use it. The other two I could have gotten, but I'm not aggressively trading for them like I should be. They aren't that expensive, it's not Tabernacle or Workshop.
- I got the bulk of what your requesting and I'll will give you my response.
- The idea of fast mana is great and all, but if you exceed more than 12 mana rocks you might dead in the water against Aura Shards if that resolves with no answer in hand. Most the time decks who depend on a enchantment to beat you and creatures have already lost the game, but that's another story.
- Don't listen to those types of people's advice. My guess they are the same people who agree that spot removal is overrated. They fail to see how effective destroying a single create is better than wiping the board. I've learned a long time ago to proper pick my batters especially if your playing to win and Sharuum the Hegemon Stax EDH is the deck for that.
- Be sure you have over 35 artifacts to make Artificer's Intuition consistent. Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas and Magister Sphinx is a win condition you might want to include. In a Stax deck, you only need like 3-5 win conditions because most the time your opponents will have scooped or rage quit.
Make sure you include Armageddon, Smokestack, Trinsiphere, Lodestone Golem, Sphere of Resistance, Nethervoid (maybe), various lock pieces that you haven't already mentioned.
- All those Crypt effect are really a meta call. All of my friends play recursion/re-animator. I don't like being put at 10 or having a Primeval Titan or Sundering Titan on my opponent side of the board on before my turn 2/3.
- Snapcaster Mage will come later. I have been modifying my deck recently. I need to pick up a few if not a playset for my EDH decks. I've made it stronger and Stax-tastic. I will post an updated deck list for you.
Keep in touch. I'm pretty useful when it comes to Stax and Sharuum builds. Most people's opinion on here is questionable, they let their emotions take control of themselves. That's the worst way to build a deck, if you want to win, you have to be rude.
1x Sharuum the Hegemon
[Big creatures] [2]
1x Magister Sphinx
1x Serra Ascendant
[Stax/Tokens/Land Destruction] [14]
1x Braids, Cabal Minion
1x In the Eye of Chaos
1x Invoke Prejudice
1x Lodestone Golem
1x Nether Void
1x Smokestack
1x Trinisphere
1x Winter Orb
1x Bitterblossom
1x Sword of the Meek
1x Thopter Foundry
1x Armageddon
1x Death Cloud
1x Sundering Titan
[Ramp] [11]
1x Azorius Signet
1x Basalt Monolith
1x Coalition Relic
1x Dimir Signet
1x Grim Monolith
1x Mana Vault
1x Mox Diamond
1x Orzhov Signet
1x Sol Ring
1x Talisman of Dominance
1x Talisman of Progress
[Draw/Tutors] [19]
1x Courier's Capsule
1x Dark Confidant
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Enlightened Tutor
1x Entomb
1x Fact or Fiction
1x Intuition
1x Memory Jar
1x Mystical Tutor
1x Necropotence
1x Phyrexian Arena
1x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Stoneforge Mystic
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Tezzeret the Seeker
1x Thirst for Knowledge
1x Trinket Mage
1x Vampiric Tutor
1x Windfall
1x Diabolic Edict
1x Dismember
1x Mind Twist
1x Path to Exile
1x Steel Hellkite
1x Swords to Plowshares
1x Vindicate
1x Crucible of Worlds
1x Reanimate
1x Sun Titan
1x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Phantasmal Image
1x Phyrexian Metamorph
1x Sculpting Steel
1x Sword of War and Peace
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Umezawa's Jitte
[Lands] [36]
1x Academy Ruins
1x Bojuka Bog
1x Buried Ruin
1x Cabal Pit
1x Bazaar of Baghdad
1x Ghost Quarter
1x Maze of Ith
1x Phyrexian Tower
1x Strip Mine
1x Wasteland
1x Bloodstained Mire
1x Flooded Strand
1x Marsh Flats
1x Misty Rainforest
1x Polluted Delta
1x Scalding Tarn
1x Verdant Catacombs
1x Ancient Tomb
1x City of Brass
1x Command Tower
1x Fetid Heath
1x Godless Shrine
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Mystic Gate
1x River of Tears
1x Scrubland
1x Seat of the Synod
1x Snow-Covered Island
1x Snow-Covered Swamp
1x Sunken Ruins
1x Tundra
1x Underground Sea
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Vault of Whispers
1x Watery Grave
EDIT: im still wondering if its a good idea to add Scroll Rack for hand fixing
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
since his + ability basically does Diabolic Vision or Impulsefor artifacts and his - ability gives you a creature which can be good at times
just giving ideas to help out
Good idea! I don't have one yet. Never got around to trading for it. Planeswalker aren't very useful unless there are Nicol Bolas or Liliana Vess or Tezzeret or Sorrin Markov. Their abilities are more game changing compared the other 18.
+ City of Traitors
+ Fleshbag Marauder
+ Sword of Light and Shadow
+ Visions of Beyond
- Courier's Capsule
- Buried Ruin
- Mox Diamond
- Ghost Quarter
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
but you can also try the previously mentioned cards (diabolic vision, impulse) or even Lim-Dûl's Vault
How's your version treating you? I took out all my wrath effects :P. I almost never have to use Oblivion Stone, so that got the cut. Fleshbag Marauder has been a champ. It acts like a board wipe because most decks I play against have 1 or 2 creatures out.
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
but so far im still trying to figure out when to pull her into the field in comparison to the rest of the times since sometimes i just get lucky with the draws and get something real aggressive (stoneforge down with swords of fire/ice, war/peace and sculpting steel copying fire/ice) this really did happen while doing test draws...had them equipped on the trinket mage
She's not fast enough as Zur, but she can sure beat everyone else :P. It also takes practice, you'll be much better in a few weeks.
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
Take notes man, 1v1 is weird compared to mutli-player.
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
What do you think of Thopter Assembly? I'm already running Sword of the Meek + Thopter Foundry combination and was thinking if I should add Thopter Assembly and Time Sieve in the list.
Also, do you have any good suggestions for budget friendly stax cards?
+ Cruel Tutor
+ Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
+ Mox Diamond
+ Snow-Covered Plains
- Steel Hellkite
- Fleshbag Marauder
- Sunder
- City of Traitors
Tell me what you think!
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
why the change on the steel hellkite? just curious
city of traitors is kinda iffy due to the next land coming in killing it but it does give you 2 mana per tap so its good in a way but with 1 per deck its kinda hard to make it work properly
EDIT: i personally would have kept sunder its a good option for finishing up the game and locking all your opponents out (and making them discard alot >: D )
I might space for Sunder once more, but Armageddon effects are sooo much more effect than Sunder. I don't have an Discard effects besides Windfall. I want more mass land destruction spells like Catastrophe and Desolation Angel first. I just need to make space.
Stell Hellkite is lackluster, better in a hardcore Stax build with little no win conditions. It looks good on paper, but under performs in practice.
City of Traitors depends on your style. My friend needed it for a deck, so I took it out for more basics. I don't want to totally lose to Blood Moon/Magus of the Moon :P.
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
catastrophe is different since it makes the caster choose what to keep and what goes (whether its lands or creatures) but for that i would rather do cataclysm but that too can be a double edged sword
PS too bad balance is not allowed in EDH/Commander
by far one of the best ways to wreck an opponents lands cheaply (mana wise) (if you combo it with zuran orb + crucible of worlds) since its a sacrifice rather than a destroy effect
Cataclysm should be paired with Eldrazis'. Any of them work because they at least have to sacrifice 2 permanents.
How's your deck building going? I made a lot of small changes throughout the week, but it's pretty much the same.
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
+ Darksteel Citadel
+ Relic of Progenitus (More grave hate with draw)
- Maze of Ith (It's lost it's power since all the creatures my group attacks with has Hexproof/shroud or Titans :P)
- Cabal Pit
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
- Umezawa's Jitte
- Cruel Tutor
- Scalding Tarn
- Sword of the Meek
- Thopter Foundry
- Death Cloud
- In the Eye of Chaos
+ Rings of Brighthearth
+ Deep Analysis
+ Sword of Light and Shadow
+ Miren, the Moaning Well
+ Consecrated Sphinx
+ Yawgmoth's Will
+ Dust Bowl
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
I have Thopter Foundry, Sword of the Meek, and Time Sieve set aside.
Maybe another possibility, Torpor Orb, Hokori, Dust Drinker, and Aven Mindcensor.
They both draw hate, but what would more effective and consistent?
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
- 1x Deep Analysis
- 1x Temple of the False Gods
- 1x Darksteel Citadel
- 1x Snow-Covered Plains
+ 1x Time Spiral
+ 1x Mana Vortex
+ 1x Mox Opal
+ 1x Mishra's Factory
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW
Anyway, I'm building a slightly more combocentric/timmycentric build, kind of a mix of yours and bitterroot's.
Probably the biggest difference is my running lion's eye diamond and mana crypt which with paris mulling gives me good odds of hitting a T1 "fastmana" card (also includes sol ring, mana vault, grim monolith to a lesser extent, and ancient tomb)
With this, a T3/4 Sharuum looks possible.
I'm also using higher manacost stuff so no confidant - darksteel forge, lattice, et al - mainly because I plan to have many discard outlets, windfall, LED, artificer's intuition (all these will be cardtagged when I post my list probably in 60 hours or so, sometime sunday) and as such dumping DSF and casting sharuum in the same turn is always possible and very potent.
I'm also going to try 2 other strategies - tangle wire + other counter cards + proliferate (contagion engine so I can wipe token decks) and howling mine, static orb, and something that taps/untaps artifacts - my gut tells me clock of omens will be okay.
(also I'mma test unwinding clock, as it's seedborn muse in this deck essentially - that seems pretty sweet!) If I can find cards that love tapping and untapping (icy manipulator?) using unwinding clock could be ridiculous.
Of course these will dilute and weaken the deck - but I want to have something that can get a good lock on the board or play a non-super mean game if required.
Overall I do like your list - as said mana crypt, LED are the main cards not in the list, along with tundra et al, but I understand the price issue.
I'd take out nihil spellbomb and tormod's crypt - the only gravehates that are good IMO are bojuka bog and leyline of the void.
With leyline you can throw in helm of obedience to randomly kill one player very fast - excellent if total lockdown fails. Plus helm is so easy to revive for us. People say it's weak since it only kills 1 player and I can see why they feel that way, but I think it's underestimated. Quickly knocking out the most advanced player if you have an opening with leyline is cool. I mean - it is a douche card though and I'm sure it was mentioned earlier in the thread.
I really dislike tormod crypt and bomb because they're hate against a specific decktype, which even if grave decks are super prevelant, I think should be kept to the sideboard.
Further, the fact that they're uselees against nongravedecks - but yeah, that's just my opinion.
EDIT:
One more addition! Snapcaster Mage! I feel he's great for reusing tutors, draw cards, counters or whatever we need.
UWBSharuum the HegemonBWU
UAzami, Lady of ScrollsU
UGMomir Vig, Simic VisionaryGU
GAzusa, Lost but SeekingG
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestGU
- To answer your question about the cost of Mana Crypt, Tundra and LED. I have a Lion's Eye Diamond, but I need to practice with it more to learn how to properly use it. The other two I could have gotten, but I'm not aggressively trading for them like I should be. They aren't that expensive, it's not Tabernacle or Workshop.
- I got the bulk of what your requesting and I'll will give you my response.
- The idea of fast mana is great and all, but if you exceed more than 12 mana rocks you might dead in the water against Aura Shards if that resolves with no answer in hand. Most the time decks who depend on a enchantment to beat you and creatures have already lost the game, but that's another story.
- Don't listen to those types of people's advice. My guess they are the same people who agree that spot removal is overrated. They fail to see how effective destroying a single create is better than wiping the board. I've learned a long time ago to proper pick my batters especially if your playing to win and Sharuum the Hegemon Stax EDH is the deck for that.
- Leyline of the Void + Helm of Obedience is amazing. It's a great win condition, include it in your list if you have space.
- Be sure you have over 35 artifacts to make Artificer's Intuition consistent. Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas and Magister Sphinx is a win condition you might want to include. In a Stax deck, you only need like 3-5 win conditions because most the time your opponents will have scooped or rage quit.
- Your win conditions could be these.
* Sharuum, herself
* Magister Sphinx
* Tezzeret the Seeker
* Tezzert, Agent of Bolas
* Jace, the Mindsculptor
* Desolation Angel
Make sure you include Armageddon, Smokestack, Trinsiphere, Lodestone Golem, Sphere of Resistance, Nethervoid (maybe), various lock pieces that you haven't already mentioned.
- All those Crypt effect are really a meta call. All of my friends play recursion/re-animator. I don't like being put at 10 or having a Primeval Titan or Sundering Titan on my opponent side of the board on before my turn 2/3.
- Snapcaster Mage will come later. I have been modifying my deck recently. I need to pick up a few if not a playset for my EDH decks. I've made it stronger and Stax-tastic. I will post an updated deck list for you.
Keep in touch. I'm pretty useful when it comes to Stax and Sharuum builds. Most people's opinion on here is questionable, they let their emotions take control of themselves. That's the worst way to build a deck, if you want to win, you have to be rude.
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW