Thank you so much. I already had my eyes on Yawgmoth, but I have never played with Necropotence even though I know it's a very strong card. To be honest I don't quiet understand the card, and how to use it, but know I guess I have to learn
I see btw that you almost don't run any removal. Do you rely on pushing through with your Vampires, or that your other opponents just takes care of it? I quickly find my self as the arch nemesis in the game, for obvious reasons, so ppl are hesitant when it comes to remove anything that works against me, meaning I almost always have to fight my own battles, and can't rely on politics like with other decks.
Does this deck only win if one doens't run into too many wipes? What was your game plan?
Necropotence - essentially it lets you refill your hand every turn at the cost of life. Being that you are the aggro player use your HP pool to get yourself resources. The way you lose the game tends to be because you run out of resources or the game goes long rather than health hitting zero. I mean, eventually you die to hp hitting zero but its usually because you failed at your primary goal of being the aggressor.
Removal - I run a little bit. My answer is to kill the player that is being the problem rather than removing their things. Don't try to answer everything, just run people down and answer what you have to. Its part of why most of the answers I do run are very versatile in targeting instead of having things like Swords to Plowshares. Who cares whats in play if you are killing that player through it. Target priority and killing the right person first is a big thing too.
Wraths - Keep drawing cards and you will be fine. I can think of some games where I would eat a wrath every turn and be fine because I kept my draw going. If you stop drawing that is when a wrath will wreck you.
Selfless Spirit - Its ok. Keep in mind that it won't protect from every type of wrath and wraths aren't the only thing that can cause problems. An opponent walks right through this with a Toxic Deluge for example. Personally I think that people over focus the idea of wraths as the problem for this deck and my issue with most wrath protection effects is how they are often situational or require mana to stay up and be responsive. Selfless is far from the worst of these and I think if you want to run it its probably fine, just be aware of the drawbacks of it as well. Most anything that isn't a vampire in some way or another competes for a slot in the list.
Obelisk of Urd / Venerated Loxodon - I haven't gotten enough testing in with Obelisk to really comment much on it. I have been playing the list a bit less of late but I think the difference between Obelisk and Loxodon are quite big. Keep in mind that you can have any number of vampires taking the buff of Obelisk which is also twice as powerful as Loxodon and you can attack with the improved power of Obelisk this turn where as Loxodon has a big wait before its buff picks up given you just tapped down the ones you buffed. While I am still not sure how I feel about Obelisk, I would say that Loxodon is less than 1/4 as good in my mind for the deck.
What do you think about Rankle, Master of Pranks? His ability to sacrifice creatures seems good to keep opponents' boards clear while we have tokens to spare. If opponents don't have threatening creatures, the hand attack can be strong, and we likely run enough draw to compensate anyway.
Rankle, Master of Pranks - Outside of the fact that its a 4 mana non vampire, yea I dig it. All of the effects are relevant for the deck. I guess my issue is that I don't know that it does enough for a 4 mana non vampire. We are trying to move so fast and every turn we tend to have a lot of demands on our mana. Its nice that he has haste and does his thing quickly, I guess I just don't see it as something that will add up fast enough to pay for itself and the value over time or off of curve seems questionable to me.
I have been kind of lazy when it comes to updating this list. I have known for a while I wanted to make a few changes so I am going to push a few through after giving them some more thought.
DECK CHANGES:
Dark Confidant -> Arcane Signet - as much as I hate to admit it, Dark Confidant hasn't been stellar. He costs less than Phyrexian Arena but has all of the same issues and dies to a lot of the things that sweep my board as well. I wasn't exactly on the hype train for Arcane Signet when it came out but having played it in a few other decks I think it probably is the right to pick it up here. Only costing a single mana the turn I play it because it taps for mana and fixes for me makes it cost very little and give me fixing and ramp at just too cheap of a cost. I still don't think I would want the other signets but this one is so much superior to all the others its not even fair.
Falkenrath Aristocrat -> Champion of Dusk - Falkenrath Aristocrat is close to what I would call a pet card of mine. I really am fond of what it does. That said, I think the payoff for sac vampires is still not quite there. If there were more incentive to have that sacrifice on demand it might be different. Without more death trigger vampires in the chaper costs though I just haven't been happy enough to pay this much for this effect. I think I will give Yahenni, Undying Partisan a little longer to test in part because he has some natural stat growth that seems appealing. I had wanted to push my draw up a little more which gets me back to bringing Champion back in.
Judith, the Scourge Diva -> Universal Automaton - Judith was...... close on several occasions to being what I was looking for but I still found her a little lacking primarily on the fact that she wasn't a vampire. With adding more draw to the list and some of that shifting the curve up I just kind of want to drop some mana here and there and increase the vampire count.
Pawn of Ulamog -> Adanto Vanguard the death triggers plan just wasn't panning out. I wanted to drop the curve down a little where I can which got me to this change.
Ad Nauseam -> Bolas's Citadel The more I thought about it, Ad Nauseam just costs a bit too much mana given some of the new options. The fact that it costs me 5 mana and a bunch of life and I still need to cast the things I draw just put me sort of questioning if this is where I wanted to be. I haven't tested Citadel out yet and the more I thought about it I think I kind of like the option to use my life to cast things directly to play.
I guess thats all for now. I need to get some more testing in with all these new changes.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Thank you so much for your answer. They make so much sense, and I almost feel stupid when you explain it, cause it just seem SO obv
Do you run Dech Tech's on youtube or anywhere else, that one can follow?
Thanks again, this is SO much help.
No problem, I really haven't done much with the original post in conveying a lot of this. I kind of backed off on trying to be the person to make a Primer on this in part because after I really got it where I wanted I backed off on it as its faster than I often want to try to be for average games of commander.
I primarily post to MTGNexus these days but I haven't done any work with this over there in part because while I have not retired this deck, again I am not really seeing tons of changes these days with it nor am I playing it as much. I kept everything for Markov over here given I wasn't really making big strides with it of late and a lot of the history of it was here.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Hi ISBP! What are your thoughts about Heraldic Banner? Could it be considered another anthem effect for Vampires (which are mostly black)?
At three mana its not really great ramp for the deck. I guess you could get away with running it but it feels like kind of bad ramp / bad anthem mushed together. Maybe that's good enough but I wouldn't normally run a three mana ramp or three non creature vampire anthem for the most part in this list. Getting both I guess is a thing but I am not really excited about it. I think there are a lot of other ramp or anthem effects that compete with it is all.
I think its far from a terrible inclusion. I just think that there isn't a huge reason to run it when comparing with other ramp or anthems. Even just a +1/+1 anthem has some amount of advantage in that you then don't still 1 for 1 trade with a token deck. I did kind of questionably recently add Arcane Signet to my list which I guess I could maybe see going with the Banner instead but to be honest, that is something I am far from confident in here anyways.
When it comes to Arcane Signet I think I'd ommit it IF we were discussing a 2-color deck. But that's not the case here. In my opinion even though it competes with 2 CMC Vampires for a place it produces mana of all three colors we need and in case someone uses land destruction or Winter Orb-like effects we're still good to go just because there's some diversity in mana production. That's why I love Springleaf Drum AND Arcane Signet in my version.
EDIT: Also it being colorless spell means that we can temporarily fix mana until we've got lands that produce all of our colors.
I think Crescendo of War has too high of a CMC, additionally it doesn't have a significant effect the first turn it hits the field. Shared Animosity is cheaper, has a more significant effect (with no advantage to opponents) and has an effect the turn it is put onto the board.
Crescendo of War is cool, but its slow to spin up. In a lot of cases with the more expensive cards and really non vampires in general you want a fast return on investment. Four mana is manageable but waiting a turn to get value back while being very obvious about what you are doing isn't great.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
ISBpathfinder, what are your thoughts on Ruinous Ultimatum? I know 7 mana is a lot but it destroys all nonland permanents your opponents’s control and I know you’re running Austere Command. It’s probably an easy replace, right?
Edit: Also what are your thoughts on Savai Triome?
I think that instead of focusing on bigger spells I'd like to ask if Bastion of Remembrance might find a slot in this build? It's essentially a 3-CMC Zulaport Cutthroat effect that survives boardwipes and convinently provides a 1/1 body to use for other effects like Phyrexian Altar.
I've tried my build recently and must say that I'm very impressed with Cordial Vampire and Blood Artist and co. because their incidental value is huge and these small effects were the reason I've won some of my games. That's why I'm wondering about adding another card like this.
The problem with Subira is once your vampires become too big she's a dead card. Also if you want draw immediately, you need to have 5 mana sitting around which Edgar will likely not.
Not an awful card, but probably one of the last options to consider.
I haven't checked in for some time, so here I am. Over the Covid 19 global crisis and beyond, I have been updating my build and playing through Skype when I can. I always come back to this list to see what is going on and if there is any cool tech to plunder. I am glad that this thread has not been abandoned. As always, this is an inspiration for my budget build.
My best friend has a Scion of the Ur Dragon deck and it is imperative that I have ways of removing and/or blocking his dragons, or I just lose. Scion can ramp into play by the 4th turn and knock me out through the air on turn 5. Based on the turn order, that gives me 4-5 turns to have an answer or scoop. Similarly, my wife plays Inalla which can ramp on turn two, cast Trophy Mage on turn three and combo on turn 4... in addition to other paths to victory. The best I can do is attack Inalla and try to have removal in the form of Path or StP or something for the Scion.
You know how much I respect your build, but against the decks I face, I find it better to have some interaction (instant speed removal) and some more anthems such as Glory of Warfare and combat modifiers like Dolmen Gate or Cover of Darkness which were both older tech you had shared before. In my games, it has been less about the fast initial rush as it has been about being mana efficient and having individually strong attacks that go in as unblocked as possible.
I really feel like the wonderful thing about Edgar Markov is that, depending on your budget and meta, it can be a "Your millage may vary" kind of a deck, and this is a wonderful starting place to see how it fits with your meta. Never stop updating and improving it. I deeply appreciate it.
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"Whatever style you wish to play, be it fast and frenzied or slow and tactical, the surest way to defeat your opponent consistently is by dominating him or her in the war of card advantage." - Brian Wiseman, April 1996
The determining factor is probably comparing the trigger vs just playing another 1 drop or card draw instead. Comparing it to a 1 drop, you could say that in the case of blood-priest you are paying 1 mana for the bodies, and 1 for the drain effect. That means the drain has to on average deal as much damage as simply having two more bodies in play would. There will be times where you have no other party creatures, or you have 2. A fully party is very unlikely. Let us assume then that on average you have a party of 2, which is 6 damage total.
With pump effects, your vampires will on average be 3/3s. This means that two additional bodies are offering at least a potential 6 damage, possibly more if they attack more than once. The damage potential of just playing two 1 drops instead of this card is better, but I could see the argument that blood-priest dealing direct damage is more reliable.
In the end, leaning into synergy with the number of bodies in play is probably the better direction as it is what Edgar is best at. It is much easier to optimize for a wide board than it is having a 3+ party. Blood-Priest is by no means a BAD card, but if you have a refined deck list there probably isn't anything worth cutting for it.
ISBpathfinder, what are your thoughts on Ruinous Ultimatum? I know 7 mana is a lot but it destroys all nonland permanents your opponents’s control and I know you’re running Austere Command. It’s probably an easy replace, right?
Edit: Also what are your thoughts on Savai Triome?
Even with the mana cost being similar to Austere Command, I think that the color intensity is off the chart. I also think that even just one more mana when it comes to anything that costs 4 or more is all increasingly difficult for this deck. We run on a low curve so whenever possible I think its better to curve in lower rather than moving curves up.
Savai Triome is a sweet card. I think there are a lot of decks where it makes sense to run a copy of these tri lands with fetches but unfortunately ETB tapped lands are a problem that get compiled a lot more when you are trying to move fast which this deck is. I think in a budget markov list it could be fine but if you are trying to move as fast as possible I don't think we can justify an always tapped fix land.
I think that instead of focusing on bigger spells I'd like to ask if Bastion of Remembrance might find a slot in this build? It's essentially a 3-CMC Zulaport Cutthroat effect that survives boardwipes and convinently provides a 1/1 body to use for other effects like Phyrexian Altar.
I've tried my build recently and must say that I'm very impressed with Cordial Vampire and Blood Artist and co. because their incidental value is huge and these small effects were the reason I've won some of my games. That's why I'm wondering about adding another card like this.
Bastion of Remembrance - I don't hate it. Its still a non vampire card but coming with a free body, being cheap, and accomplishing something we want helps to some degree. Hitting each opponent is also a big deal with aristocrat effects. Some of my issues with aristocrats is that I haven't found quite enough density of sac outlets I like. I would LOVE to find another few Bloodthrone Vampire level sac outlets but its so rare that we get anything new that I would put on that level. I tried doing aristocrats recently and I ended up backing off because I didn't feel like I had the sac outlet density I wanted especially for the mana price I was willing to pay for them.
I think if it was a 2 CMC i would include it in a heartbeat, but i struggle with a non-vampire 3 CMC spell.
^
I did try going down that path a while back and I just found that I couldn't get the consistency out of it that I wanted. I wanted a few more sac outlets and I wanted them to cost a little less as well as a few more payoffs. I think we tend to see some new payoffs but the sac outlets we still struggle with.
Thoughts on Subira, Tulzidi Caravanner? She looks like a solid draw option that also happens to give some evasion as a mana sink.
Subira, Tulzidi Caravanner its cute but its a non vampire and I think that I would more consider her a five drop because I really wouldn't want to just cast her at three and not activate that ability in the same turn. I think that the cost is a little steep and you might be paying a lot of mana to blow up your hand before drawing cards so it could easily end up with overdrawing after tapping out. I think its interesting but I think I would pass.
As a budget replacement for Tymna i think it's ok. They are kind of similar, but Tymna it's far superior.
I think that all non vampires are things to look at and question in this list. I think there is a time and place for several though. Obviously I have had some good results with several that are in my own list but I think its well worth questioning each. There is a question of how efficient an effect is when its on a nonvampire for this deck though. Anything where it has continued mana costs to maintain and do something is going to be a lot harder to justify in my book than something that is a fire and forget one time mana cost.
The problem with Subira is once your vampires become too big she's a dead card. Also if you want draw immediately, you need to have 5 mana sitting around which Edgar will likely not.
Not an awful card, but probably one of the last options to consider.
If you have a swarm of vampires and they are bigger than 2 power then I think you probably don't need more draw
I haven't checked in for some time, so here I am. Over the Covid 19 global crisis and beyond, I have been updating my build and playing through Skype when I can. I always come back to this list to see what is going on and if there is any cool tech to plunder. I am glad that this thread has not been abandoned. As always, this is an inspiration for my budget build.
My best friend has a Scion of the Ur Dragon deck and it is imperative that I have ways of removing and/or blocking his dragons, or I just lose. Scion can ramp into play by the 4th turn and knock me out through the air on turn 5. Based on the turn order, that gives me 4-5 turns to have an answer or scoop. Similarly, my wife plays Inalla which can ramp on turn two, cast Trophy Mage on turn three and combo on turn 4... in addition to other paths to victory. The best I can do is attack Inalla and try to have removal in the form of Path or StP or something for the Scion.
You know how much I respect your build, but against the decks I face, I find it better to have some interaction (instant speed removal) and some more anthems such as Glory of Warfare and combat modifiers like Dolmen Gate or Cover of Darkness which were both older tech you had shared before. In my games, it has been less about the fast initial rush as it has been about being mana efficient and having individually strong attacks that go in as unblocked as possible.
I really feel like the wonderful thing about Edgar Markov is that, depending on your budget and meta, it can be a "Your millage may vary" kind of a deck, and this is a wonderful starting place to see how it fits with your meta. Never stop updating and improving it. I deeply appreciate it.
I think that every meta has different demands that will get you playing a little different with different tech. Dolmen Gate for instance is fantastic if you play against a lot of other go wide decks but it might not be the card you need if your opponents are playing a bunch of sweepers and control.
There is nothing wrong with adjusting your list to fit the meta you play in. Spot removal has its place as well, I just think that it is primarily for must answer things which in my book for this deck are threats that are ending the game if not answered or preventing you from playing. The more of that stuff you see the more answers you need. I have been hating on Swords to Plowshares for a few years now from the standpoint that so many of the must answer threats don't feel like they are creatures anymore. They still exist though and if you see something like an Elesh Norn, Consecrated Sphinx, or Seedborn Muse I am more than happy to have and cast that Swords to Plowshares. I just also feel like I see a lot of combo based things where I would rather have a Disenchant or can't be responded to at all with spot removal (looking at you Thassa's Oracle).
Thanks, I ended up downsizing my collection a little selling off a number of expensive things like going from 4 Mana Crypts to 2 and selling off a lot of duplicate ABU Duels to pay off some debt before my kid was born. I have found it a little harder to have as many active multicolored and or fast decks together after that. Currently my Markov list is not complete but also not put away. I might order a few more Mana Crypts as I do like having another one or two on hand but at that time it was more important to get things payed down. Since then I paid off the house that I sold that I had to take out a loan to cover the sale of, I paid off my car, my student loans, and am within the next few months going to pay off the hospital for my daughter's birth. I am almost debt free so I might be able to pick up some of the things I purged at the time to not be up to my eyeballs in debt lol.
I think I might have responded to this question on Nexus already but I think it is not because I would want 3-4+ as the hit before I feel I would be happy with it. I feel like it would be sort of rare to hit for more than one as it stands and one to two is not a good result in my book.
The determining factor is probably comparing the trigger vs just playing another 1 drop or card draw instead. Comparing it to a 1 drop, you could say that in the case of blood-priest you are paying 1 mana for the bodies, and 1 for the drain effect. That means the drain has to on average deal as much damage as simply having two more bodies in play would. There will be times where you have no other party creatures, or you have 2. A fully party is very unlikely. Let us assume then that on average you have a party of 2, which is 6 damage total.
With pump effects, your vampires will on average be 3/3s. This means that two additional bodies are offering at least a potential 6 damage, possibly more if they attack more than once. The damage potential of just playing two 1 drops instead of this card is better, but I could see the argument that blood-priest dealing direct damage is more reliable.
In the end, leaning into synergy with the number of bodies in play is probably the better direction as it is what Edgar is best at. It is much easier to optimize for a wide board than it is having a 3+ party. Blood-Priest is by no means a BAD card, but if you have a refined deck list there probably isn't anything worth cutting for it.
This is interesting just as a 2 drop. I've been favoring a couple of lifelinkers in the deck and this is an upgrade.
Life is a resource, being an aggro deck generally speaking I usually feel like we haven't been fast enough before my own life total is an issue and by then its hard for a little bit of lifegain to be what keeps us in. Use up the life and move faster. If you run out, its usually because it took too long to kill everyone.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
This is interesting just as a 2 drop. I've been favoring a couple of lifelinkers in the deck and this is an upgrade.
Life is a resource, being an aggro deck generally speaking I usually feel like we haven't been fast enough before my own life total is an issue and by then its hard for a little bit of lifegain to be what keeps us in. Use up the life and move faster. If you run out, its usually because it took too long to kill everyone.
Yeah, thats true. Thing is in my meta the group was scared of Markov, so many times they where banging me up as a 3v1 from the start until i was at 10-15 or something so that i could not pay much life for card draw. So i was leaning to try some lifelinkers that are in reality fuel for card draw.
I haven't played it in a while now... maybe it's time to see if they remember.
Great to see you again ISBPathfinder, i'm following a couple of your decks. Thanks.
Ok, so last night i played two games with Uncle Edgar.
First one, the group ended me first. Deck was moving smooth and fast, sadly i flooded a little at mid/end game and couldn't finish it so the 3v1 got me. Second game they gave me some space at the beginning and ended up winning.
As for the lifelinkers inclutions i mentioned, the only one that felt relevant was Tithe Drinker altought it was a fringe case i think, since i was flooding i dumped the excess mana in extort, in fact she ate a removal spell. I guess she stays in my list for the moment, maybe my group wastes another removal spell in her. They tend to hold grudges.
What you guys think about the new "dual" land cycle? I'm considering Brightclimb Pathway Since black is the primary color in the deck, i like this one because the only one drop i think makes a huge differece on turn one is Serra Ascendant In fact the only fetchland i have is Marsh Flats for the same reason.
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Necropotence - essentially it lets you refill your hand every turn at the cost of life. Being that you are the aggro player use your HP pool to get yourself resources. The way you lose the game tends to be because you run out of resources or the game goes long rather than health hitting zero. I mean, eventually you die to hp hitting zero but its usually because you failed at your primary goal of being the aggressor.
Removal - I run a little bit. My answer is to kill the player that is being the problem rather than removing their things. Don't try to answer everything, just run people down and answer what you have to. Its part of why most of the answers I do run are very versatile in targeting instead of having things like Swords to Plowshares. Who cares whats in play if you are killing that player through it. Target priority and killing the right person first is a big thing too.
Wraths - Keep drawing cards and you will be fine. I can think of some games where I would eat a wrath every turn and be fine because I kept my draw going. If you stop drawing that is when a wrath will wreck you.
Selfless Spirit - Its ok. Keep in mind that it won't protect from every type of wrath and wraths aren't the only thing that can cause problems. An opponent walks right through this with a Toxic Deluge for example. Personally I think that people over focus the idea of wraths as the problem for this deck and my issue with most wrath protection effects is how they are often situational or require mana to stay up and be responsive. Selfless is far from the worst of these and I think if you want to run it its probably fine, just be aware of the drawbacks of it as well. Most anything that isn't a vampire in some way or another competes for a slot in the list.
Obelisk of Urd / Venerated Loxodon - I haven't gotten enough testing in with Obelisk to really comment much on it. I have been playing the list a bit less of late but I think the difference between Obelisk and Loxodon are quite big. Keep in mind that you can have any number of vampires taking the buff of Obelisk which is also twice as powerful as Loxodon and you can attack with the improved power of Obelisk this turn where as Loxodon has a big wait before its buff picks up given you just tapped down the ones you buffed. While I am still not sure how I feel about Obelisk, I would say that Loxodon is less than 1/4 as good in my mind for the deck.
Rankle, Master of Pranks - Outside of the fact that its a 4 mana non vampire, yea I dig it. All of the effects are relevant for the deck. I guess my issue is that I don't know that it does enough for a 4 mana non vampire. We are trying to move so fast and every turn we tend to have a lot of demands on our mana. Its nice that he has haste and does his thing quickly, I guess I just don't see it as something that will add up fast enough to pay for itself and the value over time or off of curve seems questionable to me.
I have been kind of lazy when it comes to updating this list. I have known for a while I wanted to make a few changes so I am going to push a few through after giving them some more thought.
DECK CHANGES:
I guess thats all for now. I need to get some more testing in with all these new changes.
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Do you run Dech Tech's on youtube or anywhere else, that one can follow?
Thanks again, this is SO much help.
No problem, I really haven't done much with the original post in conveying a lot of this. I kind of backed off on trying to be the person to make a Primer on this in part because after I really got it where I wanted I backed off on it as its faster than I often want to try to be for average games of commander.
I primarily post to MTGNexus these days but I haven't done any work with this over there in part because while I have not retired this deck, again I am not really seeing tons of changes these days with it nor am I playing it as much. I kept everything for Markov over here given I wasn't really making big strides with it of late and a lot of the history of it was here.
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At three mana its not really great ramp for the deck. I guess you could get away with running it but it feels like kind of bad ramp / bad anthem mushed together. Maybe that's good enough but I wouldn't normally run a three mana ramp or three non creature vampire anthem for the most part in this list. Getting both I guess is a thing but I am not really excited about it. I think there are a lot of other ramp or anthem effects that compete with it is all.
I think its far from a terrible inclusion. I just think that there isn't a huge reason to run it when comparing with other ramp or anthems. Even just a +1/+1 anthem has some amount of advantage in that you then don't still 1 for 1 trade with a token deck. I did kind of questionably recently add Arcane Signet to my list which I guess I could maybe see going with the Banner instead but to be honest, that is something I am far from confident in here anyways.
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EDIT: Also it being colorless spell means that we can temporarily fix mana until we've got lands that produce all of our colors.
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Edit: Also what are your thoughts on Savai Triome?
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
I've tried my build recently and must say that I'm very impressed with Cordial Vampire and Blood Artist and co. because their incidental value is huge and these small effects were the reason I've won some of my games. That's why I'm wondering about adding another card like this.
I think if it was a 2 CMC i would include it in a heartbeat, but i struggle with a non-vampire 3 CMC spell.
I don’t think any creatures who cost 3 mana and aren’t vampires are worth it.
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
The only one of those that I run is Purphoros, who is never a creature in this deck.
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Not an awful card, but probably one of the last options to consider.
My best friend has a Scion of the Ur Dragon deck and it is imperative that I have ways of removing and/or blocking his dragons, or I just lose. Scion can ramp into play by the 4th turn and knock me out through the air on turn 5. Based on the turn order, that gives me 4-5 turns to have an answer or scoop. Similarly, my wife plays Inalla which can ramp on turn two, cast Trophy Mage on turn three and combo on turn 4... in addition to other paths to victory. The best I can do is attack Inalla and try to have removal in the form of Path or StP or something for the Scion.
You know how much I respect your build, but against the decks I face, I find it better to have some interaction (instant speed removal) and some more anthems such as Glory of Warfare and combat modifiers like Dolmen Gate or Cover of Darkness which were both older tech you had shared before. In my games, it has been less about the fast initial rush as it has been about being mana efficient and having individually strong attacks that go in as unblocked as possible.
I really feel like the wonderful thing about Edgar Markov is that, depending on your budget and meta, it can be a "Your millage may vary" kind of a deck, and this is a wonderful starting place to see how it fits with your meta. Never stop updating and improving it. I deeply appreciate it.
Warriors:
Rouges:
Wizards:
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
With pump effects, your vampires will on average be 3/3s. This means that two additional bodies are offering at least a potential 6 damage, possibly more if they attack more than once. The damage potential of just playing two 1 drops instead of this card is better, but I could see the argument that blood-priest dealing direct damage is more reliable.
In the end, leaning into synergy with the number of bodies in play is probably the better direction as it is what Edgar is best at. It is much easier to optimize for a wide board than it is having a 3+ party. Blood-Priest is by no means a BAD card, but if you have a refined deck list there probably isn't anything worth cutting for it.
Even with the mana cost being similar to Austere Command, I think that the color intensity is off the chart. I also think that even just one more mana when it comes to anything that costs 4 or more is all increasingly difficult for this deck. We run on a low curve so whenever possible I think its better to curve in lower rather than moving curves up.
Savai Triome is a sweet card. I think there are a lot of decks where it makes sense to run a copy of these tri lands with fetches but unfortunately ETB tapped lands are a problem that get compiled a lot more when you are trying to move fast which this deck is. I think in a budget markov list it could be fine but if you are trying to move as fast as possible I don't think we can justify an always tapped fix land.
Bastion of Remembrance - I don't hate it. Its still a non vampire card but coming with a free body, being cheap, and accomplishing something we want helps to some degree. Hitting each opponent is also a big deal with aristocrat effects. Some of my issues with aristocrats is that I haven't found quite enough density of sac outlets I like. I would LOVE to find another few Bloodthrone Vampire level sac outlets but its so rare that we get anything new that I would put on that level. I tried doing aristocrats recently and I ended up backing off because I didn't feel like I had the sac outlet density I wanted especially for the mana price I was willing to pay for them.
^
I did try going down that path a while back and I just found that I couldn't get the consistency out of it that I wanted. I wanted a few more sac outlets and I wanted them to cost a little less as well as a few more payoffs. I think we tend to see some new payoffs but the sac outlets we still struggle with.
Subira, Tulzidi Caravanner its cute but its a non vampire and I think that I would more consider her a five drop because I really wouldn't want to just cast her at three and not activate that ability in the same turn. I think that the cost is a little steep and you might be paying a lot of mana to blow up your hand before drawing cards so it could easily end up with overdrawing after tapping out. I think its interesting but I think I would pass.
I think that all non vampires are things to look at and question in this list. I think there is a time and place for several though. Obviously I have had some good results with several that are in my own list but I think its well worth questioning each. There is a question of how efficient an effect is when its on a nonvampire for this deck though. Anything where it has continued mana costs to maintain and do something is going to be a lot harder to justify in my book than something that is a fire and forget one time mana cost.
If you have a swarm of vampires and they are bigger than 2 power then I think you probably don't need more draw
I think that every meta has different demands that will get you playing a little different with different tech. Dolmen Gate for instance is fantastic if you play against a lot of other go wide decks but it might not be the card you need if your opponents are playing a bunch of sweepers and control.
There is nothing wrong with adjusting your list to fit the meta you play in. Spot removal has its place as well, I just think that it is primarily for must answer things which in my book for this deck are threats that are ending the game if not answered or preventing you from playing. The more of that stuff you see the more answers you need. I have been hating on Swords to Plowshares for a few years now from the standpoint that so many of the must answer threats don't feel like they are creatures anymore. They still exist though and if you see something like an Elesh Norn, Consecrated Sphinx, or Seedborn Muse I am more than happy to have and cast that Swords to Plowshares. I just also feel like I see a lot of combo based things where I would rather have a Disenchant or can't be responded to at all with spot removal (looking at you Thassa's Oracle).
Thanks, I ended up downsizing my collection a little selling off a number of expensive things like going from 4 Mana Crypts to 2 and selling off a lot of duplicate ABU Duels to pay off some debt before my kid was born. I have found it a little harder to have as many active multicolored and or fast decks together after that. Currently my Markov list is not complete but also not put away. I might order a few more Mana Crypts as I do like having another one or two on hand but at that time it was more important to get things payed down. Since then I paid off the house that I sold that I had to take out a loan to cover the sale of, I paid off my car, my student loans, and am within the next few months going to pay off the hospital for my daughter's birth. I am almost debt free so I might be able to pick up some of the things I purged at the time to not be up to my eyeballs in debt lol.
I think I might have responded to this question on Nexus already but I think it is not because I would want 3-4+ as the hit before I feel I would be happy with it. I feel like it would be sort of rare to hit for more than one as it stands and one to two is not a good result in my book.
I agree.
Life is a resource, being an aggro deck generally speaking I usually feel like we haven't been fast enough before my own life total is an issue and by then its hard for a little bit of lifegain to be what keeps us in. Use up the life and move faster. If you run out, its usually because it took too long to kill everyone.
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[Modern] Allies
Yeah, thats true. Thing is in my meta the group was scared of Markov, so many times they where banging me up as a 3v1 from the start until i was at 10-15 or something so that i could not pay much life for card draw. So i was leaning to try some lifelinkers that are in reality fuel for card draw.
I haven't played it in a while now... maybe it's time to see if they remember.
Great to see you again ISBPathfinder, i'm following a couple of your decks. Thanks.
First one, the group ended me first. Deck was moving smooth and fast, sadly i flooded a little at mid/end game and couldn't finish it so the 3v1 got me. Second game they gave me some space at the beginning and ended up winning.
As for the lifelinkers inclutions i mentioned, the only one that felt relevant was Tithe Drinker altought it was a fringe case i think, since i was flooding i dumped the excess mana in extort, in fact she ate a removal spell. I guess she stays in my list for the moment, maybe my group wastes another removal spell in her. They tend to hold grudges.
What you guys think about the new "dual" land cycle? I'm considering Brightclimb Pathway Since black is the primary color in the deck, i like this one because the only one drop i think makes a huge differece on turn one is Serra Ascendant In fact the only fetchland i have is Marsh Flats for the same reason.