The star of the deck is Root Maze, which is incredibly powerful in today's format, but rarely sees use. It is particularly effective against:
-Fetchlands: Fetchland comes into play tapped (CITP), land it gets CITP.
-Stax builds: These decks rely on early mana development from lands that tap for 2, that will now CITP, and Chrome Mox, that will also CITP. Trinisphere CITP, which shuts it off for a turn, too
-Slows down combo decks, buying us time so we can start hitting their land, and adding the pressure with cards like Sphere of Resistence, and Thorn of Amethyst from SB.
-affinity (lol)
-43land.dec builds
-you get the point
We are able to lessen Root Maze's impact on us by running some decent lands that come into play tapped:
-Cloudpost: Rather nice with Root Maze out, gets increasingly effective as the game progresses.
-Vesuva: Cloudposts 5-8, also can copy your Treetop Villages for additional beats, can nuke opponents' legendary lands (bye, Karakas/Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth)
-Treetop Village: Nice beater with trample, fun to throw equipment on. Laughs in Mishra's Factory's face, especially when you have a City of Solitude out.
Other control elements:
-City of Solitude: Beautiful card. Resolve one of these and you don't have much at all to worry about vs. any kind of control decks. Take a seat, Counterbalance.
-Winter's Grasp & Plow Under: Self explanatory.
-Krosan Grip: Self-explanatory. We can go up to 4-count and 3 Indrik Stomphowlers from the SB *evil grin*
-Sphere of Resistance: Slows the game down so we can start getting a Cloudpost engine going, perfect partner-in-crime with Root Maze.
Threats:
-Garruk, Wildspeaker: Great with Rootmaze, Cloudpost, and Baloth.
-Ravenous Baloth: Above.
-Sundering Titan: Badass. Easily castable once we get the Cloudposts going. Keeps on the land-hate pressure too.
-Woodfall Primus: Badass #2. Can keep the land-hate pressure going, or remove other pesky permanents.
Our two heavy-hitters also work very well vs. enemy creature-hate, other than Swords to Plowshares/Path to Exile. Of course, we can always equip them with Sword of Light & Shadow under a City of Solitude shell to alleviate that problem too
-Sword of Fire and Ice & Sword of Light and Shadow: Both are perfect in this deck. Cloudpost helps allow us to run four, and we can now make our creatures protection from everything except green (means, all removal :xd:). With City of Solitude, we can safely equip and not have to worry about in-response-removal. Card advantage from Sword of Fire and Ice, and recurring Baloths and Sakura-Tribe Elders from Sword of Light and Shadow.
Sideboard:
-1x Sphere of Resistance, 4x Thorn of Amethyst: Seals the deal vs. Combo.
-2x Krosan Grip, 3x Indrik Stomphowler: Pesky artifacts and enchantments? No more. Indrik is a beast and can be sacrificed to Baloth, as well.
-4x Elephant Grass: Great versus early, aggressive aggro, and Ichorid especially.
Benefits of running this deck in your typical metagame:
-Unexpected and fun!
-Root Maze is beautiful versus Thresh, and the litany of decks that run fetchlands. Also lovely against Stax.
-Little dependence on graveyard: Only thing we have that really takes advantage of our graveyard is Sword of Light and Shadow. We are hardly hurt at all by Tormod's Crypt, Relic of Progenitus, and Leyline of the Void, which means most decks will have a smaller sideboard pool against us.
-Great match-up versus combo: 4x Root Maze, 3x Sphere of Resistance are very effective vs. combo. After we sideboard, however, we rather seal the deal. Go ahead, laugh maniacally to yourself. You deserve it.
-Heavy land-hate theme: Most decks in today's environment don't run that many land. When we start hitting their land and then make the rest of them CITP tapped, the game sways progressively in our favor.
-Lots of life gain: Baloth and Sword of Light and Shadow help us recover mid-late game versus those fast aggro decks, and Burn especially.
Downsides:
-Vulnerability to non-basic land hate. This being said, with Root Maze, enemy Wastelands CITP, giving us a chance to nuke them with Winter's Grasp, etc.
-Sometimes, just not fast enough. If we cannot resolve an early Root Maze or Sphere, we can be in trouble, especially versus fast aggro decks.
Yes, I know we are not running Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere. They are antisynergistic with several cards in the deck, and I find Root Maze & Sphere of Resistance as an equivalent trade (well, I find it better for us in this situation, heh).
i really like this deck, xanth. i used to play something similar to this in extended (back in the day, obv) using the land destro (winters grasp, plow under, fallow earth), umbilicus and and cards like deranged hermit and wall of blossoms to take advantage of umbilicus. it was a lot of fun. i love the idea of being able to take the role of control player in a game when you're playing mono green. it's almost wrong.
To be honest (because everything else I say is a lie! j/k), I completely forgot about Tarmogoyf, because I hate him so much, :xd:. Hmmm... not sure about including him though. Most of the deck consists of permanents, and it doesn't have a way to put different card types in the 'yard quickly and consistently.
i really like this deck, xanth. i used to play something similar to this in extended (back in the day, obv) using the land destro (winters grasp, plow under, fallow earth), umbilicus and and cards like deranged hermit and wall of blossoms to take advantage of umbilicus. it was a lot of fun. i love the idea of being able to take the role of control player in a game when you're playing mono green. it's almost wrong.
calibretto
Yes it feels very rewarding, almost like you've taught your goldfish to do your taxes :xd:
For critters what about... Blastoderm, its a good beater with shroud... also a beast Indrik stomphowler, maybe just sideboard but blows up artifacts and enchantments and is a beast Yavimaya dryad, not a beast but gets you a land every time you recur her
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Blastoderm cannot be equipped, and Yavimaya Enchantress will be harder to cast early due to her casting cost. I'd much rather run Sakura-Tribe Elder in her stead.
The Stomphowler, however, is a lovely suggestion for sideboard
Lovely idea! Sakura tribe elder seems good here; reap and sow is played in mirrodin block with tooth and nail and is also good here.
I like the indrik stomphowler; he isn't too taxing on landbase and can hurt countertop pretty bad although they could reveal force of will to counter him city of solitude solves that problem nicely.
4 grips maindeck? Maybe cut a few and have you considered jitte? I always like that equipment because it is the definition of versatility
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
The star of the deck is Root Maze, which is incredibly powerful in today's format, but rarely sees use. It is particularly effective against:
-Slows down combo decks, buying us time so we can start hitting their land (more fun in sideboard) (Lion's Eye Diamond and the like CITP :))
While it is true that LED will come into play tapped, that won't prevent the opponent using it, as it only needs to be sacked. Just wanted to point it out for you.
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Original quote byTacosnape "All ideas that give me knowledge without any effort involved on my part are good ideas. Chop chop, my dear fellow."
DCI L2 Judge GP:Madrid 2010 45th GP:Amsterdam 2011 74th GP:London 2013 67th Bazaar of Moxen 2013 32nd
The upkeep could be payed for quite a long time if need be, and it keeps this deck from rolling to ichorid. If anything, i think its a better sb card than fallowed earth.
By the way, I really love this idea. I love mono green, and have been working on a somewhat similar list in my head for a while now. Never gonna bother getting the cards for it most likely, but its just fun to thing about mono green control.
Also, with so few creatures i would think that sphere of resistance would be better in the board than the thorns.
Could Mwonvuli Acid-Moss have a place here? It's land destruction and acceleration. How about Tangle Wire for added protection?
The wires might be a decent fit for this style of deck, though it would certainly need testing. As for Mwonvuli, I would think Creeping Mold would be a better fit, as it would allow for a similar effect to grip (granted without the uncounterability) + Land Destruction.
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I edit after I post... just a heads up.
Currently Running Legacy: Burn; Various Stompy's; Food Chain Goblins; FC Elves Standard: Junk Super Friends, Elf-Wave Elder Dragon Highlander: Animar, Skithiryx, Bosh, Konda, Wort, Ezuri, Patron of the Moon
I like the ideas and flavor of the deck, a few concerns and questions on card choices and execution:
- I do not think there is a need to ramp up mana. You got Garruk, Cloudposts and Vesuva's but max out at a 5 cc spell. It's not adding up in my head. (ie, there is not "fireball" esq spell or a crush of wurms or something that needs sooooo much mana)
I would center the deck on root maze, LD, and Plow Under as control/screw the opponent and work my way outward. Thorn is also good because Maze + Thorn is just gravy against combo. I'd prefer to keep it in the SB just like you have it because it doesn't hit critters. Plow under is a mini-finisher. You not only ruin the mana base, they draw lands for the ensuing 2 turns (unless they got something to fix it pronto).
I'd personally run the wasteland + loam combo (ghost quarter as well). Way too good not to abuse with root maze. I'd also swap mox diamond IN for chrome mox OUT. Moment's peace is also a nice card to consider -- owns out of the SB against aggro. Tangle Wire is a good suggestion (kudos to NERER0CKET for that)
With all that said, this would be my shell...trying to stay out of Green-Staxxx area:
I got a few slots open, and some numbers out of this can be tweaked. Wall of Blossoms would be my next logical step -- since it draws stuff for you and can block early junk. Sensei's Divining Top is also considerable or Mirri's Guile for the same effect without needing to spend constantly on the effect. In both cases, fixing draws is key. Straight-up card draw would be nice but Harmonize is so mediocre.
As for threats, i have no idea lol. Baloth is a great option and Garruk can do awesome stuff too (do not run him as a 4x he's got that legend effect). I like Call of the Herd but maybe that's me. Tarmogoyf is yet again another good inclusion (who woulda guessed). Witness is a must IMO...i NEED to be able to recur some options pronto! "oh, i just plow-undered you? yea...have it again" or "tangle wire just fizzled...let's have it again"
I feel inclined to add COTH to the mix because if I abuse loam with the LD-lands, I can flashback those spells from the grave.
I mean, hell, we're all on a forum for something that most people would describe as a "children's card game"...do what makes you happy. You are never too old to enjoy yourself.
The interesting thing about us legacy players is that we consider Force of Will, Dark Ritual, Blood Moon, Tarmogoyf and Swords to Plowshare to be fair.
Yeah the GGGGG is hard on your but just think of the softlock it puts on them with root maze on the board; they're slowed down but they then get locked down pretty hard and you can manascrew them with it
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
Thanks for the wonderful suggestions, everyone! I'll try to answer them all:
Quote from King Canute »
What about thornling and tabernacle?
I thought long and hard about Thornling. I decided against it as I found it a bit too slow, and it still dies just as easily to Swords to Plowshares and the new Path to Exile, and it's sadly not a beast Also, He does not go well at all with City of Solitude, and I would much much rather run the City over Thornling.
Quote from Barl, Artificer »
Lovely idea! Sakura tribe elder seems good here; reap and sow is played in mirrodin block with tooth and nail and is also good here.
I like the indrik stomphowler; he isn't too taxing on landbase and can hurt countertop pretty bad although they could reveal force of will to counter him city of solitude solves that problem nicely.
4 grips maindeck? Maybe cut a few and have you considered jitte? I always like that equipment because it is the definition of versatility
I like Reap and Sow, but I don't think it does enough for the mana investment; it is too slow, and Plow Under is too good to removet. A resolved Plow Under hitting two lands can often win us the game.
Indrik Stomphowler is definitely going in the sideboard. With his addition, I think I will also cut one or two Grips maindeck, as I'm starting to realize we need more room for other things anyways Don't want Umezawa's Jitte, however. I'd much rather have the swords in here; they give us the card advantage the deck is lacking, and protect our creatures from kill spells. Umezawa's Jitte doesn't go very will with City of Solitude, either.
Quote from PhanTom It »
While it is true that LED will come into play tapped, that won't prevent the opponent using it, as it only needs to be sacked. Just wanted to point it out for you.
Thanks for pointing that out, I am stupid sometimes, hehe.
Quote from NERER0CKET »
Could Mwonvuli Acid-Moss have a place here? It's land destruction and acceleration. How about Tangle Wire for added protection?
The Acid-Moss is nice, but I'd rather run Reap and Sow in its stead (also easier to cast with 8 Cloudposts maindeck :p). And I'd rather run Plow Under in Reap's stead, lol.
Sakura-Tribe Elder however should be enough to help us get more land out, especially when it is recurrable with SOLS.
Tangle Wire is a card I definitely considered. I chose not to run it because we cannot take that much advantage of it; we don't provide enough early permanents to tap for it (Root Maze cannot be tapped to Tangle Wire), and we do not have lands that tap for 2 on turn 1. Ultimately, I decided the three-mana-investment is better spent on land destruction (Ice Storm).
The upkeep could be payed for quite a long time if need be, and it keeps this deck from rolling to ichorid. If anything, i think its a better sb card than fallowed earth.
By the way, I really love this idea. I love mono green, and have been working on a somewhat similar list in my head for a while now. Never gonna bother getting the cards for it most likely, but its just fun to thing about mono green control.
Also, with so few creatures i would think that sphere of resistance would be better in the board than the thorns.
Also, I've decided that the Sphere can come in maindeck. There will be no situation where it is not advantageous to us
Quote from UDemon »
I like this deck a lot, wanna pm me the current list you're playing?
Thanks. Updated decklist at the end of this post, and updated to the thread's original post as well.
Quote from Bangoo »
Nice idea Xanth!
Something bothers me, however:
With play 8 cloudposts?
Why even play a single one?
I have a hard time figuring out what you need that much mana for?
Your curve tops at 5, or even 4 if we don't count the 2 plow under.
You have no mana sink (with 8 posts, i was expecting something along the lines of verdeloth the ancient, wurmcalling or sprout swarm).
Your points are well-founded, but I am making additions to the deck to take advantage of the plethora of mana it can generate. Namely Sundering Titan, which is a complete badass. Sphere of Resistence is another one. Also, all the colorless mana helps us abuse our equipment and keep the threats coming.
And, to answer your last suggestion: The equipment is also there for our card advantage. Sylvan Library sounds like an interesting suggestion, though. We can take advantage of it with all the life gain the deck offers. I think I will try adding a few of those too.
I like the ideas and flavor of the deck, a few concerns and questions on card choices and execution:
- I do not think there is a need to ramp up mana. You got Garruk, Cloudposts and Vesuva's but max out at a 5 cc spell. It's not adding up in my head. (ie, there is not "fireball" esq spell or a crush of wurms or something that needs sooooo much mana)
I would center the deck on root maze, LD, and Plow Under as control/screw the opponent and work my way outward. Thorn is also good because Maze + Thorn is just gravy against combo. I'd prefer to keep it in the SB just like you have it because it doesn't hit critters. Plow under is a mini-finisher. You not only ruin the mana base, they draw lands for the ensuing 2 turns (unless they got something to fix it pronto).
I'd personally run the wasteland + loam combo (ghost quarter as well). Way too good not to abuse with root maze. I'd also swap mox diamond IN for chrome mox OUT. Moment's peace is also a nice card to consider -- owns out of the SB against aggro. Tangle Wire is a good suggestion (kudos to NERER0CKET for that)
With all that said, this would be my shell...trying to stay out of Green-Staxxx area:
I got a few slots open, and some numbers out of this can be tweaked. Wall of Blossoms would be my next logical step -- since it draws stuff for you and can block early junk. Sensei's Divining Top is also considerable or Mirri's Guile for the same effect without needing to spend constantly on the effect. In both cases, fixing draws is key. Straight-up card draw would be nice but Harmonize is so mediocre.
As for threats, i have no idea lol. Baloth is a great option and Garruk can do awesome stuff too (do not run him as a 4x he's got that legend effect). I like Call of the Herd but maybe that's me. Tarmogoyf is yet again another good inclusion (who woulda guessed). Witness is a must IMO...i NEED to be able to recur some options pronto! "oh, i just plow-undered you? yea...have it again" or "tangle wire just fizzled...let's have it again"
I feel inclined to add COTH to the mix because if I abuse loam with the LD-lands, I can flashback those spells from the grave.
@ the Wasteland + Loam combo: I am not fond of this. It does not work as well under a Root Maze, and I also am rather fond of the deck's current little-dependance on graveyard (only thing really taking advantage of it is Sword of Light and Shadow), which is hated on enormously in sideboards.
Moment's Peace is bad with City of Solitude. City ain't going, it is an incredible card. Playtest it and you will looooove it, almost as much as Root Maze
I don't like the idea of swapping Chrome Mox for Mox Diamond; Mox Diamond would require us to run more mana to be able to reliably cast it turn 1 with a land, and would put us again on the track of wanting to run cards like Life From the Loam. Chrome Mox allows us to put extra coppies of Garruk and Root Maze to better use.
I like your deck, but I find it too dedicated to one function. I don't see it doing well versus cheap, aggressive aggro, or at being able to keep the pressure on by presenting threats and gaining card advantage. I would at least suggest that land that cycles for for you to abuse with LFTL. I would suggest Garruk, but I don't think you have enough to protect him (from attacking creatures).
Quote from Naz »
Would you reckon the deck could handle Woodfall Primus? Didn't shuffle the deck together so I don't know the mana production. But if it's surpassing 5 greatly as everyone is saying then it seems like a good option.
He's defnitely a lovely option, I will try to fit him in.
I've removed Eladamri's Vineyard from the SB, as the mana it provides our opponents will now be usuable to pay the tax of Sphere and Thorn.
The match-up versus combo is much better now. After sideboarding, we have 4x Root Maze, 4x Sphere of Resistence, 4x Thorn of Amethyst.
The deck is starting to look more fine-tuned now too.
The addition of heavy threats like Sundering Titan and Woodfall Primus are very much to my liking. They keep on the land-hate pressure while providing big, fat win conditions that keep hurting the opponent again even if they manage to remove them (aside from Swords to Plowshares).
I'd immediately drop the 4x swords...you're control, no need for stuff like that. It's cute if you wanna go casual or do some pseudo late-game aggro/control thing but it really goes against your plan of control.
I don't like Elvish Spirit Guide and Chrome Mox...I think it's more economical to just go 4x Mox Diamond and run with mana accel that way (rather than the 1x stint from ESG)...your stuff costs a bunch anyways (ie; you are not comboing into stuff or "going off" fast on T1 or T2 --- build for the long haul).
I would advise to drop Treetops, since you're running a tempo-control sort of game (LD and the likes). Creatures are up to you as well. I like the improvements overall but had to point out some more stuff in the updated list.
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I mean, hell, we're all on a forum for something that most people would describe as a "children's card game"...do what makes you happy. You are never too old to enjoy yourself.
The swords have two functions: They generate card advantage, and they protect our major threats from removal. These are both two very vital functions. I am also not worried about not having enough creatures to equip. The deck runs 14 creatures, 17 if you count the Treetops, and 20 if you count the Garruks too.
-The swords can be casted and equiped in the same turn easily mid-late game from the cloudpost engine + Garruk.
-With a City of Solitude in play, the swords are even more effective, as we can cast a threat, and equip it that turn, not having to worry about it ever being exposed to hate. Alternatively, we can cast a sword and equip it that turn too. And the opponent will not be able to respond to it being equipped.
Elvish Spirit Guide is very useful because:
-It is an immediate mana source, similar to Chrome Mox/Mox Diamond, that is unaffected by Root Maze. This is very key. Also, mid-late game it can be cast as a creature instead and carry a sword. That is a huge bonus over a mox, which is why the deck runs four.
I am considering replacing the 3rd Treetop with another forest. However, they are very useful. And they do well carrying swords as well, providing trample as well to ensure you get some damage through. A Treetop with a sword is a 5/5 trampler, able to take on most threats out there.
I suggest you playtest my build some more, hopefully you'll at least somewhat agree with my points here.
The swords have two functions: They generate card advantage, and they protect our major threats from removal. These are both two very vital functions. I am also not worried about not having enough creatures to equip. The deck runs 14 creatures, 17 if you count the Treetops, and 20 if you count the Garruks too.
-The swords can be casted and equiped in the same turn easily mid-late game from the cloudpost engine + Garruk.
-With a City of Solitude in play, the swords are even more effective, as we can cast a threat, and equip it that turn, not having to worry about it ever being exposed to hate. Alternatively, we can cast a sword and equip it that turn too. And the opponent will not be able to respond to it being equipped.
Don't forget they're also manasinks, and with 8 post that's a big plus. I think they should stay, but I'm not sold on 4, I think 3 should be enough, would let you up City back to 4 as well.
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I edit after I post... just a heads up.
Currently Running Legacy: Burn; Various Stompy's; Food Chain Goblins; FC Elves Standard: Junk Super Friends, Elf-Wave Elder Dragon Highlander: Animar, Skithiryx, Bosh, Konda, Wort, Ezuri, Patron of the Moon
I see 8-post... I want to see Wurmcalling soooooooooo bad
I love City in the deck. It protects you from so much stuff, it's hilarious.
Also, it'd help if i were more coherent right now... my thoughts are slipping in and out
More of my 2 cents later.
(and now my closer makes me think... and it hurts)
i know tribe elder costs lest but what about yavimaya elder?
he draws you cards, gets an 2 lands and has and 2 power for an extra green
He is definitely a noteworthy suggestion. I fear he will fail to perform the role that Sakura does, and is harder to resolve early with 8post. Still, he's pretty rockin'. I'll have to playtest him.
Yeah yavimaya elder deserves some testing...he could be good I'm not sure though. He at least blocks a goyf for a turn or they target him with a swords in able for him not to do his effect but then they are down one swords. Just test him out to see how it goes I guess
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
-Freyalise
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The decklist:
(updated 4/4/09)
4x Cloudpost
4x Vesuva
3x Treetop Village
4x Forest
4x Snow-Covered Forest
Acceleration (9)
2x Chrome Mox
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
3x Sakura-Tribe Elder
Control (18)
4x Root Maze
4x Ice Storm
2x Plow Under
3x City of Solitude
2x Krosan Grip
3x Sphere of Resistence
3x Garruk, Wildspeaker
3x Ravenous Baloth
2x Sundering Titan
2x Woodfall Primus
2x Sword of Fire and Ice
2x Sword of Light and Shadow
1x Sphere of Resistence
2x Krosan Grip
1x City of Solitude
4x Thorn of Amethyst
4x Elephant Grass
3x Indrik Stomphowler
-Fetchlands: Fetchland comes into play tapped (CITP), land it gets CITP.
-Stax builds: These decks rely on early mana development from lands that tap for 2, that will now CITP, and Chrome Mox, that will also CITP. Trinisphere CITP, which shuts it off for a turn, too
-Slows down combo decks, buying us time so we can start hitting their land, and adding the pressure with cards like Sphere of Resistence, and Thorn of Amethyst from SB.
-affinity (lol)
-43land.dec builds
-you get the point
We are able to lessen Root Maze's impact on us by running some decent lands that come into play tapped:
-Cloudpost: Rather nice with Root Maze out, gets increasingly effective as the game progresses.
-Vesuva: Cloudposts 5-8, also can copy your Treetop Villages for additional beats, can nuke opponents' legendary lands (bye, Karakas/Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth)
-Treetop Village: Nice beater with trample, fun to throw equipment on. Laughs in Mishra's Factory's face, especially when you have a City of Solitude out.
Other control elements:
-City of Solitude: Beautiful card. Resolve one of these and you don't have much at all to worry about vs. any kind of control decks. Take a seat, Counterbalance.
-Winter's Grasp & Plow Under: Self explanatory.
-Krosan Grip: Self-explanatory. We can go up to 4-count and 3 Indrik Stomphowlers from the SB *evil grin*
-Sphere of Resistance: Slows the game down so we can start getting a Cloudpost engine going, perfect partner-in-crime with Root Maze.
Threats:
-Garruk, Wildspeaker: Great with Rootmaze, Cloudpost, and Baloth.
-Ravenous Baloth: Above.
-Sundering Titan: Badass. Easily castable once we get the Cloudposts going. Keeps on the land-hate pressure too.
-Woodfall Primus: Badass #2. Can keep the land-hate pressure going, or remove other pesky permanents.
Our two heavy-hitters also work very well vs. enemy creature-hate, other than Swords to Plowshares/Path to Exile. Of course, we can always equip them with Sword of Light & Shadow under a City of Solitude shell to alleviate that problem too
-Sword of Fire and Ice & Sword of Light and Shadow: Both are perfect in this deck. Cloudpost helps allow us to run four, and we can now make our creatures protection from everything except green (means, all removal :xd:). With City of Solitude, we can safely equip and not have to worry about in-response-removal. Card advantage from Sword of Fire and Ice, and recurring Baloths and Sakura-Tribe Elders from Sword of Light and Shadow.
Sideboard:
-1x Sphere of Resistance, 4x Thorn of Amethyst: Seals the deal vs. Combo.
-2x Krosan Grip, 3x Indrik Stomphowler: Pesky artifacts and enchantments? No more. Indrik is a beast and can be sacrificed to Baloth, as well.
-4x Elephant Grass: Great versus early, aggressive aggro, and Ichorid especially.
Benefits of running this deck in your typical metagame:
-Unexpected and fun!
-Root Maze is beautiful versus Thresh, and the litany of decks that run fetchlands. Also lovely against Stax.
-Little dependence on graveyard: Only thing we have that really takes advantage of our graveyard is Sword of Light and Shadow. We are hardly hurt at all by Tormod's Crypt, Relic of Progenitus, and Leyline of the Void, which means most decks will have a smaller sideboard pool against us.
-Great match-up versus combo: 4x Root Maze, 3x Sphere of Resistance are very effective vs. combo. After we sideboard, however, we rather seal the deal. Go ahead, laugh maniacally to yourself. You deserve it.
-Heavy land-hate theme: Most decks in today's environment don't run that many land. When we start hitting their land and then make the rest of them CITP tapped, the game sways progressively in our favor.
-Lots of life gain: Baloth and Sword of Light and Shadow help us recover mid-late game versus those fast aggro decks, and Burn especially.
Downsides:
-Vulnerability to non-basic land hate. This being said, with Root Maze, enemy Wastelands CITP, giving us a chance to nuke them with Winter's Grasp, etc.
-Sometimes, just not fast enough. If we cannot resolve an early Root Maze or Sphere, we can be in trouble, especially versus fast aggro decks.
Yes, I know we are not running Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere. They are antisynergistic with several cards in the deck, and I find Root Maze & Sphere of Resistance as an equivalent trade (well, I find it better for us in this situation, heh).
Thanks for reading!
calibretto
MTGS Average Peasant Cube 2023 Edition
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Sakura-Tribe Elder is a lovely suggestion. So is Sundering Titan. I am considering removing the Call of the Herds to make room for these, as well as the two Chrome Moxen, as they haven't been working that well in playtesting.
I'm thinking:
-4 Call of the Herd
-2 Chrome Mox
+4 Sakura-Tribe Elder
+2 Sundering Titan
What do you guys think?
*edit:
Yes it feels very rewarding, almost like you've taught your goldfish to do your taxes :xd:
Blastoderm, its a good beater with shroud... also a beast
Indrik stomphowler, maybe just sideboard but blows up artifacts and enchantments and is a beast
Yavimaya dryad, not a beast but gets you a land every time you recur her
The Stomphowler, however, is a lovely suggestion for sideboard
I like the indrik stomphowler; he isn't too taxing on landbase and can hurt countertop pretty bad although they could reveal force of will to counter him city of solitude solves that problem nicely.
4 grips maindeck? Maybe cut a few and have you considered jitte? I always like that equipment because it is the definition of versatility
Currently Playing:
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While it is true that LED will come into play tapped, that won't prevent the opponent using it, as it only needs to be sacked. Just wanted to point it out for you.
DCI L2 Judge
GP:Madrid 2010 45th
GP:Amsterdam 2011 74th
GP:London 2013 67th
Bazaar of Moxen 2013 32nd
Currently Playing
WUBG Ravanger Affinity
WWWTheMightyQuinn
The upkeep could be payed for quite a long time if need be, and it keeps this deck from rolling to ichorid. If anything, i think its a better sb card than fallowed earth.
By the way, I really love this idea. I love mono green, and have been working on a somewhat similar list in my head for a while now. Never gonna bother getting the cards for it most likely, but its just fun to thing about mono green control.
Also, with so few creatures i would think that sphere of resistance would be better in the board than the thorns.
The wires might be a decent fit for this style of deck, though it would certainly need testing. As for Mwonvuli, I would think Creeping Mold would be a better fit, as it would allow for a similar effect to grip (granted without the uncounterability) + Land Destruction.
Currently Running
Legacy: Burn; Various Stompy's; Food Chain Goblins; FC Elves
Standard: Junk Super Friends, Elf-Wave
Elder Dragon Highlander: Animar, Skithiryx, Bosh, Konda, Wort, Ezuri, Patron of the Moon
I like the ideas and flavor of the deck, a few concerns and questions on card choices and execution:
- I do not think there is a need to ramp up mana. You got Garruk, Cloudposts and Vesuva's but max out at a 5 cc spell. It's not adding up in my head. (ie, there is not "fireball" esq spell or a crush of wurms or something that needs sooooo much mana)
I would center the deck on root maze, LD, and Plow Under as control/screw the opponent and work my way outward. Thorn is also good because Maze + Thorn is just gravy against combo. I'd prefer to keep it in the SB just like you have it because it doesn't hit critters. Plow under is a mini-finisher. You not only ruin the mana base, they draw lands for the ensuing 2 turns (unless they got something to fix it pronto).
I'd personally run the wasteland + loam combo (ghost quarter as well). Way too good not to abuse with root maze. I'd also swap mox diamond IN for chrome mox OUT. Moment's peace is also a nice card to consider -- owns out of the SB against aggro. Tangle Wire is a good suggestion (kudos to NERER0CKET for that)
With all that said, this would be my shell...trying to stay out of Green-Staxxx area:
4 Mox Diamond
4 wasteland
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Winter's Grasp
3 Tangle Wire
3 Plow Under
3 Life from the Loam
3 Eternal Witness
As for threats, i have no idea lol. Baloth is a great option and Garruk can do awesome stuff too (do not run him as a 4x he's got that legend effect). I like Call of the Herd but maybe that's me. Tarmogoyf is yet again another good inclusion (who woulda guessed). Witness is a must IMO...i NEED to be able to recur some options pronto! "oh, i just plow-undered you? yea...have it again" or "tangle wire just fizzled...let's have it again"
I feel inclined to add COTH to the mix because if I abuse loam with the LD-lands, I can flashback those spells from the grave.
Dosan the Falling Leaf = another option to disrupt the opponent. There's also Xantid Swarm.
10th at SCG: Syracuse (2014), GP:NJ Last-Chance Grinder Winner (2014):: Former Legacy Mod
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Treetop Village
3 Tranquil Thicket
8 Forest
2 Eternal Witness
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Life from the Loam
4 Root Maze
4 Thorn of Amethys
3 Moment's Peace
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
3 Harmonize
2 Rude Awakening
2 Plow Under
... it's not competitive though
Currently Playing
WUBG Ravanger Affinity
WWWTheMightyQuinn
Currently Playing:
Retired
I thought long and hard about Thornling. I decided against it as I found it a bit too slow, and it still dies just as easily to Swords to Plowshares and the new Path to Exile, and it's sadly not a beast Also, He does not go well at all with City of Solitude, and I would much much rather run the City over Thornling.
I like Reap and Sow, but I don't think it does enough for the mana investment; it is too slow, and Plow Under is too good to removet. A resolved Plow Under hitting two lands can often win us the game.
Indrik Stomphowler is definitely going in the sideboard. With his addition, I think I will also cut one or two Grips maindeck, as I'm starting to realize we need more room for other things anyways Don't want Umezawa's Jitte, however. I'd much rather have the swords in here; they give us the card advantage the deck is lacking, and protect our creatures from kill spells. Umezawa's Jitte doesn't go very will with City of Solitude, either.
Thanks for pointing that out, I am stupid sometimes, hehe.
The Acid-Moss is nice, but I'd rather run Reap and Sow in its stead (also easier to cast with 8 Cloudposts maindeck :p). And I'd rather run Plow Under in Reap's stead, lol.
Sakura-Tribe Elder however should be enough to help us get more land out, especially when it is recurrable with SOLS.
Tangle Wire is a card I definitely considered. I chose not to run it because we cannot take that much advantage of it; we don't provide enough early permanents to tap for it (Root Maze cannot be tapped to Tangle Wire), and we do not have lands that tap for 2 on turn 1. Ultimately, I decided the three-mana-investment is better spent on land destruction (Ice Storm).
Elephant Grass is a lovely suggestion, I will put those in the sideboard too. And @ Sphere of Resistance over Thorns of Amethyst: good call, I had completely forgot about the Sphere.
Also, I've decided that the Sphere can come in maindeck. There will be no situation where it is not advantageous to us
Thanks. Updated decklist at the end of this post, and updated to the thread's original post as well.
Your points are well-founded, but I am making additions to the deck to take advantage of the plethora of mana it can generate. Namely Sundering Titan, which is a complete badass. Sphere of Resistence is another one. Also, all the colorless mana helps us abuse our equipment and keep the threats coming.
And, to answer your last suggestion: The equipment is also there for our card advantage. Sylvan Library sounds like an interesting suggestion, though. We can take advantage of it with all the life gain the deck offers. I think I will try adding a few of those too.
I hope to answer your first concern with my following new decklist.
Root Maze + Sphere of Resistance
@ the Wasteland + Loam combo: I am not fond of this. It does not work as well under a Root Maze, and I also am rather fond of the deck's current little-dependance on graveyard (only thing really taking advantage of it is Sword of Light and Shadow), which is hated on enormously in sideboards.
Moment's Peace is bad with City of Solitude. City ain't going, it is an incredible card. Playtest it and you will looooove it, almost as much as Root Maze
I don't like the idea of swapping Chrome Mox for Mox Diamond; Mox Diamond would require us to run more mana to be able to reliably cast it turn 1 with a land, and would put us again on the track of wanting to run cards like Life From the Loam. Chrome Mox allows us to put extra coppies of Garruk and Root Maze to better use.
I like your deck, but I find it too dedicated to one function. I don't see it doing well versus cheap, aggressive aggro, or at being able to keep the pressure on by presenting threats and gaining card advantage. I would at least suggest that land that cycles for for you to abuse with LFTL. I would suggest Garruk, but I don't think you have enough to protect him (from attacking creatures).
He's defnitely a lovely option, I will try to fit him in.
Alright, the updated decklist:
4x Cloudpost
4x Vesuva
3x Treetop Village
4x Forest
4x Snow-Covered Forest
Acceleration (9)
2x Chrome Mox
4x Elvish Spirit Guide
3x Sakura-Tribe Elder
Control (18)
4x Root Maze
4x Ice Storm
2x Plow Under
3x City of Solitude
2x Krosan Grip
3x Sphere of Resistence
3x Garruk, Wildspeaker
3x Ravenous Baloth
2x Sundering Titan
2x Woodfall Primus
2x Sword of Fire and Ice
2x Sword of Light and Shadow
1x Sphere of Resistence
2x Krosan Grip
1x City of Solitude
4x Thorn of Amethyst
4x Elephant Grass
3x Indrik Stomphowler
The match-up versus combo is much better now. After sideboarding, we have 4x Root Maze, 4x Sphere of Resistence, 4x Thorn of Amethyst.
The deck is starting to look more fine-tuned now too.
The addition of heavy threats like Sundering Titan and Woodfall Primus are very much to my liking. They keep on the land-hate pressure while providing big, fat win conditions that keep hurting the opponent again even if they manage to remove them (aside from Swords to Plowshares).
I'd immediately drop the 4x swords...you're control, no need for stuff like that. It's cute if you wanna go casual or do some pseudo late-game aggro/control thing but it really goes against your plan of control.
I don't like Elvish Spirit Guide and Chrome Mox...I think it's more economical to just go 4x Mox Diamond and run with mana accel that way (rather than the 1x stint from ESG)...your stuff costs a bunch anyways (ie; you are not comboing into stuff or "going off" fast on T1 or T2 --- build for the long haul).
I would advise to drop Treetops, since you're running a tempo-control sort of game (LD and the likes). Creatures are up to you as well. I like the improvements overall but had to point out some more stuff in the updated list.
10th at SCG: Syracuse (2014), GP:NJ Last-Chance Grinder Winner (2014):: Former Legacy Mod
-The swords can be casted and equiped in the same turn easily mid-late game from the cloudpost engine + Garruk.
-With a City of Solitude in play, the swords are even more effective, as we can cast a threat, and equip it that turn, not having to worry about it ever being exposed to hate. Alternatively, we can cast a sword and equip it that turn too. And the opponent will not be able to respond to it being equipped.
Elvish Spirit Guide is very useful because:
-It is an immediate mana source, similar to Chrome Mox/Mox Diamond, that is unaffected by Root Maze. This is very key. Also, mid-late game it can be cast as a creature instead and carry a sword. That is a huge bonus over a mox, which is why the deck runs four.
I am considering replacing the 3rd Treetop with another forest. However, they are very useful. And they do well carrying swords as well, providing trample as well to ensure you get some damage through. A Treetop with a sword is a 5/5 trampler, able to take on most threats out there.
I suggest you playtest my build some more, hopefully you'll at least somewhat agree with my points here.
Don't forget they're also manasinks, and with 8 post that's a big plus. I think they should stay, but I'm not sold on 4, I think 3 should be enough, would let you up City back to 4 as well.
Currently Running
Legacy: Burn; Various Stompy's; Food Chain Goblins; FC Elves
Standard: Junk Super Friends, Elf-Wave
Elder Dragon Highlander: Animar, Skithiryx, Bosh, Konda, Wort, Ezuri, Patron of the Moon
I need to playtest this more.
I love City in the deck. It protects you from so much stuff, it's hilarious.
Also, it'd help if i were more coherent right now... my thoughts are slipping in and out
More of my 2 cents later.
(and now my closer makes me think... and it hurts)
Have any questions or concerns? Come take a dip in my pool.
he draws you cards, gets an 2 lands and has and 2 power for an extra green
He is definitely a noteworthy suggestion. I fear he will fail to perform the role that Sakura does, and is harder to resolve early with 8post. Still, he's pretty rockin'. I'll have to playtest him.
Currently Playing:
Retired