If someone is countering your creatures, that's a NO they can not counter later. Also, these days, I only see cards like Symbiote and Visionary get counted unless I am hardcasting Hoof. I am ok with that.
Finally getting around to finishing my Elves deck. Been playing it for about a year and a half, but after they changed the Legendary rule, I put it on the backburner because I couldn't afford more Cradles. Better living situation, finances, etc. means I can start tackling away at it. Just picked up my last Natural Order, and will be hopefully picking up a Wooded Foothills and Cradle this week. Here's what I'm thinking.
I'm attending a SCG Open in July, so I'm preparing for that. Shifting around my SB from my local tournament scene to a 9 or 10 round tournament.
Apparently Elderscale Wurm could be a thing in the sideboard. Being on the play, ramping into a N.O. grabbing that on turn 2/3 definitely help against a handful of decks. That over Progenitus?
I was originally rocking a Savannah in the MD with a Gaddock Teeg in the side, but I'm not too concerned about it right now. I think Mindbreak Trap fills that void. I took out 1 Trap though for a Pithing Needle. Seems like a necessary evil with the rise of Sneak & Show, and Miracles back on the scene.
Why no Cavern of Souls? I could see squeezing it in as a one of or is there a downside that I'm missing? It cannot cast Glimpse, but that one is likely to be followed by creatures anyway and it cannot cast Symbiote, but that doesn't seem terrible.
I don't think countering elves is a winning proposition against this deck. I mean, it could be an issue sometimes, but I think not being able to cast Glimpse off Cavern will come up more often.
Elderscale wurm is definitely a thing. That said, I don't know that it's good against the same decks as Progenitus. I really like having a backup guy that can't (usually) be removed. Elderscale seems amazing for the burn matchup in particular.
Progenitus is good against attrition matches, the kinds where they want to slowly eat away at your creatures and lands and gradually gain small advantages that pile up. In these matches, dropping a card that they can not handle is useful and life it not often an issue. After all, when racing a Delver, two hits is faster than 7.
Elderscale I feel is useful against matches that we are already advantaged at. Against Burn we are faster, against Zoo we have more resources, against Goblins we have a larger pool of effects to draw from. Most of the other decks I would see Elderscale being useful, we already have answers for in either Hoof or Progenitus.
Granted, if combo is dead in your meta and Aggro is a big deal, this guy would be better than Ruric Thar. So I can see some people really getting their moneys worth it if him.
Well personally, I'm the only Combo player in my local Meta, but burn (and U/R/x tempo) is pretty big. I like the idea of having something in the Sideboard that just totally puts them out of the game. These decks rarely have access to STP or edicts, but can kill enough elves to give me trouble, while still going for my life total.
Can someone explain to me the benefit of playing Dryad Arbor? I understand it helps with Gaea's Cradle and Natural Order synergy, but that does not seem too strong to me. Why is it good in this deck?
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Modern: U Merfolk | GR Tron | WUR Jeskai Control | WBG Abzan Company
Can someone explain to me the benefit of playing Dryad Arbor? I understand it helps with Gaea's Cradle and Natural Order synergy, but that does not seem too strong to me. Why is it good in this deck?
T1 GSZ target. NO Sac outlet. Shenanigans with Quirion Ranger. Adds extreme backup insurance while Progenitus is in play vs sacrifice effects. Values well with Cradle. Any reason not to play it?
While good for finding what you want in the list and keeping things compact, all the Spoiler tags make this Primer quite the pain to edit. I may, if i have to do large amounts of editing in the future, change the lay out for ease of use in this regard.
Hi Dice_Bag. I would encourage you to lose most of the spoiler tags. In general you only want to put bonus information in spoilers; the stuff that everyone is clicking on your primer to see probably should be just out in the open. I use 'quote' boxes as a way of separating sections in my primer.
This is a good read I'm looking to get into legacy and this style of deck really suits me. Would Crop Rotation be useful as a way to cheat out Gaea's Cradle?
Edit: I see you do run Crop Rotation but most of the decks listed don't. Why do you run it? Why don't most decks? Thanks
I don't run it much any more, but I did run it as a second tool box when combo was big in my Meta. Some lands where great silver bullets against said combo decks and made the effort worthwhile.
If you happen to only have two Cradle though for example, yes, rotation is the best option open on you. It also gives you cards like Bog, Karakas if you have it and other things like Maze from the side. It's not something that is used much now, but for years it was a main stay and if the legend rule had not changed, it would still be in the deck. It's good enough.
It's not without its weakness though, often you weaken yourself to Wasteland, Counterspells hurt and you offer more for to opposing DRS if they are on the table. But, that said, it's not bad.
with ruric thar showing up in some lists, for those that have tried it, do you feel like it's a good option to have in the deck, or is it better just to main 2 hoofs?
i'm trying to decide whether i take a 4-of down to 3 for 1 reclamation sage mainboard, or run 1 ofs hoof and ruric.
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Standard:
Nothing Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar
Hoof is too important to cut, if your needing to add Thar, add him on top of the Hoof. Julian won BoM with a 61 card list that was standard plus a Thar in top.
Also, just to add, we have the strongest drawing power in the format aside from Omnishow. Visionary, Glimpse, Symbiote. This deck can get away with 61. Insitually you always cut the idea, but it can be done.
Wurm is an answer to Sneak and show. They attack with Emmy, you kill them on the swing back.
Personally, I run 4 Thoughtseize and 4 Swan Song, but before that I ran 4 Therapy and 3 Thoughtseize. If you are playing GB, I would say go high, but Blue really does offer that extra option. Against RUG, it's great to counter Rough and against SnT it's good to have the two options
Honestly, it offers options but my Meta has shifted to mostly DnT. I have found that I am mostly just breaking face without the sideboard. That and my recent acquirement of new cards has left me with more decks to test.
That said, I love that card. The games that it shines it glows. In the games where it is lacklustre, Thoughtseize is normally quite strong. The two in combination make for a great match against no small amount of decks. Also, fetching a Tropical has won me a few game one's. Blue is on everyone's radar and when they don't know why you have it, the Wastelands fly at the Tropical then the Bayou. The other thing is that the card is so unexpected that you often catch people off guard. One of the best options we have against traditionally unanswerable cards. The downside is though, you fracture your Mana base and you take up a large amount of your side on a card you may not use all night. Also, Tropical Island is no a cheep card. So it is not for everyone.
I have my Trop. I just got done trading for the rest of the deck minus the natural orders (can't find them anywhere). Just waiting for it to come in the mail. Last night I watched about ten matches of elves. I'm so excited to start playing it.
Nice. When you have it all done up, let me know, I would love to know how you go learning all the tricks this deck has to offer.
Just a note to myself, I need to update the OP when I get time and add in Wren's Run Packmaster, this is something the guys at The Source came up with and she works well. Also need to add some new deck lists.
I was reading that. Seems interesting, I haven't played the deck like I've said in the past but I'm not convinced on that card yet. I want to play a singleton Edric in mine.
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Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
Reclamation Sage
Color: Green
Type: Creature - Elf, Shaman
Rarity: Common
Set: M15
Cost: 2G
When Reclamation Sage enters the battlefield, you may destroy target artifact or enchantment.
2/1
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
I'm attending a SCG Open in July, so I'm preparing for that. Shifting around my SB from my local tournament scene to a 9 or 10 round tournament.
4 Heritage Druid
4 Quirion Ranger
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Elvish Visionary
2 Llanowar Elves
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
1 Viridian Shaman
1 Birchlore Rangers
1 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
4 Glimpse of Nature
3 Natural Order
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Gaea's Cradle
2 Bayou
1 Taiga
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Forest
4 Thoughtseize
3 Cabal Therapy
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Mindbreak Trap
1 Pithing Needle
1 Progenitus
1 Scavenging Ooze
Apparently Elderscale Wurm could be a thing in the sideboard. Being on the play, ramping into a N.O. grabbing that on turn 2/3 definitely help against a handful of decks. That over Progenitus?
I was originally rocking a Savannah in the MD with a Gaddock Teeg in the side, but I'm not too concerned about it right now. I think Mindbreak Trap fills that void. I took out 1 Trap though for a Pithing Needle. Seems like a necessary evil with the rise of Sneak & Show, and Miracles back on the scene.
ex-Moderator
Legacy love.
I don't think countering elves is a winning proposition against this deck. I mean, it could be an issue sometimes, but I think not being able to cast Glimpse off Cavern will come up more often.
Elderscale wurm is definitely a thing. That said, I don't know that it's good against the same decks as Progenitus. I really like having a backup guy that can't (usually) be removed. Elderscale seems amazing for the burn matchup in particular.
Elderscale I feel is useful against matches that we are already advantaged at. Against Burn we are faster, against Zoo we have more resources, against Goblins we have a larger pool of effects to draw from. Most of the other decks I would see Elderscale being useful, we already have answers for in either Hoof or Progenitus.
Granted, if combo is dead in your meta and Aggro is a big deal, this guy would be better than Ruric Thar. So I can see some people really getting their moneys worth it if him.
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
Circle of Predation, Part 1
Circle of Predation, Part 2
U Merfolk | GR Tron | WUR Jeskai Control | WBG Abzan Company
EDH:
G Ezuri, Renegade Leader, Fighting for Rivendell
WU Brago, King Eternal, Long Live the King
WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon, Worship the Dragon
T1 GSZ target. NO Sac outlet. Shenanigans with Quirion Ranger. Adds extreme backup insurance while Progenitus is in play vs sacrifice effects. Values well with Cradle. Any reason not to play it?
Remember guys, you can GSZ for more than the target to play around Counterbalance.
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
This is a good read I'm looking to get into legacy and this style of deck really suits me. Would Crop Rotation be useful as a way to cheat out Gaea's Cradle?
Edit: I see you do run Crop Rotation but most of the decks listed don't. Why do you run it? Why don't most decks? Thanks
If you happen to only have two Cradle though for example, yes, rotation is the best option open on you. It also gives you cards like Bog, Karakas if you have it and other things like Maze from the side. It's not something that is used much now, but for years it was a main stay and if the legend rule had not changed, it would still be in the deck. It's good enough.
It's not without its weakness though, often you weaken yourself to Wasteland, Counterspells hurt and you offer more for to opposing DRS if they are on the table. But, that said, it's not bad.
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
i'm trying to decide whether i take a 4-of down to 3 for 1 reclamation sage mainboard, or run 1 ofs hoof and ruric.
Nothing
Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial
EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar
Also, just to add, we have the strongest drawing power in the format aside from Omnishow. Visionary, Glimpse, Symbiote. This deck can get away with 61. Insitually you always cut the idea, but it can be done.
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
Also what is Worldspine Wurm doing in sideboards?
PS just now making this deck, pretty excited about it.
Personally, I run 4 Thoughtseize and 4 Swan Song, but before that I ran 4 Therapy and 3 Thoughtseize. If you are playing GB, I would say go high, but Blue really does offer that extra option. Against RUG, it's great to counter Rough and against SnT it's good to have the two options
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
That said, I love that card. The games that it shines it glows. In the games where it is lacklustre, Thoughtseize is normally quite strong. The two in combination make for a great match against no small amount of decks. Also, fetching a Tropical has won me a few game one's. Blue is on everyone's radar and when they don't know why you have it, the Wastelands fly at the Tropical then the Bayou. The other thing is that the card is so unexpected that you often catch people off guard. One of the best options we have against traditionally unanswerable cards. The downside is though, you fracture your Mana base and you take up a large amount of your side on a card you may not use all night. Also, Tropical Island is no a cheep card. So it is not for everyone.
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.
Just a note to myself, I need to update the OP when I get time and add in Wren's Run Packmaster, this is something the guys at The Source came up with and she works well. Also need to add some new deck lists.
Current decks of choice:
Vintage: Shops.
Legacy: Lands.
Modern: Lantern.