I have 2 GB decks that all have interesting elements I like, but they just aren't enough. They are either too slow or inconsistent and I end up drawing crap even when I have non-land cards. I'm wondering what could turn them into actually good decks. The problem is they both depend on one main component which obviously isn't always drawn, and I don't think cheap tutors are allowed in legacy anyway.
First of all; I don't know how you're making a bad Survival deck with Vengevine + Rootwalla; but it's illegal anyway. It's banned because when you add blue to the mix; the deck is insanely consistent and works
I hate to suggest things like this for legacy; but the synergies with: Drown in Filth (kill a weenie, works well with fetch-lands, helps get dreads/shadows into the grave) Grisly Salvage (helps find varolz, puts dreads/shadows in the grave) Tormented Existence (Vengevine + Rootwalla combo like a bad survival of the fittest; which is from the same cycle. Also digs out Varols while putting Shadows/Dreads in the grave)
Consider Torpor Orb as an alternate way to get Horror + Dreadnought into play. Probably only a 2-of. Gravecrawler is a good fit; Bloodghast isn't. This is because Gravecrawler "casts", so you can get castings for Vengevine.
While I know you're on a budget; your manabase is pretty garbagey.
A list I'd imagine serving you better would be something like:
The mountain is just to make it obvious you need to figure out the land base for it; but I'd also imagine getting Life from the Loam would help on all fronts; as well as getting Wasteland in there. Were you going all out, dropping Deluge, Commune, and a couple Drowns would be good slots for Dark Confidant.
That all said; dumping a ton of money into a grave deck is not an optimal solution; especially a grave deck that is kinda slow. Dredge is somewhat budget and at least can combo out relatively easily G1, and sometimes just fine G2/G3.
Consider other Evoke creatures as well; as "Evoke" is a form of casting; and so is Madness. Both of these can trigger Vengevine.
Well this is more casual legacy and survival wasn't always be banned, and I never said the combo in general wasn't inconsistent. I made separate decks because I didn't want them to be combined, I don't want valroz and vengevine in the same deck, why would I want to exile a vengevine? The draw you presented isn't as good for a deck that consists of 17 spells.
if you're in casual, and by that i mean, not trying to beat legacy decks at all, i like to make BG about good creatures (putrid leech, kitchen finks), good removal (putrefy, abrupt decay), card advantage in night's whisper and maybe add some cool recursion cards like pharika's healer and death denied going with shriekmaw.
if you like graveyard theme, you could add mortivore, whip of erebos. boneyard wurm and play many grisly salvages, dredge cards, and other grave stuff. if you are going to play survival of the fittest deck, i'd suggest a rock deck like i mentioned but this time including 1 genesis, 1 acidic slime or viridian zealot and the full 4 survivals.
You're in a legacy forum and Survival is banned. You want non-legacy advice then parading illegal lists in legacy forums will cause members to state the obvious. The combo in general is *not* inconsistent is my point. If you have Survival in your hand or tutor it with Commune with the Gods (or other colors) it's a 1-card engine that will win within two turns.
Either way, the reason to combine the decks is you're using a lot of mediocre cards to fill gaps; at least the mediocre cards I suggested fulfill either plan (dumping vengevines into the grave, or fat for Varolz.) By multiplying the number of combos in a deck, you get much better chance of finding one (or even both) of them.
It also saves you from losing to Surgical Extraction or Extirpate; which (if you were playing Legacy) would matter. I stand by the card suggestions I presented you with; casual or not.
Alright I'll give it a try. But if I'm going to be putting lands in my graveyard, I should probably have something to do with them. Btw toxic deluge doesn't exist, the only deluges are blue.
Alright I'll give it a try. But if I'm going to be putting lands in my graveyard, I should probably have something to do with them. Btw toxic deluge doesn't exist, the only deluges are blue.
Reprints the one card that people point to when saying that art objectifies women.
Well done Wizards.
Liliana does not objectify women in any way at all. We have gotten to a point in our society that every single picture of a women must be objectifying a women in some negative way......blah blah blah.. That is not the case. (((Sarcasm)))Picture of a girl drinking a milk shake, must be sex related and putting women down, picture of girl sitting on a beach, picture of a girl driving a car, picture of a girl on the moon at a new space station.)))
You have a picture of an attractive strong power women who girls dress up as for anime conventions. What more do you want? The picture is fine, happy to see a reprint. Sick of of seeing people claim that everything in existence must be putting women down. Then all I have to do is replace the word "women" with anything else to get the same mentality; fish, cats, arabs, blacks, jews, men, environment, whites, chinese, old people, etc. It doesn't matter what word I put in. Stop sucking life out of everything man. That artwork of her is awesome. Stop putting stuff down man. Just stop. If the picture was really as negative as you claim she would totally nude, in a kitchen, making sandwiches and giving blow jobs. Her abilities would be horrible as well. +1 do nothing -2 do nothing -6 do nothing. Instead liliana of the veil is an amazing planeswalker comparable to jace, the mind sculpter with great art to appreciate.
My suggestion listen to some comedy radio for a while, pandora is free, youtube is free there is something out there for you. ***** go make fun of somebody. The whole world is so serious and campaigning for some cause, or someones rights, everything is a hate crime, racist, sexist. blah blah blah.
"O no mcdonalds must be slandering a hate crime against skinny people every time they make a big mac." hahaha jeeze You're just someone perpetuating another groups negative perspective that they've made you believe is correct. Look at the picture for a hour and tell me what's wrong with it? I don't see anything.
I have heard vague rumors of a moustache-dispensing vending machine in a distant laundromat, across the street from a tattoo parlor. However, this information is shaky, and time is of the essence.
Must not be in tcgplayer's database yet.
Anyway, the deck actually works nice, it beats novice-advert decks more often than not with a few modifications. Torpor orb also helps defend against my opponents, it doesn't mess up Valroz or lotleth or vengevine or any of the key cards and I like lotleth as a discard engine too much to get rid of it. I wanted to make use of the lands I'd end up putting in my graveyard with attack power and I couldn't find a better one for its mana cost than terravore, but I could have sword there were better ones, similar to Knight of the Reliquary but green/black for 3 or less.
4 Woodland Cemetery
4 Overgrown Tomb
8 Swamp
8 Forest
24 Lands
Creatures
4 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 Death's Shadow
4 Lotleth Troll
2 Thought Gorger
2 Mind Maggots
2 Hunted Horror
22 Creatures
4 Thoughtseize
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Survival of the Fittest
3 Ranger's Guile
14 Other Spells
0 Sideboard Cards
4 Overgrown Tomb
5 Forest
5 Swamp
4 Woodland Cemetery
4 Golgari Guildgate
20 Lands
Creatures
4 Vengevine
4 Lotleth Troll
4 Bloodghast
4 Gravecrawler
2 Basking Rootwalla
1 Big Game Hunter
4 Rotting Rats
1 Nezumi Bone-Reader
24 Creatures
4 Thoughtseize
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Survival of the Fittest
4 Skulltap
16 Other Spells
0 Sideboard Cards
I hate to suggest things like this for legacy; but the synergies with:
Drown in Filth (kill a weenie, works well with fetch-lands, helps get dreads/shadows into the grave)
Grisly Salvage (helps find varolz, puts dreads/shadows in the grave)
Tormented Existence (Vengevine + Rootwalla combo like a bad survival of the fittest; which is from the same cycle. Also digs out Varols while putting Shadows/Dreads in the grave)
Consider Torpor Orb as an alternate way to get Horror + Dreadnought into play. Probably only a 2-of. Gravecrawler is a good fit; Bloodghast isn't. This is because Gravecrawler "casts", so you can get castings for Vengevine.
While I know you're on a budget; your manabase is pretty garbagey.
A list I'd imagine serving you better would be something like:
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Drown in Filth
2 Grisly Salvage
1 Commune with the Gods
1 Tormented Existence
2 Toxic Deluge
4 Thoughtseize
3 Shriekmaw
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 Death's Shadow
4 Vengevine
4 Basking Rootwalla
3 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
21 Mountain
The mountain is just to make it obvious you need to figure out the land base for it; but I'd also imagine getting Life from the Loam would help on all fronts; as well as getting Wasteland in there. Were you going all out, dropping Deluge, Commune, and a couple Drowns would be good slots for Dark Confidant.
That all said; dumping a ton of money into a grave deck is not an optimal solution; especially a grave deck that is kinda slow. Dredge is somewhat budget and at least can combo out relatively easily G1, and sometimes just fine G2/G3.
Consider other Evoke creatures as well; as "Evoke" is a form of casting; and so is Madness. Both of these can trigger Vengevine.
Look, Fetch, Draw, Look
Draw
Fetch
Look
if you like graveyard theme, you could add mortivore, whip of erebos. boneyard wurm and play many grisly salvages, dredge cards, and other grave stuff. if you are going to play survival of the fittest deck, i'd suggest a rock deck like i mentioned but this time including 1 genesis, 1 acidic slime or viridian zealot and the full 4 survivals.
Either way, the reason to combine the decks is you're using a lot of mediocre cards to fill gaps; at least the mediocre cards I suggested fulfill either plan (dumping vengevines into the grave, or fat for Varolz.) By multiplying the number of combos in a deck, you get much better chance of finding one (or even both) of them.
It also saves you from losing to Surgical Extraction or Extirpate; which (if you were playing Legacy) would matter. I stand by the card suggestions I presented you with; casual or not.
Look, Fetch, Draw, Look
Draw
Fetch
Look
This is Toxic Deluge.
Anyway, the deck actually works nice, it beats novice-advert decks more often than not with a few modifications. Torpor orb also helps defend against my opponents, it doesn't mess up Valroz or lotleth or vengevine or any of the key cards and I like lotleth as a discard engine too much to get rid of it. I wanted to make use of the lands I'd end up putting in my graveyard with attack power and I couldn't find a better one for its mana cost than terravore, but I could have sword there were better ones, similar to Knight of the Reliquary but green/black for 3 or less.
4 Overgrown Tomb
4 Woodland Cemetery
7 Forest
7 Swamp
22 Lands
Creatures
4 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
4 Basking Rootwalla
1 Gravecrawler
1 Death's Shadow
4 Vengevine
4 Lotleth Troll
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
2 Terravore
23 Creatures
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Grisly Salvage
1 Commune with the Gods
4 Thoughtseize
2 Torpor Orb
15 Other Spells
0 Sideboard Card
Have any questions or concerns? Come take a dip in my pool.