That's why we need a little more spoils to start making educated guesses, If magma jet is the sole pre 5 mana response to a phalanx leader getting spectral flighted up or whatever there's going to be a lot of people going to 12.
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Yeah. If the clunky, common removal spell is sorcery speed again like Liturgy of Blood, heroes might roam free. M14 actually has so few instant answers that running out auras is totally fine. In M14, an aura is very unlikely to get 2-for-1ed until your opponent's turn (in fact, is red the only color that can actually 2-for-1 auras at instant speed at common? nothing else is coming to mind). That makes losing Mark of the Vampire easier to swallow. If that's anywhere near the case in Theros...
As it seems like this might be a slightly slower format, card advantage could be extremely important. Along those lines, Read the Bones looks fantastic. Divination with an added bonus of hopefully drawing no lands with only a minor drawback of 2 life looks very, very good.
My pick for best common revealed so far. I'd go as far as saying it may be format defining. "Too bad" it's splashable, so everyone will fight over these.
I'm not sure of how much of a role bog-standard auras (As opposed to Bestow) are going to play in Theros limited. Because Bestow sidesteps most of the weaknesses of auras, they don't have to specifically downplay removal (And instant-speed removal) to make auras 'playable,' so I'm not sure if this is a set where you play a bunch of noncreature auras and Voltron up your creatures every time. There might be other ways of mitigating the weaknesses of auras.
However, removal at common has been significantly depowered from Innistrad block on, so I don't expect a removal spell that's as good as Doom Blade. There might be some premium removal that's sorcery speed - something like Journey to Nowhere (There's a rumored card that's Journey for W with a downside).
EDIT: Read the Bones is the stone noodly boodlies in any format from planet earth. The card's powerlevel is more similar to Compulsive Research or Thirst for Knowledge than Divination.
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My biggest issue with Heroic is the fact that most Limited decks will probably only be packing eight or nine non-creature spells. Most of the time (at least in my opinion), I would want the majority of those to be removal spells of some kind or other, or else a finisher effect like Overrun. How many times can you run something like Giant Growth before it becomes too many? Consequently, how many chances are you honestly going to see Heroic activate?
I had similar concerns about Battalion and was proven wrong about how recurring the effect could be, but simply turning men sideways seems different from having to find and cast something that targets your own guys. Note that Heroic doesn't trigger when your opponent targets your guy with a spell, only when you do.
This is what I was thinking. At first I was like "omg!!! A +1/+1 counter on all my creatures when I target this guy!!" But then I thought about how heroic would actually play and I don't know how relevant it will be. I think it's a really cool mechanic with a simple design, but I actually think it's a slower grindier mechanic rather than an aggro one, just because early on I'd rather develop the board than target my guy with a spell. It becomes more of a thing with bestow creatures, but those (so far) seem to be late game plays since they're costed highly.
As for removal in the set, so far it's REALLY bad. However, so far there are only like 5 instants revealed, so I'm sure there will be some instant speed removal. Also, no removal in black has been spoiled, so I'm confident that what we've seen is not necessarily representative of the set.
As for removal in the set, so far it's REALLY bad. However, so far there are only like 5 instants revealed, so I'm sure there will be some instant speed removal. Also, no removal in black has been spoiled, so I'm confident that what we've seen is not necessarily representative of the set.
But you know one of the black removal is gonna be the obligatory "doesn't interact with the block mechanic" removal. Probably "destroy target non-enchantment creature" or "destroy target non-enchanted creature."
But you know one of the black removal is gonna be the obligatory "doesn't interact with the block mechanic" removal. Probably "destroy target non-enchantment creature" or "destroy target non-enchanted creature."
That's fine. Ultimate Price was still a first pick in RTR. If they made a 1B uncommon instant with "Destroy target non-enchantment creature" or "Destroy target creature that's not enchanted" (or whatever the templating would be) I would first pick it every time. Because even though it wouldn't interact with the block mechanic, it would still cover a majority of the creatures in the set.
Well, the common nymph cycle looks good. We'd already seen the black one, which seems to be more or less in the middle of the pack (second-best ability, but quite a bit more expensive than the others).
The white one is pretty bad as a creature (kind of a "I really need to trade with an early x/2" kind of thing), but as an aura it's reasonably costed and vigilance is good on big things. Think of worse Knightly Valor that still gives you your token if the target gets removed in response, and isn't blank if you're stuck on land or don't have a creature in play.
Red seems pretty good; the option to cast it as a creature seems a lot more relevant than it does for the white nymph, since a 2/2 first striker is usually a pretty good early blocker (which seems like one of the major scenarios where you wouldn't hold out for Bestow).
Blue is obviously just fantastic. It's not that far from a wind drake/Drake Umbra split card, which seems amazing on a common. This is going to be one of the top commons.
The green one is actually pretty interesting just because the Bestow ability is so aggressively costed. 4 mana is a lot less than 5, and it's worlds away from 6 or 7 mana. I think that makes this an important enabler for Heroic.
So far, I would say that red and blue have thus far gotten the lion's share of good bestow cards. As you noted, the blue flier is fantastic. Very versatile. Wind Drake or finisher, whichever you need. I think red and blue also made out best on the emissaries. Hill GiantScroll Thief that can make a huge fatty that you basically can't afford to not block is pretty sweet as is the same granting "can only be blocked by two or more."
For our common cycle, the green one also has the advantage of coming down as a bear rather than an ogre.
What's with white? I feel like they got the shaft in M14 and it's looking like it in Theros so far as well....
The white nymph may end up being better than it looks. It's a lousy creature but a pretty good aura... Knightly Valor was a good card more for the aura itself than for the token. While the Bestow on the white nymph is not as good as Knightly Valor (since you don't get the "knight" up front from the nymph), it gets wrecked by instant-speed removal slightly less hard than Valor did, and having the option to cast it as a gray ogre isn't worthless. Synergy with Heroic is probably worth something too, and the Bant-colored nymphs are best at that (because they have much more reasonable Bestow costs).
Man, there just hasn't been many low picks yet! Everything with monstrosity and bestow looks powerful so far, and heroic has a bunch of interesting stuff worth building around. Here's hoping this keeps up for the rest of the set, since Modern Masters taught us that more playables means a more interesting format.
Yeah, the nymphs are cool, but only the blue is bonkers, imo. It is arguably the only one that is good to play without bestow, and is together with the black relevant lategame when un-bestowed.
I think all of the nymphs are good role-players in the right deck but the green and blue one are high picks. The green one is just very efficient, and they both wear auras well, which I think is going to be important in this format.
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I think I will have very hard time convincing myself to cast these in the creature mode. It feels a lot like wasting some card advantage.
A lot also depends on how relevant these bodies will be. What if 2/2 end up being irrelevant after turn 5? Then this bestow mode might not be so good after all.
If your deck needs to build up Devotion, you can drop them early as their creature forms to snag another UWGR or B. If you have more auras to curve into, having an early evasive/first striking guy to suit up is fine too.
And the point to bestow is you can take what would otherwise be an irrelevant 2/2 and use it to make another creature much better. If you have a 3/3, and they have a 4/4, a 2/2 isn't going to get you much because you are still on the defensive. But turning your 3/3 into a 5/5 with vigilance/first strike/flying/reach/intimidate? That's a major gameplay swing. Suddenly they have the irrelevant creature (life totals notwithstanding obviously), and what removal they might be packing now has to hit your otherwise-useless 3/3, after which you still have a 2/2 with some ability. That's not bad at all, and in pure CA you're basically even.
This format still looks quite slow. Not because there aren't aggro options, but because there are so many rewards for spending a ton of mana: casting your Bestow creatures in their most efficient mode, activating your monsters, etc. There are plenty of incentives in all colors to draft a control deck with early blockers that curves into something big.
It also feels like the type of format where the game is decided by two players throwing knockout punches at each other (monsters, bestowed creatures, etc.) instead of a racing format.
Whilst I'd love that, WotC have already explicitly denied this.
Possibly the subset of cards we've seen so far is giving a misleading impression.
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It's looking like white might end up as the aggressive color in the set, from what we've seen so far, and it looks like Heroic will play a part in that. That said, in terms of the prerelease the red promo looks pretty insane in a format full of powerful plays at 6+ mana.
I'm hoping they print reasonable removal and little-to-no Hexproof in the set, lest the limited format turn out to be a race to huge dudes, be they Bestowed or Monstrous.
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Whilst I'd love that, WotC have already explicitly denied this.
Possibly the subset of cards we've seen so far is giving a misleading impression.
I know, I just find that hard to believe in a set that has creatures at common and uncommon that can become 8/8, 8/7, 8/9, etc. by themselves given enough time. The only other set that comes close to that is Eldrazi.
Granted, you'll need some form of mana ramp just like you needed Spawn tokens if you wanted to cast your Ulamog's Crusher with any reliability. But while the ramp should be less plentiful, monsters also function before their big finisher goes off which balances the risk that you don't get enough mana in time.
I guess we'll see, but most sets in total don't have the volume of "big mana rewards" at common and uncommon that we're seeing here in just ~30% of the Theros card pool.
This format is probably slow, but not 'battleship Magic' like RoE was. It's probably faster than R&D thinks, so it's maybe a smidge slower than triple INN. Bestow is also not entirely unlike Fuse, Evoke and Kicker in that the big, expensive version of the effect is not the one true form of the card. I think we're going to see Bestow being used more to let you break through in the late game than players holding their Bestow creatures to play them as an aura even if they have nothing else to cast.
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Do we get to play the pre-release promo again? Ouch.
On topic: read the bones - above the curve card draw. At least it's not draw 2 - scry 2 (in that order), which would be OP at 3 mana.
The common bestow: who can say no to a risk-free +2/+2 and ability? The blue one is particularly good. Man, it's a common! Pump, evasion and an additional evasive body when it dies? Sign me up.
Well, it's not necessarily because you can spend extra mana later on, that the format is slow. It could hypothetically be full of aggressive creatures that never let the big stuff come into play. After all, Zendikar had kicker (and Quests, which where also a kind of slow build-up mechanic that pretty much completely missed).
I don't actually expect this - the format does look slowish so far, and you'd expect that they want the big Monstrous and Bestow cards to do something (but that's no guarantee that they'll succeed). I wouldn't jump to conclusions yet about the speed of the format - that pretty much depends on how all of the commons look (high toughness, aggressive tricks, prevalent stats, what kind of removal, cheap evasion, etc etc), and we have nowhere near enough of the commons to make any kind of judgment about that.
You really just need to embrace the rage. I keep a small colony of hamsters next to my computer and every time I lose a match to mana screw I throw one against the wall.
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My pick for best common revealed so far. I'd go as far as saying it may be format defining. "Too bad" it's splashable, so everyone will fight over these.
However, removal at common has been significantly depowered from Innistrad block on, so I don't expect a removal spell that's as good as Doom Blade. There might be some premium removal that's sorcery speed - something like Journey to Nowhere (There's a rumored card that's Journey for W with a downside).
EDIT: Read the Bones is the stone noodly boodlies in any format from planet earth. The card's powerlevel is more similar to Compulsive Research or Thirst for Knowledge than Divination.
This is what I was thinking. At first I was like "omg!!! A +1/+1 counter on all my creatures when I target this guy!!" But then I thought about how heroic would actually play and I don't know how relevant it will be. I think it's a really cool mechanic with a simple design, but I actually think it's a slower grindier mechanic rather than an aggro one, just because early on I'd rather develop the board than target my guy with a spell. It becomes more of a thing with bestow creatures, but those (so far) seem to be late game plays since they're costed highly.
As for removal in the set, so far it's REALLY bad. However, so far there are only like 5 instants revealed, so I'm sure there will be some instant speed removal. Also, no removal in black has been spoiled, so I'm confident that what we've seen is not necessarily representative of the set.
But you know one of the black removal is gonna be the obligatory "doesn't interact with the block mechanic" removal. Probably "destroy target non-enchantment creature" or "destroy target non-enchanted creature."
That's fine. Ultimate Price was still a first pick in RTR. If they made a 1B uncommon instant with "Destroy target non-enchantment creature" or "Destroy target creature that's not enchanted" (or whatever the templating would be) I would first pick it every time. Because even though it wouldn't interact with the block mechanic, it would still cover a majority of the creatures in the set.
Chained to the Rocks.
Personally I think it's still a little too soon say what will and won't be good, we need to see more cards.
The white one is pretty bad as a creature (kind of a "I really need to trade with an early x/2" kind of thing), but as an aura it's reasonably costed and vigilance is good on big things. Think of worse Knightly Valor that still gives you your token if the target gets removed in response, and isn't blank if you're stuck on land or don't have a creature in play.
Red seems pretty good; the option to cast it as a creature seems a lot more relevant than it does for the white nymph, since a 2/2 first striker is usually a pretty good early blocker (which seems like one of the major scenarios where you wouldn't hold out for Bestow).
Blue is obviously just fantastic. It's not that far from a wind drake/Drake Umbra split card, which seems amazing on a common. This is going to be one of the top commons.
The green one is actually pretty interesting just because the Bestow ability is so aggressively costed. 4 mana is a lot less than 5, and it's worlds away from 6 or 7 mana. I think that makes this an important enabler for Heroic.
For our common cycle, the green one also has the advantage of coming down as a bear rather than an ogre.
What's with white? I feel like they got the shaft in M14 and it's looking like it in Theros so far as well....
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If your deck needs to build up Devotion, you can drop them early as their creature forms to snag another UWGR or B. If you have more auras to curve into, having an early evasive/first striking guy to suit up is fine too.
And the point to bestow is you can take what would otherwise be an irrelevant 2/2 and use it to make another creature much better. If you have a 3/3, and they have a 4/4, a 2/2 isn't going to get you much because you are still on the defensive. But turning your 3/3 into a 5/5 with vigilance/first strike/flying/reach/intimidate? That's a major gameplay swing. Suddenly they have the irrelevant creature (life totals notwithstanding obviously), and what removal they might be packing now has to hit your otherwise-useless 3/3, after which you still have a 2/2 with some ability. That's not bad at all, and in pure CA you're basically even.
It also feels like the type of format where the game is decided by two players throwing knockout punches at each other (monsters, bestowed creatures, etc.) instead of a racing format.
In short -- Rise of the Eldrazi 2.0.
Whilst I'd love that, WotC have already explicitly denied this.
Possibly the subset of cards we've seen so far is giving a misleading impression.
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I'm hoping they print reasonable removal and little-to-no Hexproof in the set, lest the limited format turn out to be a race to huge dudes, be they Bestowed or Monstrous.
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I know, I just find that hard to believe in a set that has creatures at common and uncommon that can become 8/8, 8/7, 8/9, etc. by themselves given enough time. The only other set that comes close to that is Eldrazi.
Granted, you'll need some form of mana ramp just like you needed Spawn tokens if you wanted to cast your Ulamog's Crusher with any reliability. But while the ramp should be less plentiful, monsters also function before their big finisher goes off which balances the risk that you don't get enough mana in time.
I guess we'll see, but most sets in total don't have the volume of "big mana rewards" at common and uncommon that we're seeing here in just ~30% of the Theros card pool.
On topic: read the bones - above the curve card draw. At least it's not draw 2 - scry 2 (in that order), which would be OP at 3 mana.
The common bestow: who can say no to a risk-free +2/+2 and ability? The blue one is particularly good. Man, it's a common! Pump, evasion and an additional evasive body when it dies? Sign me up.
I don't actually expect this - the format does look slowish so far, and you'd expect that they want the big Monstrous and Bestow cards to do something (but that's no guarantee that they'll succeed). I wouldn't jump to conclusions yet about the speed of the format - that pretty much depends on how all of the commons look (high toughness, aggressive tricks, prevalent stats, what kind of removal, cheap evasion, etc etc), and we have nowhere near enough of the commons to make any kind of judgment about that.