I've also started to realize I'm very happy maindecking a single counterspell when I'm in blue. I don't care that it's 4 mana, if you're playing a blue deck with a fairly low curve, being able to counter a Soul or Hornet Queen is a pretty good play. I'd never draft it highly, but I love having one.
Magicmerl, You clarified the ratings and exactly what the numbers mean, and I didn't consider the implications in regard to Tyrants Machine. 1.8 is too high.
1.5 then? 1.0 still feels harsh on what amounts to a renewable removal spell, and in a set that encourages playing artifacts for at least 2 of its colors. 1.0 suggests that this is on the same sideboard only level as something like "clear a path", which it cearly is not.
Hunters Ambush is still a much more playable fog to me, and with creatures down and facing down an attack, becomes a combat trick. Not 2.0...but still very playable. 1.6/1.7 maybe?
Magicmerl, You clarified the ratings and exactly what the numbers mean, and I didn't consider the implications in regard to Tyrants Machine. 1.8 is too high.
1.5 then? 1.0 still feels harsh on what amounts to a renewable removal spell, and in a set that encourages playing artifacts for at least 2 of its colors. 1.0 suggests that this is on the same sideboard only level as something like "clear a path", which it cearly is not.
The thing is, the two colours that want artifacts are also the 'spell' colours. So they already have a whole lot of spells to cast and they don't really need Tyrants Machine. I see this as a situational sideboard card in a heavy creature deck that has an almost complete lack of removal. Say, GW or GU. So this definitely seems to be a similar sort of card as Plummet in terms of being ok to maindeck very occasionally in particular decks, but most of the time it's sideboard fodder. Yeah, that seems fair. I've buffed it up to Plummet level.
Hunters Ambush is still a much more playable fog to me, and with creatures down and facing down an attack, becomes a combat trick. Not 2.0...but still very playable. 1.6/1.7 maybe?
Maybe I am underrating this fog variant. My analysis of it is that I will never play it in any limited deck. And because that's my gut call, I'm never actually going to include it in a deck to find out if I'm wrong
How have other people found Hunters Ambush? Is this a fringe playable, or not really?
I have yet to play it or have it played against me. As a baseline I'd need a deck that was like 2/3 green to even consider sideboarding it and I just haven't had that deck yet.
The problem with Hunter's Ambush is that even if you're somehow mono-green, it's terrible if your opponent is running even a few green creatures. In other words, it's a sideboard card in a deck that almost never gets built.
Tyrant's Machine isn't an autoinclude, but I'd say I put it in my deck like 75% of the time if I'm green of any kind, 60% if I'm blue and black, and 50% if I'm red, and like 33% if I'm white (because it has Pillar of Light).
The Machine has won me quite a few games in which I was aggro and my opponent dropped a high toughness guy or aura's up a dude. Seriously, it's like Prowler's Helm in Theros, no one takes it and yet it's good. If you expect your wins to happen past turn 8 or so, then Machine should be in your deck. It's a very late pick anyway.
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I've also started to realize I'm very happy maindecking a single counterspell when I'm in blue. I don't care that it's 4 mana, if you're playing a blue deck with a fairly low curve, being able to counter a Soul or Hornet Queen is a pretty good play. I'd never draft it highly, but I love having one.
R Norin the Wary: I've Got a Bad Feeling About This
UG Thrasios & Kydele: Knowledge is Power
RG Borborygmos Enraged: The Breaking of the World
BG The Gitrog Monster: All Glory to the Hypnotoad
WUR Zedruu the Greathearted: Endless Possibilities, One Outcome
WBG Karador, Ghost Chieftain: What's Dead May Never Die
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1.5 then? 1.0 still feels harsh on what amounts to a renewable removal spell, and in a set that encourages playing artifacts for at least 2 of its colors. 1.0 suggests that this is on the same sideboard only level as something like "clear a path", which it cearly is not.
Hunters Ambush is still a much more playable fog to me, and with creatures down and facing down an attack, becomes a combat trick. Not 2.0...but still very playable. 1.6/1.7 maybe?
The thing is, the two colours that want artifacts are also the 'spell' colours. So they already have a whole lot of spells to cast and they don't really need Tyrants Machine. I see this as a situational sideboard card in a heavy creature deck that has an almost complete lack of removal. Say, GW or GU. So this definitely seems to be a similar sort of card as Plummet in terms of being ok to maindeck very occasionally in particular decks, but most of the time it's sideboard fodder. Yeah, that seems fair. I've buffed it up to Plummet level.
Maybe I am underrating this fog variant. My analysis of it is that I will never play it in any limited deck. And because that's my gut call, I'm never actually going to include it in a deck to find out if I'm wrong
How have other people found Hunters Ambush? Is this a fringe playable, or not really?
The Machine has won me quite a few games in which I was aggro and my opponent dropped a high toughness guy or aura's up a dude. Seriously, it's like Prowler's Helm in Theros, no one takes it and yet it's good. If you expect your wins to happen past turn 8 or so, then Machine should be in your deck. It's a very late pick anyway.