Ehh but the bouncelands are uncommon now, so I doubt 14-15 land decks will be that much of a reality. Still happy to see em.
In any event there aren't a lot of commons out yet so theres not a lot to talk about yet. However soulshift + nameless inversion is value that makes me drool.
However soulshift + nameless inversion is value that makes me drool.
That is pretty awesome.
I'm excited to see what they do with the Eldrazi. RoE was obviously a remarkable format, & I have fond memories of all of these guys (Artisan of Kozilek, Nest Invader, etc), and I'm curious to see how far they push that particular strategy. Scion of the Wild (at common?!) should go pretty well with Eldrazi spawn.
Always happy to see my old friend Mulldrifter show up again.
Ehh but the bouncelands are uncommon now, so I doubt 14-15 land decks will be that much of a reality. Still happy to see em.
Someone else pointed out that there are the full ten as uncommons, as compared to either 4 or 3 at common in R, G or D. So it's not as big a disparity as you might initially think, although I haven't done all the math.
Ehh but the bouncelands are uncommon now, so I doubt 14-15 land decks will be that much of a reality. Still happy to see em.
Someone else pointed out that there are the full ten as uncommons, as compared to either 4 or 3 at common in R, G or D. So it's not as big a disparity as you might initially think, although I haven't done all the math.
I just did the math. There will be, on average, 9 bouncelands per draft. In RGD, there were 12.4 bouncelands per draft.
Ravnica: 11 commons per pack & 8 packs mean 88 commons per draft. There are 110 commons, so 0.8 of each. There are four bouncelands, so 3.2 will be opened in total.
Guildpact: 11 commons per pack & 8 packs mean 88 commons per draft. There are 55 commons, so 1.6 of each. There are three bouncelands, so 4.8 will be opened in total.
Dissension: 11 commons per pack & 8 packs mean 88 commons per draft. There are 60 commons, so 1.48 of each. There are three bouncelands, so 4.4 will be opened in total.
Modern Masters 2015: 3 uncommons per pack & 24 packs mean 72 uncommons per draft. There are 80 uncommons, so 0.9 of each. There are ten bouncelands, so 9 will be opened in total.
I just did the math. There will be, on average, 9 bouncelands per draft. In RGD, there were 12.4 bouncelands per draft.
That's not as bad as I originally thought. I'll be interested to see how highly they should be taken once this format fully unfolds. Maybe they'll throw in something like landfall to make them even better
You missed the foils for MM which is much more meaningful than RAV because every pack contains a foil.
That adds another 0.64 bouncelands per draft if I understand the foil slot correctly (a common 71.4% of the time, an uncommon 21.4% of the time, a rare 6.3% of the time, a mythic 0.9% of the time).
I'm not sure what's the appeal of paying though the nose even on MTGO. Will the draft be that greater than cube?
Modern Masters was much more fun than cube.
Cube was much better than Modern Masters, well depends on the Cube though.
I love me some cube, but IMO it ranks below the great draft formats of all time. Cube is like a constructed/limited hybrid, whereas I'm more of a limited fan myself. Obviously completely subjective, but that's how I feel.
I will say this though, the whole spoiler is extremely discouraging. It doesn't look like nearly as interesting a limited format as MM1, and the rares are just awful. They did not do a good job here.
Looking at the spoiler, a somewhat unrelated (to the spoiler) thought occured to for for MM15 limited:
Won't having a foil in every pack cause more bad feeling? Now in every pack, you got to choose between: taking the possibly valuable rare, the possibly valuable foil, or a good card.
In normal sets, IRL, it's a rare occurrence where someone chooses to drop because he got a money rare and foil. In MM15, every pack is in danger of messing the draft with someone choosing to drop rather than pass either of a good mythic and foil rare.
I will say this though, the whole spoiler is extremely discouraging. It doesn't look like nearly as interesting a limited format as MM1, and the rares are just awful. They did not do a good job here.
The rares are not super exciting, but I like the way the limited format looks. I didn't play in the first one, but I heard it was pretty linear. It seems not as transparent this time, with some cool interactions between archetypes that could be cool to tap into and may give the format some legs.
U/B seems to have lots of proliferate shenanigans although I'm rather upset with the amount of things to play with (wheres my damn Leech Bonder WotC). R/G I would say is screaming domain, what with both Dragonsoul Knight and tribal flames being common.
UB seems like proliferate is the connection, with +1/+1 counters from blue with graft, and -1/-1 counters from black with wither etc.
5C / Domain stuff seems centered in RG.
Looking at the spoiler, a somewhat unrelated (to the spoiler) thought occured to for for MM15 limited:
Won't having a foil in every pack cause more bad feeling? Now in every pack, you got to choose between: taking the possibly valuable rare, the possibly valuable foil, or a good card.
In normal sets, IRL, it's a rare occurrence where someone chooses to drop because he got a money rare and foil. In MM15, every pack is in danger of messing the draft with someone choosing to drop rather than pass either of a good mythic and foil rare.
I have never understood this logic. Someone is really going to be distressed because they get a valuable card they get to keep and have to pass a differnet valuable card down the road? Be happy for yourself and be happy for your neighbor. It's also just as likely that you get passed the valuable card than that you open it, so it balances out.
A few tweaks: UB: Proliferate (Which performs better as a control deck since it's all about long-term resource management). RG: Domain (Which is happy to make use of colorless cards and ramp to shore up it's shaky manabase).
As well, the general abundance of artifacts+fixing+hybrids+eldrazi+phyrexian-mana may make it easier to support splashes for tri-color builds as well; especially where themes overlap such as Jeskai artiface.
Thanks for the overview izzetmage. I was having a hard time shifting from looking at the money to looking at the interactions between colors. BW spirits looks a lot more fun now looking back through the stuff and I am actually surprised that proliferate seems to have as much synergy as it does between multiple color combinations (mostly B/X and or U/X)
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Guys can we only discuss LIMITED here? There isn't anyplace else in this forum to talk about the format MM15 limited. People only complain about the monetary factor. I wont be doing any real draft (i cant, live in brazil, its impossible), but we can use computers or proxies. I think we should talk only about the limited in this thread, because every other thread is talking about money/ bashing the no-money rares, etc.
About the Archetypes, i would like to point out that RG is probably the house of the 5 color draft. Green has the rampant growth style cards, and red has this elemental/tribal/all colors interaction. There is only domain in Red/Green as well as the basic landcyclers, what u guys think?
EDIT: just know I read Izzetmage's comment about RG: 5color domain
This looks like it will be a pretty fun limited format. Maybe not as good as the first MM (I loved drafting the rebels deck there) but they've put in some carefully thought-out archetypes for all of the color pairs and there's even the possibility of three+ color decks with the bouncelands and Sphere of the Suns. Also will there be a worse feeling than when a Fulminator Mage blows up your turn 2 or 3 bounceland?
Also what is Daybreak Coronet even doing in the set? Goblin Warpaint appears to be the only thing that can work with it at common/uncommon (all of the other auras are removal auras). I guess it's there for financial considerations only, seems like a big waste of a slot though.
So we've pretty well established what the 10 primary archetypes are, and some of the synergies they have with one another.
What are people thoughts on relative powerlevels? Which commons seem to straddle multiple archetypes, and will therefore be in high demand, vs. being niche and more likely to wheel? What are the top 5 commons and 1-3 notable uncommons for each archetype?
I've got to run, but I'll chime in with my thoughts in 3-4 hours or so.
As a fairly concrete question, which archetype looks weakest to you? For me it's WR.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I primarily play limited, so most of my spoiler season comments view cards through that lens.
Bouncelands! Wooooooooooo!
*passes out*
In any event there aren't a lot of commons out yet so theres not a lot to talk about yet. However soulshift + nameless inversion is value that makes me drool.
I'm excited to see what they do with the Eldrazi. RoE was obviously a remarkable format, & I have fond memories of all of these guys (Artisan of Kozilek, Nest Invader, etc), and I'm curious to see how far they push that particular strategy. Scion of the Wild (at common?!) should go pretty well with Eldrazi spawn.
Always happy to see my old friend Mulldrifter show up again.
Someone else pointed out that there are the full ten as uncommons, as compared to either 4 or 3 at common in R, G or D. So it's not as big a disparity as you might initially think, although I haven't done all the math.
Ravnica: 11 commons per pack & 8 packs mean 88 commons per draft. There are 110 commons, so 0.8 of each. There are four bouncelands, so 3.2 will be opened in total.
Guildpact: 11 commons per pack & 8 packs mean 88 commons per draft. There are 55 commons, so 1.6 of each. There are three bouncelands, so 4.8 will be opened in total.
Dissension: 11 commons per pack & 8 packs mean 88 commons per draft. There are 60 commons, so 1.48 of each. There are three bouncelands, so 4.4 will be opened in total.
Modern Masters 2015: 3 uncommons per pack & 24 packs mean 72 uncommons per draft. There are 80 uncommons, so 0.9 of each. There are ten bouncelands, so 9 will be opened in total.
That's not as bad as I originally thought. I'll be interested to see how highly they should be taken once this format fully unfolds. Maybe they'll throw in something like landfall to make them even better
FTFY. Please, think of RL drafters.
I'm not sure what's the appeal of paying though the nose even on MTGO. Will the draft be that greater than cube?
Modern Masters was much more fun than cube.
Cube was much better than Modern Masters, well depends on the Cube though.
My Theros-M15-Khans-Origins Cube (Trimming)
I love me some cube, but IMO it ranks below the great draft formats of all time. Cube is like a constructed/limited hybrid, whereas I'm more of a limited fan myself. Obviously completely subjective, but that's how I feel.
Won't having a foil in every pack cause more bad feeling? Now in every pack, you got to choose between: taking the possibly valuable rare, the possibly valuable foil, or a good card.
In normal sets, IRL, it's a rare occurrence where someone chooses to drop because he got a money rare and foil. In MM15, every pack is in danger of messing the draft with someone choosing to drop rather than pass either of a good mythic and foil rare.
The rares are not super exciting, but I like the way the limited format looks. I didn't play in the first one, but I heard it was pretty linear. It seems not as transparent this time, with some cool interactions between archetypes that could be cool to tap into and may give the format some legs.
U/B seems to have lots of proliferate shenanigans although I'm rather upset with the amount of things to play with (wheres my damn Leech Bonder WotC). R/G I would say is screaming domain, what with both Dragonsoul Knight and tribal flames being common.
UB seems like proliferate is the connection, with +1/+1 counters from blue with graft, and -1/-1 counters from black with wither etc.
5C / Domain stuff seems centered in RG.
Edit: Nath'd
I have never understood this logic. Someone is really going to be distressed because they get a valuable card they get to keep and have to pass a differnet valuable card down the road? Be happy for yourself and be happy for your neighbor. It's also just as likely that you get passed the valuable card than that you open it, so it balances out.
A few tweaks:
UB: Proliferate (Which performs better as a control deck since it's all about long-term resource management).
RG: Domain (Which is happy to make use of colorless cards and ramp to shore up it's shaky manabase).
As well, the general abundance of artifacts+fixing+hybrids+eldrazi+phyrexian-mana may make it easier to support splashes for tri-color builds as well; especially where themes overlap such as Jeskai artiface.
EDIT: all of the NATH'd
RRR - Bosh's School of Hard(cover) Knocks
Bouncelands
|
|
Big Johnny.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
About the Archetypes, i would like to point out that RG is probably the house of the 5 color draft. Green has the rampant growth style cards, and red has this elemental/tribal/all colors interaction. There is only domain in Red/Green as well as the basic landcyclers, what u guys think?
EDIT: just know I read Izzetmage's comment about RG: 5color domain
Also what is Daybreak Coronet even doing in the set? Goblin Warpaint appears to be the only thing that can work with it at common/uncommon (all of the other auras are removal auras). I guess it's there for financial considerations only, seems like a big waste of a slot though.
What are people thoughts on relative powerlevels? Which commons seem to straddle multiple archetypes, and will therefore be in high demand, vs. being niche and more likely to wheel? What are the top 5 commons and 1-3 notable uncommons for each archetype?
I've got to run, but I'll chime in with my thoughts in 3-4 hours or so.
As a fairly concrete question, which archetype looks weakest to you? For me it's WR.
Interested in Custom Card Creation.
My Cube:Cardinal Custom Cube
A custom version of a third modern masters: MM2019
(filter->rarity to see in set rarity).