Its something I've been wondering for a longggg time. Should new cards made for planechase, and commander, be modern legal? I think its unfair that these cards become "eternal legal" but modern is not "eternal".
Now then, Im not saying reprinted cards as in sol ring, but the new cards.
I'd divert you to this article, as he lists the cards that could make a splash. No doubt scavenging ooze would be the biggest.
No. I want wizards to have freedom to create any card they want for stuff like Commander and Planechase without having to worry how it might affect Modern.
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WoTC, thank you for finally announcing the Modern format, an eternal format where everyone can participate.
No. I want wizards to have freedom to create any card they want for stuff like Commander and Planechase without having to worry how it might affect Modern.
This 1000 times over. Wotc got this right, the Modern card pool needs to go thru Standard. No special product. Tho I would do back flips for a Modern Chronicles type packed set. Packs like that would be amazing to play limited with.
Personally, I think if they want to have "new" cards reprinted to be modern legal from sets like Commander, they should simply use those cards as reprints in core or block sets.
Cards like Scavenging Ooze, Animar, Soul of Elements, and quite a few others would be awesome to have in modern. With that said, you can't print a set and arbitrarily have 1/2 of the cards in that set legal for modern. It would just be too confusing, especially for newer players who aren't entirely familiar with all the older sets.
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Yeah, I remember getting seriously into Modern under the assumption I could play a Baleful Strix artifact control deck. Unfortunately that's not the case.
Honestly, I'd rather not have extra sets that aren't ever in Standard be included in Modern. I would however like to see extra sets that are part of a series that end up being combined into a set large enough to be reprinted for Standard. That would be awesome.
It would be somewhat trouble some,while I agree that Flusterstorm,Chaos Warp and Sakashima's Student are nice cards for modern,Scavenging Ooze would be a demon,I would easily run it over Goyf on Jund and both Jund and RUG would be over the top,it would give those decks extra SB slots and main deck spots and Bob would be less deadly and way more efficient.
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Standard
Boring...
Modern WGBJunk:Feel the Rhinos WGB RWUAmerican Taxes RWU
EDH XKarn and the Living StaxX RETIRED GWURoon of The Hidden RealmGWU
Scavenging Ooze would be awesome. I'd run it maindeck in Melira Pod and Twin Pod every time. Yes, I'd boot Knight of the Reliquary for it, despite the fact that she's two hate bears in one.
However, after two cool extra sets have gone by, I'm content to wait to see if Wizards ever reprints those special product-only cards in other sets. If they're that awesome, they may just do so.
For simplicities sake, I'd rather it remain how it is. Saying "you can use all cards from 8th edition afterwards, but cards that aren't in actual sets that are reprints can't be used, however you can use the new cards from non-actual sets" is a little confusing...
I would love for some of those cards make it into a core set or expansion.
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Out of the blackness and stench of the engulfing swamp emerged a shimmering figure. Only the splattered armor and ichor-stained sword hinted at the unfathomable evil the knight had just laid waste.
No. I want wizards to have freedom to create any card they want for stuff like Commander and Planechase without having to worry how it might affect Modern.
This.
There would be a very difficult distinction to be made between every card printed in these products and what are actually legal in modern.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
I really, really wish there were a way to bypass Standard. This would clear up a great deal of issues surrounding reprints.
I agree. Also, with a lack of true powerful cards that existed in old extended (pernicious deed, vindicate, etc.) Having to get all of our cards through standard is really going to set a tone for this format I'm not sure I like.
THIS 100X!!! If you don't agree with this then there is no amount of logic that will ever convince you that good, non-oppressive, combos should be allowed. If you don't agree with it then just don't play this game, and you certainly shouldn't feel entitled to make any comment on ban lists ever.
I agree. Also, with a lack of true powerful cards that existed in old extended (pernicious deed, vindicate, etc.) Having to get all of our cards through standard is really going to set a tone for this format I'm not sure I like.
This is why I wish they had started Modern at Invasion. So many powerful (but not broken) cards are left out. Control would have also gotten a nice boost with Counterspell, Force Spike, Undermine, Stifle etc...
This is why I wish they had started Modern at Invasion. So many powerful (but not broken) cards are left out. Control would have also gotten a nice boost with Counterspell, Force Spike, Undermine, Stifle etc...
If they did that, the formats power level would be much closer to Legacys instead of in between Legacy and Standard. Probably why they picked the cut off point they did.
This is why I wish they had started Modern at Invasion. So many powerful (but not broken) cards are left out. Control would have also gotten a nice boost with Counterspell, Force Spike, Undermine, Stifle etc...
Force spike is already legal, it's called mana tithe, and nobody plays it.
Stifle isn't played in control decks, it's played in tempo decks. Undermine is just too slow for the format even if it's been played in the past.
Counterspell would see play for sure, but it wouldn't be all that much better than mana leak (very rarely do people play around the 3 mana in modern outside tron decks).
Personally, I like the start at 8th edition. I had a discussion with SPC about this, I love a lot of cards from those formats, but there is a TON of stuff they would have to auto-ban to make it worthwhile.
-Mind's desire would be the first to go
-Stifle would be REALLY annoying to play with and against
-Goblins would be incredibly powerful, and would probably prompt an Aether Vial ban
-Burning Wish would probably get banned
-Cabal Therapy, breakthrough & Ichorid would likely have to see the ban hammer due to enabling dredge too much (unless they were to unban bridge from below)
-Aggro loam would be just as powerful in modern as it is in Legacy (short of mox diamond at least)
-Combo Elves would be insane, even without glimpse of nature in the format
-Griselbrand Reanimator would be busted wide open with entomb and other odyssey cards legal, and would get way too many consistent turn 2 wins
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For a very long time, format legality has been determined by expansion symbol. Changing that would just be weird.
It's a bit unfortunate to have new cards be released but not be legal in Modern, but I think there isn't really a better way. I remember Aaron Forsythe saying that they'd initially considered having them not be tournament-legal at all but changed their minds because players (even 100% casual ones) tend to think of non-tournament-legal cards as not being "real".
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When you peer long enough through the depths, the depths peer also through you.
Nah. Brainstorm in modern? We can't even have Preordain.
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By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
For simplicities sake, I'd rather it remain how it is. Saying "you can use all cards from 8th edition afterwards, but cards that aren't in actual sets that are reprints can't be used, however you can use the new cards from non-actual sets" is a little confusing...
I think a Modern legal "set" that never enters Standard could work and make more sense. Not that I see it happening, but I would like if it did so that cards can be printed/reprinted without affecting Standard or (what I see coming up more often) having a mechanic that makes it incompatible with that block. Shardless Agent might never be reprinted in Standard for example, even if it seems a good fit for Modern and Standard just because its keyword. Same with Sakashima's Student and Flusterstorm.
First, I dont understand people saying its confusing. Coldsnap was part of Ice Age block but played in Timespiral and it wasn't a hassle at all. In fact it promoted some decks we wouldnt have seen otherwise (Dragonstorm. Skred control. Martyr of Sands. Rune Snag.)
So saying cards that come from commander or planechase that aren't reprints of sets not legal in modern, isn't hard to understand at all.
Second, I feel like there are Four types of people who are interested in Modern. People who stopped playing around Lorwyn/Alara. People who want Old Extended part two, and not Legacy. People who started recently and are looking to get mileage out of their Standard decks. And people who actually have an interest in the format as it is.
Unfortunately, this isn't the nostalgia format that the first group wants. It isn't the power without Legacy price tag that the second group wants. It isn't last year's Standard. And the rest of the people are the minority. And it all feels so...stale.
THIS 100X!!! If you don't agree with this then there is no amount of logic that will ever convince you that good, non-oppressive, combos should be allowed. If you don't agree with it then just don't play this game, and you certainly shouldn't feel entitled to make any comment on ban lists ever.
First, I dont understand people saying its confusing. Coldsnap was part of Ice Age block but played in Timespiral and it wasn't a hassle at all. In fact it promoted some decks we wouldnt have seen otherwise (Dragonstorm. Skred control. Martyr of Sands. Rune Snag.)
So saying cards that come from commander or planechase that aren't reprints of sets not legal in modern, isn't hard to understand at all.
How is this even remotely similar? Coldsnap came out in 2006. It was legal in the same formats as other expansions released in 2006. All cards with a Coldsnap expansion symbol were legal in formats where Coldsnap was legal. This is all expected behaviour.
On the other hand, Commander is a summer multiplayer product, which normally don't affect format legality of the cards contained. Furthermore, this proposal would allow only some of the cards from the set to be legal, not anything with the expansion symbol. This is not expected behaviour.
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When you peer long enough through the depths, the depths peer also through you.
First, I dont understand people saying its confusing. Coldsnap was part of Ice Age block but played in Timespiral and it wasn't a hassle at all. In fact it promoted some decks we wouldnt have seen otherwise (Dragonstorm. Skred control. Martyr of Sands. Rune Snag.)
So saying cards that come from commander or planechase that aren't reprints of sets not legal in modern, isn't hard to understand at all.
Second, I feel like there are Four types of people who are interested in Modern. People who stopped playing around Lorwyn/Alara. People who want Old Extended part two, and not Legacy. People who started recently and are looking to get mileage out of their Standard decks. And people who actually have an interest in the format as it is.
Unfortunately, this isn't the nostalgia format that the first group wants. It isn't the power without Legacy price tag that the second group wants. It isn't last year's Standard. And the rest of the people are the minority. And it all feels so...stale.
..and coldsnap was Standard legal too. What people are asking for is to by pass the Standard legal phase for Modern cards. Coldsnap in no way defines this.
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Now then, Im not saying reprinted cards as in sol ring, but the new cards.
I'd divert you to this article, as he lists the cards that could make a splash. No doubt scavenging ooze would be the biggest.
http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=10618
This 1000 times over. Wotc got this right, the Modern card pool needs to go thru Standard. No special product. Tho I would do back flips for a Modern Chronicles type packed set. Packs like that would be amazing to play limited with.
Cards like Scavenging Ooze, Animar, Soul of Elements, and quite a few others would be awesome to have in modern. With that said, you can't print a set and arbitrarily have 1/2 of the cards in that set legal for modern. It would just be too confusing, especially for newer players who aren't entirely familiar with all the older sets.
Honestly, I'd rather not have extra sets that aren't ever in Standard be included in Modern. I would however like to see extra sets that are part of a series that end up being combined into a set large enough to be reprinted for Standard. That would be awesome.
Boring...
Modern
WGBJunk:Feel the Rhinos WGB
RWUAmerican Taxes RWU
EDH
XKarn and the Living StaxX RETIRED
GWURoon of The Hidden RealmGWU
I wouldn't believe cards like it, Flusterstorm, Baleful Strix, or even Shardless Agent would be broken in Modern.
However, after two cool extra sets have gone by, I'm content to wait to see if Wizards ever reprints those special product-only cards in other sets. If they're that awesome, they may just do so.
Me too. I'm not saying I don't want the cards in the format, but I just don't think non-actual set cards should be legal.
Unfortunately I don't know when we will see another set with cascade and ninjutsu, so that makes it hard for some of the PC2 cards.
This.
There would be a very difficult distinction to be made between every card printed in these products and what are actually legal in modern.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
CG
I agree. Also, with a lack of true powerful cards that existed in old extended (pernicious deed, vindicate, etc.) Having to get all of our cards through standard is really going to set a tone for this format I'm not sure I like.
This is why I wish they had started Modern at Invasion. So many powerful (but not broken) cards are left out. Control would have also gotten a nice boost with Counterspell, Force Spike, Undermine, Stifle etc...
If they did that, the formats power level would be much closer to Legacys instead of in between Legacy and Standard. Probably why they picked the cut off point they did.
Force spike is already legal, it's called mana tithe, and nobody plays it.
Stifle isn't played in control decks, it's played in tempo decks. Undermine is just too slow for the format even if it's been played in the past.
Counterspell would see play for sure, but it wouldn't be all that much better than mana leak (very rarely do people play around the 3 mana in modern outside tron decks).
Personally, I like the start at 8th edition. I had a discussion with SPC about this, I love a lot of cards from those formats, but there is a TON of stuff they would have to auto-ban to make it worthwhile.
-Mind's desire would be the first to go
-Stifle would be REALLY annoying to play with and against
-Goblins would be incredibly powerful, and would probably prompt an Aether Vial ban
-Burning Wish would probably get banned
-Cabal Therapy, breakthrough & Ichorid would likely have to see the ban hammer due to enabling dredge too much (unless they were to unban bridge from below)
-Aggro loam would be just as powerful in modern as it is in Legacy (short of mox diamond at least)
-Combo Elves would be insane, even without glimpse of nature in the format
-Griselbrand Reanimator would be busted wide open with entomb and other odyssey cards legal, and would get way too many consistent turn 2 wins
It's a bit unfortunate to have new cards be released but not be legal in Modern, but I think there isn't really a better way. I remember Aaron Forsythe saying that they'd initially considered having them not be tournament-legal at all but changed their minds because players (even 100% casual ones) tend to think of non-tournament-legal cards as not being "real".
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
The new cards not reprinted.
Again, too complicated. I'd like to use the new cards, but:
So saying cards that come from commander or planechase that aren't reprints of sets not legal in modern, isn't hard to understand at all.
Second, I feel like there are Four types of people who are interested in Modern. People who stopped playing around Lorwyn/Alara. People who want Old Extended part two, and not Legacy. People who started recently and are looking to get mileage out of their Standard decks. And people who actually have an interest in the format as it is.
Unfortunately, this isn't the nostalgia format that the first group wants. It isn't the power without Legacy price tag that the second group wants. It isn't last year's Standard. And the rest of the people are the minority. And it all feels so...stale.
How is this even remotely similar? Coldsnap came out in 2006. It was legal in the same formats as other expansions released in 2006. All cards with a Coldsnap expansion symbol were legal in formats where Coldsnap was legal. This is all expected behaviour.
On the other hand, Commander is a summer multiplayer product, which normally don't affect format legality of the cards contained. Furthermore, this proposal would allow only some of the cards from the set to be legal, not anything with the expansion symbol. This is not expected behaviour.
..and coldsnap was Standard legal too. What people are asking for is to by pass the Standard legal phase for Modern cards. Coldsnap in no way defines this.