There's two things wrong with that statement (hint: it's the words in bold). The deck's not popular in terms of overall numbers, nor has it only just re-emerged post-banning (see: Cifka).
D- for coherence of argument, but I guess you can have a B+ for the attempted pun :).
No, I remember looking at the PTQ data from the PTQ Meta topic (which, sadly, has been lost due to an error) and seeing that after the ban, Eggs made a comeback. It wasn't, say, one of the top 5 decks, but it still had a reasonable number of PTQ wins and Top 8's, when before the bans it was practically a nonentity.
Maybe "popular again" wasn't the best choice of words, but Eggs certainly got noticeably more popular after the bans.
Undone, you have no idea... Bitterblossom does nothing vs. eggs. Sword is broken. But I'm not here to complain about what should be unbanned, I'm here to beg any powers that be to ban eggs.
I just finished GP San Diego (10-5, 72nd) and the worst part about the tournament was eggs. In my one match vs. it his game one took 30 minutes, of which I used two and a half minutes tops. He beat me game 2, but if he hadn't there's no way we could've finished, except of course by going way, way way over time as everyone waits. GP San Diego was very efficiently run, pairings going out seconds after the last result came in. Still, eggs, and eggs alone, is the reason the tournament dragged on late into the night. All the judges I talked to hate eggs. All the players i talked to hate having a plan for it.
Oh, and discard doesn't work as a plan, they play 4x leyline in their board and have 4x silence for your counters.
Suppression field is good, but eggs plays bounce and you cant use your own abilities either. Still, I argue that Eggs isn't broken good, it's broken mechanically. It takes too long and is a detriment to the tournament as a whole.
You don't have any idea.
Bitterblossom doing nothing against eggs isn't the point. The UB disruption deck with seize, spell snare, spellstutter sprite and mistbind clique would be a good deck vs it unfortunately it's a deck which is unplayable against the field at the moment due to BB's absence.
The decks which are good vs eggs are gone.
The top 8 of this and the last PT it won are absolute proof that the deck isn't too slow seeing as how the eggs players won their matches before some of the game 1's ended. Time is not a valid reason as has been proven twice with the deck.
Has any other deck even won two tournaments in a row? Even Jund?
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By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
The reason can be more or less attributed to the fact that counterspell decks are now 'better' than discard decks, which interestingly enough the stack control decks are weaker to eggs than the discard decks where.
The argument for banning eggs isn't brokenness or even going to time, it's bad mechanics. An approximation is a combination of eggs not being magic(similar to dredge and to a lesser extent storm, both neutered by WOTC), and it being a horrible deck to spectate, something wizards doesn't want since they are making strides to improve video coverage.
Edit: Jund won at least 3 GP's in a row. Traditional jund piloted by someone. 74/75 mirror match Spirit jund between Utter-Layton and Jacob Wilson was the Second GP won by Wilson. The third consecutive GP won by Jund was Willy Edel using Lotus Cobra's, Thundermaw Hellkites, and Maelstrom pulses to next level the mirror match. After that, the jund mirror was impossible to get good tech for, but I think it still won another GP. Not sure.
LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
And back to back wins warranted Jund a ban, despite jund being a more 'fair' deck and certainly much more interesting to watch. =\
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By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
The amount of whining going on in this thread is ridiculous. There were 8 different archetypes in the top 8. We saw multiple archetypes the entire weekend. Yes eggs plays a different style of game, but that's part of the allure to eternal formats. I thought the GP was great.
The problem with jund was even jund players didn't like playing it(aside from like, Reid, but he's an outlier among human beings).
Jund was format warping, and a deck that you didn't want to play but felt that you had to if you wanted to win. They Ban BBE and suddenly format diversity so I don't see what the problem is.
LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
And back to back wins warranted Jund a ban, despite jund being a more 'fair' deck and certainly much more interesting to watch. =\
Jund didn't get just back to back wins, it got three. And if I recall correctly, it had at least one deck in the finals of six events in a row.
Pro Tour Return to Ravnica? Second place.
Grand Prix Lyon? First place.
Grand Prix Chicago? First and second place.
Grand Prix Toronto? First place.
Grand Prix Bilbao? Second place.
It also had by far the highest number of PTQ wins (before the bans). Don't kid yourself by saying a simple case of "back to back" wins got Jund a ban.
Sure, suspending Lotus Bloom like you're supposed to can be good, but often the deck needs to combo out on turn three, and there's no way to get the mana necessary to do that without Reshaping into a Bloom or two. Nathan Holiday won both games in the Grand Prix finals on turn three doing just that and ended the consistent undervaluing of this extremely powerful, if a little tedious, Modern deck.
MTGGPCoverage
#baneggs
The deck wins consistently on turn 3, they dont want this. It is getting the ax on the next update or i will be so mad after they ban seething song and BBE
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top 100 SCG Sacramento
1st place GPT Seattle
1st place GPT Anaheim
The amount of crying from some people for Eggs is unbelievable. you're all delusional;' eggs is ****ed come next list.
You can count on it.
Solitaire is not a good look for modern. Pro's hate the deck, one of them being hugely influential to modern.
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By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
I couldn't imagine being 2nd place. Battling your ass off for 2 days just to ****ing sit there and watch someone do some mental masterbation for a half hour and lose.
I actually wouldn't be surprised to see eggs banned in some context. But some of the arguments for an eggs ban are just terrible and/or poorly informed.
LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
If they ban something from Eggs it will be for the wrong reasons (Time and Boring to play against) so I would hope they don't, Modern should be allowed to have a deck like Eggs banning it hurts diversity in the format
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Modern:
Paper: WUR Waffle Control, RG and U Tron
MTGO: U Tron, BRG Living End, B Infect
Testing Modern on MTGO and helping to craft decks on a Budget I stream!
I actually wouldn't be surprised to see eggs banned in some context. But some of the arguments for an eggs ban are just terrible and/or poorly informed.
Most of the arguments for Eggs existing are even worse.
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By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Mhjames: mtgsalvation: I DON'T SEE HOW THIS CARD IS GOOD. I KNOW PATRICK CHAPIN USED IT AND WENT 8-0, BUT THAT WAS A SMALL TOURNAMENT. THE CARD IS TOO SLOW. YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THE OPPONENT HAS A SPELL IN THE GRAVEYARD
My friend Chris plays Eggs and I typically play GR Tron.
The match typically involves me looking for a Relic, and if I don't have it my iPad comes out turn 3 as he sits there for 10 minutes going through the motions of the Goldberg device that is eggs.
It's one of the few decks I've played against where I didn't want to play anymore not out of frustration but out of abject boredom and lack of interactivity, and this is coming from someone who's played and played against Stasis more times than I can remember.
I think decks that are non-interactive and monotonous are bad for the format. People just roll their eyes, toss their hand down on the table, and wait. It's like going on a date with someone who's interested in talking about themselves the entire time.
Most of the arguments for Eggs existing are even worse.
This statement is poorly phrased since nobody's really arguing for eggs to exist seeing as it exists perfectly fine whether we argue that it should or shouldn't.
The only valid reasons based on ban criteria for WOTC banning the deck would be violation of the turn 3 rule.
Outside of that, the only reason to ban the deck would be if wizards thought it would make them more money then letting the deck exist in it's current iteration.
LP, I'm checking your article out as well. Behind all of your swag is the brain of one of the most intelligent Magic players I've ever known. I guess that's one more thing for you to add to the wall of ego that is your Sally sig.
I can go with that. LK, you are the Mace Windu of red mages...cool, tempered logic in deliberation, but capable of just flat kicking tail when the situation warrants it.
Has everyone just assumed that they can just complain enough and get rid of a deck instead of simply preparing for it, we're pretty content to allow people to keep Sowing Salt and Blood Moon boarded for Tron matchups, why can't we just expect people to play Burning-Tree Shaman and Stony Silence?
The problem is less eggs taking forever and more people need to learn when you should simply scoop, there is a point when eggs cannot lose, statistically impossible for them to do so (in fact, when they have less than 30 cards, and have 7-10 eggs coming into play, probably should just scoop there), being stubborn and forcing them to play it out (especially in a game 1 situation) runs out YOUR clock, unless your a fast aggro deck and gold fish turn 4-5 consistantly, your not going to have enough time to actually kill them, they can stall the clock, that's not a problem for them.
That said, how long until speculators start buying up copies of Faith's Reward en masse?
Has everyone just assumed that they can just complain enough and get rid of a deck instead of simply preparing for it, we're pretty content to allow people to keep Sowing Salt and Blood Moon boarded for Tron matchups, why can't we just expect people to play Burning-Tree Shaman and Stony Silence?
The problem is less eggs taking forever and more people need to learn when you should simply scoop, there is a point when eggs cannot lose, statistically impossible for them to do so (in fact, when they have less than 30 cards, and have 7-10 eggs coming into play, probably should just scoop there), being stubborn and forcing them to play it out (especially in a game 1 situation) runs out YOUR clock, unless your a fast aggro deck and gold fish turn 4-5 consistantly, your not going to have enough time to actually kill them, they can stall the clock, that's not a problem for them.
That said, how long until speculators start buying up copies of Faith's Reward en masse?
People need to feel engaged in the game though. Whether you are the person sitting across from the Eggs player or somebody that is watching, you would like to think you would have a chance to make a play and save yourself. That isn't how it goes with Eggs. Even with storm there were spots in the combo you could counter and it would put you back in the game. In the end Magic needs to be a 2 person game in order to keep people engaged. There's never that wow moment in watching a Eggs matchup. It either makes it or it doesn't after a long and uneventful rotation of cards on one side of the table. If people wanted to watch one person have fun then we would have professional Solitaire instead of professional Poker.
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Modern xWBreakfast at Urza'sxW UWGBantUWG GWRNaya ZooRWG
This whole thread has devolved into Ban List Discussion.
Closed
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Maybe "popular again" wasn't the best choice of words, but Eggs certainly got noticeably more popular after the bans.
You don't have any idea.
Bitterblossom doing nothing against eggs isn't the point. The UB disruption deck with seize, spell snare, spellstutter sprite and mistbind clique would be a good deck vs it unfortunately it's a deck which is unplayable against the field at the moment due to BB's absence.
The decks which are good vs eggs are gone.
The top 8 of this and the last PT it won are absolute proof that the deck isn't too slow seeing as how the eggs players won their matches before some of the game 1's ended. Time is not a valid reason as has been proven twice with the deck.
Wizards in relation to modern.
"The bannings will continue until attendance improves."
Not sure if trolling or just very stupid.:fry:
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
I'm fairly certain that jund at least a few back to back events, which is the only deck to do so in the history of modern.
UWRasputin DreamweaverUW
UWBSen TripletsUWB
Edit: Jund won at least 3 GP's in a row. Traditional jund piloted by someone. 74/75 mirror match Spirit jund between Utter-Layton and Jacob Wilson was the Second GP won by Wilson. The third consecutive GP won by Jund was Willy Edel using Lotus Cobra's, Thundermaw Hellkites, and Maelstrom pulses to next level the mirror match. After that, the jund mirror was impossible to get good tech for, but I think it still won another GP. Not sure.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Jund was format warping, and a deck that you didn't want to play but felt that you had to if you wanted to win. They Ban BBE and suddenly format diversity so I don't see what the problem is.
Pro Tour Return to Ravnica? Second place.
Grand Prix Lyon? First place.
Grand Prix Chicago? First and second place.
Grand Prix Toronto? First place.
Grand Prix Bilbao? Second place.
It also had by far the highest number of PTQ wins (before the bans). Don't kid yourself by saying a simple case of "back to back" wins got Jund a ban.
MTGGPCoverage
#baneggs
The deck wins consistently on turn 3, they dont want this. It is getting the ax on the next update or i will be so mad after they ban seething song and BBE
1st place GPT Seattle
1st place GPT Anaheim
Didn't you read my post? That's exactly what I was implying
Modern Junk Primer
Legacy ANT Primer
L1 Judge
You can count on it.
Solitaire is not a good look for modern. Pro's hate the deck, one of them being hugely influential to modern.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
Standard
W.I.P.
EDH
WNorn Tokens
Paper: WUR Waffle Control, RG and U Tron
MTGO: U Tron, BRG Living End, B Infect
Testing Modern on MTGO and helping to craft decks on a Budget
I stream!
Hermit Druid Combo:
Most of the arguments for Eggs existing are even worse.
By: ol MISAKA lo
Cockatrice: Infallible
The match typically involves me looking for a Relic, and if I don't have it my iPad comes out turn 3 as he sits there for 10 minutes going through the motions of the Goldberg device that is eggs.
It's one of the few decks I've played against where I didn't want to play anymore not out of frustration but out of abject boredom and lack of interactivity, and this is coming from someone who's played and played against Stasis more times than I can remember.
I think decks that are non-interactive and monotonous are bad for the format. People just roll their eyes, toss their hand down on the table, and wait. It's like going on a date with someone who's interested in talking about themselves the entire time.
Want to be a better Magic player? Read the rulings forum and check out the comprehensive rules!
This statement is poorly phrased since nobody's really arguing for eggs to exist seeing as it exists perfectly fine whether we argue that it should or shouldn't.
The only valid reasons based on ban criteria for WOTC banning the deck would be violation of the turn 3 rule.
Outside of that, the only reason to ban the deck would be if wizards thought it would make them more money then letting the deck exist in it's current iteration.
The problem is less eggs taking forever and more people need to learn when you should simply scoop, there is a point when eggs cannot lose, statistically impossible for them to do so (in fact, when they have less than 30 cards, and have 7-10 eggs coming into play, probably should just scoop there), being stubborn and forcing them to play it out (especially in a game 1 situation) runs out YOUR clock, unless your a fast aggro deck and gold fish turn 4-5 consistantly, your not going to have enough time to actually kill them, they can stall the clock, that's not a problem for them.
That said, how long until speculators start buying up copies of Faith's Reward en masse?
People need to feel engaged in the game though. Whether you are the person sitting across from the Eggs player or somebody that is watching, you would like to think you would have a chance to make a play and save yourself. That isn't how it goes with Eggs. Even with storm there were spots in the combo you could counter and it would put you back in the game. In the end Magic needs to be a 2 person game in order to keep people engaged. There's never that wow moment in watching a Eggs matchup. It either makes it or it doesn't after a long and uneventful rotation of cards on one side of the table. If people wanted to watch one person have fun then we would have professional Solitaire instead of professional Poker.
Modern
xWBreakfast at Urza'sxW
UWGBantUWG
GWRNaya ZooRWG
Closed