Shardless Agent would barely be playable let alone banned.
Careful about that. Shardless Agent is a powerful card in Legacy and would likely see significant play in Modern, at least until Wizards keeps it from breaking Ancestral Vision wide open. At the very least, I can definitely see Living End changing out its builds because Shardless Agent doesn't need to target creatures (unlike Demonic Dread) and it's not close-to-useless if Living End is countered.
I'm not convinced Toxic Deluge is broken in Modern, but it would be a very interesting sweeper here.
TNN would get banned, the rest would be iffy to say it this way.
I mean, the combination of Shardless Agent and Baleful Strix would create U Jund on it's own, especially since you can run AV (which is not that great in modern tbh).
Toxic Deluge would be a nice card to have in Modern, since it is an actually good sweeper in B where the drawback is noticeable in modern.
Flusterstorm would be another card which I would actually like, since it helps out Delver and similar decks the most while being a good general counterspell for the SB vs Combo.
Magus of the Will would be interesting as a card, but PiF does the same thing in Modern (cause no LED and Petals).
Ash Barrens would be a nice card to have for Loam decks, though it is still way worse than the classic Cycle lands (sadly)
The Confluence cycle would see play for sure (especially the U one)
Shardless Agent would barely be playable let alone banned.
Careful about that. Shardless Agent is a powerful card in Legacy and would likely see significant play in Modern, at least until Wizards keeps it from breaking Ancestral Vision wide open. At the very least, I can definitely see Living End changing out its builds because Shardless Agent doesn't need to target creatures (unlike Demonic Dread) and it's not close-to-useless if Living End is countered.
Cast a random spell in your library and put a 2/2 creature that dies to Ancient Grudge into play doesn't seem great to me.
The problem was (when TNN got released and also the many months afterwards), that the format drifted into three directions:
a) You played TNN and beat up every fair deck
b) You played Miracles cause it has 4 MD Terminus to screw TNN over
c) You ignore TNN
Hence, the format became: "TNN decks" vs "Miracles" vs "I don't care for TNN"
The TNN decks were: Team America, Patriot and Deathblade
Miracle was the Miracle deck
"I can ignore TNN" decks were Sneak Show, Storm and Elves
That was basically the Tier 1 and the format was REALLY boring to play. Trust me, I played back than and quit playing Legacy cause of that stupid card (even though I was in the "I can ignore it" camp).
Sure, the format evolved out of this dilemma but because TNN is not a good card anymore (or as bad as a 3/1 fk you can get). Furthermore, with Monastery Mentor in the format, which is a better TNN in close to every deck, the need for such a card went also down.
TNN was also one of the reason, why Canadian Tresh fell out of the DTB (so Tier 1) the first time ever, it just took 3 1/2 years
TNN was also the reason, why Jund was suddenly playable, since it was the best deck against all those TNN like decks + had a good Miracles match-up (Abrupt Decay, Bob, Lilli, P.Fire and BBE are all great card vs Miracles for different reasons).
So please no, I would rather want something like Wasteland in Modern than TNN, since it makes the whole format just miserable.
Greetings,
Kathal
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What I play or have:
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
Titanshift and regular scapeshift would love collective voyage . I could see it replacing Khalni Heart Expedition and thus the non Foothills fetches in Titanshift. Even if the opponent buys in, they probably won't outright win that turn and you will win on the untap.
Shardless Agent would barely be playable let alone banned.
Careful about that. Shardless Agent is a powerful card in Legacy and would likely see significant play in Modern, at least until Wizards keeps it from breaking Ancestral Vision wide open. At the very least, I can definitely see Living End changing out its builds because Shardless Agent doesn't need to target creatures (unlike Demonic Dread) and it's not close-to-useless if Living End is countered.
Cast a random spell in your library and put a 2/2 creature that dies to Ancient Grudge into play doesn't seem great to me.
I wouldn't board in Ancient Grudge if the only artifact in my opponent's deck was Shardless Agent. It's only a 2/2 and more than half of its damage was already done with the Cascade trigger.
Casting random spells in your library that cost less than Shardless Agent actually gets pretty useful. Seems like you've never had the pleasure of Cascading this bad boy into targeted discard, Bolt, a cantrip, Path to Exile, or Goyf (to name the Modern equivalents of Legacy's targeted discard, Bolt, superior cantrips, Swords to Plowshares, and Goyf).
Casting random spells in your library that cost less than Shardless Agent actually gets pretty useful. Seems like you've never had the pleasure of Cascading this bad boy into targeted discard, Bolt, a cantrip, Path to Exile, or Goyf (to name the Modern equivalents of Legacy's targeted discard, Bolt, superior cantrips, Swords to Plowshares, and Goyf).
You forgot the all important Ancestral Visions there. Grizzly Bear + Ancestral Recall is pretty good.
True-Name, Containment Priest, Baleful Strix and Shardless Agent would all be too impactful for modern imo. I'd love to play me some Leovold, card is pretty sweet.
I think it should be at least tried. Whole new archetypes for modern would be born and the metagame would adjust to it correctly. I think diversity would flourish out of a merge like that and it would push the format to play slower, as modern pool doesn't have the tools to break those cards fast enough. Maybe there would be bans needed, but I don't think it would break the format or push decks like TC/DTT and low-costed eldrazi with Eye of Ugin did.
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In Lorwyn's brief evenings, the sun pauses at the horizon long enough for a certain species of violet to bloom with the fragrance of mischief.
IMHO, you guys are out of your mind if you think WotC would put cards into modern outside of standard sets. The reason is simple: modern exists as a means for WotC to add long-term value to their standard sets. If good cards for the format don't need to be introduced in standard, they are seriously risking sales for no business value.
Seriously guys, this prospect - while beneficial to the format abstractly, is a risk to the bottom line for WotC. This is incredibly unlikely to happen as it would reduce the value of standard sets. I like unicorns and rainbows myself, but I think realistic expectations will go a long way to being happy with the game.
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Modern Decks
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
IMHO, you guys are out of your mind if you think WotC would put cards into modern outside of standard sets. The reason is simple: modern exists as a means for WotC to add long-term value to their standard sets. If good cards for the format don't need to be introduced in standard, they are seriously risking sales for no business value.
Seriously guys, this prospect - while beneficial to the format abstractly, is a risk to the bottom line for WotC. This is incredibly unlikely to happen as it would reduce the value of standard sets. I like unicorns and rainbows myself, but I think realistic expectations will go a long way to being happy with the game.
Scavenging Ooze used to be exclusive to commander or something.
True-Name, Containment Priest, Baleful Strix and Shardless Agent would all be too impactful for modern imo. I'd love to play me some Leovold, card is pretty sweet.
True-Name Nemesis, sure. But Containment Priest? Containment Priest? It's just a hatebear that's only relevant against certain decks. Quite honestly I think the card would be a great thing to have around.
Baleful Strix is good, but it's hard to say it's "too impactful" when you look at the power of other 2-drop creatures in this format.
Shardless Agent is an iffy one. It's got a good combo with Ancestral Vision, even if it is rather luck-based, and it's already on color with it so you don't run into a lot of the things that would easily prevent any kind of Bloodbraid Elf+Ancestral Vision deck from being too good (e.g. counterspells synergize horribly with Bloodbraid Elf, so you need discard as your disruption, but that would push you into 4 colors, which is tricky to accomplish--Shardless Agent+Ancestral Vision can just splash Black for discard and call it a day). On the other hand, Brainstorm isn't around to help you set up Shardless Agent.
IMHO, you guys are out of your mind if you think WotC would put cards into modern outside of standard sets. The reason is simple: modern exists as a means for WotC to add long-term value to their standard sets. If good cards for the format don't need to be introduced in standard, they are seriously risking sales for no business value.
Seriously guys, this prospect - while beneficial to the format abstractly, is a risk to the bottom line for WotC. This is incredibly unlikely to happen as it would reduce the value of standard sets. I like unicorns and rainbows myself, but I think realistic expectations will go a long way to being happy with the game.
Scavenging Ooze used to be exclusive to commander or something.
And it turned out pretty good.
It's in M14, so I'm not entirely clear on your point.
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Modern Decks
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
It's in M14, so I'm not entirely clear on your point.
Exactly. Wizards has printed Commander cards for Standard and Modern (Ooze was printed before M14). These cards just need a good set. Scavenging Ooze wasn't as gamebreaking as Wizard thought. I can see other commons like Baleful Strix
Shardless Agent would barely be playable let alone banned.
Laughable statement.
Shardless Agent would be one of the best cards in the format.
Right? You wouldn't even have to have Ancestral visions in the deck (I mean, you would obviously, but just for an example)...you could just cascade into jund's removal suite: lightning bolts and abrupt decays and stuff and no deck would ever beat you.
Also, why hasn't anyone mentioned Show and Tell? If you thought splinter twin was bad, just let that card into the format.
Obviously the most broken one would have to be banned, true name, toxic deluge, shardless agent, etc.
I think it would really freshen up the meta-game, and allow for some really interesting decks. What do you guys think.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
Careful about that. Shardless Agent is a powerful card in Legacy and would likely see significant play in Modern, at least until Wizards keeps it from breaking Ancestral Vision wide open. At the very least, I can definitely see Living End changing out its builds because Shardless Agent doesn't need to target creatures (unlike Demonic Dread) and it's not close-to-useless if Living End is countered.
I'm not convinced Toxic Deluge is broken in Modern, but it would be a very interesting sweeper here.
I mean, the combination of Shardless Agent and Baleful Strix would create U Jund on it's own, especially since you can run AV (which is not that great in modern tbh).
Toxic Deluge would be a nice card to have in Modern, since it is an actually good sweeper in B where the drawback is noticeable in modern.
Flusterstorm would be another card which I would actually like, since it helps out Delver and similar decks the most while being a good general counterspell for the SB vs Combo.
Magus of the Will would be interesting as a card, but PiF does the same thing in Modern (cause no LED and Petals).
Ash Barrens would be a nice card to have for Loam decks, though it is still way worse than the classic Cycle lands (sadly)
The Confluence cycle would see play for sure (especially the U one)
Containment Priest would also see play (as an out vs CoCo and Dredge)
Recruiter of the Guild would buff D&T and Hatebears and would see a lot of play
Edric, Spymaster of Trest would give a huge push for Spirits and similar decks (+ you can hit him with CoCo), but I think it would be still acceptable
From the Ashes would probably be to good
Sudden Demise would see a lot play, since it is a one sided sweeper
Unexpected Absent would also see some play, since it deals with any non-land permanent, if the opponent fetches
Brago, King Eternal would see play in the UW value Midrange decks, which got played a year ago
Coercive Portal would see a lot of play, especially in decks like Tron (you draw an additional card every turn)
Council's Judgment BINGO for all the UWx Control decks (handles every problematic non-land permanent regardless of what it is (Hexproof included))
Dack Fayden would see some fringe play, but he would shine in RUG Loam and Grixis Tezzerator
Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast again something for Tezzeret ^^
Kaya, Ghost Assassin could see some play in Junk but I doubt it
Leovold, Emissary of Trest BUG Midrange would play the crap out of that card
Tyrant's Choice would see play in Mardu Burn
I think, that's all Modern playable cards. I'm sure, I missed at least one card, but w/e.
Greetings,
Kathal
PS: Baleful Strix has nothing to do in a proper Delver deck btw
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
Exactly and we all know, how good Etched Champion is vs all the fair decks.
There was a reason, why TNN warped Legacy for several months and it would be even worse in Modern.
Greetings,
Kathal
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
Cast a random spell in your library and put a 2/2 creature that dies to Ancient Grudge into play doesn't seem great to me.
a) You played TNN and beat up every fair deck
b) You played Miracles cause it has 4 MD Terminus to screw TNN over
c) You ignore TNN
Hence, the format became: "TNN decks" vs "Miracles" vs "I don't care for TNN"
The TNN decks were: Team America, Patriot and Deathblade
Miracle was the Miracle deck
"I can ignore TNN" decks were Sneak Show, Storm and Elves
That was basically the Tier 1 and the format was REALLY boring to play. Trust me, I played back than and quit playing Legacy cause of that stupid card (even though I was in the "I can ignore it" camp).
Sure, the format evolved out of this dilemma but because TNN is not a good card anymore (or as bad as a 3/1 fk you can get). Furthermore, with Monastery Mentor in the format, which is a better TNN in close to every deck, the need for such a card went also down.
TNN was also one of the reason, why Canadian Tresh fell out of the DTB (so Tier 1) the first time ever, it just took 3 1/2 years
TNN was also the reason, why Jund was suddenly playable, since it was the best deck against all those TNN like decks + had a good Miracles match-up (Abrupt Decay, Bob, Lilli, P.Fire and BBE are all great card vs Miracles for different reasons).
So please no, I would rather want something like Wasteland in Modern than TNN, since it makes the whole format just miserable.
Greetings,
Kathal
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
Marath, Will of the Wild Tokens!! / Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund Dragons! / Muzzio, Visionary Architect / Brago, King Eternal / Daretti, Scrap Savant / Narset, Enlightened Master / Alesha, Who Smiles at Death / Bruna, Light of Alabaster / Marchesa, the Black Rose / Iroas, God of Victory / Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury / Omnath, Locus of rage / Titania, Protector of Argoth / Kozilek, the Great Distortion
Modern
Elves / Titanshift / Merfolk
I wouldn't board in Ancient Grudge if the only artifact in my opponent's deck was Shardless Agent. It's only a 2/2 and more than half of its damage was already done with the Cascade trigger.
Casting random spells in your library that cost less than Shardless Agent actually gets pretty useful. Seems like you've never had the pleasure of Cascading this bad boy into targeted discard, Bolt, a cantrip, Path to Exile, or Goyf (to name the Modern equivalents of Legacy's targeted discard, Bolt, superior cantrips, Swords to Plowshares, and Goyf).
You forgot the all important Ancestral Visions there. Grizzly Bear + Ancestral Recall is pretty good.
Leopold Emisart of trest?
Laughable statement.
Shardless Agent would be one of the best cards in the format.
Seriously guys, this prospect - while beneficial to the format abstractly, is a risk to the bottom line for WotC. This is incredibly unlikely to happen as it would reduce the value of standard sets. I like unicorns and rainbows myself, but I think realistic expectations will go a long way to being happy with the game.
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
Scavenging Ooze used to be exclusive to commander or something.
And it turned out pretty good.
Modern Tallowisp Spirits - A Modern Tallowisp Deck UW
Eldrazi Ninjas - Summoning Octopus Jutsu YYYYAAAHHHH!
STANDARD
Naban Wizards
True-Name Nemesis, sure. But Containment Priest? Containment Priest? It's just a hatebear that's only relevant against certain decks. Quite honestly I think the card would be a great thing to have around.
Baleful Strix is good, but it's hard to say it's "too impactful" when you look at the power of other 2-drop creatures in this format.
Shardless Agent is an iffy one. It's got a good combo with Ancestral Vision, even if it is rather luck-based, and it's already on color with it so you don't run into a lot of the things that would easily prevent any kind of Bloodbraid Elf+Ancestral Vision deck from being too good (e.g. counterspells synergize horribly with Bloodbraid Elf, so you need discard as your disruption, but that would push you into 4 colors, which is tricky to accomplish--Shardless Agent+Ancestral Vision can just splash Black for discard and call it a day). On the other hand, Brainstorm isn't around to help you set up Shardless Agent.
KnightfallGWUR
Azorius Control UW
Burn RBG
Part 1
Part 2
Exactly. Wizards has printed Commander cards for Standard and Modern (Ooze was printed before M14). These cards just need a good set. Scavenging Ooze wasn't as gamebreaking as Wizard thought. I can see other commons like Baleful Strix
Modern Tallowisp Spirits - A Modern Tallowisp Deck UW
Eldrazi Ninjas - Summoning Octopus Jutsu YYYYAAAHHHH!
STANDARD
Naban Wizards
Right? You wouldn't even have to have Ancestral visions in the deck (I mean, you would obviously, but just for an example)...you could just cascade into jund's removal suite: lightning bolts and abrupt decays and stuff and no deck would ever beat you.
Also, why hasn't anyone mentioned Show and Tell? If you thought splinter twin was bad, just let that card into the format.
Modern Junk Primer
Legacy ANT Primer
L1 Judge
Show and tell wasn't one of the exlusive cards made for the sets. It was a reprint, so it wound not be added.
oh okay. Leovold would be good though too.
Modern Junk Primer
Legacy ANT Primer
L1 Judge