Quote from AUTUMNTWILIGHT »I mean technically you can do both bridge and lattice. If its aggro Bridge comes in from Karn. If its Control or Midrange then in comes Lattice.
Quote from DaveJacinto »You can go Turn 3 Karn (7mana) into Turn 4 Karn (4mana)+Lattice... This line of play isn't that difficult to come up... if you play 8Karn + 4 Stirrings it's actually quite easy to pull off. There has been a non-zero amount of times that I've been Turn 3 Karn into Turn 4 Ulamog...
Against Burn for example, if you lock them out of burn spells they don't have a good way to get rid of the 4mana Karn. It's not unbeatable but it's really strong.
Quote from Ym1r »Well, why is that a bad thing? Most cards (so far) seems relatively fair, and people have been complaining for a while about the Phoenix meta (although it seems to me like it is settling and things will be fine). It's ok to have a non-artificial shake up (as in no bans/unbans) and see where we are going from there in 6-8 months. Hopefully this will also stop the ban/unban discussion for a while as it has become extremely stale.
Quote from AUTUMNTWILIGHT »I would assume UW Control will be good against this new Karn. Counter the Lattice.
I am so salty about Time Wipe...the flavor fail should Exile. I delete them from Time and leave a body how?
Quote from Lectrys »Anyone else think that Honor the God-Pharaoh might see play? For one more mana than Tormenting Voice, you get Tormenting Voice on a 1/1! And it's on a sorcery, which could get useful!
Quote from tronix »from what amass cards have been spoiled so far im pretty underwhelmed. after the first instance of the effect (ie first getting that 0/0 token) each subsequent one is less potent; so in other words there are diminishing returns equating to the difference between getting a 1/1 token and giving a creature +1/+1 counters.
more spoilers on the way though, so maybe something is a little more pushed.
as for the flavor of the mechanic, i think its a miss. maybe they couldnt figure out how to balance creating separate tokens or whatever, but 'amassing' an army by getting one duder that grows doesnt make much sense to me.
Quote from Bearscape »Ignite the Beacon seems like a nice one-of for UWx over something like the third JtMS. Even as of now just getting JtMS and Teferi HoD (THoD?) already seems nuts, and it could validify playing a singleton Teferi Time Raveler main.
I'm still not sure how Ral, Storm Conduit interacts with storm spells. Does storm's trigger only count as one instance of copying a spell regardless of how many copies you make or does each copy trigger Ral separately?
Quote from Nyzzeh »I hate tron and I'm extremely happy for this new Karn. It's so broken that it will get something banned from that deck. Hopefully the tower itself (but they will just ban karn), but yes, I know, not the place to talk about that here.
Strom? T3 trinishphere!
Aggro? T3 bridge!
Control? just faceroll like you always do, no changes here.
Then if you dont kill it, next turn it gives you another card lol.
Quote from SnowCrow »Is there a way to get an infinite loop with Karn, the Great Creator and Ugin's Nexus? Not that it would be viable, but in theory.
Quote from genini2 »
His minus ability is his greatest value since it allows you a miracle sideboard plan, but how much better is this than just casting a Wurmcoil/Big Karn on turn 3. You have to give up your sideboard, it has to be <4 CMC artifacts and you have to assemble Tron on turn 3 with the ability to cast something which is about a 20% chance to have Tron and being able to cast 7 mana worth of spells on turn 3.
His ability to combo with Mycosynth Lattic is perhaps his greatest ability, but they need 10 mana to do it in one turn otherwise hand disruption stops them and then you still have countermagic, Lightning Bolt, creatures already in play. That's not to say they won't run the lattice because given up a SB slot to win the game is worthwhile, but this karn is just too overblown. It doesn't make the matchups where Tron suffers better.