@ Val, I concur that Elspeth is probably better than both Sorins. However, I can't help but giggle maniacally when I think about casting a Lingering Souls on turn 3, making a Lord of Innistrad emblem on turn four, and then dropping/making a couple Pack Rats on turn five. Obviously turns 1 and 2 you're killing things.
This is probably why I was originally thinking of Sorin, Solemn Visitor. Turn 1 Bolt, turn 2 Terminate, turn 3 Lingering Souls, turn 4 Sorin hit for 4 with lifelink, turn 5 Lingering Souls flashback Lingering Souls, hit for 4 with lifelink, turn 6 flashback Lingering Souls, Dreadbore, hit for 12 with lifelink...
However, what you said about me killing things turn 1 and 2 raises an interesting point. This deck really only has 4 turn 1 plays (Path to Exile is really bad on turn 1). I am not sure if that is really good enough or not, but the only thing I can think of cutting for Burst Lightning is Lightning Helix, which is the kind of card I want against the same decks I want to kill things on turn 1 against. Any suggestions?
Shriekmaw feels like it could be perfect in a deck like this. It gives you you removal, while also allowing you transition it into a threat later. I don't think that the tar getting restriction matters that much when the deck is packed with so many other ways to remove things.
I thought about it, but being its sorcery-speed and color/type restrictions make it basically dead against Affinity and bad against Twin, Grixis, Amulet, and BGx, so I am not a fan. If the meta shifted, it might be viable, but otherwise it isn't. It's a nice idea though.
I don't think so; even in a meta where it's usable against 95% of the targets, it still dies to every removal spell used in the format. Not where we want to be for a 5 drop finisher.
As for 1 drop spells, I think we're just kinda out there till Innocent Blood gets reprinted.
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It isn't a five drop finisher, though. It's a two mana kill spell. One that can try to whack somebody later in the game if you happen to have five mana and not much in which to invest it. I suspect this deck will find itself in that situation every so often. The opportunity cost is very low here, and it's just about the only way to get a two-for-one in the deck. He wasn't suggesting you replace Blood Baron, with it...
Shriekmaw might not be needed for this deck, I'm not really sure, but it's definitely worth being aware of. I've found it to be a really good magic card over the years, and it generally exceeds expectations when I play it.
Yes, I was suggesting replacing some of the other removal with shriekmaw. When you start to overload on removal (which this deck is aiming for), more flexible yet sometimes somewhat more limited removal can become attractive. It's basically the same concept of how manlands contribute to the strategy of decks by giving them something they need while turning into something more useful later. And yes, it doesn't hit everything in the format, but that's not necessarily a problem when 90% of your deck otherwise is removal that hits almost all of the format.
It isn't a five drop finisher, though. It's a two mana kill spell. One that can try to whack somebody later in the game if you happen to have five mana and not much in which to invest it. I suspect this deck will find itself in that situation every so often. The opportunity cost is very low here, and it's just about the only way to get a two-for-one in the deck. He wasn't suggesting you replace Blood Baron, with it...
Shriekmaw might not be needed for this deck, I'm not really sure, but it's definitely worth being aware of. I've found it to be a really good magic card over the years, and it generally exceeds expectations when I play it.
Yes, I was suggesting replacing some of the other removal with shriekmaw. When you start to overload on removal (which this deck is aiming for), more flexible yet sometimes somewhat more limited removal can become attractive. It's basically the same concept of how manlands contribute to the strategy of decks by giving them something they need while turning into something more useful later. And yes, it doesn't hit everything in the format, but that's not necessarily a problem when 90% of your deck otherwise is removal that hits almost all of the format.
As I said, it sounds like it could be a cool idea. I just am not sure if it hits enough. I'll add a bit to the primer on it though and try it out in my 2 flex slots.
I notice there are no copies of Kolaghan's Command in the deck. It's doing really good work across the whole format and would actually pair nicely w/the aforementioned Shriekmaw. Terror something, then cast Command and force a discard or pop the x/2 or whatever and get Shriekmaw back to kill something else next turn.
He's never going to be a creature, but he's a free shock if they don't have creatures or a free creature kill. He can't be Decayed, is indestructible, and looks awesome.
Yes, the opponent gets to choose, but we have enough creature kill that he should just be a clock. Maybe too slow?
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I notice there are no copies of Kolaghan's Command in the deck. It's doing really good work across the whole format and would actually pair nicely w/the aforementioned Shriekmaw. Terror something, then cast Command and force a discard or pop the x/2 or whatever and get Shriekmaw back to kill something else next turn.
After trying Shriekmaw a little I was going to cut it. Mardu Charm seemed a lot better. But Kolaghan's Command+Shriekmaw seems like a really good idea. The main reason why I wasn't running Command is because I wasn't running enough creatures, but with Pack Rat, Blood Baron, and Shriekmaw, it could work really well. Having Command also balances out Shriekmaw's weakness to Affinity.
I should be able to buy the rest of my deck this week (unless if I decide to buy Magus of the Moon which is somehow sold out in every store in one of the biggest Magic areas in the country). Which deck do you guys think would be best (I don't have the perfect fetch-shock manabase so I'm going to have to use off-color fetches)?
The first one is the one I've been using, the second one is just because we have very few removal spells that we can cast on turn 1, and the last one is because Shriekmaw+Kolaghan's Command seems super sweet.
He's never going to be a creature, but he's a free shock if they don't have creatures or a free creature kill. He can't be Decayed, is indestructible, and looks awesome.
Yes, the opponent gets to choose, but we have enough creature kill that he should just be a clock. Maybe too slow?
If he made them sacrifice a creature and if they couldn't he dealt 2 damage, then he would be great. Unfortunately, he will just do whatever the opponent wants him to do, which makes him an unreliable finisher. He also seems a lot worse than Gideon Jura, who can both kill creatures more effectively and deal more damage.
I think for the 3rd deck do a 2:2 split for Shriekmaw and Lightning Helix. The life seems really important in the Burn matchup. Losing the Mardu Charm and Wurmcoil Engine may be doable, we're just counting on Blood Baron being our boy to finish things off most likely. Of course, if you're going to run some test games, give 4 Shriekmaw a shot and see if it flows well. If not, do the split.
I think for the 3rd deck do a 2:2 split for Shriekmaw and Lightning Helix. The life seems really important in the Burn matchup. Losing the Mardu Charm and Wurmcoil Engine may be doable, we're just counting on Blood Baron being our boy to finish things off most likely. Of course, if you're going to run some test games, give 4 Shriekmaw a shot and see if it flows well. If not, do the split.
I'll run some tests. I think that if I do that I will definitely run 4 Commands and only 3 Shriekmaws though. Also, I think that even without Lightning Helix, 4 Timely Reinforcements, 4 Leyline of Sanctity, and a ton of removal should be enough to win games 2 and 3 almost every time.
I feel that a fundamental problem with this deck is that it both eschews card draw and is a deck that is strictly 1 for 1's, with only one real threat to pressure the opponent until turn 5 (lingering souls). You also have no card draw/selection to smooth your draws and ensure the land drops you need to cast your 5+ mana cards (of which I am including Pack Rat). This does not seem like a recipe for success.
Match 1: Genesis Command 0-2-0
Game 1: Was on the draw, had a Blackcleave Cliffs, Sacred Foundry, two Helix, a Terminate, path and a Sorin. Didn't draw another land, got Primal Command locked into drawing my Foundry every turn. By the time he stopped doing that nonsense I was too far behind to come back.
Game 2: Sided in Hide // Seek and Anger of the Gods, but he Genesis Waved for 7 T4 and followed with another one for 8 T5. Didn't draw my Anger in time to stabilize.
Match 2: Elves 1-1-1
Game 1: I'm not one to make excuses, but this was my fault; I was drawing all the removal but wasting them early on against his Llanowar/Mystic elves, which left his pump lords untouched. Coupled with the fact that instead of blowing up Ezuri, Renegade Leader on MY turn so he couldn't pump, I let him attack and tried to remove it to dubious results. Mistakes were made, I lost.
Game 2: In came the Anger of the Gods. I learned my lesson from the first game, and the only thing I let him keep were Llanowars/Mystics. Landed a T4 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad against a T3 Spellskite, Angered T5, and stuck a BBoV T6. He shortly scooped.
Game 3: We went into G3 with 5 minutes on the clock (It was a more relaxed game, he took 10 minutes boarding in T2 as he had only seen Sorin and kill spells at that point, then got a phone call before G3). He got me down to 14 life before I stabilized and we drew from going to turns.
Match 3: Grixis Twin 0-2-0
Both games went the same; Had loads of removal, lands for days, but he landed a threat both times and had the counter spells to back it up and win via beats. I made two play mistakes that cost me the game; G1 I kept trying to land a threat only to have it Remanded and would sit there being slapped by Tasigur. G2, instead of waiting for his Deceiver Exarch to be targeted by an enchantment, I just blasted them out right away. I blame myself.
Game 4: Mono-G Heroic? 2-0-0
Not going to go into detail about this one; he was using the three big Heroic Green guys and Fight effects, and was getting blown out by removal. Was kinda getting salty to, trying to say that his 7/7 Setessan Oathsworn still fought my BBoV even though I terminated him. Add to the fact that he never attacked with his three Ulvenwald Trackers despite a (Seemingly) empty board, I easily won. He asked for advice, the store told him to check out Bogle to see if it was up his alley.
I asked the regulars what they thought (Most common being "Holy Removal Batman!"), and I was told I need to take it in one of two directions; Go further into Tokens with Sorin, Solemn Visitor isntead of LoI, Young Pyromancer, another Pack Rat, and basically use Paco and YP as the win cons later on. Alternatively, use Gurmag Angler as my late drop win con and just keep the field clear for him. I was also told to drop most if not all of the Dreadbores for Bobs or IoK.
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Match 1: Genesis Command 0-2-0
Game 1: Was on the draw, had a Blackcleave Cliffs, Sacred Foundry, two Helix, a Terminate, path and a Sorin. Didn't draw another land, got Primal Command locked into drawing my Foundry every turn. By the time he stopped doing that nonsense I was too far behind to come back.
Game 2: Sided in Hide // Seek and Anger of the Gods, but he Genesis Waved for 7 T4 and followed with another one for 8 T5. Didn't draw my Anger in time to stabilize.
Admitedly, this is not a great matchup. They are similar to Tron since they have the inevitability with Primal Command and Genesis Wave. I personally would just try to dodge it since it sees very little play.
Match 2: Elves 1-1-1
Game 1: I'm not one to make excuses, but this was my fault; I was drawing all the removal but wasting them early on against his Llanowar/Mystic elves, which left his pump lords untouched. Coupled with the fact that instead of blowing up Ezuri, Renegade Leader on MY turn so he couldn't pump, I let him attack and tried to remove it to dubious results. Mistakes were made, I lost.
Game 2: In came the Anger of the Gods. I learned my lesson from the first game, and the only thing I let him keep were Llanowars/Mystics. Landed a T4 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad against a T3 Spellskite, Angered T5, and stuck a BBoV T6. He shortly scooped.
Game 3: We went into G3 with 5 minutes on the clock (It was a more relaxed game, he took 10 minutes boarding in T2 as he had only seen Sorin and kill spells at that point, then got a phone call before G3). He got me down to 14 life before I stabilized and we drew from going to turns.
I think that if you continued playing that last game you would have won. Stabilizing against Elves is the toughest part, the rest is easy.
Match 3: Grixis Twin 0-2-0
Both games went the same; Had loads of removal, lands for days, but he landed a threat both times and had the counter spells to back it up and win via beats. I made two play mistakes that cost me the game; G1 I kept trying to land a threat only to have it Remanded and would sit there being slapped by Tasigur. G2, instead of waiting for his Deceiver Exarch to be targeted by an enchantment, I just blasted them out right away. I blame myself.
That's odd. Twin has a lot of countermagic, but a lot of it (like Remand) isn't going to stop removal. And most of their counterspells should be ineffective against our cheaper threats like Pack Rat and Lingering Souls.
Game 4: Mono-G Heroic? 2-0-0
Not going to go into detail about this one; he was using the three big Heroic Green guys and Fight effects, and was getting blown out by removal. Was kinda getting salty to, trying to say that his 7/7 Setessan Oathsworn still fought my BBoV even though I terminated him. Add to the fact that he never attacked with his three Ulvenwald Trackers despite a (Seemingly) empty board, I easily won. He asked for advice, the store told him to check out Bogle to see if it was up his alley.
I hope he doesn't go with Bogles. The less Bogles players, the better this deck is.
I asked the regulars what they thought (Most common being "Holy Removal Batman!"), and I was told I need to take it in one of two directions; Go further into Tokens with Sorin, Solemn Visitor isntead of LoI, Young Pyromancer, another Pack Rat, and basically use Paco and YP as the win cons later on. Alternatively, use Gurmag Angler as my late drop win con and just keep the field clear for him. I was also told to drop most if not all of the Dreadbores for Bobs or IoK.
Running Bob seems terrible in a deck with multiple 5-6 drops. Angler can work well in this deck, it is just a little too vulnerable to Terminate and Path for my tastes. I am not a fan of Young Pyromancer, since it doesn't stabilize the game immediately if you topdeck it and it dies to everything. Another Pack Rat would be a good idea. Inquisition is bad in this deck because it is a terrible topdeck that is useless in the lategame. It also is much worse than Thoughtseize would be since Thoughtseize is better against most of our bad matchups (Tron, Ad Nauseum, Scapeshift, Amulet, Storm). I still wouldn't run Seize though. Finally, I like the look of your list, but I'd cut an Elspeth for a Pack Rat, 2 Sorins for Blood Barons, possibly the other 2 Sorins for Elspeth Knight Errants, and cut Kataki from the sideboard (Affinity is a really good matchup).
I feel that a fundamental problem with this deck is that it both eschews card draw and is a deck that is strictly 1 for 1's, with only one real threat to pressure the opponent until turn 5 (lingering souls). You also have no card draw/selection to smooth your draws and ensure the land drops you need to cast your 5+ mana cards (of which I am including Pack Rat). This does not seem like a recipe for success.
Just wondering, have you tried out any sample hands with the deck? I've been able to get to 5 mana by turn 5-7 and have enough removal to last that long (even if I cast a removal spell each turn) very consistently.
I was drawing a ton of removal against Twin...... but it was both my playsets of Bolt and Helix :/ Bad shuffling was the cause, I think, because it was both games and the guy was NOT cheater. He would play a Deceiver and I had to Bolt/Bolt him and just ran out of cards too fast. Then I started topdecking Elspeth + BBoV and THOSE got Remanded. He also boarded in Dispel, which were a tempo blowout for the one Dreadbore I did draw.
They were saying if I wanted to use Paco/YP, I would want Bob to retain the CA and help make dudes. This would be a more token based build (One guy called it Riot Control because you would stabilize then just make a crap ton of dudes and start a Riot). Alternatively, I was told to play Angler instead of BBoV for the cheaper CMC (So as to cast him and still have mana open to kill something).
I dunno, still some toying around to do. Dreadbore is getting replaced in an instant if I get my hands on Mardu Charms or Innocent Blood/Vindicate get reprinted.
Sorcery Speed is just too slow.
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I was drawing a ton of removal against Twin...... but it was both my playsets of Bolt and Helix :/ Bad shuffling was the cause, I think, because it was both games and the guy was NOT cheater. He would play a Deceiver and I had to Bolt/Bolt him and just ran out of cards too fast. Then I started topdecking Elspeth + BBoV and THOSE got Remanded.
Seems like you just got really unlucky to not draw any hard removal and then draw into the worst cards possible.
He also boarded in Dispel, which were a tempo blowout for the one Dreadbore I did draw.
You sure that guy was not a cheater? Because Dispel can't counter Dreadbore.
They were saying if I wanted to use Paco/YP, I would want Bob to retain the CA and help make dudes. This would be a more token based build (One guy called it Riot Control because you would stabilize then just make a crap ton of dudes and start a Riot).
If you were going to do that, I would run Phyrexian Arena instead of Bob. However, I'm still not a fan. Making the deck vulnerable to Bolt for a win-con that dies to everything and gets significantly worse the later you draw it is not where we want to be IMO.
Alternatively, I was told to play Angler instead of BBoV for the cheaper CMC (So as to cast him and still have mana open to kill something).
I definitely don't like this idea. Blood Baron has protection from Modern. It is immune to every removal spell in the format except for Roast and Rending Volley. It is unblockable against many decks. Its lifelink immediately stabilizes you. Gurmag Angler dies to a lot of removal spells like Terminate, Path to Exile, and Dismember, and heavy-creature decks can chump-block him forever. Sure, you can't cast something in the same turn as Blood Baron, but you usually don't need to. It almost always can automatically stabilize you the turn you play it.
I dunno, still some toying around to do. Dreadbore is getting replaced in an instant if I get my hands on Mardu Charms or Innocent Blood/Vindicate get reprinted.
Sorcery Speed is just too slow.
While I definitely would love Vindicate or Innocent Blood in this deck, I am not a fan of lowering the number of spells that can kill Siege Rhino, Tasigur, and Gurmag Angler in your deck to 8 by running Mardu Charm over Dreadbore. If Twin is big in your meta, I would run a 2-2 split.
I beat a casual Angel deck, drew against an Axebane Guardian combo deck with Isochron Scepter+Silence/Angel's Grace/Fog, and lost to Merfolk and Infect.
Against Merfolk I kept a strong hand of 2 lands, Terminate, Dreadbore, Shriekmaw, Blood Baron, and Pack Rat in game 1. Then I didn't draw any more lands and both of my lands were turned into islands with Spreading Seas. I made the very stupid mistake of siding out Kolaghan's Command for Timely Reinforcements (not sure why I did) and was then punished for it by losing to a 1-of Sword of Light and Shadow.
Against Infect I killed every infect creature without getting poisoned at all in game 1, was knocked down to 1 life by Dryad Arbor+Become Immense+Vines of the Vastwood, and managed to win by killing every one of his threats and slowly grinding away with spirit tokens. In game 2 I mulliganed down to 5, kept a hand with only 1 removal spell, and easily lost. In game 3 I kept a hand with 3 lands, Blood Baron, Bolt, and Terminate, and lost when my opponent had multiple protection spells and I drew 4 lands in a row.
Overall, how have you liked Lingering Souls so far?
Lingering Souls has worked really well. It is great at buying time and also works as a decent win-con.
I went to another Modern event and went 2-2.
My first match was against a 4-color Midrange/Land destruction deck that was sort of like Kiki-Pod used to be but instead of Kikis it had Flagstones of Trokair and Boom // Bust. In game 1, I was able to kill everything he played, but he kept me at 2-4 lands the whole game so I could never cast Blood Baron or Shriekmaw and both Pack Rat and Lavaclaw Reaches kept dying (I wasn't able to draw Lingering Souls). He eventually played a Geist of Saint Traft and won. In game 2 he had a turn 3 Geist and I wasn't able to stabilize after he also played a Huntmaster of the Fells and I could only cast 1 removal spell due to having 3 Plains and only 2 lands that make red/black out while having Shriekmaw, Terminate, and Dreadbore in hand.
My second match was against Jund. In game 1, he discarded my Pack Rat and then made me discard another Pack Rat. I had to use a Path to kill a Dark Confidant, which left me with no answer to Raging Ravine (I had Shriekmaw in hand). I chumped with Lingering Souls tokens for several turns, but it didn't help as I didn't draw any Paths or Terminates. I cast a Blood Baron to help stabilize, but he had Liliana in hand and made me sacrifice Blood Baron after I ran out of Lingering Souls tokens. In game 2 I was able to 1-for-1 him for 10-15 turns, but I never drew Pack Rat or Lingering Souls and he then landed his 1-of Outpost Siege and overwhelmed me (he also had Liliana when I cast Blood Baron).
My third match was against WUR Delver. Game 1 wasn't a real game as my opponent mulliganed to 4 against my hand with several removal spells. Game 2 went super long. He was running 4 Supreme Verdicts and used them to kill 3 of my Blood Barons, he Bolted all but one of my Lavaclaw Reaches, and he forced me to block Geist with Lingering Souls and Mardu Charm tokens. I eventually won in extra turns with an unanswered Lavaclaw Reaches and 2 Lightning Bolts.
My fourth match was against Boros Burn. I came close to stabilizing against a creature-heavy draw in game 1, but my Blood Baron came 1 turn too late for me to stabilize. In game 2, I had a turn 0 Leyline of Sanctity and a turn 5 Blood Baron and easily won. In game 3 I stabilized with removal and Timely Reinforcements and then cast double Blood Baron to win.
I think that I am going to switch away from the Kolaghan's Command/Shriekmaw build and instead run maindeck Mardu Charms, a Grave Titan, and some other removal. The Shriekmaws often couldn't hit what I wanted them to and the Kolaghan's Commands were slow and clunky. Also, the Kolaghan's Commands were often just discard+Disentomb, which really wasn't worth it.
Also, what do you guys think of Wretched Banquet? I was just looking for 1 mana removal spells and this seems like it could possibly be good in a deck that is killing everything. If we've killed everything else this is just 1 mana to destroy target creature.
Is anyone still reading this thread? Because if they are, Titan of Erebos seems sweet. We are running a ton of removal, so as long as we have instant-speed removal ready to respond to a creature + a removal spell, we basically have a 4 mana 5/5 that only dies to Path to Exile and Dismember (there is also the other ability which I guess will sometimes come up against delve). Thoughts?
Titan seems sweet, but I wouldn't want to lower my removal count or change threats for it. I was trying a similar deck except with a Liliana of the Veil+Firemane Angel/Vengeful Pharaoh package as my win con.
Also, is Consuming Vapors any good in here? Seems super sweet to me, life gain and a double sac effect.
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This is probably why I was originally thinking of Sorin, Solemn Visitor. Turn 1 Bolt, turn 2 Terminate, turn 3 Lingering Souls, turn 4 Sorin hit for 4 with lifelink, turn 5 Lingering Souls flashback Lingering Souls, hit for 4 with lifelink, turn 6 flashback Lingering Souls, Dreadbore, hit for 12 with lifelink...
However, what you said about me killing things turn 1 and 2 raises an interesting point. This deck really only has 4 turn 1 plays (Path to Exile is really bad on turn 1). I am not sure if that is really good enough or not, but the only thing I can think of cutting for Burst Lightning is Lightning Helix, which is the kind of card I want against the same decks I want to kill things on turn 1 against. Any suggestions?
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
I don't think so; even in a meta where it's usable against 95% of the targets, it still dies to every removal spell used in the format. Not where we want to be for a 5 drop finisher.
As for 1 drop spells, I think we're just kinda out there till Innocent Blood gets reprinted.
Shriekmaw might not be needed for this deck, I'm not really sure, but it's definitely worth being aware of. I've found it to be a really good magic card over the years, and it generally exceeds expectations when I play it.
As I said, it sounds like it could be a cool idea. I just am not sure if it hits enough. I'll add a bit to the primer on it though and try it out in my 2 flex slots.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
He's never going to be a creature, but he's a free shock if they don't have creatures or a free creature kill. He can't be Decayed, is indestructible, and looks awesome.
Yes, the opponent gets to choose, but we have enough creature kill that he should just be a clock. Maybe too slow?
After trying Shriekmaw a little I was going to cut it. Mardu Charm seemed a lot better. But Kolaghan's Command+Shriekmaw seems like a really good idea. The main reason why I wasn't running Command is because I wasn't running enough creatures, but with Pack Rat, Blood Baron, and Shriekmaw, it could work really well. Having Command also balances out Shriekmaw's weakness to Affinity.
I should be able to buy the rest of my deck this week (unless if I decide to buy Magus of the Moon which is somehow sold out in every store in one of the biggest Magic areas in the country). Which deck do you guys think would be best (I don't have the perfect fetch-shock manabase so I'm going to have to use off-color fetches)?
4 Pack Rat
1 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Lightning Helix
2 Mardu Charm
4 Path to Exile
4 Terminate
4 Dreadbore
4 Lingering Souls
2 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Flooded Strand
2 Godless Shrine
3 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Mountain
4 Plains
2 Polluted Delta
2 Sacred Foundry
3 Swamp
4 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Hide // Seek
4 Slaughter Games
4 Timely Reinforcements
or
4 Pack Rat
1 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Burst Lightning
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Mardu Charm
4 Path to Exile
4 Terminate
4 Dreadbore
4 Lingering Souls
2 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Flooded Strand
2 Godless Shrine
3 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Mountain
4 Plains
2 Polluted Delta
2 Sacred Foundry
3 Swamp
4 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Hide // Seek
4 Slaughter Games
4 Timely Reinforcements
or
4 Pack Rat
4 Shriekmaw
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Kolaghan's Command
4 Path to Exile
4 Terminate
4 Dreadbore
4 Lingering Souls
2 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Flooded Strand
2 Godless Shrine
3 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Mountain
4 Plains
2 Polluted Delta
2 Sacred Foundry
3 Swamp
4 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Hide // Seek
4 Slaughter Games
4 Timely Reinforcements
The first one is the one I've been using, the second one is just because we have very few removal spells that we can cast on turn 1, and the last one is because Shriekmaw+Kolaghan's Command seems super sweet.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
If he made them sacrifice a creature and if they couldn't he dealt 2 damage, then he would be great. Unfortunately, he will just do whatever the opponent wants him to do, which makes him an unreliable finisher. He also seems a lot worse than Gideon Jura, who can both kill creatures more effectively and deal more damage.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
I'll run some tests. I think that if I do that I will definitely run 4 Commands and only 3 Shriekmaws though. Also, I think that even without Lightning Helix, 4 Timely Reinforcements, 4 Leyline of Sanctity, and a ton of removal should be enough to win games 2 and 3 almost every time.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
How did it go?
Also, I officially have the deck assembled! I'll be playing it 2-3 days per week until the SCG Premier IQ.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
I think this deck really needs at least two copies of Damnation/Wrath of Gods in the mainboard, and maybe Phyrexian Arena/Chandra, Pyromaster to fix the card advantage problems.
Decklist:
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Blood Crypt
2 Godless Shrine
3 Blackcleave Cliffs
3 Windswept Heath
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Lavaclaw Reaches
2 Temple of Silence
2 Swamp
2 Plains
1 Mountain
1 Slaughter Pact
4 Path to Exile
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Terminate
4 Lightning Helix
4 Dreadbore
Win Cons: 15
3 Pack Rat
2 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
4 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
4 Lingering Souls
3 Crackling Doom
2 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
3 Timely Reinforcements
3 Hide // Seek
2 Anger of the Gods
Match 1: Genesis Command 0-2-0
Game 1: Was on the draw, had a Blackcleave Cliffs, Sacred Foundry, two Helix, a Terminate, path and a Sorin. Didn't draw another land, got Primal Command locked into drawing my Foundry every turn. By the time he stopped doing that nonsense I was too far behind to come back.
Game 2: Sided in Hide // Seek and Anger of the Gods, but he Genesis Waved for 7 T4 and followed with another one for 8 T5. Didn't draw my Anger in time to stabilize.
Match 2: Elves 1-1-1
Game 1: I'm not one to make excuses, but this was my fault; I was drawing all the removal but wasting them early on against his Llanowar/Mystic elves, which left his pump lords untouched. Coupled with the fact that instead of blowing up Ezuri, Renegade Leader on MY turn so he couldn't pump, I let him attack and tried to remove it to dubious results. Mistakes were made, I lost.
Game 2: In came the Anger of the Gods. I learned my lesson from the first game, and the only thing I let him keep were Llanowars/Mystics. Landed a T4 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad against a T3 Spellskite, Angered T5, and stuck a BBoV T6. He shortly scooped.
Game 3: We went into G3 with 5 minutes on the clock (It was a more relaxed game, he took 10 minutes boarding in T2 as he had only seen Sorin and kill spells at that point, then got a phone call before G3). He got me down to 14 life before I stabilized and we drew from going to turns.
Match 3: Grixis Twin 0-2-0
Both games went the same; Had loads of removal, lands for days, but he landed a threat both times and had the counter spells to back it up and win via beats. I made two play mistakes that cost me the game; G1 I kept trying to land a threat only to have it Remanded and would sit there being slapped by Tasigur. G2, instead of waiting for his Deceiver Exarch to be targeted by an enchantment, I just blasted them out right away. I blame myself.
Game 4: Mono-G Heroic? 2-0-0
Not going to go into detail about this one; he was using the three big Heroic Green guys and Fight effects, and was getting blown out by removal. Was kinda getting salty to, trying to say that his 7/7 Setessan Oathsworn still fought my BBoV even though I terminated him. Add to the fact that he never attacked with his three Ulvenwald Trackers despite a (Seemingly) empty board, I easily won. He asked for advice, the store told him to check out Bogle to see if it was up his alley.
I asked the regulars what they thought (Most common being "Holy Removal Batman!"), and I was told I need to take it in one of two directions; Go further into Tokens with Sorin, Solemn Visitor isntead of LoI, Young Pyromancer, another Pack Rat, and basically use Paco and YP as the win cons later on. Alternatively, use Gurmag Angler as my late drop win con and just keep the field clear for him. I was also told to drop most if not all of the Dreadbores for Bobs or IoK.
Admitedly, this is not a great matchup. They are similar to Tron since they have the inevitability with Primal Command and Genesis Wave. I personally would just try to dodge it since it sees very little play.
I think that if you continued playing that last game you would have won. Stabilizing against Elves is the toughest part, the rest is easy.
That's odd. Twin has a lot of countermagic, but a lot of it (like Remand) isn't going to stop removal. And most of their counterspells should be ineffective against our cheaper threats like Pack Rat and Lingering Souls.
I hope he doesn't go with Bogles. The less Bogles players, the better this deck is.
Running Bob seems terrible in a deck with multiple 5-6 drops. Angler can work well in this deck, it is just a little too vulnerable to Terminate and Path for my tastes. I am not a fan of Young Pyromancer, since it doesn't stabilize the game immediately if you topdeck it and it dies to everything. Another Pack Rat would be a good idea. Inquisition is bad in this deck because it is a terrible topdeck that is useless in the lategame. It also is much worse than Thoughtseize would be since Thoughtseize is better against most of our bad matchups (Tron, Ad Nauseum, Scapeshift, Amulet, Storm). I still wouldn't run Seize though. Finally, I like the look of your list, but I'd cut an Elspeth for a Pack Rat, 2 Sorins for Blood Barons, possibly the other 2 Sorins for Elspeth Knight Errants, and cut Kataki from the sideboard (Affinity is a really good matchup).
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Just wondering, have you tried out any sample hands with the deck? I've been able to get to 5 mana by turn 5-7 and have enough removal to last that long (even if I cast a removal spell each turn) very consistently.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
They were saying if I wanted to use Paco/YP, I would want Bob to retain the CA and help make dudes. This would be a more token based build (One guy called it Riot Control because you would stabilize then just make a crap ton of dudes and start a Riot). Alternatively, I was told to play Angler instead of BBoV for the cheaper CMC (So as to cast him and still have mana open to kill something).
I dunno, still some toying around to do. Dreadbore is getting replaced in an instant if I get my hands on Mardu Charms or Innocent Blood/Vindicate get reprinted.
Sorcery Speed is just too slow.
Seems like you just got really unlucky to not draw any hard removal and then draw into the worst cards possible.
You sure that guy was not a cheater? Because Dispel can't counter Dreadbore.
If you were going to do that, I would run Phyrexian Arena instead of Bob. However, I'm still not a fan. Making the deck vulnerable to Bolt for a win-con that dies to everything and gets significantly worse the later you draw it is not where we want to be IMO.
I definitely don't like this idea. Blood Baron has protection from Modern. It is immune to every removal spell in the format except for Roast and Rending Volley. It is unblockable against many decks. Its lifelink immediately stabilizes you. Gurmag Angler dies to a lot of removal spells like Terminate, Path to Exile, and Dismember, and heavy-creature decks can chump-block him forever. Sure, you can't cast something in the same turn as Blood Baron, but you usually don't need to. It almost always can automatically stabilize you the turn you play it.
While I definitely would love Vindicate or Innocent Blood in this deck, I am not a fan of lowering the number of spells that can kill Siege Rhino, Tasigur, and Gurmag Angler in your deck to 8 by running Mardu Charm over Dreadbore. If Twin is big in your meta, I would run a 2-2 split.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
4 Pack Rat
3 Shriekmaw
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Kolaghan's Command
4 Path to Exile
4 Terminate
4 Dreadbore
4 Lingering Souls
1 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Flooded Strand
2 Godless Shrine
3 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Mountain
4 Plains
2 Polluted Delta
2 Sacred Foundry
3 Swamp
4 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Mardu Charm
4 Slaughter Games
4 Timely Reinforcements
I beat a casual Angel deck, drew against an Axebane Guardian combo deck with Isochron Scepter+Silence/Angel's Grace/Fog, and lost to Merfolk and Infect.
Against Merfolk I kept a strong hand of 2 lands, Terminate, Dreadbore, Shriekmaw, Blood Baron, and Pack Rat in game 1. Then I didn't draw any more lands and both of my lands were turned into islands with Spreading Seas. I made the very stupid mistake of siding out Kolaghan's Command for Timely Reinforcements (not sure why I did) and was then punished for it by losing to a 1-of Sword of Light and Shadow.
Against Infect I killed every infect creature without getting poisoned at all in game 1, was knocked down to 1 life by Dryad Arbor+Become Immense+Vines of the Vastwood, and managed to win by killing every one of his threats and slowly grinding away with spirit tokens. In game 2 I mulliganed down to 5, kept a hand with only 1 removal spell, and easily lost. In game 3 I kept a hand with 3 lands, Blood Baron, Bolt, and Terminate, and lost when my opponent had multiple protection spells and I drew 4 lands in a row.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Lingering Souls has worked really well. It is great at buying time and also works as a decent win-con.
I went to another Modern event and went 2-2.
My first match was against a 4-color Midrange/Land destruction deck that was sort of like Kiki-Pod used to be but instead of Kikis it had Flagstones of Trokair and Boom // Bust. In game 1, I was able to kill everything he played, but he kept me at 2-4 lands the whole game so I could never cast Blood Baron or Shriekmaw and both Pack Rat and Lavaclaw Reaches kept dying (I wasn't able to draw Lingering Souls). He eventually played a Geist of Saint Traft and won. In game 2 he had a turn 3 Geist and I wasn't able to stabilize after he also played a Huntmaster of the Fells and I could only cast 1 removal spell due to having 3 Plains and only 2 lands that make red/black out while having Shriekmaw, Terminate, and Dreadbore in hand.
My second match was against Jund. In game 1, he discarded my Pack Rat and then made me discard another Pack Rat. I had to use a Path to kill a Dark Confidant, which left me with no answer to Raging Ravine (I had Shriekmaw in hand). I chumped with Lingering Souls tokens for several turns, but it didn't help as I didn't draw any Paths or Terminates. I cast a Blood Baron to help stabilize, but he had Liliana in hand and made me sacrifice Blood Baron after I ran out of Lingering Souls tokens. In game 2 I was able to 1-for-1 him for 10-15 turns, but I never drew Pack Rat or Lingering Souls and he then landed his 1-of Outpost Siege and overwhelmed me (he also had Liliana when I cast Blood Baron).
My third match was against WUR Delver. Game 1 wasn't a real game as my opponent mulliganed to 4 against my hand with several removal spells. Game 2 went super long. He was running 4 Supreme Verdicts and used them to kill 3 of my Blood Barons, he Bolted all but one of my Lavaclaw Reaches, and he forced me to block Geist with Lingering Souls and Mardu Charm tokens. I eventually won in extra turns with an unanswered Lavaclaw Reaches and 2 Lightning Bolts.
My fourth match was against Boros Burn. I came close to stabilizing against a creature-heavy draw in game 1, but my Blood Baron came 1 turn too late for me to stabilize. In game 2, I had a turn 0 Leyline of Sanctity and a turn 5 Blood Baron and easily won. In game 3 I stabilized with removal and Timely Reinforcements and then cast double Blood Baron to win.
I think that I am going to switch away from the Kolaghan's Command/Shriekmaw build and instead run maindeck Mardu Charms, a Grave Titan, and some other removal. The Shriekmaws often couldn't hit what I wanted them to and the Kolaghan's Commands were slow and clunky. Also, the Kolaghan's Commands were often just discard+Disentomb, which really wasn't worth it.
Also, what do you guys think of Wretched Banquet? I was just looking for 1 mana removal spells and this seems like it could possibly be good in a deck that is killing everything. If we've killed everything else this is just 1 mana to destroy target creature.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Also, is Consuming Vapors any good in here? Seems super sweet to me, life gain and a double sac effect.