Heres what I am running. Been working great. actually having a 50/50 matchup with Jund/k/rock, and Have only lost 1 round against all jace decks (midrange and control, around 30 or so control decks.)
This deck does not lose to any removal decks really. Ive beaten pretty much all blood moon destroy lands decks too. Been over preforming. I think if you are going rallier, this is the best version you can run. I'll work on a thalia build next... though Atarkas command build is also pretty cool in my head.
Voice and ooze 2-1 can be swapped, but not noticeable reason to do it in my testing. Probably can run bloodmoon too over choke. Theres just enough blue right now that its basically one sided blood moon. Id switch a horizon into a forest.
Overall, the deck is super solid. Tier 2, 1.5? Not 1. Please take it out for a spin. Comment if you want any questions on this build answered. I'm about 100 rounds in now.
Great to see you back in the Zoo again! Even more so that you like the list Enabling Renegade Rallier the way this deck does feels so good! I'm actually very exited to play vs jund now. I know Grixis is a breeze, but we might need some tech v.s. tokens. (Pyromancer / Souls) though the trample at our disposal gets us a long way.
@Lantern, why don't you play Ghost Quarter?
Never been a huge fan of it to be honest. Also turn 4ing it always seemed pretty late. I like having my mana more, so horizon canopy seemed better. I actually faced very little tron or pyro
I'd still like to fit at least 1 Domri in the list, maybe on the sideboard.
EDIT:
There's another 5-0 from that Tribal list I posted on the last page with Kird Apes, Loam Lions and Mantis Riders.
I was going to say that right now I think anything aggressive can 5-0. This isnt to take away from his accomplishments. Its really hard to lose to a jace control deck if you have a grip full of 1-2 mana threats against counters and expensive removal. Especially because people right now are playing jace REALLY baddly and using him turn 4 to be a 4 mana bounce spell or brainstorm before it dies. More below.
I'd still like to fit at least 1 Domri in the list, maybe on the sideboard.
EDIT:
There's another 5-0 from that Tribal list I posted on the last page with Kird Apes, Loam Lions and Mantis Riders.
That guy went a grand total of 12-7 he's a friend of mine. He doesn't like the list.
Hey cool. tell him congrats for me. I suspect it has to be really good vs removal or jace decks, but can easily out paced. Thats why I dont like kird ape and loam lion
Nope! But bbelfibg into 5 damage seems dope. I think the issue with domain zoo is that if you want to use stuff like sideboard counters or discard, and snapcaster mage you shouldnt go bbelf. You probably go rhino instead.
But you can probably be more aggressive. Maybe running might of alara sometime.
He tried steppe lynx and Dark confidants main. Deck got real greedy in the end. Was not a fan deck kept changing. It became a near jund/zoo tribal zoo near the end.
Nope! But bbelfibg into 5 damage seems dope. I think the issue with domain zoo is that if you want to use stuff like sideboard counters or discard, and snapcaster mage you shouldnt go bbelf. You probably go rhino instead.
But you can probably be more aggressive. Maybe running might of alara sometime.
Yeah, if I was playing BBE in Tribal, I wouldn't play counters or Snap.
I'll probably try something like this one of these days:
This list has felt pretty robust against the field. The deck is a lot faster with as much haste as it has and ends the game in a hurry.
I still think this deck is avg. to not great against DS and Jund. Attacking around multiple maindeck scavenging ooze and 5x Lilianas can be pretty hard.
Over the past 5 days, I've played roughly 20 or so leagues with various 4 and 5 color zoo lists, just wanted to share my current build and hear your thoughts on it:
Readdressing coralhelm combo zoo now that bloodbraid is unbanned. Rough list, an extra aggressive take on big-ish zoo with mantis riders and a domain twist for tribal flames. Bloodbraid proving to be better than Coco due to ducking the massive deckbuilding restrictions allowing the use of full playsets of bolts and tribal flames for reach.
Hi guys! Been playing Big Zoo for 4 or 5 years now, won most of my FNMs here in Turkey or arrived second. By comparing Lantern's build and Lugger's build, can we say that Lantern's is better against midrange and Lugger's is better against Tron?
I've played a few games with both and I really miss Blood Moon in Lantern's build, while the mana in Lugger's is confusing (I wouldn't run 2 Sacred Foundry if we need double green for Geist, but I really agree with Treetop Village, also good against Cryptic).
Anyway we can make a Naya build with a better MU with both Tron and Midrange?
I'm a big fan of utility 2 drops, Voice is really great in my experience, but I agree with Lugger in that it's not aggro enough.
With Lantern's build I've almost had no problems against midrange or control. Any advice on how to make the MU better against Tron? Maybe I'm not sideboarding correctly.
P.s.: I agree with r497, I WANT TO PLAY DOMRI IN THE MAIN!!! (just because I love the card)
Lantern: will you start making Big Zoo videos again? Miss watching you play.
Played Lantern's list (only did minor changes in the manabase: 2nd Forest instead of 2nd Temple Garden) yesterday and went 3-0-1.
2-0 vs Counters Company.
Kept with Bolt and Seal with some more dudes in hand. He never untapped with a creature he played. BBE cascaded into Helix.
Sided in 2 Gaddock Teegs and Domri and sided out 2 Voices and 1 Qasali.
Kept a hand with 1 removal, but drew some more on the course of the game. He never untapped with a creature he played again. BBE cascaded into Rallier with revolt getting back Seal of Fire to kill the last dude.
2-0 vs UR Control
He had some Bolts to kill early threats, but Goyf was bigger than his removals.
Sided in 2 Teegs, 2 Thalias, 1 Domri and sided out 1 Qasali, 3 Helixes and 1 Seal of Fire
I manage to land a Thalia on turn 4, which he had to get out of his way to kill with Electrolyze and that let my Goyf attack him for some damage. At 5 life he landed a Bridge with 3 cards in hand, but luckly Goyf was still 3/4 (Instant, land, creature on GY), so Goyf got him down to 2 and I played Voice. He scooped with 2 lands and 1 Counter in his hand that couldn't prevent my creatures from attacking.
2-0 vs RG Ponza
Kept an aggressive hand with Goyf and kept pressuring him with creatures. We traded a lot in combat and then my Ooze and my big Goyf got him out of the game after I cut him from Utopia Sprawl with Qasali.
Sided in 1 Domri and 2 Thalias and sided out 3 Helixes
He started with Relic and I went playing creatures that ignore relic. He gets behind on mana and I take over with BBE into Nacatl.
Last round ID with Skred Red.
I think that matchup should be hard for all the removal the deck has (Skred can take Goyfs and Knights while Bolt gets the rest). He also has Stormbreath and Relics.
I liked the list a lot. I think I'll try to fit 1 Treetop on the 2nd Canopy slot.
Hey guys I've been out of Magic and modern especially. I've followed things as changes happened but haven't been playing. I have an event this weekend, and I'm interested in playing Zoo (but I also have access to Burn and Eldrazi Tron).
What version of Zoo should I look into playing? I saw a list with BABE and Strangle Root which seems pretty quick. BBE into Rallier also seems really good too.
Someone mentioned a list above that was also fast and it sounded like 1 drop zoo with mantis rider which I also kinda liked the sound of haha.
I did exactly the same, sold all my MTGO collection for physical cards. To be honest, it would be great to see you play even on Xmage or Cockatrice. Big fan. I totally agree with the Blood Moon mod. Any advice on sideboarding against Tron? Thanks
Played Lantern's list (only did minor changes in the manabase: 2nd Forest instead of 2nd Temple Garden) yesterday and went 3-0-1.
2-0 vs Counters Company.
Kept with Bolt and Seal with some more dudes in hand. He never untapped with a creature he played. BBE cascaded into Helix.
Sided in 2 Gaddock Teegs and Domri and sided out 2 Voices and 1 Qasali.
Kept a hand with 1 removal, but drew some more on the course of the game. He never untapped with a creature he played again. BBE cascaded into Rallier with revolt getting back Seal of Fire to kill the last dude.
2-0 vs UR Control
He had some Bolts to kill early threats, but Goyf was bigger than his removals.
Sided in 2 Teegs, 2 Thalias, 1 Domri and sided out 1 Qasali, 3 Helixes and 1 Seal of Fire
I manage to land a Thalia on turn 4, which he had to get out of his way to kill with Electrolyze and that let my Goyf attack him for some damage. At 5 life he landed a Bridge with 3 cards in hand, but luckly Goyf was still 3/4 (Instant, land, creature on GY), so Goyf got him down to 2 and I played Voice. He scooped with 2 lands and 1 Counter in his hand that couldn't prevent my creatures from attacking.
2-0 vs RG Ponza
Kept an aggressive hand with Goyf and kept pressuring him with creatures. We traded a lot in combat and then my Ooze and my big Goyf got him out of the game after I cut him from Utopia Sprawl with Qasali.
Sided in 1 Domri and 2 Thalias and sided out 3 Helixes
He started with Relic and I went playing creatures that ignore relic. He gets behind on mana and I take over with BBE into Nacatl.
Last round ID with Skred Red.
I think that matchup should be hard for all the removal the deck has (Skred can take Goyfs and Knights while Bolt gets the rest). He also has Stormbreath and Relics.
I liked the list a lot. I think I'll try to fit 1 Treetop on the 2nd Canopy slot.
Congrats mate! What was your cut to add Domri? How was your sideboard?
I did exactly the same, sold all my MTGO collection for physical cards. To be honest, it would be great to see you play even on Xmage or Cockatrice. Big fan. I totally agree with the Blood Moon mod. Any advice on sideboarding against Tron? Thanks
Against Tron I'd take out some burn spells (2 Seal of Fires and 3 Helixes) to side in 2 Blood Moon, 2 Stony Silence and 1 Aven Mindcensor.
Played Lantern's list (only did minor changes in the manabase: 2nd Forest instead of 2nd Temple Garden) yesterday and went 3-0-1.
2-0 vs Counters Company.
Kept with Bolt and Seal with some more dudes in hand. He never untapped with a creature he played. BBE cascaded into Helix.
Sided in 2 Gaddock Teegs and Domri and sided out 2 Voices and 1 Qasali.
Kept a hand with 1 removal, but drew some more on the course of the game. He never untapped with a creature he played again. BBE cascaded into Rallier with revolt getting back Seal of Fire to kill the last dude.
2-0 vs UR Control
He had some Bolts to kill early threats, but Goyf was bigger than his removals.
Sided in 2 Teegs, 2 Thalias, 1 Domri and sided out 1 Qasali, 3 Helixes and 1 Seal of Fire
I manage to land a Thalia on turn 4, which he had to get out of his way to kill with Electrolyze and that let my Goyf attack him for some damage. At 5 life he landed a Bridge with 3 cards in hand, but luckly Goyf was still 3/4 (Instant, land, creature on GY), so Goyf got him down to 2 and I played Voice. He scooped with 2 lands and 1 Counter in his hand that couldn't prevent my creatures from attacking.
2-0 vs RG Ponza
Kept an aggressive hand with Goyf and kept pressuring him with creatures. We traded a lot in combat and then my Ooze and my big Goyf got him out of the game after I cut him from Utopia Sprawl with Qasali.
Sided in 1 Domri and 2 Thalias and sided out 3 Helixes
He started with Relic and I went playing creatures that ignore relic. He gets behind on mana and I take over with BBE into Nacatl.
Last round ID with Skred Red.
I think that matchup should be hard for all the removal the deck has (Skred can take Goyfs and Knights while Bolt gets the rest). He also has Stormbreath and Relics.
I liked the list a lot. I think I'll try to fit 1 Treetop on the 2nd Canopy slot.
Congrats mate! What was your cut to add Domri? How was your sideboard?
Sold out, but kept zoo pieces, glad to see it is getting some steam up gain. might build something close to Lanterns list. Gotta have domri in main some how
Board still needs some work, but so far I've been crushing the BG/x and UW/x decks. The board cards listed are going to be my shell, and seem very strong in the meta currently. It's so much fun getting people with Smiter when they play Lilly. Got two jund opponents today with it. I have found Domri to be really MEH sometimes, so I'm not sure what to do with that. Hopefully Dominaria gives us a better.
What do you guys think of smuggler's copter in the rallier builds?
I've been testing it on modo for a couple days and it's seemed competitive. Evasion wins games, looting is great (bin a voice, rally it back), and it survives wraths. It's also extremely hard for fair decks to kill if you have a voice, because it's only targetable during your turn.
There are also games where you can't crew it effectively. And games where it's inability to join an alpha strike came up.
Is it worth continued testing? Does anyone else have experience with copter?
So aside from the list I put out, which I still think is still pretty good, I said Id put out a thalia version... but I keep thinking about doing it and then running away... because what deck do you do with thalia? Small with aggro beats and leverage thalias ability to mess up the opponent to speed your aggro?
I can see that, its a low cmc, that messes with combo and removal... but then Im depriving myself from that 20 20 20 mix and missing burn...
Or I can do value creature town and basically run the same build as the renegade, but with less burn. I already have thalias in that board, so its not really a big change.
Never been a huge fan of it to be honest. Also turn 4ing it always seemed pretty late. I like having my mana more, so horizon canopy seemed better. I actually faced very little tron or pyro
I was going to say that right now I think anything aggressive can 5-0. This isnt to take away from his accomplishments. Its really hard to lose to a jace control deck if you have a grip full of 1-2 mana threats against counters and expensive removal. Especially because people right now are playing jace REALLY baddly and using him turn 4 to be a 4 mana bounce spell or brainstorm before it dies. More below.
Hey cool. tell him congrats for me. I suspect it has to be really good vs removal or jace decks, but can easily out paced. Thats why I dont like kird ape and loam lion
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
But you can probably be more aggressive. Maybe running might of alara sometime.
Yeah, if I was playing BBE in Tribal, I wouldn't play counters or Snap.
I'll probably try something like this one of these days:
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Steppe Lynx
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Mantis Rider
4 Bloodbraid Elf
4 Tribal Flames
3 Lightning Helix
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Qasali Pridemage
4 Strangleroot Geist
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Bloodbraid Elf
2 Ghor-Clan Rampager
Land (22)
3 Forest
1 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Treetop Village
2 Arid Mesa
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Temple Garden
1 Sacred Foundry
3 Stomping Ground
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Lightning Helix
3 Path to Exile
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Gaddock Teeg
3 Kitchen Finks
3 Blood Moon
1 Choke
1 Stony Silence
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Dromoka's Command
1 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
This list has felt pretty robust against the field. The deck is a lot faster with as much haste as it has and ends the game in a hurry.
I still think this deck is avg. to not great against DS and Jund. Attacking around multiple maindeck scavenging ooze and 5x Lilianas can be pretty hard.
Liliana of the Veil and Liliana, the Last Hope are problematic for zoo in general.
1 Birds of Paradise
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Geist of Saint Traft
4 Mantis Rider
4 Bloodbraid Elf
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Path to Exile
2 Lightning Helix
4 Tribal Flames
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Windswept Heath
4 Arid Mesa
1 Flooded Strand
1 Breeding Pool
1 Blood Crypt
1 Stomping Ground
1 Godless Shrine
1 Temple Garden
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Steam Vents
1 Mountain
1 Plains
3 Stony Silence
3 Timely Reinforcements
2 Natural State
1 Back to Nature
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Lightning Helix
Readdressing coralhelm combo zoo now that bloodbraid is unbanned. Rough list, an extra aggressive take on big-ish zoo with mantis riders and a domain twist for tribal flames. Bloodbraid proving to be better than Coco due to ducking the massive deckbuilding restrictions allowing the use of full playsets of bolts and tribal flames for reach.
~Modern~
BGURWhiteless Death's ShadowRUGB
GWRUSaheeli BlinkURWG
RGBUGood Ole' DredgeUBGR
~Commander~
URWNarset, Enlightened Time-TravelerWRU
UBRWBreya, Etherium ArchitectWRBU
A Prolific Loser To Blood Moon
I've played a few games with both and I really miss Blood Moon in Lantern's build, while the mana in Lugger's is confusing (I wouldn't run 2 Sacred Foundry if we need double green for Geist, but I really agree with Treetop Village, also good against Cryptic).
Anyway we can make a Naya build with a better MU with both Tron and Midrange?
I'm a big fan of utility 2 drops, Voice is really great in my experience, but I agree with Lugger in that it's not aggro enough.
With Lantern's build I've almost had no problems against midrange or control. Any advice on how to make the MU better against Tron? Maybe I'm not sideboarding correctly.
P.s.: I agree with r497, I WANT TO PLAY DOMRI IN THE MAIN!!! (just because I love the card)
Lantern: will you start making Big Zoo videos again? Miss watching you play.
I think if you like you can swap choke for blood moon, but Id add a forest cut a horizon canopy for it
2-0 vs Counters Company.
Kept with Bolt and Seal with some more dudes in hand. He never untapped with a creature he played. BBE cascaded into Helix.
Sided in 2 Gaddock Teegs and Domri and sided out 2 Voices and 1 Qasali.
Kept a hand with 1 removal, but drew some more on the course of the game. He never untapped with a creature he played again. BBE cascaded into Rallier with revolt getting back Seal of Fire to kill the last dude.
2-0 vs UR Control
He had some Bolts to kill early threats, but Goyf was bigger than his removals.
Sided in 2 Teegs, 2 Thalias, 1 Domri and sided out 1 Qasali, 3 Helixes and 1 Seal of Fire
I manage to land a Thalia on turn 4, which he had to get out of his way to kill with Electrolyze and that let my Goyf attack him for some damage. At 5 life he landed a Bridge with 3 cards in hand, but luckly Goyf was still 3/4 (Instant, land, creature on GY), so Goyf got him down to 2 and I played Voice. He scooped with 2 lands and 1 Counter in his hand that couldn't prevent my creatures from attacking.
2-0 vs RG Ponza
Kept an aggressive hand with Goyf and kept pressuring him with creatures. We traded a lot in combat and then my Ooze and my big Goyf got him out of the game after I cut him from Utopia Sprawl with Qasali.
Sided in 1 Domri and 2 Thalias and sided out 3 Helixes
He started with Relic and I went playing creatures that ignore relic. He gets behind on mana and I take over with BBE into Nacatl.
Last round ID with Skred Red.
I think that matchup should be hard for all the removal the deck has (Skred can take Goyfs and Knights while Bolt gets the rest). He also has Stormbreath and Relics.
I liked the list a lot. I think I'll try to fit 1 Treetop on the 2nd Canopy slot.
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
What version of Zoo should I look into playing? I saw a list with BABE and Strangle Root which seems pretty quick. BBE into Rallier also seems really good too.
Someone mentioned a list above that was also fast and it sounded like 1 drop zoo with mantis rider which I also kinda liked the sound of haha.
Congrats mate! What was your cut to add Domri? How was your sideboard?
Against Tron I'd take out some burn spells (2 Seal of Fires and 3 Helixes) to side in 2 Blood Moon, 2 Stony Silence and 1 Aven Mindcensor.
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
My side was:
1 Aven Mindcensor
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Stony Silence
2 Blood Moon
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Domri Rade
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Gaddock Teeg
1 Selfless Spirit
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Bloodbraid Elf
3 Scavenging Ooze
3 Voice of Resurgence
3 Loxodon Smiter
3 Path to Exile
2 Domri Rade
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Archangel Avacyn
3 Dromoka's Command
3 Gaddock Teeg
2 Fiery Justice
1 Lightning Helix
Board still needs some work, but so far I've been crushing the BG/x and UW/x decks. The board cards listed are going to be my shell, and seem very strong in the meta currently. It's so much fun getting people with Smiter when they play Lilly. Got two jund opponents today with it. I have found Domri to be really MEH sometimes, so I'm not sure what to do with that. Hopefully Dominaria gives us a better.
Need a collection tracker? Use EchoMTG here: https://www.echomtg.com/r/7bb6961d/
Join the Zoo Discord: https://discord.gg/Yu6eTSTrzA
I've been testing it on modo for a couple days and it's seemed competitive. Evasion wins games, looting is great (bin a voice, rally it back), and it survives wraths. It's also extremely hard for fair decks to kill if you have a voice, because it's only targetable during your turn.
There are also games where you can't crew it effectively. And games where it's inability to join an alpha strike came up.
Is it worth continued testing? Does anyone else have experience with copter?
I can see that, its a low cmc, that messes with combo and removal... but then Im depriving myself from that 20 20 20 mix and missing burn...
Or I can do value creature town and basically run the same build as the renegade, but with less burn. I already have thalias in that board, so its not really a big change.
I dunno!