First of all thank you for the time and effort of you reply.
On some points I agree with you, on others I'll have to kindly differ from your opinion.
Also for the record I've been playing this deck for a long time now, several years actually. On an off obviously but I always come back to it in the end, it's just too much fun to play and perfectly fits my playstyle.
You seem very engaged in the deck? How often do you play it? Do you attend FNMs or other 'tournaments' with it?
After some more thought I agree with you on the Blood Moon idea. While certainly good in some MUs it sucks to warp our manabase (and fetch basics) for a card that we won't even draw half of the time.
I'm back on the Spreading Seas plan, but replaced one with a Stone Rain, since Gx Tron seems to be coming back a little and Rain really shines in the MU.
I also agree with you on Roast. The card was solid some time ago and I liked the idea of having a 5th sorcery to grow my Goyf more reliably. It's just not good in the current metagame with all those Shadows, huge Goyfs, TKS and Smashers. I took some inspiration from Fabianos RUG Moon list and am currently trying out 1x Engineered Explosives main. Expensive but very versatile card that also grows Goyf and even enables Delirium. Haven't gotten enough matches in to speak a verdict on it yet.
All the suggestions you are making increase the overall cmc of the deck (out: Opt, Snare and Pierce, in: Thirst, Leak) and I don't like it. This deck is not a control deck that is very good at coming back from a bad boardstate. We don't have real sweepers. We don't even have real removal spells. Thirst for Knowledge is too clunky for my taste and I'm very fond of my 5 cantrips. Their good to have in deck with only 20 lands.
Mana Leak isn't comparable at all to Ruse in my opinion. Leak is best between turn 2 and maybe 5, while Ruse gets online on turn 3-4 and pretty much gets better the longer the game goes. I agree that Ruse is kinda hit or miss, but it's a pet card of mine that definitely shines in some MUs.
I've been playing without a Basic Mountain in my manabase for more than a year now and like it. The scenario where it would be critical to fetch for painless untapped red mana really doesn't come up very often and it minimizes the chances to not be able to play Cryptic on turn 4.
Regarding SB choices, the simply aren't many Dredge or Company decks in my meta, so Cage is not necessary. Big mana decks are known as rather bad MUs for us. You can get by playing only 2 pieces of land destruction, but I really don't see how a 3rd piece can hurt, especially since Spreading Seas are also very relevant in Midrange MUs (shutting down manlands and annoying their manabase while cantripping is pretty good).
You can't really treat Staticaster as a wrath. It can act as one against tokens but it's also huge against decks like DnT or Infect since it's a repeatable effect.
You can make a point for running the second Anger over Kozilek's Return, but as I said I don't have many Company/Dredge decks in my meta while there's quite a bit of Affinity (which has turned out to be a worse MU than I thought after I started tracking down my matches in August).
Nice to have you on board with Eternal Command!
For local meta I'd say it's pretty diverse, just had a look at my spreadsheet where I track my matches since the end of August and I faced 43 different decks since then (either on FNMs or playstesting with buddies).
3 matches against Abzan Company decks and only 2 against Dredge.
I'm fine with my burn MU right (7-5 since I started tracking). I see that you don't play Spirebluff Canals which help a lot in getting early pain free red mana. I'm actually not sure if you should run 2 Sulfur Falls together with 2x Flooded Grove. A starting hand with any combination of the 4 as your only lands seems pretty awkward. I played 2x Flooded Groves for a long time, cut one when I went down to 20 lands and I'm not looking back. It's nice if you draw it later in the game, but very awkward as your 1st or 2nd, sometimes even as your 3rd land drop.
Scavenging Ooze also comes in pretty big in the Burn MU by the way. Regurarly nets me 3+ life. Have you given Spell Snare a try? It's a lot better than you seem to acknowledge.
I agree that I could probably cut the Ruse, but it's grown dear to my heart, does heavy work in some MUs and I always love some spice in my decks. I don't agree with cutting a Remand. 3 copies are perfect for this deck unless you know your meta is really hostile to it. The card draw is super valuable and is usually better against Gx Tron or Valakut decks and at least cantrips in attrition MUs (if it's not value countering flashbacked stuff against Snapcaster and Souls decks). Against aggro decks it's obviously not as good, but that's what the 1 cmc counters are for.
Staticaster is surprisingly solid against dredge actually. Kills their Bloodghasts every turn while you blocks their amalgams with goyf to stall a little until you find a cryptic for an big strike. Obviously not as good Anger in this particular MU, but so much more versatile. Also Angers double red cost can be an issue and you can search up Staticaster with Traverse.
Played some matches with Engineered Explosives main now. I'm not really convinced yet. Any other suggestions? Should be either a creature or some form of kill spell. Tarfire, Burst Lightning, Forked Bolt, Narnam Renegade possibly? Really not sure.
Snare is good in pretty much every MU that is not GDS or Eldrazi Tron...and maybe Vial decks but that's not where Pierce shines either. It really shines against Affinity, Jund, Abzan Company, Snapcaster.dec and I'd argue it's better than Pierce against Storm and RG Valakut.
I agree that the card wasn't very good this summer (since GDS and Eldrazi where everywhere). But the meta has adjusted back.
Helping to get Delirium/grow Goyfs would be a sweet upside, but not a necessity.
Hey guys, spoiler season is upon us and so far I've spotted 2 interesting cards for us: Warsail Marauder
1U
Creature - Human Pirate
Flying
When ~ target creature an opponent controls has base power and toughness 0/1 and loses all abilities until end of turn.
2/1
I really wish this would happen upon etb instead of whenever it attacks, but a flying 2/1 body should get some attack in and it offers a much needed way to interact with opposing Shadows, Tasigurs and even otherwise annoying stuff like Smashers or Wurmcoils.
Not sure if needing to attack is to clunky, but it's something to consider.
Dire Fleet Daredevil
1R
Creature - Human Pirate
First Strike
2/1
When ~ etbs, exile target instant or sorcery from an opponent’s graveyard. You may cast that card this turn and you may spend mana as though as it were mana of any color. If that card would be put into a graveyard this turn, exile it instead.
Spicy red Snapcaster variant. Will definitely try one or in the side. Killing opposing Shadows with their own Pushes seems sweet. Bonus points for vialing it in in response to a Snapcaster target.
Card could be solid against Burn too, getting a Lightning Helix is very sweet, but a Bolt isn't bad either and the body (First Strike!) is relevant.
Other MUs where
Holy crap Daredevil is ridiculous for this. Absolutely ridiculous. Hit your opponents thought seize? Path? Removal? And it exiles from their graveyard? This is NUTS!
The first strike is absolutely relevant too, since it will have to eat a removal. Boys I think we found ourselves a new main deck addition.
I'm not sure if it's really maindeckable. What does it do against Tron, RG Valakut, Affinity, Merfolk, Elves, Humans, Company decks, Lantern, DnT, Living End...
All that said I'm also maindecking 2x Scavenging Ooze which are not really good in some MUs. I guess I'll give it a try anyway because we don't get new promising cards very often, but I tend to think it's better as a SB card.
ouh that's something I didn't even think about yet. Block, deal first strike damage then bolt a Tasigur? not too shabby. And yeah the first strike is definitely relevant. Think I'm getting two copies for now, one main for a scooze and one in the side and then see how testing goes.
I've recently taken an interest in Modern--Eternal Command/RUG Flash in particular. I ran a bunch of lists but have refined it to this list so far.
I've taken it to 4:2 finish at a PPTQ and regularly take it to a top 4 finish at my LGSs.
I then wanted to test Traverse the Ulvenwald as a way to tutor out Kiki or an answer to an otherwise difficult board. 3 was too many, 1 was too little and 2 seems just about right. It allows you to cut the mana base to 20 instead of 21-22 and have an active draw later on with either Traverse the Ulvenwald, Snapcaster Mage + Traverse the Ulvenwald, Eternal Witness + Traverse the Ulvenwald, etc. Which in turn allows you to get out whatever ETB/combo/aggro cards you need. I run 3 Serum Visions as I feel you need to run at least 1 Thirst for Knowledge to drop dead Aether Vials or help put more types in the yard. I feel that you need at least 3 Serum Visions to fuel the yard with sorceries for Tarmogoyf and Traverse--4 would be great but I just can't seem to fit it anywhere else without feeling like another area loses its effectiveness.
Just to make things clear, although this deck has Kiki Combo, it functions mainly as midrange with a lot of value options in many different directions. Out of the 10 or so games that I play, I'll manage to get Eternal Command Combo off about twice, whereas Kiki Combo sees play about once. Most games are Goyf/Huntmaster/Krasis/Bolt+Snap+Bolt type games.
As for the SB, I think I'll end up taking out the Fulminator Mage's for Stone Rain and also replace Roast with Dismember--the value of instant speed removal is pretty key. Finally, Nature's Claim is the only enchantment removal which kind of scares me but it doubles as a buffer against burn decks--have won a few games by targeting my own Aether Vials.
Let me know what you think? I've had an absolute blast refining this list and have had a lot of success. It feels super versatile and I have faith that it will only get better as it's refined further.
How easy is it to get Delirium? I guess you don't really need it super quickly, but do you ever run into issues when you could win but don't have delirium? I've been wanting to do a deck very similar to this but the list is slightly different (no Huntmaster of the Fells maindeck, and 2xKiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker and 4xBounding Krasis), but I'm definitely interested in this Traverse the Ulvenwald business.
Hey guys, spoiler season is upon us and so far I've spotted 2 interesting cards for us: Warsail Marauder
1U
Creature - Human Pirate
Flying
When ~ target creature an opponent controls has base power and toughness 0/1 and loses all abilities until end of turn.
2/1
I really wish this would happen upon etb instead of whenever it attacks, but a flying 2/1 body should get some attack in and it offers a much needed way to interact with opposing Shadows, Tasigurs and even otherwise annoying stuff like Smashers or Wurmcoils.
Not sure if needing to attack is to clunky, but it's something to consider.
Dire Fleet Daredevil
1R
Creature - Human Pirate
First Strike
2/1
When ~ etbs, exile target instant or sorcery from an opponent’s graveyard. You may cast that card this turn and you may spend mana as though as it were mana of any color. If that card would be put into a graveyard this turn, exile it instead.
Spicy red Snapcaster variant. Will definitely try one or in the side. Killing opposing Shadows with their own Pushes seems sweet. Bonus points for vialing it in in response to a Snapcaster target.
Card could be solid against Burn too, getting a Lightning Helix is very sweet, but a Bolt isn't bad either and the body (First Strike!) is relevant.
Other MUs where
Daredevil seems wicked!
I'm brand new to this thread but love watching RUG Command decks online and my friend from back home played it a lot. I have most of the cards on Magic Online so I think I'm going to try to give the deck a go. It seems right up my alley, and it's nice having a primer to look to for help
Dire Fleet Daredevil seems sweet as well. Could be a 1-2 of in the mainboard. Has a lot of potential and a lot of ways it could fail miserably--as rayo mentioned before. Deserves testing. I guess if it only improves our better match-ups it might not be the right way to go.
The sweet thing about Daredevil is that it's potentially good in usually even to slightly unfavored MUs (Grixis Shadow, Jund/Junk and Burn are my big hopes). It won't do much against Tron/Eldrazi Tron/Bant Eldrazi, which I consider to be our rather bad MUs, but it potentially offers us something we didn't have before/couldn't do efficiently before so my hopes are actually quite high to get another playable.
Regarding the question of Traverse and Kiki Combo, here are my thoughts after playing it in a couple of local tournaments:
Traverse is fine at finding basic in the early game. You have Delirium usually around turn 5-6, which is quite late tbh. However, from there it is a nice tutor for silver bullets and potential combo cards.
Overall, I like the versatility it provides, especially with MD Huntmasters.
However, I would advise against the Kiki combo. It is to cumbersome and hard for the mana base (realistically you want to have GG, UUU AND RRR on turn 5, which is only really doable with double filterlands (since you are running a lot of basics)) and it lost me several times the game because of the awkward mana base to say it this way.
However, Bounding Crasis is a fantastic card. It might be even playable without Kiki due to the fact, that Instant speed beaters is something this deck loves to do and also has. Having Vial (and thus having any creature with flash to say it this way) is quite unreliable.
Though, I would need to test Bounding Crasis a little bit more without Kiki to give a proper final statement about this card.
Now, back to Traverse. The problem I have with that card is not Delirium, it offers utility even without it. The problem is rather deck space. You want to run around 2-3 "silver" bullets to say it this way. Those can be something like higher end cards like MD Huntmasters (which are bonkers tbh and should get played either way), or even something like Thundermaw Hellkite (flying + haste + mass removal against Lingering Souls is something this deck also loves to have, won me a ton of games too) OR lower end utility cards like Sc. Oozes, Cliques, Lavamancer or Kitchen Finks. However, it is quite hard to find a good balance silver bullets and raw power while also being aware of the deck space.
In my opinion, if somebody finds the perfect balance between raw power, silver bullets, lands and other cards, Traverse Command might be the best version of the deck. Also, it has a nice synergy with Search for Atlantis (or w/e it is called), since it enables Delirium again AND you can find indirectly creatures of it (via Traverse).
Tl;Dr: Traverse is bonkers (but hard to build proper around), Kiki is meh, Bounding Crasis is good.
Greetings,
Kathal
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What I play or have:
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
Since there's been some discussion on Traverse the Ulvenwald over the last few posts, here are my two cents:
I've been playing with a singleton of the card for over a year now and have been pretty happy with that configuration. It lets the deck go down to 20 lands while adding another copy of each creature usually from around turn 5 onwards while simply acting as the 21st land before that.
So the upside of the card is cleary its flexibility, drawing lands late in the game sucks, not drawing them early sucks even more and it can act as several different creatures.
In reality I most often searched for E-Wit/Snap to start a value chain with it (a very good option in grindy MUs like UW control or Jund) or Huntmaster to stabilize (brutal creature MUs like DnT or Humans). Scavenging Ooze (which is arguably the most silver bullet card in the maindeck) I surprisingly didn't search for as often you'd probably think. Problem here is that searching him up on turn 5+ is simply way too slow against the decks Scooze is best against (Dredge, Living End) while being quite easy to kill in for Snapcaster decks and thereby a gamble to search for.
This shows me something very important, if you're thinking about building a deck more focused on Traverse, make sure that your silverbullets are impactful if they hit the board on turn 4+ (because even if you run stuff like Mishra's Baubles you won't be able to reliably have Delirium before turn 4 without deluting the deck too much). Running Ethersworn Cannonist in a Bant version won't help much against Storm as the deck can just go off before you get to search for it. Cards to stabilize like Huntmaster or Izzet-Staticaster are great. E-Wit/Snap for lategame grinding value are great. Not sure how Daredevil will do regarding this, but searching for an 3 mana value Shadow killspell seems like a nice option to have.
The downsides of Traverse are that it is another graveyard dependent card, which isn't too bad if you just think about as land 21. But it's pretty bad at simply being a land, only taps for one colour, comes in tapped and if you're keeping a hand with no green manasources you can't really treat it as a safe 2nd or 3rd landdrop.
Thanks!
I actually haven't played much lately due to personal life stuff, but I hope I can attend FNM this week and would try out this list (given I get my hands on Dire Fleet Daredevil until then):
Obviously looking forward to test out Daredevil, but I'm also curious on how Huntmaster will be in the maindeck (haven't had him there in a long time).
Regarding sideboarding I don't have a good write up at hand, but that's actually something that would be interesting to write down and share here, as I'm also not always a 100% sure if what I'm doing is correct. So I'll try to find the time to write one!
After some back and forth I have not. The main factor was that when we side it in, we need to fetch to be ready for Blood Moon all the time, although we don't always even draw the card. While you could probably make it work, the payoff is too high. Add to that, that Eldrazi Tron's (the MU where Blood Moon would probably excel the most) meta numbers have actually gone down, I'm fine with my Spreading Seas, although I consider playing an additional Stone Rain in the board, will depend on how much Gx Tron I see expect.
Has anyone toyed around with Dryad Arbor? Ramping through Aether Vial on turn 1 seems sweet, but maybe it's more cute than good.. I don't really play Eternal Command at the moment, was just a random thought that struck me..
I tested the card a long while ago. Vialing it out on turn 1 is obviously awesome, but way too inconsistent and the card is pretty bad on it's own.
There's a reason no other green Aether Vial decks are playing it.
Obviously a small sample size but I just came back from GP London playing side events. My opponents were as follows (I entered 9 events). I didn't play command but in the interests of seeing if it would have been OK, here's the "metagame" in the actual order I played them with wins and losses.
- Ad nauseam (w)
- Devoted druid coco (L)
- jund (w)
- Jeskai (L)
- Lantern (L)
- Storm (w) [switch decks]
- Lantern (L)
- Burn (L)
- (???) (L) [hate this 0-3 run switch Decks]
- Jund moon (w)
- Burn (w)
- Burn (w)
- Burn (w) [really getting into the swing of things here dispatching three burn decks in short order]
- 8-whack (w)
- Burn (w)
- Abzan (w)
- Jund (w) [at this point my winnings are enough to get me a revised Tundra and a booster box of something recent]
- Tron (w)
- Jeskai (w)
- Melira coco (w)
- Tron (w)
- Affinity (w)
- Affinity (w)
- RG ponza (L)
- Merfolk (w) [another booster box plus a load of historic boosters]
So let's see.... If I'd been playing command I think I'd have struggled against that metagame.
As it was, my super deep winning streak was at the helm of RG tron. Turns out it's great against burn. Who knew.
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Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
Obviously a small sample size but I just came back from GP London playing side events. My opponents were as follows (I entered 9 events). I didn't play command but in the interests of seeing if it would have been OK, here's the "metagame" in the actual order I played them with wins and losses.
- Ad nauseam (w)
- Devoted druid coco (L)
- jund (w)
- Jeskai (L)
- Lantern (L)
- Storm (w) [switch decks]
- Lantern (L)
- Burn (L)
- (???) (L) [hate this 0-3 run switch Decks]
- Jund moon (w)
- Burn (w)
- Burn (w)
- Burn (w) [really getting into the swing of things here dispatching three burn decks in short order]
- 8-whack (w)
- Burn (w)
- Abzan (w)
- Jund (w) [at this point my winnings are enough to get me a revised Tundra and a booster box of something recent]
- Tron (w)
- Jeskai (w)
- Melira coco (w)
- Tron (w)
- Affinity (w)
- Affinity (w)
- RG ponza (L)
- Merfolk (w) [another booster box plus a load of historic boosters]
So let's see.... If I'd been playing command I think I'd have struggled against that metagame.
As it was, my super deep winning streak was at the helm of RG tron. Turns out it's great against burn. Who knew.
Looking at my spreadsheet of right know 174 games played I'm positive against AN, Storm, Jeskai, Lantern and Burn (but close MU). The only ones really bad are Tron, Affinity depends on how good you are prepared and Jund/Junk I'm actually even but the sample size is low, same for Druid Combo.
Not many Tron/Eldrazi variants is always good in my book, against the rest of the field we have lots of more or less even MUs.
Doesn't seem like a bad metagame to me.
Report:
Jeskai Control: 2-1
I start with Vial on the draw which lets him resolve a Search for Azquanta. We start trading resources, he plays very carefully but I manage to bait him into my counterspells and get rid of Search and counter his Sphinx’s revelation. Leaving me with Huntmaster and him no cards in hand. He topdecks Verdict and beats me down with a Colonnade I just can’t find an answer to.
SB:
In: 2x Spreading Seas, 2x Huntmaster, 1x Natural State, Dispel, Scooze
Out: 4x Goyf, Spell Pierce, 2x Lightning Bolt
Game 2 starts a lot slower with us only making landrops and cantripping the first 5 or 6 turns until we fight a counterwar over a Geist that I win, which lets me safely play my Vial and Seas his Colonnade. He can resolve Search for Azquanta but I draw Traverse the Ulvenwald and start some value chains with E/Wit, Snap and Familiar’s Ruse. We grind each other for a while, I come up ahead but his flipped Azquanta almost gets him back in the game but I can take it down on the back of Lumbering Falls, which he doesn’t have an answer to.
Game 3: My turn one Vial gets destroyed and with an active Loothouse he has the upper hand for the next 4+ turns but I manage to fight back and gain value edges here and there and get back into the driver’s seat until he finds a second Colonnade (seased the first one) and starts beating me down with it. I have to do the risky Electrolyze + snapback Bolt play, but he doesn’t have any counters either and I can get there before he finds another Colonnade
Heck of a match. Not sure if sideboarding out Goyfs is correct anymore when most Jeskai lists don’t seem to run RiP in the SB currently. Also having access to a card like Thrun in the SB would make this MU a lot easier. Not sure if it’s worth the SB slot only for the Jeskai/UW control MU if those are already quite good anyway. Another Spreading Seas/Stone Rain is probably just better, dealing with those pesky Colonnades is very good and they are also good against other decks.
Burn: 2-1
Game 1: I misplay twice by not opening with Spirebluff (after he opens with Rift Bolt) with Bolt in hand but Misty Rainforest, which I then also don’t crack to kill his turn 2 Eidolon. By wanting to save life I lose on tempo and can’t play turn 2 Goyf, try to kill his Eidolon but he saves it with Boros Charm. Don’t come back from that.
SB:
In: 2x Huntmaster, Dispel, Daredevil, Scooze
Out: 3x Remand, Vapor Snag, Electrolyze (should have been a Clique probably)
Game 2: He nullifies my Goyf block plan with Relic but is stuck on 1 land for 2 turns. Enough time for me to stall a little, get him to pop his Relic and get some creatures in the yard again to feed a big ass Scooze which I ride to victory.
Game 3: Keep a hand with lots of cheap interaction but only one land. Find the second land with Opt and proceed to counter/bolt all his stuff with recurring Snaps, Bolt, Dispel, Ruse and Command and finish him off with a Huntmaster.
Gb Tron: 2-1
Keep a very serviceable hand against Tron with Goyf, Remand, Clique and Command. His turn 1 Relic makes applying pressure a lot harder. But I fight and delay the inevitable while beating down with Clique. I bring him down to six when he lands an Ugin and I’m left with no board. Topdeck a bolt and and find another one with SV a turn later to kill him just before he would have killed me.
SB:
In: 2x Spreading Seas, Ceremonious Rejection, Ancient Grudge, Natural State
Out: Daredevil, Huntmaster, Scooze, 1x E-Wit, Electrolyze
Not sure on the Electrolyze and I think I should make room for another land destruction spell in my SB.
Game 2: I start with Vial, he takes my Remand away turn 2 and casts a turn 4 Karn I don’t have an answer to. Ulamog a turn later lets me skoop it up.
Game 3: If they don’t have Relic pressuring them with Goyf while delaying with Seas, Clique, Cryptic etc. works out pretty well. I can keep him on the backfoot the whole game and win by beatdown.
Mardu Midrange: 2-0
Opponent was new to the deck and that definitely showed with some questionable lines.
Game 1: I outvalue him with Snap/Ruse and Direfleet Daredevil. Including a line where I cast his own Inquisition on him with Daredevil, discard a K-Command, return Daredevil to my hand to counter a spell with Ruse, vial Daredevil in again to cast the K-Command I had him discard to get back Snapcaster and have him discard his last card. Felt sweeeeeet.
SB:
In: Daredevil, Dispel, Staticaster, Kozilek’s Return, E-Explosives, Scooze, 2x Huntmaster
Out: 4x Goyf, 2x Clique, 1x Remand, Vapor Snag
He plays a bunch of Lootings and lands a Blood Moon, but I have a Vial out and fetched a basic turn 1 so I don’t really care that much tick up my Vial to 4 with two Huntmaster and Dispel as protection in hand and ride them to victory.
Would be glad to hear some thoughts on my sideboarding decisions (still trying to find the time to write down a guide we could discuss here).
Overall I'm very happy with the deck, Dire Fleet Daredevil was sweet against Mardu, didn't draw him against the other decks. So far I like the 1x main, but I need more testing to be sure.
I don't think I'd run daredevil main. It's too much of a dead card in some matchups where you need to be interacting.
It's pretty spicy as a sideboard option though. Seems nice against black decks and burn of course. Kinda cool in blue control matchups as well.
So I want to let you guys know I'm going to try something weird, a new variant of e-command.
Rug scapeshift with 2x witness. The idea is that the deck can get to 7 mana trivially, which is the amount required for executing the cryptic loop. I'm not going all-in on the soft lock but it's a fun way to fix certain matchups and provide another angle of attack once you've stabilised and drawn the game out to turn four or five. It also gives the deck a unique way to ensure hitting a scapeshift, rather than luck-sacking a topdeck the turn before you die to a lethal attack.
Moreover, the deck can afford to run the full playset of cryptics. That's nothing to sniff at.
I won't be running vial. I'm using the same lock but achieving it the "hard way" by ramping, with the joint wincon of cryptic-loop beats or the traditional scapeshift one-card combo.
So what's the downside? Well, in order to include this engine I have to find space for 2x eternal witness and also be prepared for the occasional slow hand which includes a witness instead of a piece of interaction. Apart from that there's no other opportunity cost. Rug is already a deck (although as we all know it's been replaced by straight RG titanshift over the last 12 months).
I'll feed back. I'm considering it an eternal command deck although in fairness it's also a scapeshift deck. I'll test it out on thuraday this week.
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Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
That sounds a lot more like a RUG Scapeshift splashing into the EC lock than an actual EC list to.
That said I tried something similar years ago (when RUG was still the go to version) and it didn't really worked out. There's only so much space for interactive cards in the list between ramp spells, a high number of lands and Scapeshift itself.
What MUs is it actually improving? If you plan to ramp to 7 to effectively use E-Wit, why not just add in some surprise fatties your opponent doesn't expext, to stabilize and win?
E-Wit turns on all of your opponents removal that would otherwise be dead to get access to a loop that's super vulnerable to removal.
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On some points I agree with you, on others I'll have to kindly differ from your opinion.
Also for the record I've been playing this deck for a long time now, several years actually. On an off obviously but I always come back to it in the end, it's just too much fun to play and perfectly fits my playstyle.
You seem very engaged in the deck? How often do you play it? Do you attend FNMs or other 'tournaments' with it?
After some more thought I agree with you on the Blood Moon idea. While certainly good in some MUs it sucks to warp our manabase (and fetch basics) for a card that we won't even draw half of the time.
I'm back on the Spreading Seas plan, but replaced one with a Stone Rain, since Gx Tron seems to be coming back a little and Rain really shines in the MU.
I also agree with you on Roast. The card was solid some time ago and I liked the idea of having a 5th sorcery to grow my Goyf more reliably. It's just not good in the current metagame with all those Shadows, huge Goyfs, TKS and Smashers. I took some inspiration from Fabianos RUG Moon list and am currently trying out 1x Engineered Explosives main. Expensive but very versatile card that also grows Goyf and even enables Delirium. Haven't gotten enough matches in to speak a verdict on it yet.
All the suggestions you are making increase the overall cmc of the deck (out: Opt, Snare and Pierce, in: Thirst, Leak) and I don't like it. This deck is not a control deck that is very good at coming back from a bad boardstate. We don't have real sweepers. We don't even have real removal spells. Thirst for Knowledge is too clunky for my taste and I'm very fond of my 5 cantrips. Their good to have in deck with only 20 lands.
Mana Leak isn't comparable at all to Ruse in my opinion. Leak is best between turn 2 and maybe 5, while Ruse gets online on turn 3-4 and pretty much gets better the longer the game goes. I agree that Ruse is kinda hit or miss, but it's a pet card of mine that definitely shines in some MUs.
I've been playing without a Basic Mountain in my manabase for more than a year now and like it. The scenario where it would be critical to fetch for painless untapped red mana really doesn't come up very often and it minimizes the chances to not be able to play Cryptic on turn 4.
Regarding SB choices, the simply aren't many Dredge or Company decks in my meta, so Cage is not necessary. Big mana decks are known as rather bad MUs for us. You can get by playing only 2 pieces of land destruction, but I really don't see how a 3rd piece can hurt, especially since Spreading Seas are also very relevant in Midrange MUs (shutting down manlands and annoying their manabase while cantripping is pretty good).
You can't really treat Staticaster as a wrath. It can act as one against tokens but it's also huge against decks like DnT or Infect since it's a repeatable effect.
You can make a point for running the second Anger over Kozilek's Return, but as I said I don't have many Company/Dredge decks in my meta while there's quite a bit of Affinity (which has turned out to be a worse MU than I thought after I started tracking down my matches in August).
For local meta I'd say it's pretty diverse, just had a look at my spreadsheet where I track my matches since the end of August and I faced 43 different decks since then (either on FNMs or playstesting with buddies).
3 matches against Abzan Company decks and only 2 against Dredge.
I'm fine with my burn MU right (7-5 since I started tracking). I see that you don't play Spirebluff Canals which help a lot in getting early pain free red mana. I'm actually not sure if you should run 2 Sulfur Falls together with 2x Flooded Grove. A starting hand with any combination of the 4 as your only lands seems pretty awkward. I played 2x Flooded Groves for a long time, cut one when I went down to 20 lands and I'm not looking back. It's nice if you draw it later in the game, but very awkward as your 1st or 2nd, sometimes even as your 3rd land drop.
Scavenging Ooze also comes in pretty big in the Burn MU by the way. Regurarly nets me 3+ life. Have you given Spell Snare a try? It's a lot better than you seem to acknowledge.
I agree that I could probably cut the Ruse, but it's grown dear to my heart, does heavy work in some MUs and I always love some spice in my decks. I don't agree with cutting a Remand. 3 copies are perfect for this deck unless you know your meta is really hostile to it. The card draw is super valuable and is usually better against Gx Tron or Valakut decks and at least cantrips in attrition MUs (if it's not value countering flashbacked stuff against Snapcaster and Souls decks). Against aggro decks it's obviously not as good, but that's what the 1 cmc counters are for.
Staticaster is surprisingly solid against dredge actually. Kills their Bloodghasts every turn while you blocks their amalgams with goyf to stall a little until you find a cryptic for an big strike. Obviously not as good Anger in this particular MU, but so much more versatile. Also Angers double red cost can be an issue and you can search up Staticaster with Traverse.
Played some matches with Engineered Explosives main now. I'm not really convinced yet. Any other suggestions? Should be either a creature or some form of kill spell. Tarfire, Burst Lightning, Forked Bolt, Narnam Renegade possibly? Really not sure.
I agree that the card wasn't very good this summer (since GDS and Eldrazi where everywhere). But the meta has adjusted back.
Helping to get Delirium/grow Goyfs would be a sweet upside, but not a necessity.
Warsail Marauder
1U
Creature - Human Pirate
Flying
When ~ target creature an opponent controls has base power and toughness 0/1 and loses all abilities until end of turn.
2/1
I really wish this would happen upon etb instead of whenever it attacks, but a flying 2/1 body should get some attack in and it offers a much needed way to interact with opposing Shadows, Tasigurs and even otherwise annoying stuff like Smashers or Wurmcoils.
Not sure if needing to attack is to clunky, but it's something to consider.
Dire Fleet Daredevil
1R
Creature - Human Pirate
First Strike
2/1
When ~ etbs, exile target instant or sorcery from an opponent’s graveyard. You may cast that card this turn and you may spend mana as though as it were mana of any color. If that card would be put into a graveyard this turn, exile it instead.
Spicy red Snapcaster variant. Will definitely try one or in the side. Killing opposing Shadows with their own Pushes seems sweet. Bonus points for vialing it in in response to a Snapcaster target.
Card could be solid against Burn too, getting a Lightning Helix is very sweet, but a Bolt isn't bad either and the body (First Strike!) is relevant.
Other MUs where
The first strike is absolutely relevant too, since it will have to eat a removal. Boys I think we found ourselves a new main deck addition.
All that said I'm also maindecking 2x Scavenging Ooze which are not really good in some MUs. I guess I'll give it a try anyway because we don't get new promising cards very often, but I tend to think it's better as a SB card.
How easy is it to get Delirium? I guess you don't really need it super quickly, but do you ever run into issues when you could win but don't have delirium? I've been wanting to do a deck very similar to this but the list is slightly different (no Huntmaster of the Fells maindeck, and 2xKiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker and 4xBounding Krasis), but I'm definitely interested in this Traverse the Ulvenwald business.
Daredevil seems wicked!
I'm brand new to this thread but love watching RUG Command decks online and my friend from back home played it a lot. I have most of the cards on Magic Online so I think I'm going to try to give the deck a go. It seems right up my alley, and it's nice having a primer to look to for help
The sweet thing about Daredevil is that it's potentially good in usually even to slightly unfavored MUs (Grixis Shadow, Jund/Junk and Burn are my big hopes). It won't do much against Tron/Eldrazi Tron/Bant Eldrazi, which I consider to be our rather bad MUs, but it potentially offers us something we didn't have before/couldn't do efficiently before so my hopes are actually quite high to get another playable.
Traverse is fine at finding basic in the early game. You have Delirium usually around turn 5-6, which is quite late tbh. However, from there it is a nice tutor for silver bullets and potential combo cards.
Overall, I like the versatility it provides, especially with MD Huntmasters.
However, I would advise against the Kiki combo. It is to cumbersome and hard for the mana base (realistically you want to have GG, UUU AND RRR on turn 5, which is only really doable with double filterlands (since you are running a lot of basics)) and it lost me several times the game because of the awkward mana base to say it this way.
However, Bounding Crasis is a fantastic card. It might be even playable without Kiki due to the fact, that Instant speed beaters is something this deck loves to do and also has. Having Vial (and thus having any creature with flash to say it this way) is quite unreliable.
Though, I would need to test Bounding Crasis a little bit more without Kiki to give a proper final statement about this card.
Now, back to Traverse. The problem I have with that card is not Delirium, it offers utility even without it. The problem is rather deck space. You want to run around 2-3 "silver" bullets to say it this way. Those can be something like higher end cards like MD Huntmasters (which are bonkers tbh and should get played either way), or even something like Thundermaw Hellkite (flying + haste + mass removal against Lingering Souls is something this deck also loves to have, won me a ton of games too) OR lower end utility cards like Sc. Oozes, Cliques, Lavamancer or Kitchen Finks. However, it is quite hard to find a good balance silver bullets and raw power while also being aware of the deck space.
In my opinion, if somebody finds the perfect balance between raw power, silver bullets, lands and other cards, Traverse Command might be the best version of the deck. Also, it has a nice synergy with Search for Atlantis (or w/e it is called), since it enables Delirium again AND you can find indirectly creatures of it (via Traverse).
Tl;Dr: Traverse is bonkers (but hard to build proper around), Kiki is meh, Bounding Crasis is good.
Greetings,
Kathal
Modern/Legacy
either funpolice (Delver, Deathcloud, UW Control) or the fun decks (especially those ft. Griselbrand)
I've been playing with a singleton of the card for over a year now and have been pretty happy with that configuration. It lets the deck go down to 20 lands while adding another copy of each creature usually from around turn 5 onwards while simply acting as the 21st land before that.
So the upside of the card is cleary its flexibility, drawing lands late in the game sucks, not drawing them early sucks even more and it can act as several different creatures.
In reality I most often searched for E-Wit/Snap to start a value chain with it (a very good option in grindy MUs like UW control or Jund) or Huntmaster to stabilize (brutal creature MUs like DnT or Humans). Scavenging Ooze (which is arguably the most silver bullet card in the maindeck) I surprisingly didn't search for as often you'd probably think. Problem here is that searching him up on turn 5+ is simply way too slow against the decks Scooze is best against (Dredge, Living End) while being quite easy to kill in for Snapcaster decks and thereby a gamble to search for.
This shows me something very important, if you're thinking about building a deck more focused on Traverse, make sure that your silverbullets are impactful if they hit the board on turn 4+ (because even if you run stuff like Mishra's Baubles you won't be able to reliably have Delirium before turn 4 without deluting the deck too much). Running Ethersworn Cannonist in a Bant version won't help much against Storm as the deck can just go off before you get to search for it. Cards to stabilize like Huntmaster or Izzet-Staticaster are great. E-Wit/Snap for lategame grinding value are great. Not sure how Daredevil will do regarding this, but searching for an 3 mana value Shadow killspell seems like a nice option to have.
The downsides of Traverse are that it is another graveyard dependent card, which isn't too bad if you just think about as land 21. But it's pretty bad at simply being a land, only taps for one colour, comes in tapped and if you're keeping a hand with no green manasources you can't really treat it as a safe 2nd or 3rd landdrop.
I actually haven't played much lately due to personal life stuff, but I hope I can attend FNM this week and would try out this list (given I get my hands on Dire Fleet Daredevil until then):
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Eternal Witness
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Dire Fleet Daredevil
2x Vendillion Clique
1x Huntmaster of the Fells
4x Aether Vial
3x Remand
3x Cryptic Command
3x Serum Visions
2x Opt
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Familiar's Ruse
1x Traverse the Ulvenwald
1x Electrolyze
1x Vapor Snag
1x Spell Pierce
1x Spell Snare
1x Forest
1x Steam Vents
1x Stomping Ground
2x Breeding Pool
4x Scalding Tarn
4x Misty Rainforest
2x Spirebluff Canal
1x Flooded Grove
1x Lumbering Falls
2x Spreading Seas
1x Anger of the Gods
1x Kozilek's Return
1x Ancient Grudge
1x Abrade
1x Ceremonious Rejection
1x Engineered Explosives
2x Huntmaster of the Fells
1x Dispel
1x Dire Fleet Daredevil
1x Natural State
1x Izzet Staticaster
1x Scavenging Ooze
Obviously looking forward to test out Daredevil, but I'm also curious on how Huntmaster will be in the maindeck (haven't had him there in a long time).
Regarding sideboarding I don't have a good write up at hand, but that's actually something that would be interesting to write down and share here, as I'm also not always a 100% sure if what I'm doing is correct. So I'll try to find the time to write one!
I tested the card a long while ago. Vialing it out on turn 1 is obviously awesome, but way too inconsistent and the card is pretty bad on it's own.
There's a reason no other green Aether Vial decks are playing it.
- Ad nauseam (w)
- Devoted druid coco (L)
- jund (w)
- Jeskai (L)
- Lantern (L)
- Storm (w) [switch decks]
- Lantern (L)
- Burn (L)
- (???) (L) [hate this 0-3 run switch Decks]
- Jund moon (w)
- Burn (w)
- Burn (w)
- Burn (w) [really getting into the swing of things here dispatching three burn decks in short order]
- 8-whack (w)
- Burn (w)
- Abzan (w)
- Jund (w) [at this point my winnings are enough to get me a revised Tundra and a booster box of something recent]
- Tron (w)
- Jeskai (w)
- Melira coco (w)
- Tron (w)
- Affinity (w)
- Affinity (w)
- RG ponza (L)
- Merfolk (w) [another booster box plus a load of historic boosters]
So let's see.... If I'd been playing command I think I'd have struggled against that metagame.
As it was, my super deep winning streak was at the helm of RG tron. Turns out it's great against burn. Who knew.
Looking at my spreadsheet of right know 174 games played I'm positive against AN, Storm, Jeskai, Lantern and Burn (but close MU). The only ones really bad are Tron, Affinity depends on how good you are prepared and Jund/Junk I'm actually even but the sample size is low, same for Druid Combo.
Not many Tron/Eldrazi variants is always good in my book, against the rest of the field we have lots of more or less even MUs.
Doesn't seem like a bad metagame to me.
Here's the list I played:
4x Snapcaster Mage
2x Eternal Witness
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Dire Fleet Daredevil
2x Vendillion Clique
1x Huntmaster of the Fells
4x Aether Vial
3x Remand
3x Cryptic Command
3x Serum Visions
2x Opt
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Familiar's Ruse
1x Traverse the Ulvenwald
1x Electrolyze
1x Vapor Snag
1x Spell Pierce
1x Spell Snare
1x Forest
1x Steam Vents
1x Stomping Ground
2x Breeding Pool
4x Scalding Tarn
4x Misty Rainforest
2x Spirebluff Canal
1x Flooded Grove
1x Lumbering Falls
2x Spreading Seas
1x Anger of the Gods
1x Kozilek's Return
1x Ancient Grudge
1x Abrade
1x Ceremonious Rejection
1x Engineered Explosives
2x Huntmaster of the Fells
1x Dispel
1x Dire Fleet Daredevil
1x Natural State
1x Izzet Staticaster
1x Scavenging Ooze
Report:
Jeskai Control: 2-1
I start with Vial on the draw which lets him resolve a Search for Azquanta. We start trading resources, he plays very carefully but I manage to bait him into my counterspells and get rid of Search and counter his Sphinx’s revelation. Leaving me with Huntmaster and him no cards in hand. He topdecks Verdict and beats me down with a Colonnade I just can’t find an answer to.
SB:
In: 2x Spreading Seas, 2x Huntmaster, 1x Natural State, Dispel, Scooze
Out: 4x Goyf, Spell Pierce, 2x Lightning Bolt
Game 2 starts a lot slower with us only making landrops and cantripping the first 5 or 6 turns until we fight a counterwar over a Geist that I win, which lets me safely play my Vial and Seas his Colonnade. He can resolve Search for Azquanta but I draw Traverse the Ulvenwald and start some value chains with E/Wit, Snap and Familiar’s Ruse. We grind each other for a while, I come up ahead but his flipped Azquanta almost gets him back in the game but I can take it down on the back of Lumbering Falls, which he doesn’t have an answer to.
Game 3: My turn one Vial gets destroyed and with an active Loothouse he has the upper hand for the next 4+ turns but I manage to fight back and gain value edges here and there and get back into the driver’s seat until he finds a second Colonnade (seased the first one) and starts beating me down with it. I have to do the risky Electrolyze + snapback Bolt play, but he doesn’t have any counters either and I can get there before he finds another Colonnade
Heck of a match. Not sure if sideboarding out Goyfs is correct anymore when most Jeskai lists don’t seem to run RiP in the SB currently. Also having access to a card like Thrun in the SB would make this MU a lot easier. Not sure if it’s worth the SB slot only for the Jeskai/UW control MU if those are already quite good anyway. Another Spreading Seas/Stone Rain is probably just better, dealing with those pesky Colonnades is very good and they are also good against other decks.
Burn: 2-1
Game 1: I misplay twice by not opening with Spirebluff (after he opens with Rift Bolt) with Bolt in hand but Misty Rainforest, which I then also don’t crack to kill his turn 2 Eidolon. By wanting to save life I lose on tempo and can’t play turn 2 Goyf, try to kill his Eidolon but he saves it with Boros Charm. Don’t come back from that.
SB:
In: 2x Huntmaster, Dispel, Daredevil, Scooze
Out: 3x Remand, Vapor Snag, Electrolyze (should have been a Clique probably)
Game 2: He nullifies my Goyf block plan with Relic but is stuck on 1 land for 2 turns. Enough time for me to stall a little, get him to pop his Relic and get some creatures in the yard again to feed a big ass Scooze which I ride to victory.
Game 3: Keep a hand with lots of cheap interaction but only one land. Find the second land with Opt and proceed to counter/bolt all his stuff with recurring Snaps, Bolt, Dispel, Ruse and Command and finish him off with a Huntmaster.
Gb Tron: 2-1
Keep a very serviceable hand against Tron with Goyf, Remand, Clique and Command. His turn 1 Relic makes applying pressure a lot harder. But I fight and delay the inevitable while beating down with Clique. I bring him down to six when he lands an Ugin and I’m left with no board. Topdeck a bolt and and find another one with SV a turn later to kill him just before he would have killed me.
SB:
In: 2x Spreading Seas, Ceremonious Rejection, Ancient Grudge, Natural State
Out: Daredevil, Huntmaster, Scooze, 1x E-Wit, Electrolyze
Not sure on the Electrolyze and I think I should make room for another land destruction spell in my SB.
Game 2: I start with Vial, he takes my Remand away turn 2 and casts a turn 4 Karn I don’t have an answer to. Ulamog a turn later lets me skoop it up.
Game 3: If they don’t have Relic pressuring them with Goyf while delaying with Seas, Clique, Cryptic etc. works out pretty well. I can keep him on the backfoot the whole game and win by beatdown.
Mardu Midrange: 2-0
Opponent was new to the deck and that definitely showed with some questionable lines.
Game 1: I outvalue him with Snap/Ruse and Direfleet Daredevil. Including a line where I cast his own Inquisition on him with Daredevil, discard a K-Command, return Daredevil to my hand to counter a spell with Ruse, vial Daredevil in again to cast the K-Command I had him discard to get back Snapcaster and have him discard his last card. Felt sweeeeeet.
SB:
In: Daredevil, Dispel, Staticaster, Kozilek’s Return, E-Explosives, Scooze, 2x Huntmaster
Out: 4x Goyf, 2x Clique, 1x Remand, Vapor Snag
He plays a bunch of Lootings and lands a Blood Moon, but I have a Vial out and fetched a basic turn 1 so I don’t really care that much tick up my Vial to 4 with two Huntmaster and Dispel as protection in hand and ride them to victory.
Would be glad to hear some thoughts on my sideboarding decisions (still trying to find the time to write down a guide we could discuss here).
Overall I'm very happy with the deck, Dire Fleet Daredevil was sweet against Mardu, didn't draw him against the other decks. So far I like the 1x main, but I need more testing to be sure.
It's pretty spicy as a sideboard option though. Seems nice against black decks and burn of course. Kinda cool in blue control matchups as well.
So I want to let you guys know I'm going to try something weird, a new variant of e-command.
Rug scapeshift with 2x witness. The idea is that the deck can get to 7 mana trivially, which is the amount required for executing the cryptic loop. I'm not going all-in on the soft lock but it's a fun way to fix certain matchups and provide another angle of attack once you've stabilised and drawn the game out to turn four or five. It also gives the deck a unique way to ensure hitting a scapeshift, rather than luck-sacking a topdeck the turn before you die to a lethal attack.
Moreover, the deck can afford to run the full playset of cryptics. That's nothing to sniff at.
I won't be running vial. I'm using the same lock but achieving it the "hard way" by ramping, with the joint wincon of cryptic-loop beats or the traditional scapeshift one-card combo.
So what's the downside? Well, in order to include this engine I have to find space for 2x eternal witness and also be prepared for the occasional slow hand which includes a witness instead of a piece of interaction. Apart from that there's no other opportunity cost. Rug is already a deck (although as we all know it's been replaced by straight RG titanshift over the last 12 months).
I'll feed back. I'm considering it an eternal command deck although in fairness it's also a scapeshift deck. I'll test it out on thuraday this week.
That said I tried something similar years ago (when RUG was still the go to version) and it didn't really worked out. There's only so much space for interactive cards in the list between ramp spells, a high number of lands and Scapeshift itself.
What MUs is it actually improving? If you plan to ramp to 7 to effectively use E-Wit, why not just add in some surprise fatties your opponent doesn't expext, to stabilize and win?
E-Wit turns on all of your opponents removal that would otherwise be dead to get access to a loop that's super vulnerable to removal.