I'm gonna try swapping out my 4 Dryad Militant for the new guy. Might even go crazy and try out Tarmogoyf if the first swap pans out well. I am really liking the new snake tho. Him being unable to target after level 3 is annoying tho, so we shall see if that is a big enough setback to bar him from the deck.
without targeted discard ir kill spells goyf doesnt far very well (hes been tried alot and is normally a 1/2 or 2/3) he also has only 1 devotion and no native abilities or counter synergy. millantant on the other hand is a one mana layline for spell slinger decks, which can straight up win games against dredge, phoenix, hollow one and storm. it also dose a lot of work against deathshadow w/u control, fairies and b/w smallpox.
so personally i would keep the dryad, the place i would cut would be rhonas (less good in the current meta) and maybe a avatar or a pump spell.
this would give us
14 one drop
7-8 2 drops
4 three drops
which is the ideal curve the decks wanted for a long time. (and only not had due to the awful state of one drops available to us)
i agree that the lvl 6 progenitus is going to be very rare, but the lvl 3 almost hexproof seems a lot more doable and consistent. if the snake dose well i might have to push back up the number of rancors in the deck as its the only pump that can reach it once its lvl 3. (i would also point out that if the snake becomes a 3-4 of in the deck it may make pelt collector a stronger choice than eone due to the die trigger as i fell that once this thing starts to get big your opponent is going to make it priority 1 as they will not be able to aford to deal with a 6/6 progenatus )
New snake seems radical. I'm going to test a build where it actually supplants Experiment One. I've wanted another mana sink creature that scales with the game, and having one in the 1CMC slot is awesome.
I'm not loving Scale Up/Upscale so much. It could be cool as a one-of. Can't even target opponent's creatures to shrink a Death's Shadow back into Dismember range.
You do not take out Dryad Militant for this new snake. Dryad Militant is actually the best 1 drop in the deck. It shuts down so many decks. It will probably be some number of E1/Narnam/Scavenging Ooze. I am not actually sure I will play the new snake. You can't pump it with instants after lvl 3 and it has be to lvl 8 to get protection from everything.
It's another 2/1 when we need to o fast and don't have time to level it but can finish it off with a pump. Think vs Tron or combo like ad nausea.
And in the matches vs alot of removal that go longer and we tend to side out out some of the pumps anyways to avoid 2 for 1s this is a reasonable top deck. Think vs uw control where you can easily find yourself with 4+ lands.
Perhaps not a 4 of. But I'm for sure getting 2 foils for my stompy deck
I think you guys are forgetting one vital point about level up creatures. Level up is sorcery speed. Now given the lvl 3 ability is decent enough, but you have to sink 4 mana total into it to get there and your wanting to do that as fast as possible. The big reason figure of destiny worked and a lot of the other level-up creatures did not was the fact that figure was able to boost itself at the end of your opponents turn when you had the mana. This meant that any other creatures/cards you had in hand were able to be played normally. With level up the ability you have to work around when do I cast this or can I level and cast this to make relevant plays.
Realistically we will only play a pair of these if any and the snake is likely to be the first thing cut or sided out. A full four playset is just wasted space. Its good late game but its a very durdly card early on.
The card also doesn't trade well since you cannot pump it if it has to fight something like a Gurmag or Goyf and is not lvl 8. Rancor sure but honestly, this is far from ideal. You guys really should be playing Narnam,the card is that good, with the new fetch, there should be few reasons not to.
It's another 2/1 when we need to o fast and don't have time to level it but can finish it off with a pump. Think vs Tron or combo like ad nausea.
And in the matches vs alot of removal that go longer and we tend to side out out some of the pumps anyways to avoid 2 for 1s this is a reasonable top deck. Think vs uw control where you can easily find yourself with 4+ lands.
Perhaps not a 4 of. But I'm for sure getting 2 foils for my stompy deck
yeah, I think two is the right number to test this new card. And also 3-4 rancors, so we could still pump him after he has pro instants.
I'll prolly go up to 14 one drops with 2 of them, and opt for 4 rancors. I think I can side board the maindeck Dismember For more slots with how my local FNM is
New snake seems radical. I'm going to test a build where it actually supplants Experiment One. I've wanted another mana sink creature that scales with the game, and having one in the 1CMC slot is awesome.
I'm not loving Scale Up/Upscale so much. It could be cool as a one-of. Can't even target opponent's creatures to shrink a Death's Shadow back into Dismember range.
I intend to remove almost almost all 3 drops and focus on 14 one drops including a certain number of these new snake. He's easier to enlarge than kessig prowler, and the pro instants helps against.. bolt, path, push, decay, trophy, cast down.. so many removal in modern are instants!
i agree that the lvl 6 progenitus is going to be very rare, but the lvl 3 almost hexproof seems a lot more doable and consistent. if the snake dose well i might have to push back up the number of rancors in the deck as its the only pump that can reach it once its lvl 3. (i would also point out that if the snake becomes a 3-4 of in the deck it may make pelt collector a stronger choice than eone due to the die trigger as i fell that once this thing starts to get big your opponent is going to make it priority 1 as they will not be able to aford to deal with a 6/6 progenatus )
yeah, we should not rely too much on his mini progenitus mode. although I'm curious how many games we can turn him into the 6/6.
I'll prolly go up to 14 one drops with 2 of them, and opt for 4 rancors. I think I can side board the maindeck Dismember For more slots with how my local FNM is
interested to see testing results. Please share a report when you use him in FNM. thanks.
This is a pretty rough cut and I'm not sure how many fetch lands I should increase the mana base by to optimize Narnam Renegade. Could also likely get away with a singleton copy of Mutavault, due to the lack of GG in casting costs.
This is a pretty rough cut and I'm not sure how many fetch lands I should increase the mana base by to optimize Narnam Renegade. Could also likely get away with a singleton copy of Mutavault, due to the lack of GG in casting costs.
12 fetchlands is optimal, although 8 can work well enough
mutavault is bad without tribal synagis.
i very highly recommend you read the super primer on the first post of this thread (it has a lot of information from a lot of sources and individuals and will help you avoid the basic pitfalls)
as a general run never run 4 dismembers, you cast 2 in a game and that 8 life down the drain. you cast three and crack a fetchlands or 2 and your opponent only has to deal 5-6 damage to close the game. (2 bolts or one solid attack from a gurmag or a flipped thing in the ice)
i think not running e ones is a mistake, they are easily one of the more resistant creatures for the deck
strangleroot geist is arguably the best card in the deck, its good in every matchup, and has a lot of synagis going for it.
4 treetop villages tend to be a mistake as they are bad in multiples and can very easily slow the deck down by a turn. they are good turn 4+ when you have 3 lands and are topdecking 1 drops or lands, and if you get boardwipe. but very very rarly if your on the aggressive start.
sb
you need life gain especially with fetch lands and dissmsbers, otherwise you may as well concede against burn.
you need something to help counter (reduce the impact of) board wipes as these are the biggest blowout you can face and in modern they happen your turn 2-3.
Repudiate // Replicate is just bad, if you what to stop an ability run pithing needle, and if you what an extra creature soc speed run a token generator or another good creature.
This is a pretty rough cut and I'm not sure how many fetch lands I should increase the mana base by to optimize Narnam Renegade. Could also likely get away with a singleton copy of Mutavault, due to the lack of GG in casting costs.
12 fetchlands is optimal, although 8 can work well enough
mutavault is bad without tribal synagis.
i very highly recommend you read the super primer on the first post of this thread (it has a lot of information from a lot of sources and individuals and will help you avoid the basic pitfalls)
as a general run never run 4 dismembers, you cast 2 in a game and that 8 life down the drain. you cast three and crack a fetchlands or 2 and your opponent only has to deal 5-6 damage to close the game. (2 bolts or one solid attack from a gurmag or a flipped thing in the ice)
i think not running e ones is a mistake, they are easily one of the more resistant creatures for the deck
strangleroot geist is arguably the best card in the deck, its good in every matchup, and has a lot of synagis going for it.
4 treetop villages tend to be a mistake as they are bad in multiples and can very easily slow the deck down by a turn. they are good turn 4+ when you have 3 lands and are topdecking 1 drops or lands, and if you get boardwipe. but very very rarly if your on the aggressive start.
sb
you need life gain especially with fetch lands and dissmsbers, otherwise you may as well concede against burn.
you need something to help counter (reduce the impact of) board wipes as these are the biggest blowout you can face and in modern they happen your turn 2-3.
Repudiate // Replicate is just bad, if you what to stop an ability run pithing needle, and if you what an extra creature soc speed run a token generator or another good creature.
Well, yes. All those things are true for a stock build. I've been playing that deck off and on for a couple years. This is an entirely different jam that still fits within the "Green Stompy" strategy, ergo my posting it here. I should've referenced the primer for fetch count, though. You're right.
While Repudiate // Replicate isn't super good, I've been getting really good results with it SB in a stock build on line for a while now. Positive records against Tron and Amulet Titan.
The card also doesn't trade well since you cannot pump it if it has to fight something like a Gurmag or Goyf and is not lvl 8. Rancor sure but honestly, this is far from ideal. You guys really should be playing Narnam,the card is that good, with the new fetch, there should be few reasons not to.
Agree Narnam is the best choice for this deck but it somewhat goes against the budget theme since you need a bunch of fetchlands to make NR work.
far tron has always been a bad matchup for the deck (especially the eldrazi version) ive mostly written the matcup off outside of a white splash for path charm, and teeg.
this is what i think will become the new optimal build after release (unless we get some more awesome cards to add, which is very possible)
(with the curved lowered by 14 one drops, and blossoming def over vines it may well be worth doing the land count to 20 as unless we draw steel leaf 2 mana is more that sufficient for the first 3 turns)
after many games the decks optimum opening turns still seems to be
turn one: eone
turn two: fetch millinat + narnam
although now
turn one: 1 two powered one drop
turn two: savage swipe, then rancor
seems as good and may be worth expanding on in the future.
Is Savage Swipe good enough to include? I would think that Titanic Brawl would be a better choice. Can you also explain your reason for having Blossoming Defense over Vines of Vastwood (is it just lower mana cost? You're lowering your damage output this way), and your cutting one Avatar of the Resolute for one Scavenging Ooze (at least in comparison to the list in the primer)?
Also, with your new optimum opening, you'd have a strong turn 2, but after that you'd just have one 4/1. While I'm still in favour of exploring this, I have a strong feeling that the 'original' optimum opening is a lot stronger than your new one.
This is a pretty rough cut and I'm not sure how many fetch lands I should increase the mana base by to optimize Narnam Renegade. Could also likely get away with a singleton copy of Mutavault, due to the lack of GG in casting costs.
4 Deathgorge and 4 Ooze.. are there that many graveyard decks in your meta? Anyway, that means you're pre-boarded against them already.
Would have to say the same thing as Amicdeep. 4 Treetop are too much. They will slow you down, 2 or 3 is good enough.
Maybe remove a Dismember and replace it with another pump spell?
Since you have Narnam. I suggest getting a playset of windswept heath to bring the fetch count to 8, they are the cheapest fetch lands and are actually cheaper than the prismatic vista in your deck.
That list I just posted is a trial brew I'm gonna have a go with once MH1 is released. More of a mono green hate bears type list. I've been playing a rather stock list to pretty medium/bad results lately.
I think I like new green snake a lot, the more I think about it. It's an on-par 1CMC creature. It's a "4CMC" creature to top the curve, that gets around a lot of removal, like a bad Thrun, The Last Troll (but still a good enough card.) But untapping with it is almost like untapping with Chameleon Colossus, just a real game closer. Mana effeciency is one of this decks strong-suits and this plays into it incredibly well.
Savage Swipe doesn't seem very good. You can't pump you're own creature in response to take down something real nasty. It can never kill Gurmag Angler. It seems like solid SB piece against opposing wide decks like humans, which can be a crap-shoot match-up.
this is going to be a long one, please forgive the spelling and grammar as im dyslexic and wont catch all the errores
form my limited play testing of Savage Swipe
the down side to true fight spells is that your creature almost always dies with it hence the use of natures way and dismember for so long, the big difference with swipe is the pump aspect on the card. this means that when your eone, narnam scooze or what ever fights your now have a much bigger buffer of defence (this is one of the reasons dromoka's command is so good, it pumps then it fights) providing a 3 or 4 (or in narnams case 5) defence means that you take out thalia, goblin guild, spell queller sized creatures without that loss of your own creature. it also increase the number of possible targets for a fight spell in your side of the field, (you would very rarly target militant, scooze or a 2/2 eone with fight spell as this meant loosing your creature as well). i would also point out a one drop spell makes evey creature in our deck able to take out thing in ice and thought knot seer wich are two of the biggest problems stompy as deck faces in the current meta. it also dose not cost life, and in burn and phoenix matchups the life loss form dismember is a huge handicap to winning these games.
the main advantage of this spell over prey upon or titanic brawl is that its almost a split card. it has two purposes and it fills both roles well (if imperfectly)
lastly i will concede that the big downside to this spell is soc speed, but the added pump on a creature is (in my opinion) significant enough to justify its inclusion (or at least further testing) in the mono green variant.
vines vs blossom,
i've written about the historical advantages of vines before and in the current meta they are still irrelevent (for now), so i will ignore them.
over the last 3 or so year the meta has got faster and faster. we need to be in the 16 damage by turn 4 (20 life minus a 2 fetches and a shock) to realistically get lethal. to do that effectively we need to be playing as much creatures as quickly as possible on our first 3 turns and alot of the time we will have only singular mana to work with
now the difference between the two is this
1 mana vines
hexproof
1 mana blossom
hexproof +2/+2
2 mana vines
hexproof +4/+4
2 mana blossom
hexproof +2/+2 and 1 spare mana
the one mana mode happens often enough that the variance and to be an issue
stuck one one land
blossom is supreare
2 lands, a lot of the time we want to be playing a creature, but we also don't what to loose our first to bolt or push presuming all one dops are 2 power (if eone is turn one play then defence is auto better due to the evolve trigger the second 1 drop nets him)
and that on turn three we are still stuck on 2 lands and we play a two drop
t2 t3 t4 total board state from first 2 turns
V+k 6 2 2 8 1 1drops
V-k 2 4 4 6 2 1drops
B 4 4 4 8 2 1drops
both defence and vines + kicker = 8 damage, and both vine - kicker and defence have a bigger broad presence, so in this case defence is slightly superior to maintain maximum aggression.
three mana
so turn one, onedrop turn 2 two drop (or 2 1drops)
turn three, we have a two drop in hand
it is better to play avatar and strangleroot before combat avatar for maximising the counter it gets and strangleroot for the haste.
B in this case you can attack in without worry and play the two drop. (or another 2 one drops)
V hear you have to hold up the mana attack in and potentially loose some board presents for the advantage of dealing extra damage and if you do not have another one drop in hand you lose the potential to lay a creatures this turn.
pump size
the other reason to play a pump spell is as a way of killing blocker or attackers(but this should be rare) against humans, spirits and phoenix defence serves as well as vines, now against hollow one, thoughtknot seer, gurmag angler and tasugare vines is superior due to the our creature surviving and there's not.
so meta share time (considering and approaching this from the view pint of a competitive meta (im going to use mtg top 8, yes there are other options but this is a particularly good one fro focusing on future competitive metas (as people tend to play the stuff that wins and places)
now in order of most played
Snapcaster Mage B
Walking Ballista (n/a our stuffs going to die no matter what)
Noble Hierarch (n/a dork)
Arclight Phoenix B (this will never defend, avatar is the only posible blocker, and with 2 defence defence will sufice)
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben B
Thing in the Ice B (if it flips we die anyway so this is only on offensive)
Phantasmal Image(N/A)
Celestial Colonnade V
Scavenging Ooze B (we are presuming early game as if scooze gets large we die anyway)
Reflector Mage B
Champion of the Parish Tie
Thalia's Lieutenant B
Wurmcoil Engine V (most of the time we die and killing it is worse that leaving it alive and dealing as much damage past it as possible to this but if we swig in 4 damage is better at offsetting the life gain that 2)
Crackling Drake B (defence kills it and they can esily make this big enough for the extra 2 from vines not to matter 99% of the time)
Kitesail Freebooter B
Mantis Rider V
Meddling Mage B
Tarmogoyf V
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger N/A
Vendilion Clique V (less lily to matter as will always attack and we will always almost trade)
Bloodghast B
Dark Confidant B
Tireless Tracker v
Primeval Titan v (but like wurm were already dead)
Monastery Swiftspear B
Death's Shadow V (this is the only time currently in modern where vines "target opponents stuff" abily is relevant)
Narcomoeba B
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet V (but again we dead)
Goblin Guide B
Prized Amalgam V (but if we didn't scooze it were probably dead)
looking at this a very clear picture come into being when the game is winnable blossom is better
when we are really struggling and our opponent has stopped just shore of winning vines is better, but in all but three case where vines is better aspect would be better again.
so in conclusion
if you are in the early game and trying to deal maximum damage as early as possible blossom is your spell. if your are on a low land count ( or running multiple copies of horizon canopy) blossom is your friend.
if your expect the game to go longer, have a higher curve (like the historically 8 1drops 10 2drops 7-8 3drops then vines is better)
vines is also better if you are facing, deathshadow (just) infect(alot) and if twin ever gets unbanned (alot)
(note bogles matchups B is better as even though you can target dryad arbour and the kor with aspect to fizzle stuff your are going to need to race to win, and enchemnt hate is vastly more effective that hoping they target the 3 permanents in there deck that you can use the double sided hexproof on. this also holds true for affinity (arcbound ravager and plating)
ok scooze
(ill keep this bit a little shorter)
basically with phoenix decks, dredge, neoform/reanimatore taking increasingly bigger chunks of the meta, scooze is more relevant more often (between the life gain and gy hate) yes its slower that normal gy hate but having it mb and 4 mb millanats makes these matchups slightly more winnable. this will flip back if spirits or coco decks become more popular again.
hope this answers your questions, if you need anything clarifying feel free to ask (i know that this a lot of marginally coherent information at best)
so personally i would keep the dryad, the place i would cut would be rhonas (less good in the current meta) and maybe a avatar or a pump spell.
this would give us
14 one drop
7-8 2 drops
4 three drops
which is the ideal curve the decks wanted for a long time. (and only not had due to the awful state of one drops available to us)
i agree that the lvl 6 progenitus is going to be very rare, but the lvl 3 almost hexproof seems a lot more doable and consistent. if the snake dose well i might have to push back up the number of rancors in the deck as its the only pump that can reach it once its lvl 3. (i would also point out that if the snake becomes a 3-4 of in the deck it may make pelt collector a stronger choice than eone due to the die trigger as i fell that once this thing starts to get big your opponent is going to make it priority 1 as they will not be able to aford to deal with a 6/6 progenatus )
Competitive Decks
Devotion to the Lash B ----
Monkey Conservation WUGR ---- Dragon WorshipR
I'm not loving Scale Up/Upscale so much. It could be cool as a one-of. Can't even target opponent's creatures to shrink a Death's Shadow back into Dismember range.
Sexy Sig by mchief111 @ Rising Studios
EDH
G Isao
It's another 2/1 when we need to o fast and don't have time to level it but can finish it off with a pump. Think vs Tron or combo like ad nausea.
And in the matches vs alot of removal that go longer and we tend to side out out some of the pumps anyways to avoid 2 for 1s this is a reasonable top deck. Think vs uw control where you can easily find yourself with 4+ lands.
Perhaps not a 4 of. But I'm for sure getting 2 foils for my stompy deck
Realistically we will only play a pair of these if any and the snake is likely to be the first thing cut or sided out. A full four playset is just wasted space. Its good late game but its a very durdly card early on.
Sexy Sig by mchief111 @ Rising Studios
EDH
G Isao
yeah, I think two is the right number to test this new card. And also 3-4 rancors, so we could still pump him after he has pro instants.
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I intend to remove almost almost all 3 drops and focus on 14 one drops including a certain number of these new snake. He's easier to enlarge than kessig prowler, and the pro instants helps against.. bolt, path, push, decay, trophy, cast down.. so many removal in modern are instants!
yeah, we should not rely too much on his mini progenitus mode. although I'm curious how many games we can turn him into the 6/6.
interested to see testing results. Please share a report when you use him in FNM. thanks.
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4 Dryad Militant
4 Hexdrinker
3 Kraul Harpooner
4 Narnam Renegade
3 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Scavenging Ooze
4 Rancor
4 Vines Of Vastwood
14 Forest
4 Prismatic Vista
4 Treetop Village
1 Deglamer
2 Force Of Vigor
1 Island
1 Kraul Harpooner
1 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Oxidize
2 Relic Of Progenitus
4 Repudiate // Replicate
1 Unravel The Aether
This is a pretty rough cut and I'm not sure how many fetch lands I should increase the mana base by to optimize Narnam Renegade. Could also likely get away with a singleton copy of Mutavault, due to the lack of GG in casting costs.
12 fetchlands is optimal, although 8 can work well enough
mutavault is bad without tribal synagis.
i very highly recommend you read the super primer on the first post of this thread (it has a lot of information from a lot of sources and individuals and will help you avoid the basic pitfalls)
as a general run never run 4 dismembers, you cast 2 in a game and that 8 life down the drain. you cast three and crack a fetchlands or 2 and your opponent only has to deal 5-6 damage to close the game. (2 bolts or one solid attack from a gurmag or a flipped thing in the ice)
Deathgorge Scavenger is also very bad, either run scavenging ooze-(3 of max) or steel leaf champion in this slot
i think not running e ones is a mistake, they are easily one of the more resistant creatures for the deck
strangleroot geist is arguably the best card in the deck, its good in every matchup, and has a lot of synagis going for it.
4 treetop villages tend to be a mistake as they are bad in multiples and can very easily slow the deck down by a turn. they are good turn 4+ when you have 3 lands and are topdecking 1 drops or lands, and if you get boardwipe. but very very rarly if your on the aggressive start.
sb
you need life gain especially with fetch lands and dissmsbers, otherwise you may as well concede against burn.
you need something to help counter (reduce the impact of) board wipes as these are the biggest blowout you can face and in modern they happen your turn 2-3.
Repudiate // Replicate is just bad, if you what to stop an ability run pithing needle, and if you what an extra creature soc speed run a token generator or another good creature.
Competitive Decks
Devotion to the Lash B ----
Monkey Conservation WUGR ---- Dragon WorshipR
Well, yes. All those things are true for a stock build. I've been playing that deck off and on for a couple years. This is an entirely different jam that still fits within the "Green Stompy" strategy, ergo my posting it here. I should've referenced the primer for fetch count, though. You're right.
While Repudiate // Replicate isn't super good, I've been getting really good results with it SB in a stock build on line for a while now. Positive records against Tron and Amulet Titan.
Agree Narnam is the best choice for this deck but it somewhat goes against the budget theme since you need a bunch of fetchlands to make NR work.
this is what i think will become the new optimal build after release (unless we get some more awesome cards to add, which is very possible)
4x Dryad Militant
4x Experiment One
2x Hexdrinker
4x Narnam Renegade
3x Avatar of the Resolute
3x Scavenging Ooze
4x Strangleroot Geist
Enchantment (3)
3x Rancor
Instant (7)
3x Aspect of Hydra
3x Blossoming Defense
1x Dismember
Sorcery (2)
2x Savage Swipe
4x Forest
3x Horizon Canopy
1x Treetop Village
4x Prismatic Vista
4x Windswept Heath
4x Wooded Foothills
(with the curved lowered by 14 one drops, and blossoming def over vines it may well be worth doing the land count to 20 as unless we draw steel leaf 2 mana is more that sufficient for the first 3 turns)
after many games the decks optimum opening turns still seems to be
turn one: eone
turn two: fetch millinat + narnam
although now
turn one: 1 two powered one drop
turn two: savage swipe, then rancor
seems as good and may be worth expanding on in the future.
Competitive Decks
Devotion to the Lash B ----
Monkey Conservation WUGR ---- Dragon WorshipR
Also, with your new optimum opening, you'd have a strong turn 2, but after that you'd just have one 4/1. While I'm still in favour of exploring this, I have a strong feeling that the 'original' optimum opening is a lot stronger than your new one.
4 Deathgorge and 4 Ooze.. are there that many graveyard decks in your meta? Anyway, that means you're pre-boarded against them already.
Would have to say the same thing as Amicdeep. 4 Treetop are too much. They will slow you down, 2 or 3 is good enough.
Maybe remove a Dismember and replace it with another pump spell?
Since you have Narnam. I suggest getting a playset of windswept heath to bring the fetch count to 8, they are the cheapest fetch lands and are actually cheaper than the prismatic vista in your deck.
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I think I like new green snake a lot, the more I think about it. It's an on-par 1CMC creature. It's a "4CMC" creature to top the curve, that gets around a lot of removal, like a bad Thrun, The Last Troll (but still a good enough card.) But untapping with it is almost like untapping with Chameleon Colossus, just a real game closer. Mana effeciency is one of this decks strong-suits and this plays into it incredibly well.
Savage Swipe doesn't seem very good. You can't pump you're own creature in response to take down something real nasty. It can never kill Gurmag Angler. It seems like solid SB piece against opposing wide decks like humans, which can be a crap-shoot match-up.
form my limited play testing of Savage Swipe
the down side to true fight spells is that your creature almost always dies with it hence the use of natures way and dismember for so long, the big difference with swipe is the pump aspect on the card. this means that when your eone, narnam scooze or what ever fights your now have a much bigger buffer of defence (this is one of the reasons dromoka's command is so good, it pumps then it fights) providing a 3 or 4 (or in narnams case 5) defence means that you take out thalia, goblin guild, spell queller sized creatures without that loss of your own creature. it also increase the number of possible targets for a fight spell in your side of the field, (you would very rarly target militant, scooze or a 2/2 eone with fight spell as this meant loosing your creature as well). i would also point out a one drop spell makes evey creature in our deck able to take out thing in ice and thought knot seer wich are two of the biggest problems stompy as deck faces in the current meta. it also dose not cost life, and in burn and phoenix matchups the life loss form dismember is a huge handicap to winning these games.
the main advantage of this spell over prey upon or titanic brawl is that its almost a split card. it has two purposes and it fills both roles well (if imperfectly)
lastly i will concede that the big downside to this spell is soc speed, but the added pump on a creature is (in my opinion) significant enough to justify its inclusion (or at least further testing) in the mono green variant.
vines vs blossom,
i've written about the historical advantages of vines before and in the current meta they are still irrelevent (for now), so i will ignore them.
over the last 3 or so year the meta has got faster and faster. we need to be in the 16 damage by turn 4 (20 life minus a 2 fetches and a shock) to realistically get lethal. to do that effectively we need to be playing as much creatures as quickly as possible on our first 3 turns and alot of the time we will have only singular mana to work with
now the difference between the two is this
1 mana vines
hexproof
1 mana blossom
hexproof +2/+2
2 mana vines
hexproof +4/+4
2 mana blossom
hexproof +2/+2 and 1 spare mana
the one mana mode happens often enough that the variance and to be an issue
stuck one one land
blossom is supreare
2 lands, a lot of the time we want to be playing a creature, but we also don't what to loose our first to bolt or push presuming all one dops are 2 power (if eone is turn one play then defence is auto better due to the evolve trigger the second 1 drop nets him)
and that on turn three we are still stuck on 2 lands and we play a two drop
t2 t3 t4 total board state from first 2 turns
V+k 6 2 2 8 1 1drops
V-k 2 4 4 6 2 1drops
B 4 4 4 8 2 1drops
both defence and vines + kicker = 8 damage, and both vine - kicker and defence have a bigger broad presence, so in this case defence is slightly superior to maintain maximum aggression.
three mana
so turn one, onedrop turn 2 two drop (or 2 1drops)
turn three, we have a two drop in hand
it is better to play avatar and strangleroot before combat avatar for maximising the counter it gets and strangleroot for the haste.
B in this case you can attack in without worry and play the two drop. (or another 2 one drops)
V hear you have to hold up the mana attack in and potentially loose some board presents for the advantage of dealing extra damage and if you do not have another one drop in hand you lose the potential to lay a creatures this turn.
pump size
the other reason to play a pump spell is as a way of killing blocker or attackers(but this should be rare) against humans, spirits and phoenix defence serves as well as vines, now against hollow one, thoughtknot seer, gurmag angler and tasugare vines is superior due to the our creature surviving and there's not.
so meta share time (considering and approaching this from the view pint of a competitive meta (im going to use mtg top 8, yes there are other options but this is a particularly good one fro focusing on future competitive metas (as people tend to play the stuff that wins and places)
now in order of most played
Snapcaster Mage B
Walking Ballista (n/a our stuffs going to die no matter what)
Noble Hierarch (n/a dork)
Arclight Phoenix B (this will never defend, avatar is the only posible blocker, and with 2 defence defence will sufice)
Thalia, Guardian of Thraben B
Thing in the Ice B (if it flips we die anyway so this is only on offensive)
Phantasmal Image(N/A)
Celestial Colonnade V
Scavenging Ooze B (we are presuming early game as if scooze gets large we die anyway)
Reflector Mage B
Champion of the Parish Tie
Thalia's Lieutenant B
Wurmcoil Engine V (most of the time we die and killing it is worse that leaving it alive and dealing as much damage past it as possible to this but if we swig in 4 damage is better at offsetting the life gain that 2)
Crackling Drake B (defence kills it and they can esily make this big enough for the extra 2 from vines not to matter 99% of the time)
Kitesail Freebooter B
Mantis Rider V
Meddling Mage B
Tarmogoyf V
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger N/A
Vendilion Clique V (less lily to matter as will always attack and we will always almost trade)
Bloodghast B
Dark Confidant B
Tireless Tracker v
Primeval Titan v (but like wurm were already dead)
Monastery Swiftspear B
Death's Shadow V (this is the only time currently in modern where vines "target opponents stuff" abily is relevant)
Narcomoeba B
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet V (but again we dead)
Goblin Guide B
Prized Amalgam V (but if we didn't scooze it were probably dead)
looking at this a very clear picture come into being when the game is winnable blossom is better
when we are really struggling and our opponent has stopped just shore of winning vines is better, but in all but three case where vines is better aspect would be better again.
so in conclusion
if you are in the early game and trying to deal maximum damage as early as possible blossom is your spell. if your are on a low land count ( or running multiple copies of horizon canopy) blossom is your friend.
if your expect the game to go longer, have a higher curve (like the historically 8 1drops 10 2drops 7-8 3drops then vines is better)
vines is also better if you are facing, deathshadow (just) infect(alot) and if twin ever gets unbanned (alot)
(note bogles matchups B is better as even though you can target dryad arbour and the kor with aspect to fizzle stuff your are going to need to race to win, and enchemnt hate is vastly more effective that hoping they target the 3 permanents in there deck that you can use the double sided hexproof on. this also holds true for affinity (arcbound ravager and plating)
ok scooze
(ill keep this bit a little shorter)
basically with phoenix decks, dredge, neoform/reanimatore taking increasingly bigger chunks of the meta, scooze is more relevant more often (between the life gain and gy hate) yes its slower that normal gy hate but having it mb and 4 mb millanats makes these matchups slightly more winnable. this will flip back if spirits or coco decks become more popular again.
hope this answers your questions, if you need anything clarifying feel free to ask (i know that this a lot of marginally coherent information at best)
Competitive Decks
Devotion to the Lash B ----
Monkey Conservation WUGR ---- Dragon WorshipR