I feel the soul sisters don't really add much since, if you're trying to go infinite, either your opponent is dead thanks to redcap or you have infinite life from finks anyway and the sisters themselves would need multiple counters to become offensive threats while Anafenza is required to buff them first due to their low toughness instead of being able to turn your x/2s into x/3s. Also, they aren't nearly as good without Rangers to grab a pair of Ascendants and push you over the edge. Instead, I'm looking at creatures that enjoy receiving +1/+1 counters from Anafenza and are decent on their own. Warden gets to be a 4/4 and gives us something else to do with out mana(maybe Figure of Destiny is better?) Cartel Aristocrat doesn't mind getting bigger, is decent on her own, dodging removal, being unblockable, and gives us the infinite life combo, which is just nice to randomly have. Eternal Witness gives us solid redundancy, combos with Collected Company and enjoys being a 3/2. Boon Satyr is really nice as a surprise 5/3 although the 4/2 version is also acceptable. Rhino is here because its just good and SoLiS is because it wins grindy games and makes whatever its on extremely difficult to remove. I'm definitely considering Archangel of Thune as a 1 of since she combos with Finks, Warden, SoLiS, and Rhinos.
Alright. After doing some furious goldfishing, here is the list I ended up with.
The goal is to get the infinite combo on turn 4 or 5, but it can be done as early as turn 3.
You're right that having the soul sisters in this deck doesn't really add anything.
Similarly, I'm not sold on the Blood Artist but have been testing him as a 1-of. He's occasionally fun to flip with company, and gives us a little redundancy for the Redcap. Most likely I will end up replacing him with a third Witness.
I'm hoping to get in some real testing this weekend.
I'm starting to embrace the less Sisterific more comborific version of the deck. I'll post an updated list tomorrow morning as I don't have my iPad with me tonight.
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Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
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It'll be a little more up-to-date there.
At any rate, I've run just over 200 solo hands the past few days - keeping track of how many turns it takes to go infinite with either life or damage. Here are my results:
3-4 turns: ~46%
5-6 turns: ~35%
7+ turns: ~19%
Overall, 4-5 turns is the highest concentration with about 60% between the two of them.
Of course, I realize that this is with no disruption or interaction. Which will slow things down. But I was also testing on the play every hand, which will actually help speed things up a bit too with that extra card on the draw.
Finally. I have one question for you all. Green Sun's Zenith. Does it belong in here? Maybe as a one of? Obviously, it only helps with two of the three combo parts...but in those games that drag on because you have infinite life, at least you can use it to keep yourself from ever milling.
If I do include it. Should that one-of go in the board or the main?
Finally. I have one question for you all. Green Sun's Zenith. Does it belong in here? Maybe as a one of? Obviously, it only helps with two of the three combo parts...but in those games that drag on because you have infinite life, at least you can use it to keep yourself from ever milling.
If I do include it. Should that one-of go in the board or the main?
i'm not a huge fan of Archangel of Thune or Blasting Station in the list. The angel is a little to far up the curve for my tastes, and the station isn't a creature, which limits the effectiveness of Collected Company. After some testing this is what I've come up with:
The deck also runs light disruption in Abrupt Decay, Path to Exile, and Thoughtseize, just to keep the opponent off their guard. Right now this deck is a casual deck for me, but it's been doing a lot better than I expected in the testing I'v been able to do.
-Edit: Adjusted list
-2 Ajani's Pridemate
-1 Serra's Ascendant
+2 Summoner's Pact
+1 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
I really like your deck, and some of the card choices (Reclamation Sage, and also Cartel Aristocrat over Bloodthrone Vampire for example), but aren't you worried that you have all these cards that build this engine, but you only have four Kitchen Finks for fuel. Without Finks, your Serra Ascendant, Ajani's Pridemates, Viscera Seer, and Cartel Aristocrats are effectively useless. You don't have anything else that you want to be sacrificing...and you don't have any (real) source of lifegain outside the Finks.
I personally wouldn't feel safe running with only one card for fuel.
That being said, what are you doing for sideboard. I've decided to change most of my sideboard to low CMC creatures so they will combo well with Company. Right now, I have Qasali Pridemages, spare Eternal Witnesses, and Phyrexian Revokers in the side. Do you have any suggestions for a graveyard hate creature?
While I dislike only having one creature for Finks, Collected Company acts like finks 5-7, which helps this issue. In testing Finks has been the creature I usually looking for with Company. I've considered running Summoner's Pact for more virtual finks, but I just haven't yet 'cause I don't know what I'd cut for it. In the list I have 3 IoK, 2 Abrupt Decay, 1 Eternal Witness, 2 Phyrexian Revokers, and one more Pridemage with 6 open slots. My side is still really rough as I'm still trying to get the right 60 before I move over to the sideboard.
You're probably right about Archangel of Thune, although she does act as additional Anafenzas. Do you think Pridemates and Ascendants still belong without the sisters' life gain? I'm not sure. I do agree that I'm probably low on creatures in general.
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I'm doing alright without the sisters, but I could probably cut two Ascendants, as we need more ways to find Finks to get the combo off. Really thinking about Summoner's Pact in their place.
Edit- Rethinking things, I would cut the Pridemates. While they can grow larger than the Ascendants, they need to be on the field to get the pump. With the Ascendants you can pump before you drop them if you need to, and they will hit as 6/6 flyers. They are also harder for most decks to chump, so they can get faster kills in some cases. This is all in the case of someone not scooping to, "I'm going to do this loop half a million times. I'm nwt at 1 million life, I pass the turn."
I guess I figure, once you get a million life, no one is going to play that out, so I focus more on simply getting the combo active.
The main exceptions are mill decks and super slow/grindy control, so as long as you have one card that reshuffles itself (Eldrazi or Zeniths for example), then you win.
I guess I figure, once you get a million life, no one is going to play that out, so I focus more on simply getting the combo active.
The main exceptions are mill decks and super slow/grindy control, so as long as you have one card that reshuffles itself (Eldrazi or Zeniths for example), then you win.
Twin doesn't care what your life total is, as they can just make enough creatures to kill you when they go off.
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Okay, updated again based on your advice. I really hope we can get this deck off the ground. Right now it's running at just over $400 US. Yikes!
400 isn't bad. My "budget" BG deck is running around 800-900 right now. 2 Liliana+2 Obliterator+extremely delicate mana base equals empty wallet and angry fiancee.
Okay, updated again based on your advice. I really hope we can get this deck off the ground. Right now it's running at just over $400 US. Yikes!
400 isn't bad. My "budget" BG deck is running around 800-900 right now. 2 Liliana+2 Obliterator+extremely delicate mana base equals empty wallet and angry fiancee.
Ah I see your problem... you told your fiancee =p
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Modern: U Merfolk | GR Tron | WUR Jeskai Control | WBG Abzan Company
Okay, updated again based on your advice. I really hope we can get this deck off the ground. Right now it's running at just over $400 US. Yikes!
400 isn't bad. My "budget" BG deck is running around 800-900 right now. 2 Liliana+2 Obliterator+extremely delicate mana base equals empty wallet and angry fiancee.
Ah I see your problem... you told your fiancee =p
Yeah, she had asked how much money I had spent on it over the last two years, and I told her around 600, but I didn't buy my Liliana's or some of my fetchlands lol. Now she is asking me if I would ever sell it off.
Edit: One the subject of Archangel of Thune acting like another Anafenza; while this is true, Merila effectivly does the same thing for 3 mana cheaper. Pod could afford to play it because they played ramp, and could easily pod into it. We would have to cast it, which is why I much prefer the cheaper versions. Running three Kin-Trees and three Outcasts gives us ample opportunity to find one, especially with Collected Company+Summoners Pact, toatalling up with 8 ways to find Merila and 6 ways to find Anafenza, totaling a crazy 14 ways to find an engine.
Okay, updated again based on your advice. I really hope we can get this deck off the ground. Right now it's running at just over $400 US. Yikes!
400 isn't bad. My "budget" BG deck is running around 800-900 right now. 2 Liliana+2 Obliterator+extremely delicate mana base equals empty wallet and angry fiancee.
Yeah Modern can be hard on the wallet. That's why I started with Eggs. The most expensive cards there are Mox Opal and the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
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It's a real bummer that Redcap costs four, but the reason I run him is because generally infinite damage is better than infinite life. As you said, Twin doesn't care about life, and neither does infect. But the my both do care about damage.
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4 Warden of the First Tree
4 Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit
3 Cartel Aristocrat
4 Kitchen Finks
2 Eternal Witness
2 Boon Satyr
4 Siege Rhino
Spells
3 Path to Exile
4 Thoughtseize
4 Abrupt Decay
2 Collected Company
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
Lands
2 Marsh Flats
2 Verdant Catabombs
4 Windswept Heath
2 Temple Garden
2 Godless Shrine
1 Overgrown Tomb
2 Razorverge Thicket
3 Plains
2 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Gavony Township
1 Vault of the Archangel
I feel the soul sisters don't really add much since, if you're trying to go infinite, either your opponent is dead thanks to redcap or you have infinite life from finks anyway and the sisters themselves would need multiple counters to become offensive threats while Anafenza is required to buff them first due to their low toughness instead of being able to turn your x/2s into x/3s. Also, they aren't nearly as good without Rangers to grab a pair of Ascendants and push you over the edge. Instead, I'm looking at creatures that enjoy receiving +1/+1 counters from Anafenza and are decent on their own. Warden gets to be a 4/4 and gives us something else to do with out mana(maybe Figure of Destiny is better?) Cartel Aristocrat doesn't mind getting bigger, is decent on her own, dodging removal, being unblockable, and gives us the infinite life combo, which is just nice to randomly have. Eternal Witness gives us solid redundancy, combos with Collected Company and enjoys being a 3/2. Boon Satyr is really nice as a surprise 5/3 although the 4/2 version is also acceptable. Rhino is here because its just good and SoLiS is because it wins grindy games and makes whatever its on extremely difficult to remove. I'm definitely considering Archangel of Thune as a 1 of since she combos with Finks, Warden, SoLiS, and Rhinos.
4 Viscera Seer
4 Birds of Paradise
3 Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit
4 Melira, Sylvok Outcast
2 Bloodthrone Vampire
1 Blood Artist
4 Kitchen Finks
2 Eternal Witness
4 Murderous Redcap
Spells
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Street Wraith
4 Apostle's Blessing
2 Collected Company
4 City of Brass
3 Forbidden Orchard
2 Ancient Ziggurat
1 Gemstone Caverns
2 Horizon Canopy
3 Tendo Ice Bridge
3 Forest
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Nature's Claim
2 Pithing Needle
2 Stony Silence
1 Eternal Witness
2 Rest In Peace
Alright. After doing some furious goldfishing, here is the list I ended up with.
The goal is to get the infinite combo on turn 4 or 5, but it can be done as early as turn 3.
You're right that having the soul sisters in this deck doesn't really add anything.
Similarly, I'm not sold on the Blood Artist but have been testing him as a 1-of. He's occasionally fun to flip with company, and gives us a little redundancy for the Redcap. Most likely I will end up replacing him with a third Witness.
I'm hoping to get in some real testing this weekend.
What do you guys think?
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
Sundays at 7:00 PM Eastern Time / 4:00 PM Pacific Time
Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
If you'd like to play test a few hands of my deck, you can check it out here:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/dtk-modern-persist-combo/?c=1946466
It'll be a little more up-to-date there.
At any rate, I've run just over 200 solo hands the past few days - keeping track of how many turns it takes to go infinite with either life or damage. Here are my results:
3-4 turns: ~46%
5-6 turns: ~35%
7+ turns: ~19%
Overall, 4-5 turns is the highest concentration with about 60% between the two of them.
Of course, I realize that this is with no disruption or interaction. Which will slow things down. But I was also testing on the play every hand, which will actually help speed things up a bit too with that extra card on the draw.
Finally. I have one question for you all. Green Sun's Zenith. Does it belong in here? Maybe as a one of? Obviously, it only helps with two of the three combo parts...but in those games that drag on because you have infinite life, at least you can use it to keep yourself from ever milling.
If I do include it. Should that one-of go in the board or the main?
Green Sun's Zenith is banned in Modern. Go with zero of it.
Haven't been playing modern long enough to know everything on the banlist.
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
Sundays at 7:00 PM Eastern Time / 4:00 PM Pacific Time
Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
4 Viscera Seer
3 Serra Ascendant
3 Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit
3 Melira, Sylvok Outcast
2 Cartel Aristocrat
4 Kitchen Finks
1 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Eternal Witness
1 Dryad Arbor
Sorcery
3 Thoughtseize
Instants
2 Path to Exile
3 Collected Company
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Summoner's Pact
4 Windswept Heath
2 Verdant Catacombs
2 Marsh Flats
2 Temple Garden
2 Overgrown Tomb
2 Godless Shrine
2 Plains
3 Forest
1 Swamp
3 Razorverge Thicket
3 Inqisition of Kozilek
2 Abrupt Decay
1 Eternal Witness
2 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Murderous Redcap
3 Essence Warden
This list tries to maximize Collected company by running 24 creatures, that can all be grabbed by Company. We have 6 total engines in Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit and Melira, Sylvok Outcast, four Kitchen Finks and two Summoner's Pact for fuel, 6 sac outlets with Viscera Seer + Cartel Aristocrat for ignition, and finally 6 win conditions coming from Serra Ascendant and Ajani's Pridemate. Think of Collected Company as a laggy turbo that can let you explode out of nowhere to get ahead.
The deck also runs light disruption in Abrupt Decay, Path to Exile, and Thoughtseize, just to keep the opponent off their guard. Right now this deck is a casual deck for me, but it's been doing a lot better than I expected in the testing I'v been able to do.
-Edit: Adjusted list
-2 Ajani's Pridemate
-1 Serra's Ascendant
+2 Summoner's Pact
+1 Varolz, the Scar-Striped
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I personally wouldn't feel safe running with only one card for fuel.
That being said, what are you doing for sideboard. I've decided to change most of my sideboard to low CMC creatures so they will combo well with Company. Right now, I have Qasali Pridemages, spare Eternal Witnesses, and Phyrexian Revokers in the side. Do you have any suggestions for a graveyard hate creature?
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Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
Sundays at 7:00 PM Eastern Time / 4:00 PM Pacific Time
Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
Edit- Rethinking things, I would cut the Pridemates. While they can grow larger than the Ascendants, they need to be on the field to get the pump. With the Ascendants you can pump before you drop them if you need to, and they will hit as 6/6 flyers. They are also harder for most decks to chump, so they can get faster kills in some cases. This is all in the case of someone not scooping to, "I'm going to do this loop half a million times. I'm nwt at 1 million life, I pass the turn."
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I guess I figure, once you get a million life, no one is going to play that out, so I focus more on simply getting the combo active.
The main exceptions are mill decks and super slow/grindy control, so as long as you have one card that reshuffles itself (Eldrazi or Zeniths for example), then you win.
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
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|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
Twin doesn't care what your life total is, as they can just make enough creatures to kill you when they go off.
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
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Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||
400 isn't bad. My "budget" BG deck is running around 800-900 right now. 2 Liliana+2 Obliterator+extremely delicate mana base equals empty wallet and angry fiancee.
Cheeri0sXWU
Reid Duke's Level One
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Ah I see your problem... you told your fiancee =p
U Merfolk | GR Tron | WUR Jeskai Control | WBG Abzan Company
EDH:
G Ezuri, Renegade Leader, Fighting for Rivendell
WU Brago, King Eternal, Long Live the King
WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon, Worship the Dragon
Yeah, she had asked how much money I had spent on it over the last two years, and I told her around 600, but I didn't buy my Liliana's or some of my fetchlands lol. Now she is asking me if I would ever sell it off.
Edit: One the subject of Archangel of Thune acting like another Anafenza; while this is true, Merila effectivly does the same thing for 3 mana cheaper. Pod could afford to play it because they played ramp, and could easily pod into it. We would have to cast it, which is why I much prefer the cheaper versions. Running three Kin-Trees and three Outcasts gives us ample opportunity to find one, especially with Collected Company+Summoners Pact, toatalling up with 8 ways to find Merila and 6 ways to find Anafenza, totaling a crazy 14 ways to find an engine.
Cheeri0sXWU
Reid Duke's Level One
Who's the Beatdown
Alt+0198=Æ
Yeah Modern can be hard on the wallet. That's why I started with Eggs. The most expensive cards there are Mox Opal and the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
Live streaming Casual Magic: the Gathering
Sundays at 7:00 PM Eastern Time / 4:00 PM Pacific Time
Follow along on Instagram (@kokoshomebrews) as I create casual tribal decks
and try to build around crazy combos, then play em on stream!
|| WBG || GW || GB || GWU ||