I've had Spellskite in a variety of sideboards against UWR and it was never sufficient. Given that I play aggro, Spellskite goes against role assignment.
I've had Spellskite in a variety of sideboards against UWR and it was never sufficient. Given that I play aggro, Spellskite goes against role assignment.
Kira is a sweet idea! I'll try that out
Spellskite isn't THE answer, it simply is decent protection against quite a bit of the spot removal that UWr packs and would protect other creatures that you would prefer to have on the board.
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I hear Phyrexian Crusader is pretty good against bolt/helix/path/electrolyze/geist/resto...
With him running as infect, however, it makes it so that he runs against the win strategy of Zoo and wouldn't be a great include unless it was a stompy zoo variant. The two pronged directions of attack make for quite the awkward attempt (20 damage or 10 infect damage) at a win and gives UWr quite a few turns to simply hit straight at their face with Celestial Colonnade/Lightning Bolt/Lightning Helix/Geist of Saint Traft/Vendilion Clique/Restoration Angel/Electrolyze and protect themselves with board wipes or Cryptic Command.
I'm not sure that Phyrexian Crusader would be worth sideboarding unless infect plays into your win condition, then he's decent.
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With him running as infect, however, it makes it so that he runs against the win strategy of Zoo and wouldn't be a great include unless it was a stompy zoo variant. The two pronged directions of attack make for quite the awkward attempt (20 damage or 10 infect damage) at a win and gives UWr quite a few turns to simply hit straight at their face with Celestial Colonnade/Lightning Bolt/Lightning Helix/Geist of Saint Traft/Vendilion Clique/Restoration Angel/Electrolyze and protect themselves with board wipes or Cryptic Command.
I'm not sure that Phyrexian Crusader would be worth sideboarding unless infect plays into your win condition, then he's decent.
He might not contribute to damage but a resolved Crusader puts a UWr player on a 5 turn clock with only cryptic (in some decks) to bounce it and snappy to block it. It's true, I don't know the ins and outs of Zoo, but sticking a neigh unremovable threat seems pretty dangerous to me. Perhaps the split focus of poison and damage detracts from a standard aggro plan, but there's also the fact to consider that no amount of Helix or Sphinx's lifegain can save you from poison.
Don't think in terms of making the deck something different, think in terms of silver bullets, tuning the deck to be a similar build that Raka hates or... accept that the deck has bad matchups.
Thrun as a curve topper, a PW or... something like that could all be the answer. Cave if you're tribal enough might also cut it.
Alternately, Lingering Souls, Bloodghast, are all cards that require Raka to use more than one card to deal with.
Couldn't agree more. Sphinx is that one card that's going to put you over the top once you get to midgame. When you're sitting on one card in hand Turn 7 and it's a mana leak, you're going to wish that was a Sphinx's Revelation. Even casting it with X=3 is a huge blowout, and you can always cast it again later with snappy.
Also to address an earlier comment...path is probably the worst generic removal we have. Let's be honest; this is a tempo deck. Why would you give them an extra land, and counteract all the tempo advantage you've worked so hard to accumulate the past several turns? Well obviously to hit a creature that's out of range of our normal removal like goyf, but that's exactly the point. You should NOT be pathing small bros like mana dorks or Thalia or arbiter because that's just bad. Path is usually run as a 3-of because you probably need to see one or two over the course of the game, but you definitely don't want to draw all of them.
Electrolyze, on the other hand, fits the archetype of this deck like a boss. Sure it's only 2 damage, but it replaces itself! Against x/1's, it's almost a 3-for-1! Just the fact that it does something relevant, and then it replaces itself with something else that might be relevant too is simply backbreaking. Don't be so quick to dismiss it's advantages.
I'm a little confused. First you agree with that the deck is supposed to be slow and have Sphinx's Revelation, then you state that it's supposed to be a tempo deck. Not trying to be a jerk here, just to understand. If we're tempo, shouldn't we not be playing these slow cards like Revelation main? I can see boarding it in G2 and G3 against certain matchups, but your example of wanting to have Revelation versus Mana Leak on Turn 7 also goes the other way - I'd rather have a Path or Helix turn 1 or 2 against Affinity or Infect than Revelation. I may have missed something earlier, so if you're advocating having Revelation in the board then I think we're on the same page. But I don't understand it mainboard.
I'm a little confused. First you agree with that the deck is supposed to be slow and have Sphinx's Revelation, then you state that it's supposed to be a tempo deck. Not trying to be a jerk here, just to understand. If we're tempo, shouldn't we not be playing these slow cards like Revelation main? I can see boarding it in G2 and G3 against certain matchups, but your example of wanting to have Revelation versus Mana Leak on Turn 7 also goes the other way - I'd rather have a Path or Helix turn 1 or 2 against Affinity or Infect than Revelation. I may have missed something earlier, so if you're advocating having Revelation in the board then I think we're on the same page. But I don't understand it mainboard.
I guess I should've been a little more specific. I was agreeing with the fact that Cryptic Command is good, and that Sphinx's Revelation pretty much ends games, not with the fact that the deck is supposed to be 'slow'.
But more importantly, the Tempo archetype isn't defined by 'slow' or 'fast' cards; rather, it's about gaining small advantages with every spell you play. So Bolt and Helix fill this role by keeping the board clear from attackers and slowing down decks like Pod that rely on mana dorks to cheat out a T2 Pod. Remand delays an opponents spell, denying them some amount of board presence for a turn AND it cantrips, helping you hit your land drops or providing you with another tempo card to continue the pace. Electrolyze does a hybrid between the two, cantripping and helping to keep the board clear. Cryptic, while a little costly, is more effective at keeping tempo as the match moves into midgame, because at this point you need more bang per mana spent to keep ahead of your opponent.
However, because not every spell we have cantrips, the tempo advantage we gain in the early->midgame wears off as we enter mid->late game. This is where Revelation comes in. I am advocating Revelation in the main for a couple reasons. It is undeniably a tempo card; it is just a tempo card for a certain phase of the game (mid->late), just as Remand is best for early->mid. When you and your opponent are down to 0 or 1 or 2 cards, casting Revelation on 3 or 4 puts you so far ahead, and if that's not tempo, I don't know what is. Of course, drawing it early is a concern, but that's why I would only run 2. This way, chances are you won't see it for several turns, and if it does show up in your opener, there's even less of a chance the second one is there too.
You're also getting into specific matchups. Obviously, Revelation is not needed for Infect or Affinity matchups, and should be boarded out, but on average (unless your meta is aggro heavy), Revelation should be useful game 1 against more decks than not. Ultimately, it's a personal choice, but Revelation is just a blowout in my opinion.
Ehm not intended to be a jerk either but . . . tempo is about turns/mana-per-turn, not about how many cards you have.
CA is a control thing, sometimes a midrange element too, but NEVER a tempo one, or at least i see it that way.
The only reason remand is good is because once you have a threat out, say a geist, it helps delay the opponent/keeps the board clear for the threat to win as soon as possible, the fact that it cantrips is a nice bonus.
A midrange deck doesnt want to win ASAP, you will do it if the opportunity presents itself, but otherwise, you wanna go big with things like batterskull, baneslayer or thundermaw, and win the game through raw power and efficency.
I do understand why you think reveleation is good, and i wont deny it may have a place in a midrange deck featuring geist, i just dont see why you would want it in a tempo build.
Tempo should like the old delver lists, use fast and efficient beaters on turn 1/2 (i guess turn 3 geist is an exception to that rule) then counter/remove everything in your way to victory. If you get to 6/7 mana and still havent won, then im afraid your deck has already failed its objective, regardless of the outcome of the match itself.
Ehm not intended to be a jerk either but . . . tempo is about turns/mana-per-turn, not about how many cards you have.
CA is a control thing, sometimes a midrange element too, but NEVER a tempo one, or at least i see it that way.
The only reason remand is good is because once you have a threat out, say a geist, it helps delay the opponent/keeps the board clear for the threat to win as soon as possible, the fact that it cantrips is a nice bonus.
A midrange deck doesnt want to win ASAP, you will do it if the opportunity presents itself, but otherwise, you wanna go big with things like batterskull, baneslayer or thundermaw, and win the game through raw power and efficency.
I do understand why you think reveleation is good, and i wont deny it may have a place in a midrange deck featuring geist, i just dont see why you would want it in a tempo build.
Tempo should like the old delver lists, use fast and efficient beaters on turn 1/2 (i guess turn 3 geist is an exception to that rule) then counter/remove everything in your way to victory. If you get to 6/7 mana and still havent won, then im afraid your deck has already failed its objective, regardless of the outcome of the match itself.
Heh, I guess I have no idea what I'm talking about. I always thought Tempo literally meant 'tempo'; as in a constant pace or beat (could be the musician in me). You control the overall tempo of the game by playing efficient spells that keep you slightly ahead of your opponent. Maybe I'm just describing midrange...
I feel like you guys are getting a little too caught up in trying to define the deck's archetype and adhere to it. This is a midrange deck. It has control elements, it has aggro elements, it has tempo elements. But what really matters is what cards improve your win ratios in your particular meta, not what cards fit the archetype. At the end of the day, you're not playing an archetype, you're playing a deck, and what cards you need are going to depend on the meta, the matchup, even the specific board state, not on wether or not something is a "tempo card."
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penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
how would you deal with it? my plan is to sideboard 3 wrath effects, was considering a stony silence or two for spellskite (but don't know if that works), maybe a surgical extraction for his treefolk tutors / goyfs.
I feel like you guys are getting a little too caught up in trying to define the deck's archetype and adhere to it. This is a midrange deck. It has control elements, it has aggro elements, it has tempo elements. But what really matters is what cards improve your win ratios in your particular meta, not what cards fit the archetype. At the end of the day, you're not playing an archetype, you're playing a deck, and what cards you need are going to depend on the meta, the matchup, even the specific board state, not on wether or not something is a "tempo card."
I think this makes sense. I actually have no problem with Revelation, I just prefer it in the board. I think it would be very good in certain matchups and that's when I'd bring it out. I feel pre-board what we want to do in general is drop a Geist, do a lot of damage with it and then burn someone out or just ride it the whole way by protecting it. So to me that has a bit more of an aggro element to it and why I wouldn't want Revelation to start. When the deck becomes more controlling in nature, that's probably when I'd go for the Revelation. Like maybe against Pod? I could be wrong, but between removing mana dorks early on and trying to get Finks out of the way, I run out of gas. Revelation would be a good way to refill my hand and even get some life back out of nowhere if I'm racing against say a resolved Sigarda. I think it would work well since you can wait EOT leaving up removal in case they go for the combo. If they don't, drop a big Revelation and get ahead. This all being said, I haven't tried Revelation, but I plan to once it drops. It's a little pricey at this time - not worth $30 IMO, but that's another thing.
I feel like you guys are getting a little too caught up in trying to define the deck's archetype and adhere to it. This is a midrange deck. It has control elements, it has aggro elements, it has tempo elements. But what really matters is what cards improve your win ratios in your particular meta, not what cards fit the archetype. At the end of the day, you're not playing an archetype, you're playing a deck, and what cards you need are going to depend on the meta, the matchup, even the specific board state, not on wether or not something is a "tempo card."
Fair enough. The thing about defining the archetype was more an intent on my part to explain why revelations should go SB, but i guess you are right, if it works, it works, doesnt matter if it doesnt fit the archetype style.
Still, the whole thing revolves around revs working or not working in the main, and to that i say that i think it depends on how you approach the list and the deck itself.
If most of the time you are taking an aggresive approach, then i dont think sphinxs is for you.
Sometimes this approach will be correct, and others it wont, when its not, thats when you should side sphinxs and try to play a control-ish role.
I guess thats what i was trying to say by defining the archetype, even if it came out wrong.
how would you deal with it? my plan is to sideboard 3 wrath effects, was considering a stony silence or two for spellskite (but don't know if that works), maybe a surgical extraction for his treefolk tutors / goyfs.
Honestly, your friend's deck seems a case of "metagaming against friends", which is common in some groups. I remember many years ago when I started playing that a guy always won with his red burn deck, next thing I know is everybody is maindecking Chills and Circle of Protection: Red, hilarious
That treefolk deck presents a few problems, mainly a huge resilience to bolt, hate to your Snapcasters with DRS, a relatively fast clock, and spellskite which is yet another thing that protects him from bolt type effects.
Oh, and he ALSO has Dungrove Elver, the WUR nightmare with hexproof
Not gonna lie, it looks like a terrible matchups for you, but you can also go the same way and Sideboard the Geists, maindeck 4 Wrath effects and max out on Path to Exile.
Just having 4-5 wrath effects in your deck backed up by some Sphinx's Revelation will be enough to beat him since he only has 2 Toughtseizes and the deck FOLDS to mass removal
I know it means changing your deck a bit, but it's an idea. Maybe when you start beating him all the time he'll leave the deck alone
I feel like you guys are getting a little too caught up in trying to define the deck's archetype and adhere to it. This is a midrange deck. It has control elements, it has aggro elements, it has tempo elements. But what really matters is what cards improve your win ratios in your particular meta, not what cards fit the archetype. At the end of the day, you're not playing an archetype, you're playing a deck, and what cards you need are going to depend on the meta, the matchup, even the specific board state, not on wether or not something is a "tempo card."
This just says it all. IMO this deck is not "meant to be" slow (as some argue) nor fast. This is simply just midrange. I would say the resulting versatility is one of the key factors that make this deck effective.
In this MU is fundamental to keep a good hand. An hand with just a couple of good early cards is definitely an auto-mulligan here. We want so see at least one removal, and one cmc2 counter. Better if we have a snapcaster, too, to recycle them if they are discarded. Thoughtseize and Kozilek are the best start they can do against us. A good hand, with multiple threats, is the best way to start not to find ourselves in a very bad situation already at t2.
If they start slowly, is some sort of an auto-win here for us. We can remand and leak and burn and path and everything's gonna be good. But to survive the first turns we really need them to be slow, and in the average jund MU this does not happen. SO.
If they do a mana dork, we wanna burn it asap.
We also need to count their black mana, when they come to double black we need counters for liliana. Never drop a t3 geist if we're not sure about that. They can also PTE and Edge our colonnades so we need to pay attention here. Goyfs need to be pathed. Well, g1 has not very much to say about. Let's go to g2.
g2 post side is pretty interesting. The enter with Sword, Thrun, path, finks, and dunno what, actually. I went out with 4x GoST, 1x electrolyze, and came in with 1x path to exile, 2 sphinx's revelation, 2x wrath of god. Wraths are fundamental, here. Thrun is... yeah, we need to kill him. Path is for Goyfs and manlands and finks. If we come to cast SPhinx... guys, is nearly GG for us. EVen post SB MU is slightly favourable but always hard since if Liliana resolves it's pretty bad for us. The negative side of having SO few threats leaving out GoST is that we need to play as a 90% control deck, here. But it kinda works, actually. I also tried to come in with another lightning helix instead of mana leak but really, we need counters here. Spell Pierce would be better than Mana Leak, though. But i have not find a slot for them yet. BTW they'd be definitely useful here.
Don't take out the Geists, they are a nightmare for them if they don't have Liliana and even then they hate them with all their heart since they are so difficult to remove.
The best SB card in this matchups is, without doubt, Celestial Purge
I usually side out Cryptics (don't usually like them here) and Cliques and add Wraths and Celestial Purges.
I agree, this deck's greatest strength is the ability to shift almost seamlessly between the aggro role and the control roll as the matchup and the board state demands. You can crush with a turn 3 Geist and keep his path clear, or you can grind it out with a pile of removal, permission, and snapcasters. It all depends on the situation. I assume you've all read that article "who's the beatdown", but it bears mentioning because it really explicitly describes the nature of what makes this deck work. Anyone can pick it up and do pretty well, but a skilled pilot with an intimate understanding of when you need to apply pressure and when you need to hold back can make it sing.
"I am confident that if anyone actually
penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
Don't take out the Geists, they are a nightmare for them if they don't have Liliana and even then they hate them with all their heart since they are so difficult to remove.
The best SB card in this matchups is, without doubt, Celestial Purge
I usually side out Cryptics (don't usually like them here) and Cliques and add Wraths and Celestial Purges.
Actually i think boarding out geists is the right move.
They will definitly have liliana, and jund tends to run finks, goyf and souls, all of which are pretty good at dealing with him.
I wouldnt take out an electrolyze, however, unless i know for certain they dont play souls. electrolize and snapcaster are the only cards that allow us to out CA them, so taking it out seems wrong to me.
BTW, anybody considered turn/burn in the SB? It is a little expensive, but just the turn effect is good enough to warrant play, imo.
The combat tricks it allows are excellent, and its ability to deal with goyf shouldnt be underestimated.
Actually i think boarding out geists is the right move.
They will definitly have liliana, and jund tends to run finks, goyf and souls, all of which are pretty good at dealing with him.
I wouldnt take out an electrolyze, however, unless i know for certain they dont play souls. electrolize and snapcaster are the only cards that allow us to out CA them, so taking it out seems wrong to me.
BTW, anybody considered turn/burn in the SB? It is a little expensive, but just the turn effect is good enough to warrant play, imo.
The combat tricks it allows are excellent, and its ability to deal with goyf shouldnt be underestimated.
Cards that I want to try from Dragon's Maze are:
-Turn/Burn: great combat trick with Geist, can kill almost any creature, maybe too high mana cost?
-Rak Zarek: I think he is better than Ajani and I definitely want to play with him, but will the "tapping out on turn 4" be an issue? I am reluctant to anything that it's not instant.
-Council of the Absolute: I think people are underestimating this guy, but we have NEVER (I think) had a 4-toughness (non boltable) Meddling Mage type card. What I mean is that, resolve this against Scapeshift and they have almost NO ways of removing it, mainly double bolt or Cryptic, which should be very risky against a WUR deck which packs so much disruption. Besides, it slows them quite a lot.
Against Twin, same you can shut down pieces of their combo or even their remands while making yours cost only U!
And that's another thing I wanna say, this card is never dead since it can make your Revelations much better, Cryptics for 3 mana while shutting down opposing Cryptics, Remands, 2 mana planeswalkers, etc.
Lots of potential.
Again, the only thing I don't like is that is doesn't have Flash, but then it would probably be way overpowered.
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Kira is a sweet idea! I'll try that out
Legacy: Strawberry Shortcake, Aggro Loam, DnT+b
Modern: Devoted Karn
Vintage: Survival
Spellskite isn't THE answer, it simply is decent protection against quite a bit of the spot removal that UWr packs and would protect other creatures that you would prefer to have on the board.
Modern Warp / UR Control / UR Storm / Naya Breachshift / ElectroBalance
Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
UWRUWR Midrange/GeistRWU
Retired
GWBMelira PodBWG
With him running as infect, however, it makes it so that he runs against the win strategy of Zoo and wouldn't be a great include unless it was a stompy zoo variant. The two pronged directions of attack make for quite the awkward attempt (20 damage or 10 infect damage) at a win and gives UWr quite a few turns to simply hit straight at their face with Celestial Colonnade/Lightning Bolt/Lightning Helix/Geist of Saint Traft/Vendilion Clique/Restoration Angel/Electrolyze and protect themselves with board wipes or Cryptic Command.
I'm not sure that Phyrexian Crusader would be worth sideboarding unless infect plays into your win condition, then he's decent.
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Solidarity / Lands / Sneak and Show / Grixis Delver / Reanimator / Belcher / Storm / Dredge
He might not contribute to damage but a resolved Crusader puts a UWr player on a 5 turn clock with only cryptic (in some decks) to bounce it and snappy to block it. It's true, I don't know the ins and outs of Zoo, but sticking a neigh unremovable threat seems pretty dangerous to me. Perhaps the split focus of poison and damage detracts from a standard aggro plan, but there's also the fact to consider that no amount of Helix or Sphinx's lifegain can save you from poison.
UWRUWR Midrange/GeistRWU
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Thrun as a curve topper, a PW or... something like that could all be the answer. Cave if you're tribal enough might also cut it.
Alternately, Lingering Souls, Bloodghast, are all cards that require Raka to use more than one card to deal with.
I'm a little confused. First you agree with that the deck is supposed to be slow and have Sphinx's Revelation, then you state that it's supposed to be a tempo deck. Not trying to be a jerk here, just to understand. If we're tempo, shouldn't we not be playing these slow cards like Revelation main? I can see boarding it in G2 and G3 against certain matchups, but your example of wanting to have Revelation versus Mana Leak on Turn 7 also goes the other way - I'd rather have a Path or Helix turn 1 or 2 against Affinity or Infect than Revelation. I may have missed something earlier, so if you're advocating having Revelation in the board then I think we're on the same page. But I don't understand it mainboard.
I guess I should've been a little more specific. I was agreeing with the fact that Cryptic Command is good, and that Sphinx's Revelation pretty much ends games, not with the fact that the deck is supposed to be 'slow'.
But more importantly, the Tempo archetype isn't defined by 'slow' or 'fast' cards; rather, it's about gaining small advantages with every spell you play. So Bolt and Helix fill this role by keeping the board clear from attackers and slowing down decks like Pod that rely on mana dorks to cheat out a T2 Pod. Remand delays an opponents spell, denying them some amount of board presence for a turn AND it cantrips, helping you hit your land drops or providing you with another tempo card to continue the pace. Electrolyze does a hybrid between the two, cantripping and helping to keep the board clear. Cryptic, while a little costly, is more effective at keeping tempo as the match moves into midgame, because at this point you need more bang per mana spent to keep ahead of your opponent.
However, because not every spell we have cantrips, the tempo advantage we gain in the early->midgame wears off as we enter mid->late game. This is where Revelation comes in. I am advocating Revelation in the main for a couple reasons. It is undeniably a tempo card; it is just a tempo card for a certain phase of the game (mid->late), just as Remand is best for early->mid. When you and your opponent are down to 0 or 1 or 2 cards, casting Revelation on 3 or 4 puts you so far ahead, and if that's not tempo, I don't know what is. Of course, drawing it early is a concern, but that's why I would only run 2. This way, chances are you won't see it for several turns, and if it does show up in your opener, there's even less of a chance the second one is there too.
You're also getting into specific matchups. Obviously, Revelation is not needed for Infect or Affinity matchups, and should be boarded out, but on average (unless your meta is aggro heavy), Revelation should be useful game 1 against more decks than not. Ultimately, it's a personal choice, but Revelation is just a blowout in my opinion.
UWRUWR Midrange/GeistRWU
Retired
GWBMelira PodBWG
CA is a control thing, sometimes a midrange element too, but NEVER a tempo one, or at least i see it that way.
The only reason remand is good is because once you have a threat out, say a geist, it helps delay the opponent/keeps the board clear for the threat to win as soon as possible, the fact that it cantrips is a nice bonus.
A midrange deck doesnt want to win ASAP, you will do it if the opportunity presents itself, but otherwise, you wanna go big with things like batterskull, baneslayer or thundermaw, and win the game through raw power and efficency.
I do understand why you think reveleation is good, and i wont deny it may have a place in a midrange deck featuring geist, i just dont see why you would want it in a tempo build.
Tempo should like the old delver lists, use fast and efficient beaters on turn 1/2 (i guess turn 3 geist is an exception to that rule) then counter/remove everything in your way to victory. If you get to 6/7 mana and still havent won, then im afraid your deck has already failed its objective, regardless of the outcome of the match itself.
Heh, I guess I have no idea what I'm talking about. I always thought Tempo literally meant 'tempo'; as in a constant pace or beat (could be the musician in me). You control the overall tempo of the game by playing efficient spells that keep you slightly ahead of your opponent. Maybe I'm just describing midrange...
UWRUWR Midrange/GeistRWU
Retired
GWBMelira PodBWG
"I am confident that if anyone actually
penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
4 Treefolk Harbinger
3 Spellskite
3 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Doran, the Siege Tower
4 Dungrove Elder
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Temple Garden
3 Overgrown Tomb
3 Forest
3 Murmuring Bosk
2 Cavern of Souls
how would you deal with it? my plan is to sideboard 3 wrath effects, was considering a stony silence or two for spellskite (but don't know if that works), maybe a surgical extraction for his treefolk tutors / goyfs.
I think this makes sense. I actually have no problem with Revelation, I just prefer it in the board. I think it would be very good in certain matchups and that's when I'd bring it out. I feel pre-board what we want to do in general is drop a Geist, do a lot of damage with it and then burn someone out or just ride it the whole way by protecting it. So to me that has a bit more of an aggro element to it and why I wouldn't want Revelation to start. When the deck becomes more controlling in nature, that's probably when I'd go for the Revelation. Like maybe against Pod? I could be wrong, but between removing mana dorks early on and trying to get Finks out of the way, I run out of gas. Revelation would be a good way to refill my hand and even get some life back out of nowhere if I'm racing against say a resolved Sigarda. I think it would work well since you can wait EOT leaving up removal in case they go for the combo. If they don't, drop a big Revelation and get ahead. This all being said, I haven't tried Revelation, but I plan to once it drops. It's a little pricey at this time - not worth $30 IMO, but that's another thing.
Fair enough. The thing about defining the archetype was more an intent on my part to explain why revelations should go SB, but i guess you are right, if it works, it works, doesnt matter if it doesnt fit the archetype style.
Still, the whole thing revolves around revs working or not working in the main, and to that i say that i think it depends on how you approach the list and the deck itself.
If most of the time you are taking an aggresive approach, then i dont think sphinxs is for you.
Sometimes this approach will be correct, and others it wont, when its not, thats when you should side sphinxs and try to play a control-ish role.
I guess thats what i was trying to say by defining the archetype, even if it came out wrong.
Honestly, your friend's deck seems a case of "metagaming against friends", which is common in some groups. I remember many years ago when I started playing that a guy always won with his red burn deck, next thing I know is everybody is maindecking Chills and Circle of Protection: Red, hilarious
That treefolk deck presents a few problems, mainly a huge resilience to bolt, hate to your Snapcasters with DRS, a relatively fast clock, and spellskite which is yet another thing that protects him from bolt type effects.
Oh, and he ALSO has Dungrove Elver, the WUR nightmare with hexproof
Not gonna lie, it looks like a terrible matchups for you, but you can also go the same way and Sideboard the Geists, maindeck 4 Wrath effects and max out on Path to Exile.
Just having 4-5 wrath effects in your deck backed up by some Sphinx's Revelation will be enough to beat him since he only has 2 Toughtseizes and the deck FOLDS to mass removal
I know it means changing your deck a bit, but it's an idea. Maybe when you start beating him all the time he'll leave the deck alone
This just says it all. IMO this deck is not "meant to be" slow (as some argue) nor fast. This is simply just midrange. I would say the resulting versatility is one of the key factors that make this deck effective.
Modern Esper Midrange
EDH Jenara ETB
Don't take out the Geists, they are a nightmare for them if they don't have Liliana and even then they hate them with all their heart since they are so difficult to remove.
The best SB card in this matchups is, without doubt, Celestial Purge
I usually side out Cryptics (don't usually like them here) and Cliques and add Wraths and Celestial Purges.
"I am confident that if anyone actually
penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
Actually i think boarding out geists is the right move.
They will definitly have liliana, and jund tends to run finks, goyf and souls, all of which are pretty good at dealing with him.
I wouldnt take out an electrolyze, however, unless i know for certain they dont play souls. electrolize and snapcaster are the only cards that allow us to out CA them, so taking it out seems wrong to me.
BTW, anybody considered turn/burn in the SB? It is a little expensive, but just the turn effect is good enough to warrant play, imo.
The combat tricks it allows are excellent, and its ability to deal with goyf shouldnt be underestimated.
Cards that I want to try from Dragon's Maze are:
-Turn/Burn: great combat trick with Geist, can kill almost any creature, maybe too high mana cost?
-Rak Zarek: I think he is better than Ajani and I definitely want to play with him, but will the "tapping out on turn 4" be an issue? I am reluctant to anything that it's not instant.
-Council of the Absolute: I think people are underestimating this guy, but we have NEVER (I think) had a 4-toughness (non boltable) Meddling Mage type card. What I mean is that, resolve this against Scapeshift and they have almost NO ways of removing it, mainly double bolt or Cryptic, which should be very risky against a WUR deck which packs so much disruption. Besides, it slows them quite a lot.
Against Twin, same you can shut down pieces of their combo or even their remands while making yours cost only U!
And that's another thing I wanna say, this card is never dead since it can make your Revelations much better, Cryptics for 3 mana while shutting down opposing Cryptics, Remands, 2 mana planeswalkers, etc.
Lots of potential.
Again, the only thing I don't like is that is doesn't have Flash, but then it would probably be way overpowered.