Has anyone considered sidedecking Hide // Seek? The seek feature would do wonders at chewing up win-cons, especially when decks run singletons (Batterskull.)
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Pauper: UB Wight Phantasm RB Burn UR Faerie Rites of Initiation
Wow. The Seek part is excellent vs Tron. Nice tech and it's certainly quicker than Stain the Mind/Memoricide. I think we should look into Fiendslayer Paladin, too. It can't be Decayed, burned, etc. Definitely a sb consideration.
My version doesn't even run Dark Confidant because I run higher curved cards like Hero of Bladehold, Sorin, Lord of Innistrad, Elspeth, Knight-Errant, Restoration Angel, Utter End, and Baneslayer Angel.
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How does the deck perform without Bob? I really like this deck but don't own Bobs so I'm playing tokens instead. I thought Bob is essential for any modern midrange deck - as far as I can tell all successful BW/BGx lists always run a full playset. What's your meta? I guess he might not be as good in an aggro heavy one.
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Modern: BW Tokens, BW Deadguy Ale,RWG Burn, GBW Kitchen Company
Nice Primer and all, but does this really belong in the Established section? Established is for developed decks that make up the metagame. This section is also known as Tier 1.5-2, and as far as I know, this deck does not have the results to be in the Established forum.
My deck is on the previous page, but I'll repost it. I've made some adjustments, but the core of the deck is performing very well. See results above: 14-6
Nice Primer and all, but does this really belong in the Established section? Established is for developed decks that make up the metagame. This section is also known as Tier 1.5-2, and as far as I know, this deck does not have the results to be in the Established forum.
Shouldn't this be in MDC? It hasn't put up any major results that I know of.
As for the deck itself, it has way too many 3-drops.
BW Midrange has had a thread in established since the early summer, it just took some time to get a full primer. See deck eligibility criteria here; we're on the list.
The number of 3 drops is fine. We're not the kind of deck that always wants to play a specific card on turn 3, so "competing" for the 3 slot isn't an issue.
Wow. The Seek part is excellent vs Tron. Nice tech and it's certainly quicker than Stain the Mind/Memoricide. I think we should look into Fiendslayer Paladin, too. It can't be Decayed, burned, etc. Definitely a sb consideration.
Lost vs:
-Affinity: 1x
-Mono Red Burn: 1x
-Bogles: 1x
-BW Tokens: 2x
-UR Twin: 1x
I'm not surprised at your list of lost matches. Bogles, burn, and affinity are tough. BW Tokens is also probably a hair in their favor. It has good game against midrange decks.
Mirran Crusader is a boss right now. I stared down a Batterskull with him and kept my opponent in check for a while. I did come across an unlikely threat though: Jace, AoT. He made my Lingering Souls useless, as expected. Expect to see him pop up as an answer for Lingering Souls, which is popular in Junk too.
My deck is on the previous page, but I'll repost it. I've made some adjustments, but the core of the deck is performing very well. See results above: 14-6
HI, don't know if you still want advice? Your deck will do very bad against pod and twin. I won't disect your deck but you want 8 maindeck removal, 25 lands,4 pPack Rat and 4 Lingering Souls.
Thanks for the advice. I did lose to Pod tonight, ironically. That puts me at 1 and 1 vs Pod. I definitely want that 8th removal. The 25th land would help with my curve and 4 Lingering Souls is probably where I want to be. Thanks.
The curve in my deck is higher than typical BW/BG decks, so Dark Confidant would not work as well here. May opt for Sign in Blood or Phyrexian Arena.
I have yet to try any swords, but they seem like too much of a mana investment, and a bit slow, are they really worth the slot?... Also 4 fulminators seems like overkill. It also seems a strain on mana, with brimaz needing 2 white...
I do like the addition of runed halo... Makes scapeshift a much easier match game 1
There are 12 3-drops in Elenar's list, and Pack Rat effectively makes it 16. I'm going to say again that I feel like this deck has too many 3-drops.
That aside, this deck looks pretty interesting. It seems like a good alternative for people who don't want to shell out for Goyfs or just want a competitive black midrange deck that does something different than BGx.
There are 12 3-drops in Elenar's list, and Pack Rat effectively makes it 16. I'm going to say again that I feel like this deck has too many 3-drops.
That aside, this deck looks pretty interesting. It seems like a good alternative for people who don't want to shell out for Goyfs or just want a competitive black midrange deck that does something different than BGx.
Could you elaborate on what makes a large number of 3 drops bad? The majority of the best BW options are 3 drops (pack rat, Liliana, Brimaz, Lingering souls, fulminator, kitchen finks, phyrexian arena, blade splicer). In a few cases (brimaz and Liliana come to mind) their best attributes are the low 3 cmc. Our 4 cmc and greater threats are limited to Elspeth, sorin, resto angel, hero of bladehold, batterskull, phyrexian obliterator, and baneslayer angel. All of which are powerful, but not the kind of card you run as a 4x (a hand full of batterkulls would not be great, and flipping them off a bob would be even worse). If you mean the curve is too high, we have no choice. Comparing to jund (and including scooz as a 3 drop), they sit at 12. The 4 goyfs make 16. There's no replacement to Goyf (as the $200 price tag indicates), so I feel this deck is as equivalent as it gets.
There are 12 3-drops in Elenar's list, and Pack Rat effectively makes it 16. I'm going to say again that I feel like this deck has too many 3-drops.
That aside, this deck looks pretty interesting. It seems like a good alternative for people who don't want to shell out for Goyfs or just want a competitive black midrange deck that does something different than BGx.
Could you elaborate on what makes a large number of 3 drops bad? The majority of the best BW options are 3 drops (pack rat, Liliana, Brimaz, Lingering souls, fulminator, kitchen finks, phyrexian arena, blade splicer). In a few cases (brimaz and Liliana come to mind) their best attributes are the low 3 cmc. Our 4 cmc and greaterSols are limited to Elspeth, sorin, resto angel, hero of bladehold, batterskull, phyrexian obliterator, and baneslayer angel. All of which are powerful, but not the kind of card you run as a 4x (a hand full of batterkulls would not be great, and flipping them off a bob would be even worse). If you mean the curve is too high, we have no choice. Comparing to jund (and including scooz as a 3 drop), they sit at 12. The 4 goyfs make 16. There's no replacement to Goyf (as the $200 price tag indicates), so I feel this deck is as equivalent as it gets.
I couldn't have said it better. By the way, add Desecration Demon to the list of powerful 4 drops. This guy has been stellar in testing. I'm surprised because most Standard cards don't translate as well into Modern.
UB Wight Phantasm
RB Burn
UR Faerie Rites of Initiation
Legacy:
R Burn
CG-Post
Update:
I am currently 14-6 with my version!
Won vs:
-UW Tron: 2x
-Jund: 1x
-Hatebears: 2x
-Affinity: 2x
-Mono Red Burn: 1x
-Abzan Pod: 1x
-Junk: 2x
-UWR Flash: 2x
-Scapeshift: 1x
Lost vs:
-Affinity: 1x
-Mono Red Burn: 1x
-Bogles: 1x
-BW Tokens: 2x
-UR Twin: 1x
How does the deck perform without Bob? I really like this deck but don't own Bobs so I'm playing tokens instead. I thought Bob is essential for any modern midrange deck - as far as I can tell all successful BW/BGx lists always run a full playset. What's your meta? I guess he might not be as good in an aggro heavy one.
FREE BLOODBRAID ELF
Yin Yang: 14-6
2 Restoration Angel
2 Hero of Bladehold
2 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
3 Kitchen Finks
3 Mirran Crusader
3 Pack Rat
3 Tidehollow Sculler
Planeswalkers: 2
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Spells: 17
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Thoughtseize
4 Path to Exile
2 Darkblast
1 Utter End
3 Lingering Souls
4 Marsh Flats
4 Godless Shrine
2 Isolated Chapel
3 Plains
3 Swamp
2 Fetid Heath
1 Vault of the Archangel
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Mutavault
2 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Celestial Purge
1 Disenchant
2 Baneslayer Angel
3 Fulminator Mage
2 Stony Silence
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Wrath of God
As for the deck itself, it has way too many 3-drops.
11 is not a lot for this type of deck. Have you seen Hatebears? Midrange decks are heavier in this area.
BW Midrange has had a thread in established since the early summer, it just took some time to get a full primer. See deck eligibility criteria here; we're on the list.
The number of 3 drops is fine. We're not the kind of deck that always wants to play a specific card on turn 3, so "competing" for the 3 slot isn't an issue.
I'm not surprised at your list of lost matches. Bogles, burn, and affinity are tough. BW Tokens is also probably a hair in their favor. It has good game against midrange decks.
You have to count Pack Rat as a 3-drop. And 11 is a lot for this type of deck.
Also, this deck already has a name. It's called Deadguy Ale. Just saying.
Thanks for the advice. I did lose to Pod tonight, ironically. That puts me at 1 and 1 vs Pod. I definitely want that 8th removal. The 25th land would help with my curve and 4 Lingering Souls is probably where I want to be. Thanks.
The curve in my deck is higher than typical BW/BG decks, so Dark Confidant would not work as well here. May opt for Sign in Blood or Phyrexian Arena.
I really like your list, especially the Fulminator/Light and Shadow interaction. I'd move Runed to sb and run Liliana main.
I do like the addition of runed halo... Makes scapeshift a much easier match game 1
That aside, this deck looks pretty interesting. It seems like a good alternative for people who don't want to shell out for Goyfs or just want a competitive black midrange deck that does something different than BGx.
Modern:
Abzan Company
Abzan Midrange
GB Collected Elves
Legacy:
Junkblade
EDH:
Erebos, God of Black
You won't like Omnath when he's angry...
CEDH:
Meren, Clan of Vzlue
Could you elaborate on what makes a large number of 3 drops bad? The majority of the best BW options are 3 drops (pack rat, Liliana, Brimaz, Lingering souls, fulminator, kitchen finks, phyrexian arena, blade splicer). In a few cases (brimaz and Liliana come to mind) their best attributes are the low 3 cmc. Our 4 cmc and greater threats are limited to Elspeth, sorin, resto angel, hero of bladehold, batterskull, phyrexian obliterator, and baneslayer angel. All of which are powerful, but not the kind of card you run as a 4x (a hand full of batterkulls would not be great, and flipping them off a bob would be even worse). If you mean the curve is too high, we have no choice. Comparing to jund (and including scooz as a 3 drop), they sit at 12. The 4 goyfs make 16. There's no replacement to Goyf (as the $200 price tag indicates), so I feel this deck is as equivalent as it gets.
I couldn't have said it better. By the way, add Desecration Demon to the list of powerful 4 drops. This guy has been stellar in testing. I'm surprised because most Standard cards don't translate as well into Modern.
Update:
Yin Yang: 25-12
2 Baneslayer Angel
2 Desecration Demon
2 Hero of Bladehold
2 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
3 Pack Rat
3 Tidehollow Sculler
Planeswalkers: 2
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Spells: 20
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
4 Path to Exile
2 Darkblast
1 Smother
1 Utter End
2 Runed Halo
4 Lingering Souls
4 Marsh Flats
4 Godless Shrine
3 Isolated Chapel
3 Plains
3 Swamp
2 Fetid Heath
1 Vault of the Archangel
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Mutavault
2 Liliana of the Veil
1 Celestial Purge
1 Disenchant
2 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
3 Fulminator Mage
2 Stony Silence
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Wrath of God
Honorable Mentions: Precinct Captain/Nantuko Shade
3:
Honorable Mentions: Vampire Nighthawk/Aven Mindcensor
4:
Honorable Mentions: Emeria Angel/Linvala, Keeper of Silence
5:
Honorable Mentions: Divinity of the Pride/Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon
This list is for those who want to expiriment with different viable options. Enjoy brewing!