R1 Jund 2-0
R2 Storm 2-1
R3 Humans 1-2
R4 Adnasuem 2-0
R5 Merfolk 2-0
R6 steam-kin red 2-0
R7 Bant spirits 2-0
R8 Bant Spirits 0-2 (Oscar Christensen : Pro from Denmark)
R9 Bant Spirits 0-2
R10 Burn 2-1 (Lucas Keifer)
R11 Humans 2-1 (Javiar Dominguez: reigning world champ)
R12 UW Control 2-0 (Luis Salvatto: reigning player of the year)
R13 UW Spirits 1-2 (i punted about times in this match and should've easily won (p.s. spell queller you don't haveto cast the card under))
R14 UW Control 2-0 (Peter Ingram : SCG Pro)
R15 Amulet Titan 0-2 (first bad matchup i had to play other than ad nasuem)
Congrats.
I always want a catch-all in anything but an aggro deck so Cast Out might be a viable alternative to Anguished Unmaking.
Cast Out / Anguished Unmaking are both necessary evils imo. As in, you should be playing 1 of them but you don't want to. I usually play 1 or 2 in the board. We sort of just have to hope we can thoughtseize the planeswalkers / bloodmoons / Ugins / etc and win quickly. If they play a planeswalker they are going to get at least a card off of it or some sort of value the turn they play it so we always get 2-for-1ed if we play Cast Out / Anguished. Hero's Downfall is the same but more narrow but it's serviceable as a main deck card.
I'll also point out that Cast Out is too expensive in my experience. I don't want to take a turn off to get 2-for-1ed by Teferi. Also, the life loss of Anguished rarely matters in the match ups you want it in.
I ran a Cast Out in my main for a couple weeks (I know it is not much, but it is something) and it only felt good in 2 occasions:
1- When we were already ahead and opp had a nice (non-creature) topdeck. In that case you could argue as well that if we had had a threat in hand instead, we could close up the game before opp gets to that topdeck, so... meh.
2- When you **** up with SB. Opp playing soul sisters brought Ghostly Prison from SB. Didnt see it coming and had to scoop up with BB in play.
I dont like reducing the consistency of the deck but including catch-all low-efficiency answers. Before SB, we should try to do our thing the best we can, so Zealous Persecution has filled that gap for me (already shinning in the first FNM I played it in, winning me games against spirits and sort-of-affinity with blast effects). After SB, we should know what to bring in. You can of course make mistakes, but practice can help you in that regard. And if failing once against every matchup makes me learn and gets me to use more focused and efficient SB answers, then I am happy failing.
Ya, I think just about any token deck wants 2 in the 75. Right now I have both of mine in the sideboard because I have been playing against a lot of BGx. I play a build with fewer tokens than usual so I don't want to be caught with no creatures and a pump spell in hand haha.
I've started playing ZP over board wipes in the side board. I have a ton of 1-for-1 removal so the only decks I need board wipes for are the go wide decks like mardu / humans / spirits / storm. Against Humans and Spirits ZP sometimes isn't good enough unless you have some tokens to block with but you usually do. And it's a Thalia killer which is often good enough.
I've also cut EE. It was only really there for tokens and a half-boardwipe against the vial decks but ZP is more versatile.
Hi, I am interested into playing this archetype, is it worth to start with ht modern event deck from 2014? it goes for 109 on amazon and will save me chasing some cards around and it seems good value too
Hi, I am interested into playing this archetype, is it worth to start with ht modern event deck from 2014? it goes for 109 on amazon and will save me chasing some cards around and it seems good value too
I would personally advise against the modern event deck. To get the more expensive cards bid on ebay. ebay also have 15% to sometimes 20% off of cars. Use to discounts to get the cards.
Hi, I am interested into playing this archetype, is it worth to start with ht modern event deck from 2014? it goes for 109 on amazon and will save me chasing some cards around and it seems good value too
The Event deck doesn't really have any of the more expensive cards the deck usually runs; therefore, I doubt it's worth buying but it would take some analysis to be certain. It might be worth it to get started sooner and to allow time for the upgrades, but the Event deck is probably not worth anywhere near the retail price in the long run.
Raise the Alarm is fine but some people prefer Bitterblossom. Three Zealous Persecution is perhaps too many but some number usually find their way into most decks either main-deck or side-board. A single copy of Windbrisk Heights might be okay, four is just nuts.
Don't rush out and buy everything in my list. It's only a place to start a discussion. Bitterblossom or Raise the Alarm is the first big question you must decide upon. The rest is tuning. My side-board is rather a pile of crap right now, it needs some grave-hate and probably a sweeper or two.
Hi, I am interested into playing this archetype, is it worth to start with ht modern event deck from 2014? it goes for 109 on amazon and will save me chasing some cards around and it seems good value too
The Event deck doesn't really have any of the more expensive cards the deck usually runs; therefore, I doubt it's worth buying but it would take some analysis to be certain. It might be worth it to get started sooner and to allow time for the upgrades, but the Event deck is probably not worth anywhere near the retail price in the long run.
Raise the Alarm is fine but some people prefer Bitterblossom. Three Zealous Persecution is perhaps too many but some number usually find their way into most decks either main-deck or side-board. A single copy of Windbrisk Heights might be okay, four is just nuts.
Don't rush out and buy everything in my list. It's only a place to start a discussion. Bitterblossom or Raise the Alarm is the first big question you must decide upon. The rest is tuning. My side-board is rather a pile of crap right now, it needs some grave-hate and probably a sweeper or two.
Thanks a lot for the detailed breakdown.
Right now seems like the moment to buy Bitterblossom because it is sitting at 30 with the release of UMA, if going this route are the 4 the optimal, or 3 can do the job?
I won't get fetches until next year and I will go for the shocklands as soon as the new set is released and grab them as cheap as possible. In the meantime, what do you think is better for this deck: fastlands or check lands?
Right now seems like the moment to buy Bitterblossom because it is sitting at 30 with the release of UMA, if going this route are the 4 the optimal, or 3 can do the job?
I won't get fetches until next year and I will go for the shocklands as soon as the new set is released and grab them as cheap as possible. In the meantime, what do you think is better for this deck: fastlands or check lands?
Three Bitterblossoms seem to be most common but some do play all four. Shock-lands seem pretty cheap now; I just bought some Temple Gardens a $6 apiece. Start with some W fetches from Khans, then get Marsh Flats as you are able. You'll probably want eight fetches in total anyway.
Do not waste any money on check-lands; get fast-lands. Pain-lands are (generally) better than check-lands. Check-lands are the worst of the dual-colored lot.
I wanted to give a shout out to the Bw Tokens players... played my Rock deck against a BW Token Planeswalker deck and got crushed. The deck looked amazing. Just continued to apply pressure. I think it is positioed well, and I just may have to sleeve up a deck of my own.
Private Mod Note
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He raged at the world, at his family, at his life. But mostly he just raged.
Modern: BG Rock, Grixis Control, UW Control
Commander: Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
"Win or lose, naught to choose - all men are equal when their memory fades. No one knows, friends or foes, if Valhalla lies beyond the grave." - Motörhead “Deaf Forever”
BW tokens is usually a bad match-up for BGx. Grim Flayer can help with that but he isn't popular these days. Trample is really bad for the chumps. Rex can help too if he can dodge a bullet for a turn or two but nobody has any love for the big guy anymore.
Manabase is still a long way obviously (can get fastlands and cave of kolios in the meantime), thoughtseize I will get next year too and in the meantime I can put in some duress.
My main questions to start experimenting and testing,
1.- From the token generator which is your favorite?
2.- Old lists had 3-4 Auriok Champion, I have a set so I could try them, are they worth? or just too slow? maybe only as SB vs Jund/Grixis and burn?
Manabase is still a long way obviously (can get fastlands and cave of kolios in the meantime), thoughtseize I will get next year too and in the meantime I can put in some duress.
My main questions to start experimenting and testing,
1.- From the token generator which is your favorite?
2.- Old lists had 3-4 Auriok Champion, I have a set so I could try them, are they worth? or just too slow? maybe only as SB vs Jund/Grixis and burn?
Lingering Souls is the best token generator. Spectral Procession is probably next. Bitterblossom and Raise the Alarm are both good; one or the other is nearly always played and a mix is fine too. Start is a mediocre token generator at best but it has a mediocre removal spell in Finish attached to it so it seems some play as a one or two-of.
Auriok Champion is not a bad card but it has fallen out of favor lately. Sorin, Solemn Visitor and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar are the only plainswalkers that see frequent play. Sorin, Lord of Innistrad gets a mention and a try-out now and then, but isn't generally regarded as worthwhile. Elspeth, Knight-Errant is not awful and Elspeth Tirel was once regarded as the premier PW for the deck but has fallen out of use entirely. Modern is just too fast now for five-mana cards in decks without acceleration.
Windbrisk Heights is not worth playing in my view; I ran it for a long time and it usually bit me in the butt and I don't think it ever really accomplished anything. If you want to try one, go for it.
Most lists have run only the four Intangible Virtues as dedicated anthems for a good long while now. There are other, anthem-like effects available and there are just too many other needs for the deck. More anthems means an more aggro approach and that is just not what the deck is good at. It's solidly mid-range and needs to grind.
Congrats.
I always want a catch-all in anything but an aggro deck so Cast Out might be a viable alternative to Anguished Unmaking.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
I'll also point out that Cast Out is too expensive in my experience. I don't want to take a turn off to get 2-for-1ed by Teferi. Also, the life loss of Anguished rarely matters in the match ups you want it in.
1- When we were already ahead and opp had a nice (non-creature) topdeck. In that case you could argue as well that if we had had a threat in hand instead, we could close up the game before opp gets to that topdeck, so... meh.
2- When you **** up with SB. Opp playing soul sisters brought Ghostly Prison from SB. Didnt see it coming and had to scoop up with BB in play.
I dont like reducing the consistency of the deck but including catch-all low-efficiency answers. Before SB, we should try to do our thing the best we can, so Zealous Persecution has filled that gap for me (already shinning in the first FNM I played it in, winning me games against spirits and sort-of-affinity with blast effects). After SB, we should know what to bring in. You can of course make mistakes, but practice can help you in that regard. And if failing once against every matchup makes me learn and gets me to use more focused and efficient SB answers, then I am happy failing.
BW BW Tokens
RG Dredgeplendid Reclamation
RW Boros Burn
GB Elves
RB Dark Goblins
WU Azorius' Relic
BW BW Tokens
RG Dredgeplendid Reclamation
RW Boros Burn
GB Elves
RB Dark Goblins
WU Azorius' Relic
I've started playing ZP over board wipes in the side board. I have a ton of 1-for-1 removal so the only decks I need board wipes for are the go wide decks like mardu / humans / spirits / storm. Against Humans and Spirits ZP sometimes isn't good enough unless you have some tokens to block with but you usually do. And it's a Thalia killer which is often good enough.
I've also cut EE. It was only really there for tokens and a half-boardwipe against the vial decks but ZP is more versatile.
I would personally advise against the modern event deck. To get the more expensive cards bid on ebay. ebay also have 15% to sometimes 20% off of cars. Use to discounts to get the cards.
The Event deck doesn't really have any of the more expensive cards the deck usually runs; therefore, I doubt it's worth buying but it would take some analysis to be certain. It might be worth it to get started sooner and to allow time for the upgrades, but the Event deck is probably not worth anywhere near the retail price in the long run.
Here's my breakdown:
4 Lingering Souls
4 Spectral Procession
3 Path to Exile
4 Intangible Virtue
5 Plains
4 Swamp
1 Vault of the Archangel
Four Swamps is way too many. Five Plains is close to the right number. Two Inquisition of Kozilek is not enough.
3 Zealous Persecution
4 Windbrisk Heights
Raise the Alarm is fine but some people prefer Bitterblossom. Three Zealous Persecution is perhaps too many but some number usually find their way into most decks either main-deck or side-board. A single copy of Windbrisk Heights might be okay, four is just nuts.
2 Soul Warden
3 Tidehollow Sculler
2 Shrine of Loyal Legions
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
3 Honor of the Pure
4 Caves of Koilos
2 City of Brass
4 Isolated Chapel
This stuff is mostly junk. Elspeth, Knight-Errant isn't awful, but she isn't the best Plainswalker for and rarely sees play in BW tokens.
2 Dismember
3 Duress
2 Ghost Quarter
3 Kataki, War's Wage
3 Relic of Progenitus
All of these side-board cards are sometimes played in some quantity. None are staples.
If you compare this with any reasonable list, you'll see all of the money cards are not included here.
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
3x Path to Exile
2x Thoughtseize
1x Cast Down
1x Collective Brutality
4x Intangible Virtue
4x Raise the Alarm
1x Zealous Persecution
1x Anguished Unmaking
4x Lingering Souls
1x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
4x Spectral Procession
1x Start // Finish
2x Fetid Heath
2x Godless Shrine
4x Marsh Flats
2x Plains
3x Shambling Vent
1x Shefet Dunes
1x Swamp
1x Vault of the Archangel
4x Windswept Heath
1x Slaughter Pact
1x Darkblast
1x Duress
1x Batwing Brume
2x Blessed Alliance
1x Cast Down
1x Collective Brutality
2x Damping Sphere
2x Stony Silence
1x Zealous Persecution
2x Anguished Unmaking
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Thanks a lot for the detailed breakdown.
Right now seems like the moment to buy Bitterblossom because it is sitting at 30 with the release of UMA, if going this route are the 4 the optimal, or 3 can do the job?
I won't get fetches until next year and I will go for the shocklands as soon as the new set is released and grab them as cheap as possible. In the meantime, what do you think is better for this deck: fastlands or check lands?
Three Bitterblossoms seem to be most common but some do play all four. Shock-lands seem pretty cheap now; I just bought some Temple Gardens a $6 apiece. Start with some W fetches from Khans, then get Marsh Flats as you are able. You'll probably want eight fetches in total anyway.
Do not waste any money on check-lands; get fast-lands. Pain-lands are (generally) better than check-lands. Check-lands are the worst of the dual-colored lot.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Modern: BG Rock, Grixis Control, UW Control
Commander: Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
"Win or lose, naught to choose - all men are equal when their memory fades. No one knows, friends or foes, if Valhalla lies beyond the grave." - Motörhead “Deaf Forever”
BW BW Tokens
RG Dredgeplendid Reclamation
RW Boros Burn
GB Elves
RB Dark Goblins
WU Azorius' Relic
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
3 Raise the Alarm
4 Spectral Procession
4 Lingering Souls
2 Timely Reinforcements
2 Start // Finish
//Disruption
2 Zealous Persecution
3 Path to exile
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Fatal Push
2 Sorin, Solemn Visitor
//Enchantments
2 Bitterblossom
2 Legion's Landing
4 Intangible Virtue
//Lands
2 Concealed Courtyard
1 Vault of the Archangel
1 Shambling Vent
15 Plains
5 Swamp
Manabase is still a long way obviously (can get fastlands and cave of kolios in the meantime), thoughtseize I will get next year too and in the meantime I can put in some duress.
My main questions to start experimenting and testing,
1.- From the token generator which is your favorite?
2.- Old lists had 3-4 Auriok Champion, I have a set so I could try them, are they worth? or just too slow? maybe only as SB vs Jund/Grixis and burn?
3.- Which other planeswalkers should I try first along sorin, elspeth, knight errand or Gideon, Ally of zendikar?
4.- How good is Windbrisk Heights? worth including 1-2?
5.- Anthems, are the 4 intangible virtue enough? I have honor of the pure and spear of heliod at hand so I could try them.
Thanks a lot again
Lingering Souls is the best token generator. Spectral Procession is probably next. Bitterblossom and Raise the Alarm are both good; one or the other is nearly always played and a mix is fine too. Start is a mediocre token generator at best but it has a mediocre removal spell in Finish attached to it so it seems some play as a one or two-of.
Auriok Champion is not a bad card but it has fallen out of favor lately. Sorin, Solemn Visitor and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar are the only plainswalkers that see frequent play. Sorin, Lord of Innistrad gets a mention and a try-out now and then, but isn't generally regarded as worthwhile. Elspeth, Knight-Errant is not awful and Elspeth Tirel was once regarded as the premier PW for the deck but has fallen out of use entirely. Modern is just too fast now for five-mana cards in decks without acceleration.
Windbrisk Heights is not worth playing in my view; I ran it for a long time and it usually bit me in the butt and I don't think it ever really accomplished anything. If you want to try one, go for it.
Most lists have run only the four Intangible Virtues as dedicated anthems for a good long while now. There are other, anthem-like effects available and there are just too many other needs for the deck. More anthems means an more aggro approach and that is just not what the deck is good at. It's solidly mid-range and needs to grind.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn