Are there ways to attack KCI that aren't straightforward? Currently it seems you either need graveyard hate/Surgical Extraction or you just lose.
There's really no other way to do it. KCI is one of those decks that's just a check on the format. Do you have graveyard hate? If so you can win, if not then you lose. There's no other way to attack them other than "kill their lynchpin artifacts and surgical them out of the yard so they can't be recurred".
In any case I went 1-4 tonight. Beat storm handily, then lost twice to burn and twice to abzan. Burn's just a complete mess, 2 CB and 2 Kambal aren't enough but I can't think of anything else that could tip the scales that much.
Abzan was just a grind that was so tilt-inducing at the end it killed any thoughts I had at playing in the SCGOpen tomorrow. Siege Rhino is next to impossible to stop, bedlam reveler felt dead super often between pulse, path, Liliana's -2 and goyfs; and when I cut all my discard like the sideboard guide says, they kept all theirs in and I was very quickly stuck in topdeck mode facing down a pair of 4/5s and a lily ready to ult while I only have 3 lands and nothing in my graveyard to flash back.
what am I missing?
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Top 16 - 2012 Indiana State Championships Currently Playing: GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Usually against Abzan, I find Blood Moon strongly restricts their ability to actually... do things. But while I think we're favoured, we're not that favoured.
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Well, I can saw a woman in two, but you won't wanna look in the box when I'm through.
Burn's just a complete mess, 2 CB and 2 Kambal aren't enough but I can't think of anything else that could tip the scales that much.
Maybe working in a third Collective Brutality into the 75? Timely Reinforcments could also work as a meta call if there's a lot of Burn in your area.
I suggested a Soren, Solemn Visitor a couple pages back, as it always did a great job stabilizing me (esp. against Burn) back when I played Mardu tokens. I'm not sure it fits into this shell as well, or maybe it's just too win-more/high-variance, and some sort of lifegain sorcery/instant is better, as those feed Revelers as well. That being said, if you have even a meager boardstate, the lifelink can really help bridge you into a lategame, where we're generally favored I think.
Speaking of lifelink, the other card I was wondering about was a single Vault of the Archangel. It's colorless, but the deathtouch and lifelink are great in creature and grindy matchups. Trading a token for a 5/6 Goyf and gaining back a life is always nice. Since it's colorless, does that preclude running a single plains to make sure we don't get taken off white, especially post-board? I hate the thought of being locked into 2 sunburst or not being able to cast Tear :/
Right now I'm trying to figure out which manabase is better;
Maybe having Ensnaring Bridge in the board could help? You could easily make it so your tokens can sneak under it whilst keeping their big beaters at bay, and it might be useful in other matchups like E-tron and Humans.
In any case I went 1-4 tonight. Beat storm handily, then lost twice to burn and twice to abzan. Burn's just a complete mess, 2 CB and 2 Kambal aren't enough but I can't think of anything else that could tip the scales that much.
Abzan was just a grind that was so tilt-inducing at the end it killed any thoughts I had at playing in the SCGOpen tomorrow. Siege Rhino is next to impossible to stop, bedlam reveler felt dead super often between pulse, path, Liliana's -2 and goyfs; and when I cut all my discard like the sideboard guide says, they kept all theirs in and I was very quickly stuck in topdeck mode facing down a pair of 4/5s and a lily ready to ult while I only have 3 lands and nothing in my graveyard to flash back.
what am I missing?
Was it normal Abzan or Abzan Traverse?
Specifically Abzan Traverse has a favouarble matchup against us, as Leonardo who got second at Sao Paulo claims. Trample is the key here. It seems really weird that your opponent kept all discard and especially LoTV after g1. LotV is really bad against us.
Questioning how good Hazoret actually is? I read only positive things about her here, and on reddit too, but for some reason the big "succesful" lists from large events don't run her at all...
If I go with only 3 Gravehatepieces in the board (2 Nihil, 1 Surgical as you all suggested) instead of 4, I could shove her in. Is she really worth it?
She wins me so much games! Would never cut this 1-of from the deck
In general I agree on the assessment but I still don't like leaving in LoTV from the Abzan side. The risk of playing her, plussing her and then the opponent discarding a Souls is too much imo. I think a singleton hazoret is not the biggest argument, since we run 2 paths, the odds are alone for that reason in our favour to have the answer compared to the opponent having Hazoret without an answer.
And I think personally, before Lilis plus ability really strips resources from the opponents hand she helps the opponent exectue its gameplan: Binning Souls and powering out revelers. I think its too risky for that reason.
Usually against Abzan, I find Blood Moon strongly restricts their ability to actually... do things. But while I think we're favoured, we're not that favoured.
In the 5 games I found blood moon one time, after they'd already fetched out 4 basics. I know adding a third isn't the answer but it seems to only ever show up in the matches where it's irrelevant.
Specifically Abzan Traverse has a favouarble matchup against us, as Leonardo who got second at Sao Paulo claims. Trample is the key here. It seems really weird that your opponent kept all discard and especially LoTV after g1. LotV is really bad against us.
One was probably abzan traverse, I never saw Traverse the Ulvenwald but did see a grim flayer. The other was closer to abzan superfriends with LotV, Gideon, Ally of Zendikar, and Sorin, Solemn Visitor alongside birds of paradise to ramp into them, plus the usual suite of discard and rhinos and goyfs and removal. Both times after board I just had no way to interact with them and they 1-for-1 me to death.
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Top 16 - 2012 Indiana State Championships Currently Playing: GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Just getting back into magic, can someone get me in on the loop why we are playing Wear // Tear instead of Hide // Seek?
Hide covers Wear or Tear, and seek can come in vs big mana decks/decks that have 1-2 finishers.
Obviously I'm missing something so let me know,
You're more likely to see Mishra's Bauble if it was traverse. Traverse is 3-of in most lists these days whereas Bauble is always 4-of.
I never saw bauble from the guy that had the flayer. I do remember that he questioned why I boarded in Wear // Tear, it was because I expected leyline of the void form his board. He said he plays Nihil spellbomb because it's an artifact for delirium.
I will admit that hide//seek is a clean answer to wurmcoil engine, but that's not really what we're wanting in artifact/enchantment hate, and with fetches in the format it's only a matter of time before they turn it live again.
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I would not expect Leyline from any GBx deck, unless the meta is heavily infested with GY based decks, which is not really the case. So you can skip on Wear // Tear.
Out of that changes, LtLH over LoTV makes very much sense to me. LoTV is very bad when you think about Hollow One, Humans, the mirror Affinity etc. The only argument for her would be Control in my mind. But here LtLH is also decent. Its similar to what Emma Handy wrote in her article. I would still play BM though and no Godless Shrine.
In my mind disruption like counters are simply not enough if you can't provide a fast clock, which Grixis also wouldn't be able to do. So against Tron this arguable doesn't change at all. And i think having access to Kambal means our Combo matchups are fairly okay already. So all in all I don't think it would be very useful.
Dudes, I like ideia to run 2 LTLH MD, but I continue run 2 Blood moon MD, i replace one blood Crypt for one mountain and one Sacred Foundry for the godless shire, and now i replace 3 molten rain for 3 Fulminator Mage for the LTLH destruction land plan.
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Modern:
Mardu Pyromancer
Grixis Shadow
Traverse Shadow
Jund
Abzan
The Rock
On the topic of Liliana, I've tried both and have yet to be impressed by either of them in this deck. Much of the time LotV acts like an over-costed removal spell and LtLH is like half a K-Command.
Perhaps I haven't tried enough games with them, but recently I've been happier with 2-3 blood moons and no planeswalkers. Anyone have some thoughts on this?
Exacly, in my LGS have many grinds matchups, i went 3-1-1 FNM lose to Bant Spirits, Drow wifh mono white taxes, and win mirror and affinity. My Current sideboard is:
3 FM
2 wear / tear
1 CB
2 Goblin Rablemaster
2 Kambal
3 Nihil spellbomb
1 EE
1 Anger of the gods
And i play two blood moons e two LTLH MB, and rest same list off marjor.
Edit: This side i changed after the FNM.
Edit 2: Delver, can you make sideboard plan to spirits, i think is one match wee sse more and more.
There's really no other way to do it. KCI is one of those decks that's just a check on the format. Do you have graveyard hate? If so you can win, if not then you lose. There's no other way to attack them other than "kill their lynchpin artifacts and surgical them out of the yard so they can't be recurred".
In any case I went 1-4 tonight. Beat storm handily, then lost twice to burn and twice to abzan. Burn's just a complete mess, 2 CB and 2 Kambal aren't enough but I can't think of anything else that could tip the scales that much.
Abzan was just a grind that was so tilt-inducing at the end it killed any thoughts I had at playing in the SCGOpen tomorrow. Siege Rhino is next to impossible to stop, bedlam reveler felt dead super often between pulse, path, Liliana's -2 and goyfs; and when I cut all my discard like the sideboard guide says, they kept all theirs in and I was very quickly stuck in topdeck mode facing down a pair of 4/5s and a lily ready to ult while I only have 3 lands and nothing in my graveyard to flash back.
what am I missing?
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP
Maybe working in a third Collective Brutality into the 75? Timely Reinforcments could also work as a meta call if there's a lot of Burn in your area.
I suggested a Soren, Solemn Visitor a couple pages back, as it always did a great job stabilizing me (esp. against Burn) back when I played Mardu tokens. I'm not sure it fits into this shell as well, or maybe it's just too win-more/high-variance, and some sort of lifegain sorcery/instant is better, as those feed Revelers as well. That being said, if you have even a meager boardstate, the lifelink can really help bridge you into a lategame, where we're generally favored I think.
Speaking of lifelink, the other card I was wondering about was a single Vault of the Archangel. It's colorless, but the deathtouch and lifelink are great in creature and grindy matchups. Trading a token for a 5/6 Goyf and gaining back a life is always nice. Since it's colorless, does that preclude running a single plains to make sure we don't get taken off white, especially post-board? I hate the thought of being locked into 2 sunburst or not being able to cast Tear :/
Right now I'm trying to figure out which manabase is better;
A)
B)
or
C)
Any thoughts would be appreciated.
Maybe having Ensnaring Bridge in the board could help? You could easily make it so your tokens can sneak under it whilst keeping their big beaters at bay, and it might be useful in other matchups like E-tron and Humans.
Was it normal Abzan or Abzan Traverse?
Specifically Abzan Traverse has a favouarble matchup against us, as Leonardo who got second at Sao Paulo claims. Trample is the key here. It seems really weird that your opponent kept all discard and especially LoTV after g1. LotV is really bad against us.
She wins me so much games! Would never cut this 1-of from the deck
And I think personally, before Lilis plus ability really strips resources from the opponents hand she helps the opponent exectue its gameplan: Binning Souls and powering out revelers. I think its too risky for that reason.
In the 5 games I found blood moon one time, after they'd already fetched out 4 basics. I know adding a third isn't the answer but it seems to only ever show up in the matches where it's irrelevant.
One was probably abzan traverse, I never saw Traverse the Ulvenwald but did see a grim flayer. The other was closer to abzan superfriends with LotV, Gideon, Ally of Zendikar, and Sorin, Solemn Visitor alongside birds of paradise to ramp into them, plus the usual suite of discard and rhinos and goyfs and removal. Both times after board I just had no way to interact with them and they 1-for-1 me to death.
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP
Just getting back into magic, can someone get me in on the loop why we are playing Wear // Tear instead of Hide // Seek?
Hide covers Wear or Tear, and seek can come in vs big mana decks/decks that have 1-2 finishers.
Obviously I'm missing something so let me know,
Thanks!
RGW Naya Company
RWB Mardu Control
I never saw bauble from the guy that had the flayer. I do remember that he questioned why I boarded in Wear // Tear, it was because I expected leyline of the void form his board. He said he plays Nihil spellbomb because it's an artifact for delirium.
I will admit that hide//seek is a clean answer to wurmcoil engine, but that's not really what we're wanting in artifact/enchantment hate, and with fetches in the format it's only a matter of time before they turn it live again.
Currently Playing:
GBStandard - Golgari Safari MidrangeBG
RBWModern - Mardu PyromancerWBR
RLegacy - Good Old Fashioned BurnR
Clan Contest 3 Mafia - Mafia Co-MVP
Mardu Pyromancer
Grixis Shadow
Traverse Shadow
Jund
Abzan
The Rock
Perhaps I haven't tried enough games with them, but recently I've been happier with 2-3 blood moons and no planeswalkers. Anyone have some thoughts on this?
3 FM
2 wear / tear
1 CB
2 Goblin Rablemaster
2 Kambal
3 Nihil spellbomb
1 EE
1 Anger of the gods
And i play two blood moons e two LTLH MB, and rest same list off marjor.
Edit: This side i changed after the FNM.
Edit 2: Delver, can you make sideboard plan to spirits, i think is one match wee sse more and more.
Mardu Pyromancer
Grixis Shadow
Traverse Shadow
Jund
Abzan
The Rock
Yes, thats the next point on my list. I noticed the rise too, and am figuring out the SB plan.
In: wear / tear (Abeiance plan)
LTHL
EE
Anger
Molten Rain
Out
Komand
TS
Mardu Pyromancer
Grixis Shadow
Traverse Shadow
Jund
Abzan
The Rock