I was surprised at how often Hex Drinker just came down as a 4/4 pro instants. It's a pretty decent top deck and not a bad opener. Better than just playing out a ETB tapped land for sure.
I've been playing the Hexdrinker/Dark Confidant list on moto for a bit. It's interesting. I've not played with bob before now and shifting gears from a more controlling Rock list has been an adjustment. I also haven't played for a bit so learning the new metagame as well. The Rock really just isn't what it used to be. Oh-well.
I was wondering though, if it isn't Tier 1 anymore, could it be focused more to prey on some portion of the field at the expense of another? There is so much graveyard shenanigans around. And I feel like even against aggro, the post board matchups still seem good. I'm wondering about just leaning into that and completely giving up on the big mana matchups. That should free up some board space. And I'd like to get some more MD graveyard interaction. Basically, what is scooze 5-6?
A pair of kalitas in the main and a combination of spellbombs/grafdiggers/layline in side should be enough to deal with the graveyard. Kalitas is an absolute monster in this deck. Shuts down graveyard, has lifelink, creates a board, and pumps himself(which kills bridge) all in one card.
A pair of kalitas in the main and a combination of spellbombs/grafdiggers/layline in side should be enough to deal with the graveyard. Kalitas is an absolute monster in this deck. Shuts down graveyard, has lifelink, creates a board, and pumps himself(which kills bridge) all in one card.
Kalitas is awesome, but isn't he too slow against some of those really fast graveyard decks? they kill you before you can drop him.
That's why you have other cards like scavenging ooze. Most of the time B/G, or midrange decks is going to be slightly unfavored in game 1. Trying to have enough answers for everything in single target removal, while having a board of value creatures. It's not the best spot to be in usually, but that's where the sideboard comes in. Cut the 4 lotv's for 4 layline's, and maybe a couple of spellbombs and you're looking really good vs graveyards. Plus you have an enchantment, and artifact now to feed the goyf.
Hey guys, I wanted to stop by and ask you what you think of this deck I tried to put together. The bread and butter of this deck is as follows:
Turn 1 - Land, mana dork
Turn 2 - Land, mana dork or Gravecrawler, Priest of Forgotten Gods
Turn 3 - Land, tap your mana dork(s) to put mana in pool, sac all of your other creatures to PoFG, drop Liliana, Dreadhorde General. Doing so with two mana dorks on the field actually leaves you with one mana open for a Fatal Push
From there, you aim to win by depleting the opponent's resources (Inquisition of Kozilek, Collective Brutality, Smallpox, removal) while beating them down with zombie tokens and Gravecrawlers. If Liliana can be ramped up to her ulti, all the better. Doomed Dissenter is there because I liked the idea of having something that can replace itself when sacrificed, but Scavenging Ooze would probably be a better option, especially considering that Dredge/Bridgevine, alongside Tron, is the most common deck in my meta (hence why the side looks the way it does). Constructive criticism is greatly appreciated.
@Tears of Tomorrow (post EU) I apologize if this is going to be overly negative but I'll do my best to be constructive here. There are quite a few competing issues here with this deck. Firstly, you have a few different and competing strategies going on here. You have a bunch of mana dorks but the only thing you are ramping into is liliana who, by herself, is not modern playable (although I would love to be proven wrong). She barely impacts the board, and takes way too long to really do much. I can see her in a meta of just pure grindy midrange but that's just not modern. If you are able to ramp and play a 6 drop there are much better things you can be doing. You will want something that's just going to straight win you the game right then and there or in a turn or 2. Modern is brutal and efficient and you need to be as well.
secondly, smallpox is great! I love the card but not in a deck filled with creatures. Like, t1 you cast birds then t2 do you cast smallpox? that seems horrible. You will want a deck that can maximize the ability yet not have it impact you that much. I find it hard to believe you can ramp into your payoff card (liliana) when you are killing your own guys and lands. On that, 20 lands is probably not enough, you will need at least 2-3 more. There's no way you can reliably cast a 6 drop if you have priest and smallpox working against you. I do get that priest and 2 mana dorks is some cool ramp so I'm sure that will happen but if they have an answer you are just done for.
Another problem is the creature selection. You have no pressure at all with this list. If you go by modern being a t4 format, what turn does your deck typically kill on? Yes, most of these cards do attack but they are so weak and just get outclassed by everything in the format. An easy exchange would be llanowar elves for noble heirarch, it's strictly better in every way. You also have no way to recur a crawler unless you have liliana or a dead dissenter or another crawler. Priest is an interesting inclusion and I like that card but you have to build around it. Currently, you just don't have enough to maximize it's value, it's almost negative synergy. I would lean more heavily into it. We now have nether spirit and of course trusty bloodghast. Another issue with the ramp plan is you have no way of finding your payoff cards and no mana sinks at all. What makes tron such an effective ramp deck is it just has so many ways to find it's payoff cards and it's ramp, you rarely get stuck with one half or the other. You will find many scenarios you are drawing mana dorks and nothing to do with all your mana or the other way around.
next to the mana. I think it is fine overall but you need more blooming marsh. That's an easy pain free way to have t1 black or green which is oh so important. You need some manlands in here of some kind. Smallpox and priest are boosted so much by manlands and provide a decent mana sink later. You are also going to need nurturing peatland. You need the card advantage desperately. I'm not convinced 20 lands is enough. If you are having trouble with tron which I imagine you would, I think 1-2 field of ruin could help. Plus they help in other matches and killing utility lands is pretty huge which is not a guarantee with smallpox.
Sideboard. I wouldn't bother with putrefy. Abrupt decay is better. Between trophy and decay you don't need that card. Also, play 4 leyline. It's only good on t0 which you want the best chances of seeing and not having to mull into oblivion to find it. I think an easy swap is 4 leyline, 3 surgical. There's a bunch of different avenues you can go with SB. Smallpox and priest kinda hinder your ability to use some of the utility creatures. If this works for you than no need to get fancy.
I hope there's something here to help you in this long rambling post
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Modern: BG eldrazi midrange BWG Abzan value evolution BUG BUG Midrange
Thoughts on Plague Engineer in main or sideboard? I wanted to pick up a playset, but I hesitated too long... They went from €2 up to almost €6..... damn...
Legion's End Seems like a solid option for dealing with gravecrawler, and bloodghast, and exiles sticher. Maybe a little too narrow though.
Edit: Also removes snapcasters, and a large section of humans deck.
r1 jund
both games were pretty similar in that We both do a little discard but my things just lined up better. game 1 I land karn on a near empty board but not a ton of mana so I grab batterskull and that takes it home. g2 he just floods a bit at the end and a hexdrinker got there after funneling mana into it little by little holding up removal.
1-0
r2 hogaak
this was vs endboss Sky Mason who, spoiler alert, beat me relatively soundly even though in 2 games I went, t1 relic, t2 scooze and still lost. g1 he just went super wide and couldn't stop that. g2 i flooded out at the end. if I had a mass removal spell of some kind I think I would have been ok. I was able to always answer the gaak but I could never find what I needed to stop the army of idiots.
1-1
r3 UW control
g1 i have discard into is awkward hand of nothing relevant and 2 cryptics and a verdict. Land a goyf and then karn and I start coating all his lands away. g2 we both mull to 5 but I have a decent hand just need a black. Well I luck rip a swamp off the top and double discard him. land a hexdrinker and go to town. easy as that.
2-1
r4 abzan
game 1 i have relic to deal with souls and goyf beatdowns with removal get me there easily. G2 he has endless siege rhinos combined with new sorin. g3 I make a mega bonehead lines of play. I have 2 options, go all aboard the hexdrinker plan and then play karn later or leave hexdrinker as a 2/1 and play karn and start coating away his lands seeing as he doesn't have great mana right now. Well I choose the greed play with karn and get so very punished. I knew as soon as I got the coating it was the wrong play. If i just level the drinker to a 4/4 there's literally nothing he can do about it. let alone getting it to a 6/6 which I could have done the next turn and won easily as I would have still had a karn. It was very embarrassing. I tried to get cute, it's my first time playing this, leave me alone haha
2-2*
r5 infect
both games went as such. Lots of discard and removal. g1 I killed him with liliana TLH and treetop villages, g2 it was karn into lattice on a clear board.
3-2
the deck felt great honestly. Got buried by hogaak which just proves how ridiculous the deck is but 1 shot GY things obviously don't cut it. I do think with some tweaks I can make it not bad tho. I'm going to add a flaying tendrils an that should help in the SB. Main I'm going to: -1 goyf +1 hexdrinker. I didn't have high hopes with this deck going into the tourney but the deck performed so much better than I thought. I have no idea how I beat something like mono red phoenix but can't prepare for everything. I doubt having a witchbane orb is going to fix that. maybe? I think I'm going to make those tweaks and run it back, it was certainly a fun take on GB even though I don't think it's by any means a top build.
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hence going to 3 goyf. You have to realize 3 things:
1) It's my relic, I choose how it's used. It's not like you always have to use it, which people seem to forget. It's like saying scavenging ooze is also a nonbo with goyf when it's proven to not be. There's a solid chunk of matches you just board it out. This is all assuming you even have both pieces together. If you play smart and know how to use it, it's really not an issue.
2) Even if you do pop it, decks like these are meant to fill the yard fast. 1 fetch and a discard and he's a 3/4 again. It's really not hard, I'm surprised I would have to mention this in a GB forum
3) There are matches where goyf doesn't matter at all. Like hogaak. Being able to have relic is far better than a 4/5 goyf especially when you can get back your artifacts from exile with karn. Just as often, he's even bigger as you have other artifacts in the yard.
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this all being said, there's certainly room for improvement. Especially for an expected meta. I think I may also cut either 1x fulminator or damping sphere for 1 kalitas. Once hogaak goes away who knows what things will look like
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Modern: BG eldrazi midrange BWG Abzan value evolution BUG BUG Midrange
Ran Back this list at FNM. Made a few small tweaks. +1 hexdrinker, -1 goyf. In SB +1 kalitas, +1 cry of the carnarium, -1 mycosynth lattice (don't own one and couldn't borrow it, sad) -1 fulminator. The deck didn't disappoint! Felt super good all night.
r1: hardened scales
g1 He has a semi slow start and with enough removal and disruption there was nothing he could do to stop hexdrinker and that raced everything he could throw at me. g2 was similar except I had more removal. Cry of the carnarium was a boss. Card is so good even if it is just -2/-2. I was able to dodge the t2 scales but It wouldn't have mattered much as I had a trophy for it in g2, still tho that deck is scary. MD karn helps a lot tho.
1-0 (2-0)
r2: merfolk
g1 not much to say, lots of removal and disruption and was able to dodge a critical spreading seas preventing him from swinging in for lethal. CHipped in for huge guys until both boards were gummed up. Hexdrinker full powered brought it home. G2 was fun as force of vigor was insane killing on t2 a vial and a spreading seas which was huge as i needed the color fixing. backed by liliana, the last hope combined with karn + batterskull there wasn't much he could do to recover. If I had a lattice, it would have just been game over but what can you do, bskull got me there eventually.
2-0 (4-0)
r3: izzet phoenix
g1 MD relics were huge and a single tireless tracker was able to race a couple phoenix. I ripped a push thanks to the clues and was able to kill one. Close game honestly, If he had found a bolt or something i was probably just dead...probably. g2 more relics shut off his graveyard and I just kept getting discard after discard. I dealt with his t2 TiTi and he wasn't able to do much. Here was a match that featured both goyf and relic together and no, it was never a problem. I use relic when necessary and just save it. I had to blow it once but he was immediately a 3/4 right after. Say what you will, but so far it's not an issue after 12 total matches with this build.
3-0, (6-0)
r4 hogaak
oh boy i was afraid of this match but i have SO much interaction for this match. Long story short, g1 he never drew a hogaak and I was able to get there eventually through hexdrinker and repeatedly killing his *****ters. g2 I find a LOT of interaction and I needed it all. That deck is so insane in it's ability to recover and swarm. good golly. Still tho, I had to assemble an insane amount of everything to get there. IT never felt free or easy but It's no unbeatable. My 1 conclusion from facing this a few times now is, my good hands will always beat their medium hands. I don't think I can ever beat their best but I do have tools to compete. I sure hope hogaak gets banned tho, that card is seriously effed up.
4-0 (8-0)
r5: grixis urza
opponent wanted to do other things so we drew. I wish I had forced him to at least play the match for fun. On paper, it seems really really good for me. With MD karn, relics disruption and removal it seems unbelievably good match. Of course I cannot confirm this. I regret not playing. Oh well.
ID into top 8
t8: hogaak
This was a short match. g1 he rips hogaak off the top on t2 (I inq him t1 to see he has a great hand but 1 land) and cast it (t1 gravecrawler into stitcher combined with my discard and a fetch). Hogaak proceeds to kill me as I didn't see a trophy until too late. He was on 1 mana the whole time. I kill hogaak and by that time he could replay it despite having 1 land. sigh. g2 I have some interaction but his hand was again insane. I have tons of removal and disruption but I never see a creature in like 8-9 turns and die to small chip shots turn after turn. brutal. I think I could have made better mull decisions especially for g1 knowing what I was up against. My medium hands are never going to beat hogaak.
4-1
Over all I love this build. It's so fun, has a great engine in Karn being able to search for things you may need and just having a lot of utility. MD relics are so good in the meta at large and when they aren't good it's an easy 4 cards to board out. It makes SB much easier than before. I'm going to invest in a lattice now. I've tried many variations of Rock builds but this one is my favorite. It fits my personal playstyle but I will admit it's probably not for everyone. GB is in a bad place right now but this angle feels great actually. Hogaak still feels terrible without leylines but we shall see how it shakes out with the upcoming ban announcement in a couple weeks. With good mull decions and decent hands it's beatable.
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Another FNM report with my GB Karnage deck. I was finally able to get a lattice with my winnings. Score. Same list as in the previous post. no changes
r1: izzet phoenix
g1 comes down to me needing to draw removal to stop his dual phoenixes. If I do I'm highly favored to win if I don't I lose. I didn't. g2 hexdrinker followed by a lot of removal/discard and I win. g3 was similar but with relics and goyf beatdowns I took him down no problem. I just played relic as a nihil spellbomb basically. Nothing he could do and eating a card every turn was useless anyways.
1-0
r2 bushwhacker artifacts
In my opinion this list is inferior to the regular 8 whack. It's similar but potentially faster but also more inconsistant. plays things like ornithopters, memnite and signal pest with bomat couriers. G1 I wreck him. g2 I get virtual t3. I was at a real low life and there wasn't anything I could do or draw that could get me outa the swarm. g3 I was able to deal with his big threats aka whackers and pests and a giant goyf and scooze went to town.
2-0
r3 humans
Not much to say. I drew mediocre and never drew much removal and got absoutely curb stomped both games. Neither game was close at all. I drew 2 relics game one and they were just stone dead cards I didn't even have time to crack them. yikes.
2-1
r4 mono red prison
g1 lots of discard and a powered up hexdrinker got me there. g2 was long and drawn out but without lattice I wasn't able to lock him out before he was able to play a karn and lattice me with an SSG on the table facing my lili and karn. Big oof. I did get to have fun with relics and recurring my pithing needle, so that was fun as is liquimetal coating walkers to turn them off. SPeaking of which I got to coating an ensnaring bridge and then fatal push it. THAT was sweet in g1. g3 wasn't very exciting. t1 hexdrinker into 2 goyfs easily won it for me. I had removal for anything he could play. All in all, I was able to deal with Blood moon or it didn't matter. In g3 he had moon but I had 2 basics. Sure I had 3 dead lilianas in hand but it didn't matter. Feels good playing a lot of basics.
3-1
r4 eldrazi tron
ass trophy g1 took him off tron long enough for me to get down a karn and power up a hexdrinker. g2 was a little more exciting I had to beat through a couple eldrazi but eventually I was able to get down karn, get a batterskull and start swinging in. E tron is so much easier than regular tron. I'm still very scared of that. His chalices were mostly irrelevant but I will admit I'm not sure he drew very well.
4-1
top 8: UW control
g1 just tons of discard with a powered up hexdrinker took him down. I was lucky he never drew a walker or D sphere in the 2 critical turns he had before he went to progenitus mode. g2 I drew well and got all the things I needed more or less when I needed them so I had answers to his things. Few discard and then a liliana and I stripped him into top deck mode. Then we battled top cards till I slammed karn and a coating shutting off his walkers. I got to coating + karn + lili sac to kill a teferi so that was also fun. This deck has got to be the most frustrating thing to play against as UW. WHile I hate making people tilt it's hard to feel too bad when they are playing control
5-1
I made some great plays last night and some very poor ones. Had some bad sequences and a couple rookie mistakes so if guys you are are reading this, my bad. Hexdrinker was MVP this week. There were 3 specific times I wished I had the lattice as it would have just been game over. Instead I had to keep playing...1 time losing the other 2 I eventually got there but it should never have been a thing. Thankfully I got one now. I got to do all the things this week with coating shenanigans, relic getting things back from exile. Powered up hexdrinkers and almost ulting lilis. I had a 7/8 goyf at one point vs E. tron. Gosh I love this list. Humans matchup felt awful though. If hogaak gets banned things in my list certainly change but I'm not sure what. I need more mass removal or something vs that deck. I wonder if it's possible to add more basics and play snow things to play dead of winter. If it's possible to consistently have t3 3 damage wrath then that's the way to go. Cry of the carnarium is amazing but it just doesn't cut it vs humans unless I'm lucky. Perhaps trading relics for astrolabs and adding those to SB. This would be post hogaak tho. Cry is too important for that matchup.
Played for the first time since before hogaak.
Took down a local championship with one loss (7-1)
Hexdrinker was an actual MvP
Creatures:15
2 Hexdrinker
3 Dark Confidant
3 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Tireless Tracker
Spells:21
4 Fatal Push
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Assassin's Trophy
1 Collective Brutality
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
Lands:24
4 Blooming Marsh
3 Field of Ruin
1 Forest
2 Nurturing Peatland
2 Overgrown Tomb
5 Swamp
3 Treetop Village
4 Verdant Catacombs
I was wondering though, if it isn't Tier 1 anymore, could it be focused more to prey on some portion of the field at the expense of another? There is so much graveyard shenanigans around. And I feel like even against aggro, the post board matchups still seem good. I'm wondering about just leaning into that and completely giving up on the big mana matchups. That should free up some board space. And I'd like to get some more MD graveyard interaction. Basically, what is scooze 5-6?
Kalitas is awesome, but isn't he too slow against some of those really fast graveyard decks? they kill you before you can drop him.
Turn 1 - Land, mana dork
Turn 2 - Land, mana dork or Gravecrawler, Priest of Forgotten Gods
Turn 3 - Land, tap your mana dork(s) to put mana in pool, sac all of your other creatures to PoFG, drop Liliana, Dreadhorde General. Doing so with two mana dorks on the field actually leaves you with one mana open for a Fatal Push
From there, you aim to win by depleting the opponent's resources (Inquisition of Kozilek, Collective Brutality, Smallpox, removal) while beating them down with zombie tokens and Gravecrawlers. If Liliana can be ramped up to her ulti, all the better. Doomed Dissenter is there because I liked the idea of having something that can replace itself when sacrificed, but Scavenging Ooze would probably be a better option, especially considering that Dredge/Bridgevine, alongside Tron, is the most common deck in my meta (hence why the side looks the way it does). Constructive criticism is greatly appreciated.
secondly, smallpox is great! I love the card but not in a deck filled with creatures. Like, t1 you cast birds then t2 do you cast smallpox? that seems horrible. You will want a deck that can maximize the ability yet not have it impact you that much. I find it hard to believe you can ramp into your payoff card (liliana) when you are killing your own guys and lands. On that, 20 lands is probably not enough, you will need at least 2-3 more. There's no way you can reliably cast a 6 drop if you have priest and smallpox working against you. I do get that priest and 2 mana dorks is some cool ramp so I'm sure that will happen but if they have an answer you are just done for.
Another problem is the creature selection. You have no pressure at all with this list. If you go by modern being a t4 format, what turn does your deck typically kill on? Yes, most of these cards do attack but they are so weak and just get outclassed by everything in the format. An easy exchange would be llanowar elves for noble heirarch, it's strictly better in every way. You also have no way to recur a crawler unless you have liliana or a dead dissenter or another crawler. Priest is an interesting inclusion and I like that card but you have to build around it. Currently, you just don't have enough to maximize it's value, it's almost negative synergy. I would lean more heavily into it. We now have nether spirit and of course trusty bloodghast. Another issue with the ramp plan is you have no way of finding your payoff cards and no mana sinks at all. What makes tron such an effective ramp deck is it just has so many ways to find it's payoff cards and it's ramp, you rarely get stuck with one half or the other. You will find many scenarios you are drawing mana dorks and nothing to do with all your mana or the other way around.
next to the mana. I think it is fine overall but you need more blooming marsh. That's an easy pain free way to have t1 black or green which is oh so important. You need some manlands in here of some kind. Smallpox and priest are boosted so much by manlands and provide a decent mana sink later. You are also going to need nurturing peatland. You need the card advantage desperately. I'm not convinced 20 lands is enough. If you are having trouble with tron which I imagine you would, I think 1-2 field of ruin could help. Plus they help in other matches and killing utility lands is pretty huge which is not a guarantee with smallpox.
Sideboard. I wouldn't bother with putrefy. Abrupt decay is better. Between trophy and decay you don't need that card. Also, play 4 leyline. It's only good on t0 which you want the best chances of seeing and not having to mull into oblivion to find it. I think an easy swap is 4 leyline, 3 surgical. There's a bunch of different avenues you can go with SB. Smallpox and priest kinda hinder your ability to use some of the utility creatures. If this works for you than no need to get fancy.
I hope there's something here to help you in this long rambling post
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange
BWG Abzan value evolution
BUG BUG Midrange
Tiny Leaders: BW Athreos Zombies
Commander: BG Gitrog Monster
https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/modern/established-modern/control/804978-bw-smallpox-control
I'd recommend checking out that tech for some ideas. White is usually the best support color for Smallpox because Flagstones of Trokair heavily offsets the land loss.
Edit: Also removes snapcasters, and a large section of humans deck.
2 hexdrinker
2 scavenging ooze
4 tarmogoyf
2 tireless tracker
spells
4 fatal push
4 inquisition of kozilek
3 thoughtseize
3 assassin's trophy
4 relic of progenitus
walkers
3 liliana of the veil
1 liliana, the last hope
4 karn, the great creator
1 blast zone
3 field of ruin
3 blooming marsh
1 hissing quagmire
2 treetop village
2 nurturing peatland
2 overgrown tomb
2 forest
4 swamp
4 verdant catacombs
2 fulminator mage
2 plague engineer
1 damnation
1 maelstrom pulse
1 force of vigor
1 batterskull
1 mycosynth lattice
1 liquimetal coating
1 pithing needle
2 damping sphere
1 grafdigger's cage
1 engineered explosives
r1 jund
both games were pretty similar in that We both do a little discard but my things just lined up better. game 1 I land karn on a near empty board but not a ton of mana so I grab batterskull and that takes it home. g2 he just floods a bit at the end and a hexdrinker got there after funneling mana into it little by little holding up removal.
1-0
r2 hogaak
this was vs endboss Sky Mason who, spoiler alert, beat me relatively soundly even though in 2 games I went, t1 relic, t2 scooze and still lost. g1 he just went super wide and couldn't stop that. g2 i flooded out at the end. if I had a mass removal spell of some kind I think I would have been ok. I was able to always answer the gaak but I could never find what I needed to stop the army of idiots.
1-1
r3 UW control
g1 i have discard into is awkward hand of nothing relevant and 2 cryptics and a verdict. Land a goyf and then karn and I start coating all his lands away. g2 we both mull to 5 but I have a decent hand just need a black. Well I luck rip a swamp off the top and double discard him. land a hexdrinker and go to town. easy as that.
2-1
r4 abzan
game 1 i have relic to deal with souls and goyf beatdowns with removal get me there easily. G2 he has endless siege rhinos combined with new sorin. g3 I make a mega bonehead lines of play. I have 2 options, go all aboard the hexdrinker plan and then play karn later or leave hexdrinker as a 2/1 and play karn and start coating away his lands seeing as he doesn't have great mana right now. Well I choose the greed play with karn and get so very punished. I knew as soon as I got the coating it was the wrong play. If i just level the drinker to a 4/4 there's literally nothing he can do about it. let alone getting it to a 6/6 which I could have done the next turn and won easily as I would have still had a karn. It was very embarrassing. I tried to get cute, it's my first time playing this, leave me alone haha
2-2*
r5 infect
both games went as such. Lots of discard and removal. g1 I killed him with liliana TLH and treetop villages, g2 it was karn into lattice on a clear board.
3-2
the deck felt great honestly. Got buried by hogaak which just proves how ridiculous the deck is but 1 shot GY things obviously don't cut it. I do think with some tweaks I can make it not bad tho. I'm going to add a flaying tendrils an that should help in the SB. Main I'm going to: -1 goyf +1 hexdrinker. I didn't have high hopes with this deck going into the tourney but the deck performed so much better than I thought. I have no idea how I beat something like mono red phoenix but can't prepare for everything. I doubt having a witchbane orb is going to fix that. maybe? I think I'm going to make those tweaks and run it back, it was certainly a fun take on GB even though I don't think it's by any means a top build.
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange
BWG Abzan value evolution
BUG BUG Midrange
Tiny Leaders: BW Athreos Zombies
Commander: BG Gitrog Monster
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
1) It's my relic, I choose how it's used. It's not like you always have to use it, which people seem to forget. It's like saying scavenging ooze is also a nonbo with goyf when it's proven to not be. There's a solid chunk of matches you just board it out. This is all assuming you even have both pieces together. If you play smart and know how to use it, it's really not an issue.
2) Even if you do pop it, decks like these are meant to fill the yard fast. 1 fetch and a discard and he's a 3/4 again. It's really not hard, I'm surprised I would have to mention this in a GB forum
3) There are matches where goyf doesn't matter at all. Like hogaak. Being able to have relic is far better than a 4/5 goyf especially when you can get back your artifacts from exile with karn. Just as often, he's even bigger as you have other artifacts in the yard.
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange
BWG Abzan value evolution
BUG BUG Midrange
Tiny Leaders: BW Athreos Zombies
Commander: BG Gitrog Monster
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange
BWG Abzan value evolution
BUG BUG Midrange
Tiny Leaders: BW Athreos Zombies
Commander: BG Gitrog Monster
3 hexdrinker
2 scavenging ooze
3 tarmogoyf
2 tireless tracker
spells
4 fatal push
4 inquisition of kozilek
3 thoughtseize
3 assassin's trophy
4 relic of progenitus
walkers
3 liliana of the veil
1 liliana, the last hope
4 karn, the great creator
1 blast zone
3 field of ruin
3 blooming marsh
1 hissing quagmire
2 treetop village
2 nurturing peatland
2 overgrown tomb
2 forest
4 swamp
4 verdant catacombs
1 fulminator mage
1 Kalitas, traitor of ghet
2 plague engineer
1 damnation
1 maelstrom pulse
1 force of vigor
1 batterskull
1 cry of the carnarium
1 liquimetal coating
1 pithing needle
2 damping sphere
1 grafdigger's cage
1 engineered explosives
g1 He has a semi slow start and with enough removal and disruption there was nothing he could do to stop hexdrinker and that raced everything he could throw at me. g2 was similar except I had more removal. Cry of the carnarium was a boss. Card is so good even if it is just -2/-2. I was able to dodge the t2 scales but It wouldn't have mattered much as I had a trophy for it in g2, still tho that deck is scary. MD karn helps a lot tho.
1-0 (2-0)
r2: merfolk
g1 not much to say, lots of removal and disruption and was able to dodge a critical spreading seas preventing him from swinging in for lethal. CHipped in for huge guys until both boards were gummed up. Hexdrinker full powered brought it home. G2 was fun as force of vigor was insane killing on t2 a vial and a spreading seas which was huge as i needed the color fixing. backed by liliana, the last hope combined with karn + batterskull there wasn't much he could do to recover. If I had a lattice, it would have just been game over but what can you do, bskull got me there eventually.
2-0 (4-0)
r3: izzet phoenix
g1 MD relics were huge and a single tireless tracker was able to race a couple phoenix. I ripped a push thanks to the clues and was able to kill one. Close game honestly, If he had found a bolt or something i was probably just dead...probably. g2 more relics shut off his graveyard and I just kept getting discard after discard. I dealt with his t2 TiTi and he wasn't able to do much. Here was a match that featured both goyf and relic together and no, it was never a problem. I use relic when necessary and just save it. I had to blow it once but he was immediately a 3/4 right after. Say what you will, but so far it's not an issue after 12 total matches with this build.
3-0, (6-0)
r4 hogaak
oh boy i was afraid of this match but i have SO much interaction for this match. Long story short, g1 he never drew a hogaak and I was able to get there eventually through hexdrinker and repeatedly killing his *****ters. g2 I find a LOT of interaction and I needed it all. That deck is so insane in it's ability to recover and swarm. good golly. Still tho, I had to assemble an insane amount of everything to get there. IT never felt free or easy but It's no unbeatable. My 1 conclusion from facing this a few times now is, my good hands will always beat their medium hands. I don't think I can ever beat their best but I do have tools to compete. I sure hope hogaak gets banned tho, that card is seriously effed up.
4-0 (8-0)
r5: grixis urza
opponent wanted to do other things so we drew. I wish I had forced him to at least play the match for fun. On paper, it seems really really good for me. With MD karn, relics disruption and removal it seems unbelievably good match. Of course I cannot confirm this. I regret not playing. Oh well.
ID into top 8
t8: hogaak
This was a short match. g1 he rips hogaak off the top on t2 (I inq him t1 to see he has a great hand but 1 land) and cast it (t1 gravecrawler into stitcher combined with my discard and a fetch). Hogaak proceeds to kill me as I didn't see a trophy until too late. He was on 1 mana the whole time. I kill hogaak and by that time he could replay it despite having 1 land. sigh. g2 I have some interaction but his hand was again insane. I have tons of removal and disruption but I never see a creature in like 8-9 turns and die to small chip shots turn after turn. brutal. I think I could have made better mull decisions especially for g1 knowing what I was up against. My medium hands are never going to beat hogaak.
4-1
Over all I love this build. It's so fun, has a great engine in Karn being able to search for things you may need and just having a lot of utility. MD relics are so good in the meta at large and when they aren't good it's an easy 4 cards to board out. It makes SB much easier than before. I'm going to invest in a lattice now. I've tried many variations of Rock builds but this one is my favorite. It fits my personal playstyle but I will admit it's probably not for everyone. GB is in a bad place right now but this angle feels great actually. Hogaak still feels terrible without leylines but we shall see how it shakes out with the upcoming ban announcement in a couple weeks. With good mull decions and decent hands it's beatable.
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange
BWG Abzan value evolution
BUG BUG Midrange
Tiny Leaders: BW Athreos Zombies
Commander: BG Gitrog Monster
g1 comes down to me needing to draw removal to stop his dual phoenixes. If I do I'm highly favored to win if I don't I lose. I didn't. g2 hexdrinker followed by a lot of removal/discard and I win. g3 was similar but with relics and goyf beatdowns I took him down no problem. I just played relic as a nihil spellbomb basically. Nothing he could do and eating a card every turn was useless anyways.
1-0
r2 bushwhacker artifacts
In my opinion this list is inferior to the regular 8 whack. It's similar but potentially faster but also more inconsistant. plays things like ornithopters, memnite and signal pest with bomat couriers. G1 I wreck him. g2 I get virtual t3. I was at a real low life and there wasn't anything I could do or draw that could get me outa the swarm. g3 I was able to deal with his big threats aka whackers and pests and a giant goyf and scooze went to town.
2-0
r3 humans
Not much to say. I drew mediocre and never drew much removal and got absoutely curb stomped both games. Neither game was close at all. I drew 2 relics game one and they were just stone dead cards I didn't even have time to crack them. yikes.
2-1
r4 mono red prison
g1 lots of discard and a powered up hexdrinker got me there. g2 was long and drawn out but without lattice I wasn't able to lock him out before he was able to play a karn and lattice me with an SSG on the table facing my lili and karn. Big oof. I did get to have fun with relics and recurring my pithing needle, so that was fun as is liquimetal coating walkers to turn them off. SPeaking of which I got to coating an ensnaring bridge and then fatal push it. THAT was sweet in g1. g3 wasn't very exciting. t1 hexdrinker into 2 goyfs easily won it for me. I had removal for anything he could play. All in all, I was able to deal with Blood moon or it didn't matter. In g3 he had moon but I had 2 basics. Sure I had 3 dead lilianas in hand but it didn't matter. Feels good playing a lot of basics.
3-1
r4 eldrazi tron
ass trophy g1 took him off tron long enough for me to get down a karn and power up a hexdrinker. g2 was a little more exciting I had to beat through a couple eldrazi but eventually I was able to get down karn, get a batterskull and start swinging in. E tron is so much easier than regular tron. I'm still very scared of that. His chalices were mostly irrelevant but I will admit I'm not sure he drew very well.
4-1
top 8: UW control
g1 just tons of discard with a powered up hexdrinker took him down. I was lucky he never drew a walker or D sphere in the 2 critical turns he had before he went to progenitus mode. g2 I drew well and got all the things I needed more or less when I needed them so I had answers to his things. Few discard and then a liliana and I stripped him into top deck mode. Then we battled top cards till I slammed karn and a coating shutting off his walkers. I got to coating + karn + lili sac to kill a teferi so that was also fun. This deck has got to be the most frustrating thing to play against as UW. WHile I hate making people tilt it's hard to feel too bad when they are playing control
5-1
I made some great plays last night and some very poor ones. Had some bad sequences and a couple rookie mistakes so if guys you are are reading this, my bad. Hexdrinker was MVP this week. There were 3 specific times I wished I had the lattice as it would have just been game over. Instead I had to keep playing...1 time losing the other 2 I eventually got there but it should never have been a thing. Thankfully I got one now. I got to do all the things this week with coating shenanigans, relic getting things back from exile. Powered up hexdrinkers and almost ulting lilis. I had a 7/8 goyf at one point vs E. tron. Gosh I love this list. Humans matchup felt awful though. If hogaak gets banned things in my list certainly change but I'm not sure what. I need more mass removal or something vs that deck. I wonder if it's possible to add more basics and play snow things to play dead of winter. If it's possible to consistently have t3 3 damage wrath then that's the way to go. Cry of the carnarium is amazing but it just doesn't cut it vs humans unless I'm lucky. Perhaps trading relics for astrolabs and adding those to SB. This would be post hogaak tho. Cry is too important for that matchup.
Modern: BG eldrazi midrange
BWG Abzan value evolution
BUG BUG Midrange
Tiny Leaders: BW Athreos Zombies
Commander: BG Gitrog Monster
Took down a local championship with one loss (7-1)
Hexdrinker was an actual MvP
Creatures:15
2 Hexdrinker
3 Dark Confidant
3 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Tireless Tracker
Spells:21
4 Fatal Push
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
2 Abrupt Decay
4 Assassin's Trophy
1 Collective Brutality
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
Lands:24
4 Blooming Marsh
3 Field of Ruin
1 Forest
2 Nurturing Peatland
2 Overgrown Tomb
5 Swamp
3 Treetop Village
4 Verdant Catacombs
Sideboard:15
2 Collector Ouphe
3 Fulminator Mage
2 Plague Engineer
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Collective Brutality
2 Damping Sphere
1 Torpor Orb
1 Weather the Storm