I'm playing B/G Persist. I can't see control being viable, really. It just doesn't have the tools. Right now I think there's too much combo out there and control decks can either choose to run enough counters and card advantage engines to deal with combo decks that will eventually combo out through their counters (Persist, 12 Post, etc.) but they also have to have enough removal to deal with things like Fish, Faeries and Zoo. And they need a good mix of both counters and removal to deal with combo Elves. Honestly, right now anything that can't win consistently by turn 5 I think is worthless. Turn 5 or turn 6 with significant counter backup. Turn 4 is better.
At my LGS, the 1 tourny he had the top decks were vialless merfolk, LD, zoo, and an 8 post U/G controlish build. There were 40+ in the tourny and so many decks. Alot of old school decks from days gone past revamped with some new cards. There seemed to be alot of combo decks but nothing too consistant. It was either win turn 3 or 4 or just fold. Some aggro/aggro tribal/tribal. Saw merfolk, zombies, couple elf builds, treefolk, allies, and I know there are more I am forgetting. There were some control decks, pickels and a couple post decks.
With so many decks in the format its so hard to build/pick a deck to beat everything. Personally I took a B/w zombie deck that played really well most of the day. I made top 8 but couldnt draw what I needed once I got there. It was so much fun playing more then one type of deck thru the tourny. Reminded me of legacy without the brokenness. No turn 1 craziness, no storm turn 2 for a gazzillion, tho there was an affinity deck there that could dump its hand turn 1, but didnt happen too often.
The same LGS is testing overextended later in the month. I havent had this much fun outside of legacy in a long time.
By the way, there are plenty of tools to play control, its just going to take a bit to fine tune what we got to work with.
I don't know if this has been posted but here are a few links to some modern tourney's held on magic-league. Hypergenisis isn't really a problem. The combo deck of choice seems to be melira sylvok outcast persist decks. That could also be dealt with with a simple meddling mage.
Zoo seems to be making good appearances. Blood Moon I suspect is doing a lot of work. The Mystical teachings toolbox is also representing along with the stoneforge toolbox. Might want to keep them if you have them.
Zoo if it is to dominate needs to figure out how to beat the eldrazi big decks lifegain from the locus lands. I mean if virtually 2-for-ones as playing the locus lands give them lots of mana and also a lot of life. Some anti lifegain tech is surely needed as they are very slow and could easily be beat if the lifegain can be dealt with.
Here are some links to trials played on MTGO (edit: Magic League) that someone posted in the Rumour Mill thread regarding Modern Magic;
It seems Zoo/12PostEldrazi/UW Fish(not merfolk, actual Fish), are the only decks that are popping up a lot; that isn't to say they're the best; but those seem to be the decks to beat at the moment.
I've been pretty unimpressed by 8 post having played against it. I wouldn't really consider magic-league a reliable source for what is or isn't the best deck, but it is a decent start for finding some ideas.
Here is what I would say would be in the tier 1-2 right now from playing
1. Scapeshift. Gets back everything it hand in old extended, but is even faster and more consistent due to Green Sun's Zenith, and possibly prismatic omen.
2. Vial Merfolk. It's not all that far off from Legacy merfolk, but the problem is more the fact that the meta is going to be tough for merfolk since batterskulls, punishing fires, and goyfs will be running wild here.
3. Elf Combo. I've lost to this deck on turn 2 from an experienced and talented elf combo player. That's after I bolted 1 of his elves too. Elves are much more resilient than Hyper and just about as fast as well.
4. Zoo. It's zoo. It'll be played
5. Stoneforge Mystic decks. I would expect primarily bant to be the go-to stoneforge mystic deck, but it'll pop up in Junk, UW, and any other mid-range white deck. I think Bant is probably the best shell at the time however.
6. Faeries. It's faeries. It'll be played, and it'll be good.
7. Storm Combo. Primarily w/ Pyromancer's swath is very strong with a talented pilot who knows how to play around hatebears.
8. Jund Variants. I've played around w/ jund and it can be a beating. It has enough discard to deal with the control decks, is a tough opponent to aggro-control decks via punishing grove, and packs the format's best beatsticks as well.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find me online - I'm on Cockatrice * Tag - Badd B - Or on MTGO - Tag - Cbus05
Here are some links to trials played on MTGO (edit: Magic League) that someone posted in the Rumour Mill thread regarding Modern Magic;
It seems Zoo/12PostEldrazi/UW Fish(not merfolk, actual Fish), are the only decks that are popping up a lot; that isn't to say they're the best; but those seem to be the decks to beat at the moment.
TheBaron's quote said that Persist was the combo deck of choice (something I was interested in since there wasn't a Persist thread here until I started it last night) but I only saw one, by Mossivo, that looked to be more of a Zoo deck using Melira and Finks to power Greater Gargadon into play. That's not really a combo deck. The B/G version I'm running doesn't really care about Meddling Mage and actually goes infinite (that is, arbitrarily large).
Like I said earlier, I think 12 Post is definitely a force to be reckoned with, as you have to have a clock to deal with it. All it loses from Legacy is Crop Rotation, so it will consistently be dropping colorless monsters on turn 5 and this format doesn't have Wasteland to contain it.
TheBaron's quote said that Persist was the combo deck of choice (something I was interested in since there wasn't a Persist thread here until I started it last night) but I only saw one, by Mossivo, that looked to be more of a Zoo deck using Melira and Finks to power Greater Gargadon into play. That's not really a combo deck. The B/G version I'm running doesn't really care about Meddling Mage and actually goes infinite (that is, arbitrarily large).
Like I said earlier, I think 12 Post is definitely a force to be reckoned with, as you have to have a clock to deal with it. All it loses from Legacy is Crop Rotation, so it will consistently be dropping colorless monsters on turn 5 and this format doesn't have Wasteland to contain it.
The Gargadon is used as the infinite sac engine; you can remove the last counter from Gargadon and not let it resolve by continually using the sac ability.
So you'll have infinite life and a GG in play when all is said and done. (or deal infinite damage with Red Cap)
I didn't realize you could continue to sac in response to the suspend triggering. Interesting. I definitely think he should've been running Redcap, but infinite life is usually enough to win the game.
So you Bolt Melira. And they GSZ for another one. Persist has a lot of redundancy available to it. Birthing Pod, Fauna Shaman, Eternal Witness, Green Sun's Zenith, there are a lot of ways to make the combo consistent. It depends on the configuration you're running.
I know how it works, I've played against it and tried building with it. I understand that it has redundancy, but so does punishing fire, which happens to rape Melira.
Second, this deck is a slower combo deck than other decks in the format, and therefore loses to them, especially since it's in colors without a ton of disruption, and you need to dedicate most of your deck to finding combo pieces instead of disrupting the opponent.
I'm not saying it's bad, but It's hardly the best combo deck in the format.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find me online - I'm on Cockatrice * Tag - Badd B - Or on MTGO - Tag - Cbus05
I play UG 12Post (see 'Chalice' below) and it's by far the best deck I've ever had. It's treated me well, and performs admirably every time I bust it out.
Unfortunately, opposing artifact and/or colorless creature decks make it's best spell (All is Dust) something of a liability. This probably needs to be addressed (so far I've been using Oblivion Stone) but I think the deck is flexible enough to work it's way around that and any other problem that may arise.
The problem I see with 12post... is that it's slow, and the only way it can deal with aggro is through All is Dust (which is incredibly vulnerable to cards like Spell Pierce and mana leak for aggro-control decks).
The other big problem it has, is it just flat out loses to Scapeshift & any combo deck that's not entirely vulnerable to Chalice of the void.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find me online - I'm on Cockatrice * Tag - Badd B - Or on MTGO - Tag - Cbus05
The problem I see with 12post... is that it's slow, and the only way it can deal with aggro is through All is Dust (which is incredibly vulnerable to cards like Spell Pierce and mana leak for aggro-control decks).
The other big problem it has, is it just flat out loses to Scapeshift & any combo deck that's not entirely vulnerable to Chalice of the void.
I dunno. I'm pretty damn good at hiding behind Staves. 8)
To be real, though, if the meta is mostly combo and aggro (which doesn't seem to be the case, it's only half true: combo yes, aggro.. doesn't seem like it) then the deck will change to deal with those threats. It may work, it may not. We'll just have to see.
What will kill it, I think, is decks like the Goodstuff template that was posted on this board not ten minutes ago. Faeries 2008 + Jund 2009 + UB Control 2010 = An absolute freaking slaughter.
8 and 12 post are slow but good decks. They lose to anything fast such as elves or affinity, has a decent shot at anything slower. I really think with the diverse meta and multiple decent to good decks this format has a chance.
So far, the only matchup I've played with Eternity that I didn't feel was favorable was Dragonstorm. I was siding in Chalice to stop Lotus Bloom, but I think I would've been better off just keeping the streamlined combo. Since I moved the Vengevine package to the main and cut Thoughtseize and Tidehollow Sculler, I feel that's my worst matchup; it's all about who assembles their combo faster. But I haven't played against Elves yet. We'll see how that one sits.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Will control decks emerge: of course they will. They emerge in every single format. Just wait.
With so many decks in the format its so hard to build/pick a deck to beat everything. Personally I took a B/w zombie deck that played really well most of the day. I made top 8 but couldnt draw what I needed once I got there. It was so much fun playing more then one type of deck thru the tourny. Reminded me of legacy without the brokenness. No turn 1 craziness, no storm turn 2 for a gazzillion, tho there was an affinity deck there that could dump its hand turn 1, but didnt happen too often.
The same LGS is testing overextended later in the month. I havent had this much fun outside of legacy in a long time.
By the way, there are plenty of tools to play control, its just going to take a bit to fine tune what we got to work with.
Here are some links to trials played on
MTGO(edit: Magic League) that someone posted in the Rumour Mill thread regarding Modern Magic;It seems Zoo/12PostEldrazi/UW Fish(not merfolk, actual Fish), are the only decks that are popping up a lot; that isn't to say they're the best; but those seem to be the decks to beat at the moment.
Sig courtesy of DOLZero
[82/360] Custom Cube
Blog about the Custom Cube
Here is what I would say would be in the tier 1-2 right now from playing
1. Scapeshift. Gets back everything it hand in old extended, but is even faster and more consistent due to Green Sun's Zenith, and possibly prismatic omen.
2. Vial Merfolk. It's not all that far off from Legacy merfolk, but the problem is more the fact that the meta is going to be tough for merfolk since batterskulls, punishing fires, and goyfs will be running wild here.
3. Elf Combo. I've lost to this deck on turn 2 from an experienced and talented elf combo player. That's after I bolted 1 of his elves too. Elves are much more resilient than Hyper and just about as fast as well.
4. Zoo. It's zoo. It'll be played
5. Stoneforge Mystic decks. I would expect primarily bant to be the go-to stoneforge mystic deck, but it'll pop up in Junk, UW, and any other mid-range white deck. I think Bant is probably the best shell at the time however.
6. Faeries. It's faeries. It'll be played, and it'll be good.
7. Storm Combo. Primarily w/ Pyromancer's swath is very strong with a talented pilot who knows how to play around hatebears.
8. Jund Variants. I've played around w/ jund and it can be a beating. It has enough discard to deal with the control decks, is a tough opponent to aggro-control decks via punishing grove, and packs the format's best beatsticks as well.
TheBaron's quote said that Persist was the combo deck of choice (something I was interested in since there wasn't a Persist thread here until I started it last night) but I only saw one, by Mossivo, that looked to be more of a Zoo deck using Melira and Finks to power Greater Gargadon into play. That's not really a combo deck. The B/G version I'm running doesn't really care about Meddling Mage and actually goes infinite (that is, arbitrarily large).
Like I said earlier, I think 12 Post is definitely a force to be reckoned with, as you have to have a clock to deal with it. All it loses from Legacy is Crop Rotation, so it will consistently be dropping colorless monsters on turn 5 and this format doesn't have Wasteland to contain it.
The Gargadon is used as the infinite sac engine; you can remove the last counter from Gargadon and not let it resolve by continually using the sac ability.
So you'll have infinite life and a GG in play when all is said and done. (or deal infinite damage with Red Cap)
Sig courtesy of DOLZero
[82/360] Custom Cube
Blog about the Custom Cube
Second, this deck is a slower combo deck than other decks in the format, and therefore loses to them, especially since it's in colors without a ton of disruption, and you need to dedicate most of your deck to finding combo pieces instead of disrupting the opponent.
I'm not saying it's bad, but It's hardly the best combo deck in the format.
I agree. Especially with the prevalence of PTE and other really good cheap removal spells in the format being played virtually everywhere.
I think it'll be able as successful as Project 420 was while it was in standard;
Take a few people by surprise and be a fairly decent T2 deck.
Sig courtesy of DOLZero
[82/360] Custom Cube
Blog about the Custom Cube
Unfortunately, opposing artifact and/or colorless creature decks make it's best spell (All is Dust) something of a liability. This probably needs to be addressed (so far I've been using Oblivion Stone) but I think the deck is flexible enough to work it's way around that and any other problem that may arise.
The other big problem it has, is it just flat out loses to Scapeshift & any combo deck that's not entirely vulnerable to Chalice of the void.
I dunno. I'm pretty damn good at hiding behind Staves. 8)
To be real, though, if the meta is mostly combo and aggro (which doesn't seem to be the case, it's only half true: combo yes, aggro.. doesn't seem like it) then the deck will change to deal with those threats. It may work, it may not. We'll just have to see.
What will kill it, I think, is decks like the Goodstuff template that was posted on this board not ten minutes ago. Faeries 2008 + Jund 2009 + UB Control 2010 = An absolute freaking slaughter.
12 post seems like it will make a running.
Standard:
WBGAbzan TokensBWG
Modern:
UREsper MidrangeUR