How often does this deck want the bolt on T1 anyway? Ideally you want Delver or Shaman on T1, right? Backup options being maybe Serum Visions, Thoughtseize, and Inquisition? What T1 play right now warrants an immediate bolt?
Haven't seen it been played, but T1 fetch + DRS enables a T2 Bold for removal if needed. The first land should provide Black for DRS/Iok/Thoughtseize or Blue for Visions/Delver/Snare.
I was working on a Grixis Midrange deck, but this looks better. Thoughtseize, Cryptic and Clique are just too expensive to me though. =/
I wish the grixis delver thread wasn't cluttered with jank. There was lots of good ideas and some sweet attempts at legacy ports.
Anyways, I think this deck is real solid. Bob fixes many mulligan problems that UWR geist deck wins was having. Although I think anyone who's been playing tempo lately can agree that his sb plan it the real winner here.
Threads of Disloyalty to win the dethrite battles. and NO TORPOR ORBS? Zack just went ahead and played no direct hate cards build for any match up (besides grudge) and instead build a sb that just upgrades his deck per match up.
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When does lightning bolt kill Emrakul? When your opponent's at three.
Been playing the deck for a bit, but still learning.
I found that lingering souls is very hard to beat so I changed Lili and Spell Pierce for 2 Sulfur Elementals. Has been helping a lot!
It plays out a lot like the RUG Delver deck which was very popular around the time of the World Magic Cup, but includes Deathrite Shaman which is arguably the best card in Modern. Seems good.
This 1000x. RUG Delver was my favorite deck in Modern until RTR came out, and this deck plays just like it, only with Confidant instead of Goyf, and Deathrite just being the only 1-mana Planeswalker printed.
It doesn't seem to have any bad matchups, either. I've been beating up on Tron all evening which (coming from Jund) is refreshing.
It plays out a lot like the RUG Delver deck which was very popular around the time of the World Magic Cup, but includes Deathrite Shaman which is arguably the best card in Modern. Seems good.
This deck can't beat aggro. That = bad matchup.
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I also tried this deck (well, with slightly more anti-aggro like Terminate and only 1 Cryptic) against that new "Gruul Zoo" pre-board. Most of the games--at least 3/4--were terrible. Deathrite nearly always died immediately, Delver doesn't stick, Bob bleeds me to death, V. Clique was a blocker, and my removal can't keep up with their speed and my painful mana base.
Who said the deck can't beat aggro? I agree that the matchup isn't good but it isn't close to un-winnable. Our MU vs Zoo is probably 40/60 at worst and the Affinity and Infect matchups are better.
I wouldn't really count Infect as aggro, but I suppose it could qualify as that.
Affinity is the best matchup, and it's not great.
Zoo, Burn, UWR delver, or really, any deck that plays enough burn spells that can just send it at this deck's face will be a problem. It's just too suicidal to justify being played in a burn heavy meta. I wouldn't believe GW aggro to be a good matchup either.
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Actually, Threads of Disloyalty may not be a bad sideboard choice against "Gruul Zoo". I just hope it's not too slow (3 cmc) and ineffective (the tempo boost of Burning-Tree Emissary can be backbreaking, and hasty Flinthoof Boars can be nasty if you think you're safe snatching a 3/3) compared to EE.
So what would be the best card from the following list in that matchup?
Considerations:
Pyroclasm - can be cast immediately after the zoo player's turn 2 Burning Tree Emissary combo on the play or the draw but doesn't kill X/3's and does kill all our guys.
Engineered Explosives - can be cast turn 2 on the play then cracked turn 3 to deal with the Emissary combo. Kills Tarmogoyf + Flinthoof Boar. Kills our 2 drops but not Delver or Deathrite Shaman.
Volcanic Fallout - on the play can be cast during their turn 2 off a Deathrite or on our turn 3. Costs RR which is hard, can't be countered which isn't really relevant, but is an instant. And doesn't deal with X/3's. Not a good option IMO.
Firespout - kills X/3's and not insectile aberrations but can't be cast until turn 3 if you don't have a Deathrite Shaman which means if you're on the draw they're going to get to hit you for 6-8 at least once.
Damnation - kills EVERYTHING but probably too slow.
EDIT: This is a MU where Spell Snare seems absurdly good, and it's also good versus the other Tarmogoyf decks. Maybe it's actually a better sb card for these matchups than Threads?
Turn 1 hand disruption is pretty sweet against them. Ripping a rancor and/or BTE is a hudge boost for us especially with IOK. Also like you said, spell snare is a house. It's a house basically everywhere cept against tron. I'm up to 3 main deck. It just seems like what you want to be doing when you're on the draw.
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When does lightning bolt kill Emrakul? When your opponent's at three.
I wanted to play this deck at the San Diego GP, but I don't think it is going to happen.
I won zero games after sideboard against Affinity out of about 8, and 2 games before sideboard which was out of another 8 games. Etched Champion is a beast and a half in conjunction with Cranial Plating.
Against the Tribal Zoo deck, I won about 3 out of 10 games and we played zero games with sideboards.
All of the games were close, which is what sort of makes it seem like these matches are doable. I am also not deluding myself into thinking I was playing perfect Magic, so maybe this deck is better than I am.
I have also played one match each against a random Loam deck and a Blistercoil Weird deck. I lost game one to both but won the next two games.
Yes, it is. The argument was about Lingering Souls, not Token decks. Electrolyze works very well at keeping the board clear while you crash in for a turn against their Spirits. This is a Tempo deck, Electrolyze is a Tempo card, and there are few other options that provide as much value and flexibility in the format as Electrolyze, that also happen to be great against the front half of a Lingering Souls. Technically, you're trading 1:1, unless you value two spirits as more than a card. Forked Bolt is the other decent option, but doesn't keep you up on the card advantage.
Sweepers are great, but not really in a Delver deck, and even so they are SB options at best.
4 Delver of Secret
4 Dark Confidant
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Snapcaster Mage
1 Vendilion Clique
Spells
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Serum Visions
3 Remand
3 Cryptic Command
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Thoughtseize
1 Electrolyze
1 Spell Snares
1 Mana Leak
1 Pillar of Flames
3 Creeping Tar Pit
2 Darkslick Shores
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Verdant Catacombs
1 Misty Rainforest
2 Island
1 Swamp
1 Blood Crypt
1 Watery Grave
1 Steam Vents
1 Breeding Pool
2 Threads of Disloyalty
1 Spell Pierce
1 Liliana of the Veil
1 Countersquall
2 Ancient Grudge
1 Spellskite
1 Thoughtseize
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Jace Beleran
1 Surgical Extraction
2 Geth's Verdict
1 Go For the Throat
Lvl 2 Judge
That definitely makes more sense.
Lvl 2 Judge
Other than that looks interesting. Lots of good stuff.
I was working on a Grixis Midrange deck, but this looks better. Thoughtseize, Cryptic and Clique are just too expensive to me though. =/
Anyways, I think this deck is real solid. Bob fixes many mulligan problems that UWR geist deck wins was having. Although I think anyone who's been playing tempo lately can agree that his sb plan it the real winner here.
Threads of Disloyalty to win the dethrite battles. and NO TORPOR ORBS? Zack just went ahead and played no direct hate cards build for any match up (besides grudge) and instead build a sb that just upgrades his deck per match up.
I found that lingering souls is very hard to beat so I changed Lili and Spell Pierce for 2 Sulfur Elementals. Has been helping a lot!
This 1000x. RUG Delver was my favorite deck in Modern until RTR came out, and this deck plays just like it, only with Confidant instead of Goyf, and Deathrite just being the only 1-mana Planeswalker printed.
This deck can't beat aggro. That = bad matchup.
I'm not even certain Grim Lavamancer post-board can solve it (or Sorin's Thirst). This deck may have to resort to Engineered Explosives.
I wouldn't really count Infect as aggro, but I suppose it could qualify as that.
Affinity is the best matchup, and it's not great.
Zoo, Burn, UWR delver, or really, any deck that plays enough burn spells that can just send it at this deck's face will be a problem. It's just too suicidal to justify being played in a burn heavy meta. I wouldn't believe GW aggro to be a good matchup either.
Turn 1 hand disruption is pretty sweet against them. Ripping a rancor and/or BTE is a hudge boost for us especially with IOK. Also like you said, spell snare is a house. It's a house basically everywhere cept against tron. I'm up to 3 main deck. It just seems like what you want to be doing when you're on the draw.
No, it's not.
Anything making Spirit tokens is making a lot of them, and quickly.
Spectral Procession
For three mana and a card, they get three tokens. For three mana now, cycling that card, you kill two of them.
Lingering Souls
For three mana and half a card, they get two tokens. For three mana now, cycling your card, you kill two of them.
For two more mana and the other half of a card, they get two tokens. You now have one random card from your deck to deal with that.
You need *sweepers* to deal with token decks.
I have been having a really tough time playing against Affinity and Tribal Zoo with Boros Reckoner and Geist of Saint Traft.
I wanted to play this deck at the San Diego GP, but I don't think it is going to happen.
I won zero games after sideboard against Affinity out of about 8, and 2 games before sideboard which was out of another 8 games. Etched Champion is a beast and a half in conjunction with Cranial Plating.
Against the Tribal Zoo deck, I won about 3 out of 10 games and we played zero games with sideboards.
All of the games were close, which is what sort of makes it seem like these matches are doable. I am also not deluding myself into thinking I was playing perfect Magic, so maybe this deck is better than I am.
I have also played one match each against a random Loam deck and a Blistercoil Weird deck. I lost game one to both but won the next two games.
However, Staticaster can kill Bob and V. Clique, while Sulfur Elemental can kill all of Soul Sisters' weenies at once.
It's probably a meta call.
...But Staticaster can accidentally take out your Bob, too...
Yes, it is. The argument was about Lingering Souls, not Token decks. Electrolyze works very well at keeping the board clear while you crash in for a turn against their Spirits. This is a Tempo deck, Electrolyze is a Tempo card, and there are few other options that provide as much value and flexibility in the format as Electrolyze, that also happen to be great against the front half of a Lingering Souls. Technically, you're trading 1:1, unless you value two spirits as more than a card. Forked Bolt is the other decent option, but doesn't keep you up on the card advantage.
Sweepers are great, but not really in a Delver deck, and even so they are SB options at best.
RGB Jund BGR
WGB Junk/Abzan Company WGB
LEGACY
RUGB Delver GURB
EDH
UW Geist of Saint Traft Aggro-Control WU
RUG Riku of Two Reflections Combo GUR
BBB Skithiryx Control BB