I think the Countryside Crusher/Young Pyromancer/Goyf deck is probably best labled as Aggro Loam. I know it isn't exactly like previous iterations of the deck, but it seems close enough. Maybe PyroLoam
I ask this because of decks that are rogue that pop up from time to time. How do we know the real strength of a deck without the numbers to show what it does % wise? You would think people would tend towards the best decks inherently, but that clearly isn't the case. People stick with whats familiar(jund), what's easy(burn), what they like, etc.
A deck like cruel control, which showed up in 3 dailies this week has been MIA for a long time. But if only 10 people are playing it, how do we know how strong it really is? Especially with new cards like anger of the gods, hero's downfall and steam augery.
Basically innovation is stifled on a base level by people sticking with what they know, and not trying out new things. Nobody wants to be the guy to put in 10 dailies of failures to hit a new idea with a bunch of cards nobody has used before.
Thoughts? I suppose this isn't a modern only question so feel free to relate it to other formats, but it seems we love to complain about the 'boring' metagame in this forum
Merged with official Meta Discussion thread
-ktkenshinx-
Good question. Living End, for example, hasn't been aided tremendously by recently printed cards (if anything, stuff like Scavenging Ooze should hurt it in theory), and yet it had two players piloting the deck make top 8 at GP Antwerp. It's not a popular deck for whatever reason, but people can still do well with it.
The larger the event, the more likely a rogue player can avoid playing one of its bad match ups. Meta decks work better the bigger then event. The reason we saw so many fringe decks in Antwerp was the size of the player pool. Nothing more, nothing less.
The larger the event, the more likely a rogue player can avoid playing one of its bad match ups. Meta decks work better the bigger then event. The reason we saw so many fringe decks in Antwerp was the size of the player pool. Nothing more, nothing less.
Agreed. Also why you see so much jund/birthing pod. People who go to modern events are usually just looking to play what they've seen is doing well, so a lot of people just bring those decks.
I think this is interesting, I do think that there are a lot of decks with power just waiting to be picked up.
But, is this in reference to- perhaps- tier 2 and 3 decks which all have primers here on mtgs, or does this theory also include decks that are relatively uncharted?
And, as the meta shifts constantly, there are tons of hidden decks/gems that go by the wayside because people log on to their computer and places likes mtgs rather than digging through their boxes of modern legal cards.
On the other hand, are the good cards just too obvious that this is not so much the case?
I ask this because of decks that are rogue that pop up from time to time. How do we know the real strength of a deck without the numbers to show what it does % wise? You would think people would tend towards the best decks inherently, but that clearly isn't the case. People stick with whats familiar(jund), what's easy(burn), what they like, etc.
A deck like cruel control, which showed up in 3 dailies this week has been MIA for a long time. But if only 10 people are playing it, how do we know how strong it really is? Especially with new cards like anger of the gods, hero's downfall and steam augery.
Basically innovation is stifled on a base level by people sticking with what they know, and not trying out new things. Nobody wants to be the guy to put in 10 dailies of failures to hit a new idea with a bunch of cards nobody has used before.
Thoughts? I suppose this isn't a modern only question so feel free to relate it to other formats, but it seems we love to complain about the 'boring' metagame in this forum
One thing: you need to take into account things like ease of playing vs mental fatigue when you consider how good a deck is. 16 rounds at GP is a pretty exhausting experience. The more complex the deck, the more likely a mistake is to happen. Pretty soon your plusing your Karn instead of popping a land while your opponent has the mana to combo off.
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Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
One thing: you need to take into account things like ease of playing vs mental fatigue when you consider how good a deck is. 16 rounds at GP is a pretty exhausting experience. The more complex the deck, the more likely a mistake is to happen. Pretty soon your plusing your Karn instead of popping a land while your opponent has the mana to combo off.
No doubt, im thinking about mostly online metagame but good points as well about in a GP you facing more rogue brews and that leading to less bad matchups for those decks.
I mean t2-3 decks and some decks that show up very rarely as well but are still playable depending on the meta.
One thing: you need to take into account things like ease of playing vs mental fatigue when you consider how good a deck is. 16 rounds at GP is a pretty exhausting experience. The more complex the deck, the more likely a mistake is to happen. Pretty soon your plusing your Karn instead of popping a land while your opponent has the mana to combo off.
That's a big one. For those of you who don't know what he's referencing, in the finals of the GP Antwerp, the Tron player misplayed by +ing a Karn instead of eating a land, allowing Splinter Kiki to go off.
Brian Kibler tweeted that the Tron guy killed himself, and I really think the finals could have been different if not for this mistake.
That being said, 16 rounds is crazy. I know I couldn't do it. Props to Anteri for being 1st in standings after 15 rounds.
I'm going to a tournament tonight and I'm lost as to what I should play. I've never played in this area before so I don't know what the meta will be like. I have access to a few decks but I am only really "extremely practiced" with a few of them. (I'll put a * in front of any that I am heavily practiced with) I'm a good pilot though, so I don't foresee myself having any major problems playing with one of the other decks.
At my disposal are:
- Affinity
- *URW Control (snap only version)
- *Gruul Aggro
- Naya Midrange (the Kibler list)
- Scapeshift
- Death n' Taxes (the mono white lists, not to be confused with the GW version)
- Domain Aggro (Found in my sig)
- Snapcaster Domain (the Noble Hierarch and Lingering Souls version)
I'm playing at 6pm and it's 3:50 now so any input would be greatly appreciated!!!
@Bigeyes: Simplest answer I can give is UWR. You're familiar with it, it's a legit deck, it can get there. If we're to assume the tournament is above FNM level in seriousness, expect to see Twin decks in force.
I'm admittedly not especially well versed in the modern metagame, but what specifically is holding down the Primetime version of Scapeshift lists. I can see how lists concentrating on the big Scapeshift kill would suffer from a lot of the incidental lifegain and disruption, but it seems to me that the Primetime list wouldn't suffer from the same issues.
A Mythic Conscription deck went 3-1 at a Daily three days ago. Here is the link. It seems interesting, but with it only running 3 blue cards (the sovereigns) in the 75, it just doesn't feel right to me.
A Mythic Conscription deck went 3-1 at a Daily three days ago. Here is the link. It seems interesting, but with it only running 3 blue cards (the sovereigns) in the 75, it just doesn't feel right to me.
Not really surprising, Mythic Conscription didn't play much blue in its builds. What surprises me is that player didn't run any See Beyond to shuffle Eldrazi Conscription back into the deck while drawing two.
Anyone notice how diverise the online meta has been lately? A lot of established decks, but then a ton of random ones too.. Conscription, verious esper, u/w, and u/b control decks, most with non creature win condtions.
Edit: Like reallly weird stuff (And cool things) 4-0
Anyone notice how diverise the online meta has been lately? A lot of established decks, but then a ton of random ones too.. Conscription, verious esper, u/w, and u/b control decks, most with non creature win condtions.
Edit: Like reallly weird stuff (And cool things) 4-0
Anyone notice how diverise the online meta has been lately? A lot of established decks, but then a ton of random ones too.. Conscription, verious esper, u/w, and u/b control decks, most with non creature win condtions.
Edit: Like reallly weird stuff (And cool things) 4-0
Though I think relying on Percy to get there might be a bit dangerous. He's got assorted outs, but... eh, it's far from a bad choice at any rate.
The build is indicative of a midrangey outlook, particularly of the control persuasion (that is to say, it's really only looking to be the beatdown against other control-type decks). Not maindecking counters is an interesting choice in of itself, but I guess they're just bad when you want to be proactive.
Besides, 4 IoK + 4 Thoughtseize is all the preventative measures you need when you're being that proactive.
I dont understand how this wins. Mill? All I see is take a bunch of turns, draw a crap load of cards. No wincon is popping out at me.
It wins via milling the opponent with the 2 Jace belerens. Once this deck has an active Howling mine, it can presumably time walk the rest of the game due to the density of the time walk effects, and the ability to draw 2-3 cards per turn making it easy to hit them all. After taking 6-7 turns in a row, it just jaces them to death via mill. The lab maniac in the SB is presumably an out against tron / eldrazi decks.
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A deck like cruel control, which showed up in 3 dailies this week has been MIA for a long time. But if only 10 people are playing it, how do we know how strong it really is? Especially with new cards like anger of the gods, hero's downfall and steam augery.
Basically innovation is stifled on a base level by people sticking with what they know, and not trying out new things. Nobody wants to be the guy to put in 10 dailies of failures to hit a new idea with a bunch of cards nobody has used before.
Thoughts? I suppose this isn't a modern only question so feel free to relate it to other formats, but it seems we love to complain about the 'boring' metagame in this forum
Merged with official Meta Discussion thread
-ktkenshinx-
Agreed. Also why you see so much jund/birthing pod. People who go to modern events are usually just looking to play what they've seen is doing well, so a lot of people just bring those decks.
Modern Junk Primer
Legacy ANT Primer
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But, is this in reference to- perhaps- tier 2 and 3 decks which all have primers here on mtgs, or does this theory also include decks that are relatively uncharted?
And, as the meta shifts constantly, there are tons of hidden decks/gems that go by the wayside because people log on to their computer and places likes mtgs rather than digging through their boxes of modern legal cards.
On the other hand, are the good cards just too obvious that this is not so much the case?
One thing: you need to take into account things like ease of playing vs mental fatigue when you consider how good a deck is. 16 rounds at GP is a pretty exhausting experience. The more complex the deck, the more likely a mistake is to happen. Pretty soon your plusing your Karn instead of popping a land while your opponent has the mana to combo off.
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
No doubt, im thinking about mostly online metagame but good points as well about in a GP you facing more rogue brews and that leading to less bad matchups for those decks.
I mean t2-3 decks and some decks that show up very rarely as well but are still playable depending on the meta.
That's a big one. For those of you who don't know what he's referencing, in the finals of the GP Antwerp, the Tron player misplayed by +ing a Karn instead of eating a land, allowing Splinter Kiki to go off.
Brian Kibler tweeted that the Tron guy killed himself, and I really think the finals could have been different if not for this mistake.
That being said, 16 rounds is crazy. I know I couldn't do it. Props to Anteri for being 1st in standings after 15 rounds.
I do the same thing.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
For MTGO meta, mtggoldfish is fine. If you want paper events included, try mtgtop8.
I'm going to a tournament tonight and I'm lost as to what I should play. I've never played in this area before so I don't know what the meta will be like. I have access to a few decks but I am only really "extremely practiced" with a few of them. (I'll put a * in front of any that I am heavily practiced with) I'm a good pilot though, so I don't foresee myself having any major problems playing with one of the other decks.
At my disposal are:
- Affinity
- *URW Control (snap only version)
- *Gruul Aggro
- Naya Midrange (the Kibler list)
- Scapeshift
- Death n' Taxes (the mono white lists, not to be confused with the GW version)
- Domain Aggro (Found in my sig)
- Snapcaster Domain (the Noble Hierarch and Lingering Souls version)
I'm playing at 6pm and it's 3:50 now so any input would be greatly appreciated!!!
Thanks!!
And at least one jerk piloting Boggle.
Also a good smattering of Tron seems likely.
Really, anything in the Proven sub.
60 cards
4 Creeping Tar Pit
4 Darkslick Shores
2 Ghost Quarter
4 Island
2 Swamp
4 Tectonic Edge
4 Watery Grave
24 lands
1 Frost Titan
1 creature
2 Cryptic Command
3 Damnation
4 Jace Beleren
1 Liliana of the Veil
3 Mana Leak
2 Night of Souls' Betrayal
4 Remand
2 Repeal
4 Smother
2 Spell Snare
4 Spreading Seas
4 Thoughtseize
35 other spells
1 Damnation
2 Darkblast
4 Doom Blade
2 Spell Snare
2 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
4 Vampire Nighthawk
It begins.
IT.
BEGINS.
But I think that deck could be better.
It doesn't seem to know if it wants to be midrange, or control.
Any insights?
Pemmin's ElfBall [Casual]
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Not really surprising, Mythic Conscription didn't play much blue in its builds. What surprises me is that player didn't run any See Beyond to shuffle Eldrazi Conscription back into the deck while drawing two.
Edit: Like reallly weird stuff (And cool things)
4-0
60 cards
22 Snow-Covered Island
2 Tectonic Edge
24 lands
0 creatures
4 Cryptic Command
1 Elixir of Immortality
4 Howling Mine
2 Jace Beleren
4 Remand
4 Serum Visions
3 Sleight of Hand
2 Spell Snare
4 Temporal Mastery
4 Time Warp
4 Walk the Aeons
36 other spells
2 Aetherize
2 Gigadrowse
2 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Laboratory Maniac
2 Rapid Hybridization
2 Spell Pierce
2 Swan Song
2 Trickbind
That looks... actually really fun to pilot. What's the price on it? If its cheap enough I might pick it up.
I dont understand how this wins. Mill? All I see is take a bunch of turns, draw a crap load of cards. No wincon is popping out at me.
// Smaland (4 - 0)
// Modern Daily #6257924 on 2013-11-07
4 Darkslick Shores
4 Marsh Flats
3 Mutavault
3 Swamp
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Watery Grave
4 Abyssal Persecutor
4 Geralf's Messenger
1 Snapcaster Mage
4 Damnation
2 Devour Flesh
3 Disfigure
1 Far // Away
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Jace Beleren
2 Phyrexian Arena
1 Rapid Hybridization
4 Thoughtseize
1 Vapor Snag
3 Victim of Night
1 Grave Titan
3 Infest
3 Pithing Needle
1 Raven's Crime
1 Runechanter's Pike
2 Steel Sabotage
2 Swan Song
Though I think relying on Percy to get there might be a bit dangerous. He's got assorted outs, but... eh, it's far from a bad choice at any rate.
The build is indicative of a midrangey outlook, particularly of the control persuasion (that is to say, it's really only looking to be the beatdown against other control-type decks). Not maindecking counters is an interesting choice in of itself, but I guess they're just bad when you want to be proactive.
Besides, 4 IoK + 4 Thoughtseize is all the preventative measures you need when you're being that proactive.
It wins via milling the opponent with the 2 Jace belerens. Once this deck has an active Howling mine, it can presumably time walk the rest of the game due to the density of the time walk effects, and the ability to draw 2-3 cards per turn making it easy to hit them all. After taking 6-7 turns in a row, it just jaces them to death via mill. The lab maniac in the SB is presumably an out against tron / eldrazi decks.