I am running two cavern and 4 horizon canopy's. I like cavern of souls but it does little if you are trying to cast non creature spells or creatures without the chosen type. It does tap for colorless which helps it some. My meta isn't very heavy with control so I don't really feel the need to run four. For me, horizon canopy is awesome. Being able to draw cards is very beneficial. Like others have said... It's really a meta call.
I actually like Narnam Renegade a lot. At first I didn't think it would be too impressive when compared with the Soul Sister: Essence Warden or with our classic "combo piece": Nettle Sentinel. Then I considered the wider implications with chord and coco. It isn't infrequent to have your elvish officers bolts and terminated and then your grunts outsized by Goyfs and Ravines. Those would have been great times to chord for a Deathtouch creature. Prior to this guy, we haven't had another elf with deathtouch other than Glissa, the Traitor, whom incidentally was in my sideboard during the Eldrazi Winter (what better way to stop a Reality Smasher?).
Having these guys mainboard-able at cmc 1 with no real repercussions (beyond losing the tap-untap combo with heritage druid) is surely worth the ability to wall off, or better yet ambush via chord, big guys like Tasigur, Angler, Goyf, Glistener Elf, Titans. If we were sore about fatal push, surely this is our very own "fatal push".
For those who are preparing for the SCG Regionals at the beginning of the next month lets talk S/B plans and Meta.
Now with the new banning of G. Probe and GG. Troll, I think we will see a rise in Ad Nauseam and Tron. And I think Bant Eldrazi will be played heavily.
Any thoughts on what your expecting at SCG Regionals?
I think Elves will be fine. There will most likely be a rise in midrange/control strategies, which in turn precipitates more Tron/Ad Nauseam/Titanshift.
I'm pretty attached to GB just due to familiarity, but I'd probably lean towards playing Lead in a meta like this with Chord in the board. Board would look something like:
3 Thoughtseize
3 Chord of Calling
3 Kitchen Finks
<fill rest with designated hate bullets, likely Revoker + Scooze + Rec Sage + Skite/Melira>
1 Creeping Corrosion
1 Fracturing Gust
Its not gonna change my decision not to play Elves for this up coming GP, but it does look a lot more tempting now that Dredge is a bit weaker. I still expect Dredge to see play as its still a powerful deck, and all the faster decks still have a chance at eating you before you can do much (Suiblue/Infect/Affinity will still take up a sizable amount of the meta.)
Now is also the time I'd experiment with running 4 fetches instead of Cavern. Blue based decks still pretty low percentage (~15-20%?) at a GP typically, so a decent call would be to go up to 13 black sources (vs 9) for more consistent Thoughtseizes against the slightly more unfair decks.
I actually like Narnam Renegade a lot. At first I didn't think it would be too impressive when compared with the Soul Sister: Essence Warden or with our classic "combo piece": Nettle Sentinel. Then I considered the wider implications with chord and coco. It isn't infrequent to have your elvish officers bolts and terminated and then your grunts outsized by Goyfs and Ravines. Those would have been great times to chord for a Deathtouch creature. Prior to this guy, we haven't had another elf with deathtouch other than Glissa, the Traitor, whom incidentally was in my sideboard during the Eldrazi Winter (what better way to stop a Reality Smasher?).
Having these guys mainboard-able at cmc 1 with no real repercussions (beyond losing the tap-untap combo with heritage druid) is surely worth the ability to wall off, or better yet ambush via chord, big guys like Tasigur, Angler, Goyf, Glistener Elf, Titans. If we were sore about fatal push, surely this is our very own "fatal push".
Heck, I'd even run one or 2 in my sideboard as "removal" even if I weren't mainboarding.
Exactly. We got another option at 1CMC slot which only increases our flexibility. Its ability to kill opposing Snapcasters, Goblin Guides and trade with everything else for a mere G is more than welcome addition.
As for Cavern of Souls, I agree that we can cut down on them at the moment. Although there's Jeskai Nahiri and Grixis Control/Delver as well as Chalice of the Void to worry about, I'd much rather have coloured mana to cast my spells than the ability to maybe get one or two elves through uncountered.
I actually like Narnam Renegade a lot. At first I didn't think it would be too impressive when compared with the Soul Sister: Essence Warden or with our classic "combo piece": Nettle Sentinel. Then I considered the wider implications with chord and coco. It isn't infrequent to have your elvish officers bolts and terminated and then your grunts outsized by Goyfs and Ravines. Those would have been great times to chord for a Deathtouch creature. Prior to this guy, we haven't had another elf with deathtouch other than Glissa, the Traitor, whom incidentally was in my sideboard during the Eldrazi Winter (what better way to stop a Reality Smasher?).
Having these guys mainboard-able at cmc 1 with no real repercussions (beyond losing the tap-untap combo with heritage druid) is surely worth the ability to wall off, or better yet ambush via chord, big guys like Tasigur, Angler, Goyf, Glistener Elf, Titans. If we were sore about fatal push, surely this is our very own "fatal push".
Heck, I'd even run one or 2 in my sideboard as "removal" even if I weren't mainboarding.
Exactly. We got another option at 1CMC slot which only increases our flexibility. Its ability to kill opposing Snapcasters, Goblin Guides and trade with everything else for a mere G is more than welcome addition.
As for Cavern of Souls, I agree that we can cut down on them at the moment. Although there's Jeskai Nahiri and Grixis Control/Delver as well as Chalice of the Void to worry about, I'd much rather have coloured mana to cast my spells than the ability to maybe get one or two elves through uncountered.
Would you say switching Chords out with EE to be worth it to help trigger Narnam? EE can be cast a lot earlier than Chord. But Chord is instant speed and you don't lose a creature.
I've been an advocate for Eldritch Evolution and I think Elves are the right shell for it. Our curve is low enough that we can tutor into anything CMC3 by saccing one of our dorks. The thing is that instant speed of Chord is sometimes too good to pass up. EE plays differently, similar to Lead builds where you aim to spend most of your mana on your turn since CoCo is your only instant speed spell. On the other hand EE allows you to cheat in 3 and 4CMC threats as early as T2. If blue based decks aren't common in your area, definitely try out EE.
I'd say Narnam Renegade is worth testing out with EE but as Syreal pointed out, Narnam shines in creature heavy meta where you aim to trade their fatties by blocking with it.
I actually like Narnam Renegade a lot. At first I didn't think it would be too impressive when compared with the Soul Sister: Essence Warden or with our classic "combo piece": Nettle Sentinel. Then I considered the wider implications with chord and coco. It isn't infrequent to have your elvish officers bolts and terminated and then your grunts outsized by Goyfs and Ravines. Those would have been great times to chord for a Deathtouch creature. Prior to this guy, we haven't had another elf with deathtouch other than Glissa, the Traitor, whom incidentally was in my sideboard during the Eldrazi Winter (what better way to stop a Reality Smasher?).
Having these guys mainboard-able at cmc 1 with no real repercussions (beyond losing the tap-untap combo with heritage druid) is surely worth the ability to wall off, or better yet ambush via chord, big guys like Tasigur, Angler, Goyf, Glistener Elf, Titans. If we were sore about fatal push, surely this is our very own "fatal push".
Heck, I'd even run one or 2 in my sideboard as "removal" even if I weren't mainboarding.
Exactly. We got another option at 1CMC slot which only increases our flexibility. Its ability to kill opposing Snapcasters, Goblin Guides and trade with everything else for a mere G is more than welcome addition.
As for Cavern of Souls, I agree that we can cut down on them at the moment. Although there's Jeskai Nahiri and Grixis Control/Delver as well as Chalice of the Void to worry about, I'd much rather have coloured mana to cast my spells than the ability to maybe get one or two elves through uncountered.
Would you say switching Chords out with EE to be worth it to help trigger Narnam? EE can be cast a lot earlier than Chord. But Chord is instant speed and you don't lose a creature.
I ran Eldritch Evolution for a while before rounding out my Chords and I feel very strongly that it is just too vulnerable to removal or counterspells in a way that sometimes results in EE actually setting you back. Chords can also be pretty slow, but it's important to keep in mind that when chording, every creature you have is a mana dork. Not so with EE, and if you're running Narnams (and running EE with the specific intent to make buffed Narnams stronger) then your chances of dropping EE on turn two with a dork are surprisingly low. This goes double if you've got a lot of bolts in your meta (as good players will bolt your dork before you get to use it). Even worse, if they draw into a bolt then no matter what you pull out for CMC 3 is going to die, putting you down two cards and leaving you with an empty board turn two - which is really deadly for a deck like ours that's built around achieving a critical mass.
I actually like Narnam Renegade a lot. At first I didn't think it would be too impressive when compared with the Soul Sister: Essence Warden or with our classic "combo piece": Nettle Sentinel. Then I considered the wider implications with chord and coco. It isn't infrequent to have your elvish officers bolts and terminated and then your grunts outsized by Goyfs and Ravines. Those would have been great times to chord for a Deathtouch creature. Prior to this guy, we haven't had another elf with deathtouch other than Glissa, the Traitor, whom incidentally was in my sideboard during the Eldrazi Winter (what better way to stop a Reality Smasher?).
Having these guys mainboard-able at cmc 1 with no real repercussions (beyond losing the tap-untap combo with heritage druid) is surely worth the ability to wall off, or better yet ambush via chord, big guys like Tasigur, Angler, Goyf, Glistener Elf, Titans. If we were sore about fatal push, surely this is our very own "fatal push".
Heck, I'd even run one or 2 in my sideboard as "removal" even if I weren't mainboarding.
Exactly. We got another option at 1CMC slot which only increases our flexibility. Its ability to kill opposing Snapcasters, Goblin Guides and trade with everything else for a mere G is more than welcome addition.
As for Cavern of Souls, I agree that we can cut down on them at the moment. Although there's Jeskai Nahiri and Grixis Control/Delver as well as Chalice of the Void to worry about, I'd much rather have coloured mana to cast my spells than the ability to maybe get one or two elves through uncountered.
Would you say switching Chords out with EE to be worth it to help trigger Narnam? EE can be cast a lot earlier than Chord. But Chord is instant speed and you don't lose a creature.
I ran Eldritch Evolution for a while before rounding out my Chords and I feel very strongly that it is just too vulnerable to removal or counterspells in a way that sometimes results in EE actually setting you back. Chords can also be pretty slow, but it's important to keep in mind that when chording, every creature you have is a mana dork. Not so with EE, and if you're running Narnams (and running EE with the specific intent to make buffed Narnams stronger) then your chances of dropping EE on turn two with a dork are surprisingly low. This goes double if you've got a lot of bolts in your meta (as good players will bolt your dork before you get to use it). Even worse, if they draw into a bolt then no matter what you pull out for CMC 3 is going to die, putting you down two cards and leaving you with an empty board turn two - which is really deadly for a deck like ours that's built around achieving a critical mass.
Wow. Never even thought about it that way. Well said. Thank you.
How's this Abzan mana base look:
Land (18)
4x Gilt Leaf Palace
4x Blooming Marsh
4x Wooded Foothills
1x Overgrown Tomb
1x Temple Garden
4x Forest
I was considering adding in 2 Cavern of Souls in there to make it 20 lands since i have fetches in there. What do you think. This mana base would be for Chord with silver bullets in the side.
Or I cut the fetches and run
Land (18)
4x Blooming Marsh
2x Cavern of Souls
4x Forest
4x Gilt-Leaf Palace
1x Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
2x Overgrown Tomb
1x Pendelhaven
This side is pure green and black and will run the Lead variant with no silver bullets in the side. Instead will feature multiples of creatures and some non creature spells like Thoughtseize and Abrupt Decay.
There was a good discussion on EE a few pages back. I'd been one of the first to test it; and these were my findings:
1. Con: Vulnerable to blue control
2. Pro: Excellent in noninteractive metas. (think turn 2 Anafenza against dredge or Kataki against affinity)
3. Pro: Enables 4 drop targets easily, widening toolbox options (think thought-knot seer or kalitas)
4. Con: Hurts the overall tempo of the deck.
5. Con: Dead card when board is wiped.
6. Con: Sorcery speed.
I had at one point gone overboard to say I'd gone to EE and didn't plan on looking back; and yet here I am again on Chords. The reason is simple; more dredge, affinity and combo is where EE will absolutely shine, giving you soft wins on turn 2 with ridiculous plays (turn 1 dork, turn 2 EE into Magus of the Moon against Abzan, or Anafenza against Dredge). But against a more generalized field with Mana Leaks and Midrange attrition battles, EE can sometimes prove a liability.
Observe the meta and game it; that's been the way to win instead of condemning/endorsing a specific card. That's the way to take more games wherever you are.
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BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
I went 3-0 at a small, 12 person TNM with GW Elves.
Round 1 vs. Affinity. In the first game, he comes off slowly. I explode on the field and after taking poison down to 7 poison from an Inkmoth Nexus with counters from Steel Overseer and +1/+0 for Signal Pest, I easily swing for 15 and lethal. In the next game, I make a HUGE mistake of doing turn 2 Phyrexian Revoker on Cranial Plating, preemptively casting it. He gets Ghirapur Aether Grid and whittles me down. In the next game, he gets Ghirapur Aether Grid again, but I cast Phyrexian Revoker, although my Kataki, War's Wage ate it after killing 4 artifacts. I eventually get enough to attack him while at 3 life. He made a few mistakes and I mistakenly didn't untap a creature of mine and realized it during combat. So I let him take his turn back, but he still did the same attacks. 2-1.
Round 2 vs. Grixis Delver. In the first game, he gets turn 1 Delver, but this is all he does. He misses out on Red mana, but I still end up siding in BFT and Selfless Spirit. I end up swinging with creatures with double Elvish Archdruid. In the next game, I fail to draw a 2nd land and he does double Delver and Vendilion Clique. Way too fast. In the last game, I just overwhelm the board and have Ezuri to knock his creatures down, then stomp all over him. 2-1.
Round 3 vs. RW Burn. This guy has played Burn for quite a while, but he still lacks a lot of Burn player's skills. In the first game, he is close to getting me, but his 1 Plains prevents him from potentially burning me out. I win at 3. In the next game, he does turn 2 Eidolon of the Great Revel. I go off with Elves, but have to end up taking 1 damage from each one. I have Heritage Druid and am sacrificing a Horizon Canopy each turn for 3 turns in a row looking for Chord of Calling. I find it and use it for Scavenging Ooze to exile 2 Goblin Guides (who traded with Nettle Sentinels earlier) to stay at a safe 6 life. He draws Bolt and does it, but I win at 3 again. 2-0.
3-0 is 2nd place. I will admit that the competition wasn't all that good today, but still happy to get some reps.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
You can try for the best of both worlds, but it's YOUR list that gets outperformed. G/B and G/W are both outpperforming yours. None of the top performing lists have 3 shamans. So please take your toxicity elsewhere. Besides being wrong, you're being a jerk. I get double shamans about 1 out of 5 times on Co-co because I have 4. You don't, for very good mathematical reasons. It's not that I mind you telling me you disagree, but you've not given any solid reason AND you are telling me I'm wrong. That's unproductive AND rude.
Edit: this is to the Wizard guy who keeps telling me off for suggesting 4 shamans is the better route.
To be honest you waltzed in here making statements that "4 shamans is ALWAYS the right number." We all appreciate having a discussion but if you're unwilling to participate and feel like having a fight with anyone who disagrees with you, even when they clearly state why they think so, then maybe you're the problem.
So let's keep it civil and most of all, be open for a discussion. Some people prefer Chords, some prefer Leads. Some play 3 Shamans, some play 4. The ability to change up numbers here and there is what makes Elves so great and versatile. By being condescending to those who prefer to play them differently than you, you achieve nothing.
You can try for the best of both worlds, but it's YOUR list that gets outperformed. G/B and G/W are both outpperforming yours. None of the top performing lists have 3 shamans. So please take your toxicity elsewhere. Besides being wrong, you're being a jerk. I get double shamans about 1 out of 5 times on Co-co because I have 4. You don't, for very good mathematical reasons. It's not that I mind you telling me you disagree, but you've not given any solid reason AND you are telling me I'm wrong. That's unproductive AND rude.
Edit: this is to the Wizard guy who keeps telling me off for suggesting 4 shamans is the better route.
Mods please, this guy is seriously trying to start a fight, this is weeks later and he is still trying to rehash the argument.
Have you considered that maybe I'm trying to persuade/enlighten/convince you with proper evidence and reasoning?
Pick a fight? Here are the sequence of events:
1. You said "4 shamans is ALWAYS right". ALWAYS is in capitals for emphasis (yours). No reasoning given.
2. I say this statement is questionable at best.
3. You question my objection.
4. I make a post detailing why I feel so, saying coco catching 2 shamans is not something to gun for compared to having toolbox. I also link 3 performing decks that run 3 shamans, 1 deck running 2 shamans. To be fair, I also listed 2 decks that ran 4 shamans just so it wasn't a cherrypick.
5. You call me a jerk, toxic, and rude. You claim my hybrid abzan list is being outperformed by both dedicated shaman and toolbox lists. Cherry on the cake, you say I make statements without providing proper reasoning.
6. I demand an apology, which is is ignored.
7. I present a hybrid deck that runs 3 shamans.
8. You call on the mods.
Really? I could have reported your post making an UNPROVOKED personal attack on me, the one in the quote, and it would have been an easy infraction for you. I didn't. Maybe its time you woke up and understood the only person being unreasonable and toxic is possibly yourself.
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BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
Here's the new primer! If you want to add anything, feel free to write it down and let me know and I'll add it. Still to-do is sideboarding for GW and Abzan versions.
Lead and CoCo don't play nice with spell answers but with the projected uptick in tron, valakut, and bant eldrazi, maybe it's a good idea?
Having these guys mainboard-able at cmc 1 with no real repercussions (beyond losing the tap-untap combo with heritage druid) is surely worth the ability to wall off, or better yet ambush via chord, big guys like Tasigur, Angler, Goyf, Glistener Elf, Titans. If we were sore about fatal push, surely this is our very own "fatal push".
Lots of Burn? Essence warden
Noninteractive? Nettle Sentinel
Opposing Fatties? Narnam Renegade
Heck, I'd even run one or 2 in my sideboard as "removal" even if I weren't mainboarding.
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
I think Elves will be fine. There will most likely be a rise in midrange/control strategies, which in turn precipitates more Tron/Ad Nauseam/Titanshift.
I'm pretty attached to GB just due to familiarity, but I'd probably lean towards playing Lead in a meta like this with Chord in the board. Board would look something like:
3 Thoughtseize
3 Chord of Calling
3 Kitchen Finks
<fill rest with designated hate bullets, likely Revoker + Scooze + Rec Sage + Skite/Melira>
1 Creeping Corrosion
1 Fracturing Gust
Its not gonna change my decision not to play Elves for this up coming GP, but it does look a lot more tempting now that Dredge is a bit weaker. I still expect Dredge to see play as its still a powerful deck, and all the faster decks still have a chance at eating you before you can do much (Suiblue/Infect/Affinity will still take up a sizable amount of the meta.)
Now is also the time I'd experiment with running 4 fetches instead of Cavern. Blue based decks still pretty low percentage (~15-20%?) at a GP typically, so a decent call would be to go up to 13 black sources (vs 9) for more consistent Thoughtseizes against the slightly more unfair decks.
Exactly. We got another option at 1CMC slot which only increases our flexibility. Its ability to kill opposing Snapcasters, Goblin Guides and trade with everything else for a mere G is more than welcome addition.
As for Cavern of Souls, I agree that we can cut down on them at the moment. Although there's Jeskai Nahiri and Grixis Control/Delver as well as Chalice of the Void to worry about, I'd much rather have coloured mana to cast my spells than the ability to maybe get one or two elves through uncountered.
WBG Elves WBG
Cheeri0s
EDH:
RG Omnath, Locus of Rage RG || GWUB Atraxa, Praetors' Voice GWUB
R Zo-Zu the Punisher R || WU Brago, King Eternal WU
UB Gisa and Geralf UB || BGW Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW
Would you say switching Chords out with EE to be worth it to help trigger Narnam? EE can be cast a lot earlier than Chord. But Chord is instant speed and you don't lose a creature.
I'd say Narnam Renegade is worth testing out with EE but as Syreal pointed out, Narnam shines in creature heavy meta where you aim to trade their fatties by blocking with it.
WBG Elves WBG
Cheeri0s
EDH:
RG Omnath, Locus of Rage RG || GWUB Atraxa, Praetors' Voice GWUB
R Zo-Zu the Punisher R || WU Brago, King Eternal WU
UB Gisa and Geralf UB || BGW Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW
I ran Eldritch Evolution for a while before rounding out my Chords and I feel very strongly that it is just too vulnerable to removal or counterspells in a way that sometimes results in EE actually setting you back. Chords can also be pretty slow, but it's important to keep in mind that when chording, every creature you have is a mana dork. Not so with EE, and if you're running Narnams (and running EE with the specific intent to make buffed Narnams stronger) then your chances of dropping EE on turn two with a dork are surprisingly low. This goes double if you've got a lot of bolts in your meta (as good players will bolt your dork before you get to use it). Even worse, if they draw into a bolt then no matter what you pull out for CMC 3 is going to die, putting you down two cards and leaving you with an empty board turn two - which is really deadly for a deck like ours that's built around achieving a critical mass.
Wow. Never even thought about it that way. Well said. Thank you.
How's this Abzan mana base look:
Land (18)
4x Gilt Leaf Palace
4x Blooming Marsh
4x Wooded Foothills
1x Overgrown Tomb
1x Temple Garden
4x Forest
I was considering adding in 2 Cavern of Souls in there to make it 20 lands since i have fetches in there. What do you think. This mana base would be for Chord with silver bullets in the side.
Or I cut the fetches and run
Land (18)
4x Blooming Marsh
2x Cavern of Souls
4x Forest
4x Gilt-Leaf Palace
1x Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
2x Overgrown Tomb
1x Pendelhaven
This side is pure green and black and will run the Lead variant with no silver bullets in the side. Instead will feature multiples of creatures and some non creature spells like Thoughtseize and Abrupt Decay.
1. Con: Vulnerable to blue control
2. Pro: Excellent in noninteractive metas. (think turn 2 Anafenza against dredge or Kataki against affinity)
3. Pro: Enables 4 drop targets easily, widening toolbox options (think thought-knot seer or kalitas)
4. Con: Hurts the overall tempo of the deck.
5. Con: Dead card when board is wiped.
6. Con: Sorcery speed.
I had at one point gone overboard to say I'd gone to EE and didn't plan on looking back; and yet here I am again on Chords. The reason is simple; more dredge, affinity and combo is where EE will absolutely shine, giving you soft wins on turn 2 with ridiculous plays (turn 1 dork, turn 2 EE into Magus of the Moon against Abzan, or Anafenza against Dredge). But against a more generalized field with Mana Leaks and Midrange attrition battles, EE can sometimes prove a liability.
Observe the meta and game it; that's been the way to win instead of condemning/endorsing a specific card. That's the way to take more games wherever you are.
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
Round 1 vs. Affinity. In the first game, he comes off slowly. I explode on the field and after taking poison down to 7 poison from an Inkmoth Nexus with counters from Steel Overseer and +1/+0 for Signal Pest, I easily swing for 15 and lethal. In the next game, I make a HUGE mistake of doing turn 2 Phyrexian Revoker on Cranial Plating, preemptively casting it. He gets Ghirapur Aether Grid and whittles me down. In the next game, he gets Ghirapur Aether Grid again, but I cast Phyrexian Revoker, although my Kataki, War's Wage ate it after killing 4 artifacts. I eventually get enough to attack him while at 3 life. He made a few mistakes and I mistakenly didn't untap a creature of mine and realized it during combat. So I let him take his turn back, but he still did the same attacks. 2-1.
Round 2 vs. Grixis Delver. In the first game, he gets turn 1 Delver, but this is all he does. He misses out on Red mana, but I still end up siding in BFT and Selfless Spirit. I end up swinging with creatures with double Elvish Archdruid. In the next game, I fail to draw a 2nd land and he does double Delver and Vendilion Clique. Way too fast. In the last game, I just overwhelm the board and have Ezuri to knock his creatures down, then stomp all over him. 2-1.
Round 3 vs. RW Burn. This guy has played Burn for quite a while, but he still lacks a lot of Burn player's skills. In the first game, he is close to getting me, but his 1 Plains prevents him from potentially burning me out. I win at 3. In the next game, he does turn 2 Eidolon of the Great Revel. I go off with Elves, but have to end up taking 1 damage from each one. I have Heritage Druid and am sacrificing a Horizon Canopy each turn for 3 turns in a row looking for Chord of Calling. I find it and use it for Scavenging Ooze to exile 2 Goblin Guides (who traded with Nettle Sentinels earlier) to stay at a safe 6 life. He draws Bolt and does it, but I win at 3 again. 2-0.
3-0 is 2nd place. I will admit that the competition wasn't all that good today, but still happy to get some reps.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)1 Spellskite
4 Dwynen's Elite
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Elvish Mystic
3 Elvish Visionary
1 Eternal Witness
4 Heritage Druid
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Nettle Sentinel
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Ezuri, Renegade Leader
5 Forest
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Horizon Canopy
4 Razorverge Thicket
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Spells (8)
4 Chord of Calling
4 Collected Company
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Elvish Champion
1 Essence Warden
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
2 Fracturing Gust
2 Path to Exile
1 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Melira, Sylvok Outcast
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=110817
Hybrid list, 3 shamans, 6th place.
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
So let's keep it civil and most of all, be open for a discussion. Some people prefer Chords, some prefer Leads. Some play 3 Shamans, some play 4. The ability to change up numbers here and there is what makes Elves so great and versatile. By being condescending to those who prefer to play them differently than you, you achieve nothing.
WBG Elves WBG
Cheeri0s
EDH:
RG Omnath, Locus of Rage RG || GWUB Atraxa, Praetors' Voice GWUB
R Zo-Zu the Punisher R || WU Brago, King Eternal WU
UB Gisa and Geralf UB || BGW Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW
Have you considered that maybe I'm trying to persuade/enlighten/convince you with proper evidence and reasoning?
Pick a fight? Here are the sequence of events:
1. You said "4 shamans is ALWAYS right". ALWAYS is in capitals for emphasis (yours). No reasoning given.
2. I say this statement is questionable at best.
3. You question my objection.
4. I make a post detailing why I feel so, saying coco catching 2 shamans is not something to gun for compared to having toolbox. I also link 3 performing decks that run 3 shamans, 1 deck running 2 shamans. To be fair, I also listed 2 decks that ran 4 shamans just so it wasn't a cherrypick.
5. You call me a jerk, toxic, and rude. You claim my hybrid abzan list is being outperformed by both dedicated shaman and toolbox lists. Cherry on the cake, you say I make statements without providing proper reasoning.
6. I demand an apology, which is is ignored.
7. I present a hybrid deck that runs 3 shamans.
8. You call on the mods.
Really? I could have reported your post making an UNPROVOKED personal attack on me, the one in the quote, and it would have been an easy infraction for you. I didn't. Maybe its time you woke up and understood the only person being unreasonable and toxic is possibly yourself.
BGW Elves BGW|BW Tokens BW|WBR Sword&ShieldWBR|BUG DelverBUG|UWR Kiki UWR | UR Storm UR
Here's the new primer! If you want to add anything, feel free to write it down and let me know and I'll add it. Still to-do is sideboarding for GW and Abzan versions.
WBG Elves WBG
Cheeri0s
EDH:
RG Omnath, Locus of Rage RG || GWUB Atraxa, Praetors' Voice GWUB
R Zo-Zu the Punisher R || WU Brago, King Eternal WU
UB Gisa and Geralf UB || BGW Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW
Do we continue any kind of discussion there and more or less abandon this thread?
WBG Elves WBG
Cheeri0s
EDH:
RG Omnath, Locus of Rage RG || GWUB Atraxa, Praetors' Voice GWUB
R Zo-Zu the Punisher R || WU Brago, King Eternal WU
UB Gisa and Geralf UB || BGW Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW