Still seeing phoenix put up tons of results in medium sized events. No one is denying it is good of course, just feel that hogaak has overshadowed another big problem.
Agree. I play Izzet Phoenix, from time to time, and the deck has so many problems. Some times it happens that you’re just being lucky with birds, but the metagame isn’t the promise land for it (Surgical maindeck everywhere, lots of Narset, Parter of Veils, Combo crushes it, etc...).
IMO, the only reasons why phoenix is so popular are:
The deck is the cheapest tier-1 deck, as long as you forego buying scalding tarns. (Only burn is cheaper, I believe, and not everyone considers burn tier-1.)
The deck is very consistent, thanks to all the cantrips.
The deck doesn't entirely crumble with GY hate, so it is viable in the meta. TiTi is still a big threat.
I just don't think they'll have sufficient London mull data.
1 week in just isn't long enough and likely the correct conclusion to arrive at.
I would like a statement on how War and MH1 have altered format expectations and what is in a watch list in terms of bans and unbans but that is likely fantasy land.
After they said in the last revision they have several combos on the watch list, I wouldn't be surprised if they went ban happy and banned and unbanned several cards. Not just 1 change, but more.
Because when I watch what Modern has become in videos like this one, oh man, I feel so bad. Will fair decks become legal again? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFFcOJH3TIk&t=329s
After they said in the last revision they have several combos on the watch list, I wouldn't be surprised if they went ban happy and banned and unbanned several cards. Not just 1 change, but more.
Because when I watch what Modern has become in videos like this one, oh man, I feel so bad. Will fair decks become legal again? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFFcOJH3TIk&t=329s
how about take a break, explore other formats, do something else, if modern burns you so much that you want to unload your banhammer all over?
also, wth do you guys/girls have going with SFM? why the obsession with this friggin' creature? it's only a win package. there's things way less deserving of being on the list, like jitte.
After they said in the last revision they have several combos on the watch list, I wouldn't be surprised if they went ban happy and banned and unbanned several cards. Not just 1 change, but more.
Because when I watch what Modern has become in videos like this one, oh man, I feel so bad. Will fair decks become legal again? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFFcOJH3TIk&t=329s
Fair decks are improved by Hogaak existing and warping the meta however.
The problem is, as demonstrated last weekend, that Paper players especially do not jump to it as quickly as they could/should, for a number of reasons. There are other problems, but its not because its pushing out fair decks.
also, wth do you guys/girls have going with SFM? why the obsession with this friggin' creature? it's only a win package. there's things way less deserving of being on the list, like jitte.
I'd argue the opposite. As you say, SFM is a win package. That means that unbanning it can potentially create new decks using Stoneforge as a win condition. In particular, if Legacy is any indicator, it'd open the way for more midrange oriented decks like Abzan or UWx midrange. That's not to say that this is guaranteed or even likely in any way, but it at least gives a possibility.
On the other hand, what does Jitte do for the meta? It doesn't really create new decks. It mostly just acts as an anti-creature tool and an anti-burn tool, neither of which is really necessary given Modern's card pool. So while a deck running Jitte likely won't be meta-defining because of Jitte, it won't generate anything new either.
So if I had to choose between the two, I'd much rather have Stoneforge back, and unless there's a huge spike in the quantity and quality of creature decks, I'd rather see other cards come off the list before Jitte.
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Decks
Modern: UWUW Control UBRGrixis Shadow URIzzet Phoenix
also, wth do you guys/girls have going with SFM? why the obsession with this friggin' creature? it's only a win package. there's things way less deserving of being on the list, like jitte.
I will be fully transparent and say that there are two reasons.
1) The principle of what is, by comparison, an extremely fair and low powered card sitting on the banned list, while BS nonsense has been allowed to run free. Stoneforge is not good. And outside of hype and volume, would likely see no success at top tables. She was banned for the sins of another format and has never been Modern legal. It's a joke that she remains banned.
2) I have 3 playsets of her and want to sell them for big profits.
how about take a break, explore other formats, do something else, if modern burns you so much that you want to unload your banhammer all over?
also, wth do you guys/girls have going with SFM? why the obsession with this friggin' creature? it's only a win package. there's things way less deserving of being on the list, like jitte.
Ross Merriam, is that you? (for what it's worth, Ross Merriam said the same thing in the latest video series with Todd Anderson)
Our obsession is probably that it seems like the least offensive of cards on the Ban List. If Wizards is not going to even consider unbanning the Kor Artificer, what does this say about other cards that people want unbanned? (I'll leave that list to your imagination)
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
Besides Commander, I've been getting heavy into D&D (ironically another, better managed WOTC product). I'm a player character in two different campaigns, and have been DMing Tomb of Annihilation since last October.
Helps take the sting out of how *****ty Modern has been.
They could do anything, truly anything, and any prediction is just a guess because of that. I know hogaak is strong, but I don't think they will ban anything from it THIS announcement. If they ban from hogaak, faithless looting may be the target. Twin should be unbanned and so should SFM, but I've almost given up hope on those.
We got your opinion. Stop pestering the topic with the same thing repeated until exhaustion. It’s toxic.
Feel free to use that ignore button.
That's great that you can enjoy dying on turn 2 and have your experiences filled with non-interactive decals that all attack on different axes and require specific narrow answers in your opening hand. More power to you.
Those last days of mtgsalvation mean there are not admins around anymore. That said anybody who wants to make inappropriate/illegal posts gets to have his chance now. Don't forget, everybody. Those are your last posts! You will have to look upon them for the time to come and we can look down on those posts and say "maybe it's for better that this forum came to an end".
it's a 5-0 daily challenge legacy deck for the hogaak shell. Very few changes to port from modern to legacy. Decks like that in the past, or from legacy to modern, include cawblade (that was standard/extended at about the time modern was created), jund, and eldrazi which all took bans in modern at some point. The Affinity legacy deck was specificly sited for why the artifact lands were banned in the initial modern announcement I believe. Many other extended decks could have been sited.
I still do not support a ban this announcement, but maybe next announcement. We'll see what happens.
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IOW, I don't consider phoenix to be oppressive.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
1 week in just isn't long enough and likely the correct conclusion to arrive at.
I would like a statement on how War and MH1 have altered format expectations and what is in a watch list in terms of bans and unbans but that is likely fantasy land.
Legacy - LED Dredge, ANT & WDnT
Because when I watch what Modern has become in videos like this one, oh man, I feel so bad. Will fair decks become legal again?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFFcOJH3TIk&t=329s
Bans: bridge and/or hogaak and/or looting and/or neoform.
Unbans: sfm or nothing.
how about take a break, explore other formats, do something else, if modern burns you so much that you want to unload your banhammer all over?
also, wth do you guys/girls have going with SFM? why the obsession with this friggin' creature? it's only a win package. there's things way less deserving of being on the list, like jitte.
Fair decks are improved by Hogaak existing and warping the meta however.
The problem is, as demonstrated last weekend, that Paper players especially do not jump to it as quickly as they could/should, for a number of reasons. There are other problems, but its not because its pushing out fair decks.
Spirits
On the other hand, what does Jitte do for the meta? It doesn't really create new decks. It mostly just acts as an anti-creature tool and an anti-burn tool, neither of which is really necessary given Modern's card pool. So while a deck running Jitte likely won't be meta-defining because of Jitte, it won't generate anything new either.
So if I had to choose between the two, I'd much rather have Stoneforge back, and unless there's a huge spike in the quantity and quality of creature decks, I'd rather see other cards come off the list before Jitte.
Modern:
UWUW Control
UBRGrixis Shadow
URIzzet Phoenix
Spirits
I will be fully transparent and say that there are two reasons.
1) The principle of what is, by comparison, an extremely fair and low powered card sitting on the banned list, while BS nonsense has been allowed to run free. Stoneforge is not good. And outside of hype and volume, would likely see no success at top tables. She was banned for the sins of another format and has never been Modern legal. It's a joke that she remains banned.
2) I have 3 playsets of her and want to sell them for big profits.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
Ross Merriam, is that you? (for what it's worth, Ross Merriam said the same thing in the latest video series with Todd Anderson)
Our obsession is probably that it seems like the least offensive of cards on the Ban List. If Wizards is not going to even consider unbanning the Kor Artificer, what does this say about other cards that people want unbanned? (I'll leave that list to your imagination)
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Besides Commander, I've been getting heavy into D&D (ironically another, better managed WOTC product). I'm a player character in two different campaigns, and have been DMing Tomb of Annihilation since last October.
Helps take the sting out of how *****ty Modern has been.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
NO CHANGES in modern.
They could do anything, truly anything, and any prediction is just a guess because of that. I know hogaak is strong, but I don't think they will ban anything from it THIS announcement. If they ban from hogaak, faithless looting may be the target. Twin should be unbanned and so should SFM, but I've almost given up hope on those.
I can't wait for the London Mulligan to be accompanied by "no changes"!
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
Do personal attacks make you feel better?
At least I stick to complaining about all the stupid ***** happening in the format that leads to awful play experiences and terrible gameplay.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
That's great that you can enjoy dying on turn 2 and have your experiences filled with non-interactive decals that all attack on different axes and require specific narrow answers in your opening hand. More power to you.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
I would love to live in this fictional world!
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
Ok.
Basically what it comes down to is why are your experiences valid, and mine are not?
Again, if you don't want to hear it, ignore me instead of needlessly provoking me.
UR ....... WUBR ........... WB ............. RGW ........ UBR ....... WUB .... BGU
Spells / Blink & Combo / Token Grind / Dino Tribal / Draw Cards / Zombies / Reanimate
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/88305
it's a 5-0 daily challenge legacy deck for the hogaak shell. Very few changes to port from modern to legacy. Decks like that in the past, or from legacy to modern, include cawblade (that was standard/extended at about the time modern was created), jund, and eldrazi which all took bans in modern at some point. The Affinity legacy deck was specificly sited for why the artifact lands were banned in the initial modern announcement I believe. Many other extended decks could have been sited.
I still do not support a ban this announcement, but maybe next announcement. We'll see what happens.