I'm fine if burn wants to waste a spell on my Lone Missionary, I still gained the four life and traded a card for a card. I've found the 2 mana 2/1 surprisingly relevant in a lot of matchups but I could definitely see Auriok Champion pulling it's weight against Anglers and such.
Since we're having trouble picking a solid 2 drop, why not consider Inquisitor Exarch? It provides great fodder for flicker effects, recursion and the like, and it's a solid 2/2...
Furthermore, is there no room for 1 or 2 Cloudshift? In addition to providing a 1 mana instant-speed flicker effect, it can serve as counterspell against removal, can redraw the Wall's card for 1 mana, etc...
I was directed to go here in "What Deck Should I Play" Thread, so I guess I'm back! I do have this really strange question though: My favorite card is Magus of the Tabernacle and I really want to play him in this format. Is it possuble to squeeze him in as a 2 of? Anymore is probably a little too hard on this deck.
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I don't see a place for him in Azorius Titan. We let games go long, with plenty of mana on both sides, and carry no other taxing effects such as Ghostly Prison.
Been toying with this deck for a while and I love the way the U/W version plays but I was pretty underwhelmed how inificient Pilgrim's Eye helps us get to 7 plains. I also run 2x ojutai's command in my list and I was interested in generating more targets for the recur 2cmc creature mode. So I ended up with a Bant list, splashing for Eternal Witness and Sakura-Tribe Elder and replacing Flickerwisp with Phantasmal Image. In my testing the list definitely has some play and can threaten emeria consistently with tribe Elder as well as generate a lot of value with Eternal Witness and playing with Phantasmal Image is just fun.
Creatures
3 Court Hussar
2 Eternal Witness
1 Kitchen Finks
2 Lone Missionary
3 Wall of Omens
3 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Phantasmal Image
4 Sun Titan
Spells
2 Detention Sphere
1 Dispel
4 Path to Exile
2 Negate
2 Mana Leak
2 Ojutai's Command
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Mortarpod
Lands
3 Emeria, the Sky,Ruin
2 Flooded Strand
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Hallowed Fountain
1 Island
7 Plains
I'm not sure if keeping Ojutai's Command is actually worth it. Sometimes its awesome but usually it gets sided out for hate. Maybe Resto Angel would be a better 4cmc or Spell Snare?
Bant seems good, Witness is just sweet. I wonder how would Selesnya do?
I have been playing with this deck for a while now and constantly testing new ideas. I finally decided what kind of a list I want to follow, even if there is still much testing needed. At its core, my list is the same Azorius Titan everyone is talking about but there is some differences. Here is the deck, I will explain why I made which difference:
I believe my list more aptly named as Esper Titan.
Now, First think you probably noticed is I removed some of the creatures. This was needed to included other, noncreature spells; namely Unburial Rites and Gifts Ungiven. First problem I encountered was how to compensate for the reduced creatures. To fix it; I reduced creature base further and included one Phantasmal Image, one Snapcaster Mage and two Venser, the Sojourner. Phantasmal Image can give whatever creature's ETB effect we happen to need, and Venser flicks the creatures. Venser's ultimate isn't the reason he is here but that could be a game finisher. With flickering our creatures with Venser and copying one we need with Phantasmal Image, we can somewhat cope with our reduced creature base. Snapcaster Mage recycles out instant and sorceries; we have few of them, but they are all very important.
Finding a place for 1 Unburial Rites and 1 Gifts Ungiven, opened many different possibilities of play. Gifts Ungiven virtually became a 4-card tutor in the list. Ability to tutor for sideboard cards if you don't draw them raised the win rate.
With one Unburial Rites, including one more Gifts Ungiven became almost necessary, and sideboard and deck restructured themselves accordingly. Now that we have a Tutor, we could include as many one-ofs as we need and a big angel like Iona.
So, one Path to Exile went to sideboard for a Seal of Doom. And it was glorious. Tutor it with Gifts Ungiven and put to the battlefield with Sun Titan. Repeat.
Unburial Rites and Gifts Ungiven made our deck much more consistent. For example, I could choose Sun Titan/Seal of Doom/Detention Sphere/Unburial Rites with Gifts Ungiven. Whatever the opponent chooses, would work in my favor.
In the end, my Esper Titan variant works surprisingly well. I won against the decks I couldn't reliably before; Infect, Jund, Tron... I could feel an overall powerup. The deck is still terrible against combo, but otherwise it is very good indeed.
I tried to find better avenues of play against Ad Nauseam and Living Death, so I put 2 Leyline of Sanctity to the sideboard and 2 Negate. They helped but the deck is still weak against them.
What do you think, I suggest you to try this, you might be surprised.
If you're going with the Gifts Ungiven plan and going Esper, consider playing a one-of Necrotic Sliver. If you've got Emeria active as well as a Sun Titan, you can literally destroy every permanent your opponent has.
Fleshbag Marauder is another possibility, although if you're using Seal of Doom, that probably makes more sense.
I'd prefer to run the 2 gifts 1 rites version, but without the Vensers- what would your suggestions be?
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Well, I can saw a woman in two, but you won't wanna look in the box when I'm through.
Venser compensate for the lessened ETB effects and a game finisher. Before Venser I had one more Flickerwisp and one Crystal Shard. They are also good. Flickerwisp had other uses too and Crystal Shard helps to flicker much slowly and dodge removal. I would play that two. These are other options I considered and discarded after your question:
Mistmeadow Witch: Ability is too pricy. But can target opponent too. Also, ability is instant speed.
Voyager Staff: Need sacrifice, we need this ability most in the early game.
Nephalia Smuggler: It does not make you wait until the end of turn, but Mistmeadow Witch is clearly better.
There is also Mimic Vat, but I never used it. It seems to have potential as a one-of.
I don't think Necrotic Sliver is better than Seal of Doom for the deck, it is slower and can be exiled. It is better in the late game but our endgame is already very strong. But it might indeed be better than Mangara of Corondor. It also 3CMC but does not suffer the summoning sickness and and does not need the Mortarpods. I think it is better, did not thought to include it before, thanks! But if we include Mimic Vat, Mangara of Corondor would be better. Actually, a turn 4 Gifts Ungiven with Mangara of Corondor/Mimic Vat/Unburial Rites/Sun Titan would be very powerful. You could also change one land with Minamo, School at Water's Edge if you go that way.
But I still think 2 Vensers are better that this lines, still, I will test Mimic Vat. Thank you for this nice stream of thought, it gave me a Mimic Vat
I'm probably going to be running a Crystal Shard and a Flickerwisp over the Venser, mostly because I prefer to have permanents that are gettable with Sun Titan.
But running Gifts + Rites and Seal of Doom are two things I'm definitely going to consider.
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Well, I can saw a woman in two, but you won't wanna look in the box when I'm through.
Venser, when played, usually helps greatly for Emeria. You flick Pilgrim's Eye, Sun Titan and Court Hussar for lands. It raised consistency and speed of Emeria quite a bit, I had many pre turn-ten 7 plains with Venser's help. It is true that Sun Titan doesn't work with it, but it usually does its job before killed.
I tried Mimic Vat a little bit today, played 4-5 games which I draw it. It isn't that good. Too slow. As of now, there is only one thing I am debating: -1 Ghost Quarter, +1 Swamp. Any ideas? 2 Ghost Quarter seems one too less.
The card that does the least work is Snapcaster Mage. But it saved my neck a few times by recycling a Supreme Verdict, so I am keeping it.
I just got a new idea, I will test it tonight but how do you think Athreos would do in Venser's place.
It is 3CMC, that is definitely better. His ability should work in our favor in both cases most of the time. If they agree to the 3 damage and send our creature to the graveyard, we can just take it back later; if they don't, more ETB. After they realize that the choice would become much harder for them.
One thing that really speaks in Athreos' favor is our boardwipes. With this on board, Supreme Verdict would just be much more valuable. Potentially hitting as much as 12 or getting my creatures back.
What I am not sure of is whether or not Athreos' ability would be better than extra flicking of Venser. With Venser I gathered 7 plains before turn 10 many times, and there is his ultimate. Even his -1 helped me finish a game many times with a late Venser. I think in the end Venser will prove to be better but this needs to be tested.
I will report the results.
Current list got a little more optimization by the way:
Necrotic Sliver made a huge difference over Mangara. Hits way more than him. It hits 2 times in a turn with Sun Titan and put pressure since it will just keep hitting.
I could count the times I used Miren with one hand, changing it with a swamp made the deck more consistent.
I also tested Mimic Vat. Using a Court Hussar is really valuable but I find it too slow. It was hard to use in the early turns and they are the most important ones. We don't need more cards that help in long games unless they are really spectacular, like Athreos.
I've used Athreos as a way to grind against BGx decks in MartyrProc. It worked well. The only issue I have is that it's a little bit anti-synergistic with Necrotic Sliver and Court Hussar, but that's probably not that much of a problem in the late game.
I've got a bunch of cards coming in the mail, and I'll do some trading to get the cards I need (Necrotic Sliver and Athreos.)
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Well, I can saw a woman in two, but you won't wanna look in the box when I'm through.
If you're going to be running Athreos, I think you should be running at least a one-of Fleshbag Maurauder. Target player sacrifices a creature and pays 3 life or they have to sacrifice another.
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Well, I can saw a woman in two, but you won't wanna look in the box when I'm through.
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Martyr Proc Thread
Esper Relicblade Thread
Standard:
Mardu Superfriends
Turbofog
BGElvesBG and BUGNissa ElvesBUG Faithful Elfer since May 1st, 2015
Results: SCG IQ Top 8, Monthly Modern Masters Top 4
Yeah, burn blowing a Bolt on the Missionary is effectively a 2-for-1 trade in our favor. I love when they do that.
Martyr Proc Thread
Esper Relicblade Thread
Standard:
Mardu Superfriends
Turbofog
Furthermore, is there no room for 1 or 2 Cloudshift? In addition to providing a 1 mana instant-speed flicker effect, it can serve as counterspell against removal, can redraw the Wall's card for 1 mana, etc...
Martyr Proc Thread
Esper Relicblade Thread
Standard:
Mardu Superfriends
Turbofog
The best use I ever found for Magus was in a deck that used Ardent Plea and Violent Outburst to cascade into Bust from Boom/Bust.
I don't see a place for him in Azorius Titan. We let games go long, with plenty of mana on both sides, and carry no other taxing effects such as Ghostly Prison.
Creatures
3 Court Hussar
2 Eternal Witness
1 Kitchen Finks
2 Lone Missionary
3 Wall of Omens
3 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Phantasmal Image
4 Sun Titan
Spells
2 Detention Sphere
1 Dispel
4 Path to Exile
2 Negate
2 Mana Leak
2 Ojutai's Command
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Mortarpod
Lands
3 Emeria, the Sky,Ruin
2 Flooded Strand
2 Ghost Quarter
2 Hallowed Fountain
1 Island
7 Plains
2 Temple Garden
4 Windswept Heath
SB: 1 Celestial Purge
SB: 1 Disenchant
SB: 1 Dispel
SB: 2 Ghostly Prison
SB: 1 Kitchen Finks
SB: 2 Meddling Mage
SB: 1 Negate
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage
SB: 2 Spreading Seas
SB: 2 Stony Silence
SB: 1 Supreme Verdict
I'm not sure if keeping Ojutai's Command is actually worth it. Sometimes its awesome but usually it gets sided out for hate. Maybe Resto Angel would be a better 4cmc or Spell Snare?
I like Inquisitor Exarch as a 2 drop.
Would like to hear what you guys think
Bant seems good, Witness is just sweet. I wonder how would Selesnya do?
I have been playing with this deck for a while now and constantly testing new ideas. I finally decided what kind of a list I want to follow, even if there is still much testing needed. At its core, my list is the same Azorius Titan everyone is talking about but there is some differences. Here is the deck, I will explain why I made which difference:
2 Venser, the Sojourner
Creatures
3 Sun Titan
3 Flickerwisp
3 Court Hussar
3 Wall of Omens
2 Lone Missionary
2 Pilgrim's Eye
1 Phantasmal Image
1 Mangara of Corondor
1 Snapcaster Mage
Artifacts
2 Aether Spellbomb
2 Mortarpod
Enchantments
3 Detention Sphere
1 Seal of Doom
2 Gifts Ungiven
3 Path to Exile
Sorceries
1 Unburial Rites
2 Supreme Verdict
Lands
3 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
4 Flooded Strand
3 Ghost Quarter
4 Hallowed Fountain
1 Island
1 Miren, the Moaning Well
5 Plains
2 Godless Shrine
1 Aura of Silence
1 Devout Lightcaster
1 Path to Exile
2 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Ghostly Prison
2 Negate
2 Stony Silence
1 Supreme Verdict
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
Now, First think you probably noticed is I removed some of the creatures. This was needed to included other, noncreature spells; namely Unburial Rites and Gifts Ungiven. First problem I encountered was how to compensate for the reduced creatures. To fix it; I reduced creature base further and included one Phantasmal Image, one Snapcaster Mage and two Venser, the Sojourner. Phantasmal Image can give whatever creature's ETB effect we happen to need, and Venser flicks the creatures. Venser's ultimate isn't the reason he is here but that could be a game finisher. With flickering our creatures with Venser and copying one we need with Phantasmal Image, we can somewhat cope with our reduced creature base. Snapcaster Mage recycles out instant and sorceries; we have few of them, but they are all very important.
Finding a place for 1 Unburial Rites and 1 Gifts Ungiven, opened many different possibilities of play. Gifts Ungiven virtually became a 4-card tutor in the list. Ability to tutor for sideboard cards if you don't draw them raised the win rate.
With one Unburial Rites, including one more Gifts Ungiven became almost necessary, and sideboard and deck restructured themselves accordingly. Now that we have a Tutor, we could include as many one-ofs as we need and a big angel like Iona.
So, one Path to Exile went to sideboard for a Seal of Doom. And it was glorious. Tutor it with Gifts Ungiven and put to the battlefield with Sun Titan. Repeat.
Unburial Rites and Gifts Ungiven made our deck much more consistent. For example, I could choose Sun Titan/Seal of Doom/Detention Sphere/Unburial Rites with Gifts Ungiven. Whatever the opponent chooses, would work in my favor.
In the end, my Esper Titan variant works surprisingly well. I won against the decks I couldn't reliably before; Infect, Jund, Tron... I could feel an overall powerup. The deck is still terrible against combo, but otherwise it is very good indeed.
I tried to find better avenues of play against Ad Nauseam and Living Death, so I put 2 Leyline of Sanctity to the sideboard and 2 Negate. They helped but the deck is still weak against them.
What do you think, I suggest you to try this, you might be surprised.
Fleshbag Marauder is another possibility, although if you're using Seal of Doom, that probably makes more sense.
I'd prefer to run the 2 gifts 1 rites version, but without the Vensers- what would your suggestions be?
Mistmeadow Witch: Ability is too pricy. But can target opponent too. Also, ability is instant speed.
Voyager Staff: Need sacrifice, we need this ability most in the early game.
Nephalia Smuggler: It does not make you wait until the end of turn, but Mistmeadow Witch is clearly better.
There is also Mimic Vat, but I never used it. It seems to have potential as a one-of.
I don't think Necrotic Sliver is better than Seal of Doom for the deck, it is slower and can be exiled. It is better in the late game but our endgame is already very strong. But it might indeed be better than Mangara of Corondor. It also 3CMC but does not suffer the summoning sickness and and does not need the Mortarpods. I think it is better, did not thought to include it before, thanks! But if we include Mimic Vat, Mangara of Corondor would be better. Actually, a turn 4 Gifts Ungiven with Mangara of Corondor/Mimic Vat/Unburial Rites/Sun Titan would be very powerful. You could also change one land with Minamo, School at Water's Edge if you go that way.
But I still think 2 Vensers are better that this lines, still, I will test Mimic Vat. Thank you for this nice stream of thought, it gave me a Mimic Vat
But running Gifts + Rites and Seal of Doom are two things I'm definitely going to consider.
I tried Mimic Vat a little bit today, played 4-5 games which I draw it. It isn't that good. Too slow. As of now, there is only one thing I am debating: -1 Ghost Quarter, +1 Swamp. Any ideas? 2 Ghost Quarter seems one too less.
The card that does the least work is Snapcaster Mage. But it saved my neck a few times by recycling a Supreme Verdict, so I am keeping it.
It is 3CMC, that is definitely better. His ability should work in our favor in both cases most of the time. If they agree to the 3 damage and send our creature to the graveyard, we can just take it back later; if they don't, more ETB. After they realize that the choice would become much harder for them.
One thing that really speaks in Athreos' favor is our boardwipes. With this on board, Supreme Verdict would just be much more valuable. Potentially hitting as much as 12 or getting my creatures back.
What I am not sure of is whether or not Athreos' ability would be better than extra flicking of Venser. With Venser I gathered 7 plains before turn 10 many times, and there is his ultimate. Even his -1 helped me finish a game many times with a late Venser. I think in the end Venser will prove to be better but this needs to be tested.
I will report the results.
Current list got a little more optimization by the way:
2 Venser, the Sojourner
Creatures
3 Sun Titan
3 Flickerwisp
3 Court Hussar
3 Wall of Omens
2 Pilgrim's Eye
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Lone Missionary
1 Phantasmal Image
1 Necrotic Sliver
1 Snapcaster Mage
Artifacts
2 Aether Spellbomb
2 Mortarpod
Enchantments
3 Detention Sphere
1 Seal of Doom
2 Gifts Ungiven
3 Path to Exile
Sorceries
2 Supreme Verdict
1 Unburial Rites
Lands
3 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
4 Flooded Strand
4 Hallowed Fountain
2 Godless Shrine
3 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
2 Snow-Covered Plains
1 Island
1 Swamp
1 Aura of Silence
1 Devout Lightcaster
1 Feldon's Cane
2 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Spellskite
2 Negate
2 Stony Silence
1 Wrath of God
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
Necrotic Sliver made a huge difference over Mangara. Hits way more than him. It hits 2 times in a turn with Sun Titan and put pressure since it will just keep hitting.
I could count the times I used Miren with one hand, changing it with a swamp made the deck more consistent.
I also tested Mimic Vat. Using a Court Hussar is really valuable but I find it too slow. It was hard to use in the early turns and they are the most important ones. We don't need more cards that help in long games unless they are really spectacular, like Athreos.
I've got a bunch of cards coming in the mail, and I'll do some trading to get the cards I need (Necrotic Sliver and Athreos.)