I would probably swap the 3rd sulfur falls for the 2nd steam vents. 1 land hands with vents and a serum visions are very often keepable. The same isn't true for a sulfur falls. I would also be careful with the cryptic command with only 21 lands. I also have the 22nd land in the side (20 main, 2 ghost quarter in side). The 3 Thragtusks will be difficult with just 21 as well. (I really want to try Thragtusk, but I'm almost positive you need 22 lands minimum, 23 is safer).
Which version do you feel more constant and confortable to play TDJ?
do you feel stronger with your pyromancer version? I'm interest by your version too;
Well. Its kind of a slippery slope. The first thought is "I don't really like Cryptic Command in a deck that isn't UR Twin or Scapeshift" (I can explain why if you'd like, but its long). So I cut Cryptic. Then I thought that since I cut cryptic, I can play a little lower to the ground, and try to play a lower curve in general. Which causes me to play a 1 mana removal spell over Electrolyze, and try to play a couple Gitaxian Probes in addition to cutting some lands. The probes are nice to give information so you can decide whether you should be Combo/Control/Beatdown (the deck can play all 3). Then I tried to see if anyone else had done something similar. So I saw Academy Ruins' build, which had the Pyromancers. Which I really liked, because they fit the lower curve/more tempo based deck (and go with the Probes well). It gave the deck the additional turn 2 plays that were super powerful in the deck (play threat on turn 2, hold up counters/removal/flash creatures rest of game, and make it impossible for you opponent to play around everything). Eventually with the help of GulDukat, I realized that my 1/4's weren't really helping that plan of the deck very much. And so I made the move to just completely cut all of the Deceivers, so that I was always able to further that tempo/beatdown plan, regardless of what I drew. The 3/3 body on Krasis is serious. Yes, I know it dies to bolt. That becomes a lot more acceptable when you have other threats that compete for bolts, like the Pyromancers. So sometimes you play a Pyro on 2, bait the removal, the combo them shortly after. Other times you do the reverse. This isn't a new strategy, the standard version of this deck does the same thing with Goyf/Deceiver for Decay/Terminate, but this one takes it even further.
I think the standard version is very close to just UR twin splash Goyf. Whereas mine is a completely different beast; it's closer to a RUG Tempo splash Twin. Then postboard it becomes hardcore RUG Midrange. Most of the lists I see here become RUG Control. (there is a huge difference between Keranos and Pia/Huntmaster/Thragtusk)
I can't say which one is stronger. I don't think it would be fair of me to say so when my version has been tested much less. I personally think its incredibly strong, and I think it really embraces what the green gives to Twin. (number 1 rule of good deck building: don't build a deck that is doing the same thing that another deck is doing, but worse) I just don't want to be trying to fight on the same axis as Grixis or UR. I don't want to be playing a slow/grindy control deck. I want to punish my opponent for stumbling, and I want close out games quickly with just enough disruption to keep my opponent off of their plan and put the fear of Goyf and Twin in their hearts.
If you have any other questions, I'd be glad to do my best to help and answer them. I LOVE the deck, and that is really saying something. For a long time I've been a straight Grixis mage, just trying to grind my opponent to dust. But man, it is a lot of fun to play mindgames with my opponent and corner them into an unwinnable position. I hope this helps!
Did it at FNM for lulz, but never had an opportunity to enchant it. Totally got my opponent though. I could tell he was representing dispel and when I tapped four mana to counter a thing, he got it ready in his hand. He looked mortified that he got blown out by mystic snake.
Did it at FNM for lulz, but never had an opportunity to enchant it. Totally got my opponent though. I could tell he was representing dispel and when I tapped four mana to counter a thing, he got it ready in his hand. He looked mortified that he got blown out by mystic snake.
That's knowing your meta. Right now dispel is everywhere, much more prevalent than I can ever recall. Tapping for 4 is spendy, but then to twin it? Hilarious.
Private Mod Note
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Modern UB Tezzerator UBW Gifts B 8Rack
Legacy RB Goblins
I've had a lot of fun with this archetype. I am not gonna say that i am a master on it or that my list is any good, but i would still like to share it. What i most like about the deck is how much i can and do change it after sideboard.
Also, two cards that i am interested are Blood Moon and Crumble to Dust that i would use mainly against Tron and Valakut. I still don't own any so i haven't test it yet.
Honestly, I feel like you didn't play to your outs. Using half the grudge on plating to see another turn was necessary. Killing the signal pest was greedy. You went for the "lose less" option rather than playing to your one chance of winning.
I lost against affinity this last round. I was greedy and kept a 2 land, bolt, krasisx2 , twin x2. Saw another krasis, a pyro and the last twin before I died. Game 2 felt awful. He was hellbent and I'm at 8. I have a twin, ancient grudge, and lands. He has signal pest, ornithopter and vault skirge with a plating on it. I grudge the plating and signal pest before attacks. He ripped spellskite that turn, and I ripped the krasis. Do you guys think I made the right play in the dark?
my winrate with this deck is very high. you shoudn't lose to anything besides jund and grixis maybe merfolk to.
I struggle hard against living end. It might be overrepresented in the online meta, but I seem to run into it a lot. Was also curious about your list, I've been running almost exactly it, I tried out the sarkhan in the board, and it didn't seem to be relevant very often, do you find it that useful?
RUG is good against the aggro decks and the blue decks. (Goyfs pressure/blocking backed up by counters). You can get disjointed draws and can get punished for trying follow the wrong game plan. (Tapping mana on your own turn for goyf, or drawing 1/4's when you're on beatdown)
UR is good against all the random combo decks (remand and blood moon plus a very consistent combo finish with multiple dispels). Your BGx is at its worst.
Grixis is good against all of the control/grindy decks. You sacrifice your aggro matchups to do it though.
What can i do to make my sideboard games better against Infect?
We alredy have a lot of interection but i fell like its not enought. The only thing i can think of is Spellskite.
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/tarmo-twin-low-budget/
Last changes:
-1 vendilion clique
-1 cryptic command
-1 steam vents
+2 Gitaxian probe
+1 Grim Lavamancer
--------------------------------
I really enjoy my changes;
BGUSultai Shadow
BURGrixis Shadow
BGUSultai midrange
BRWMardu Pyromancer
BGRJund
And btw, it's because of you that I'm running one less land and 2 gitaxian;;
I liked your idea.
Thank you !
BGUSultai Shadow
BURGrixis Shadow
BGUSultai midrange
BRWMardu Pyromancer
BGRJund
do you feel stronger with your pyromancer version? I'm interest by your version too;
BGUSultai Shadow
BURGrixis Shadow
BGUSultai midrange
BRWMardu Pyromancer
BGRJund
I think the standard version is very close to just UR twin splash Goyf. Whereas mine is a completely different beast; it's closer to a RUG Tempo splash Twin. Then postboard it becomes hardcore RUG Midrange. Most of the lists I see here become RUG Control. (there is a huge difference between Keranos and Pia/Huntmaster/Thragtusk)
I can't say which one is stronger. I don't think it would be fair of me to say so when my version has been tested much less. I personally think its incredibly strong, and I think it really embraces what the green gives to Twin. (number 1 rule of good deck building: don't build a deck that is doing the same thing that another deck is doing, but worse) I just don't want to be trying to fight on the same axis as Grixis or UR. I don't want to be playing a slow/grindy control deck. I want to punish my opponent for stumbling, and I want close out games quickly with just enough disruption to keep my opponent off of their plan and put the fear of Goyf and Twin in their hearts.
If you have any other questions, I'd be glad to do my best to help and answer them. I LOVE the deck, and that is really saying something. For a long time I've been a straight Grixis mage, just trying to grind my opponent to dust. But man, it is a lot of fun to play mindgames with my opponent and corner them into an unwinnable position. I hope this helps!
That's knowing your meta. Right now dispel is everywhere, much more prevalent than I can ever recall. Tapping for 4 is spendy, but then to twin it? Hilarious.
UB Tezzerator
UBW Gifts
B 8Rack
Legacy
RB Goblins
3 Island
1 Mountain
1 Forest
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Hinterland Harbor
1 Breeding Pool
1 Stomping Ground
2 Steam Vents
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Rootbound Crag
2 Sulfur Falls
1 Desolate Lighthouse
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Deceiver Exarch
3 Bounding Krasis
Spells (22)
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Splinter Twin
2 Spell Snare
4 Remand
2 Dispel
2 Cryptic Command
4 Serum Visions
1 Dispel
2 Negate
1 Consecrated Sphinx
1 Mystic Snake
1 Ancient Grudge
2 Pyroclasm
1 Roast
2 Reclamation Sage
4 Thragtusk
Also, two cards that i am interested are Blood Moon and Crumble to Dust that i would use mainly against Tron and Valakut. I still don't own any so i haven't test it yet.
That line of thought/explanation is just what I was looking for.
BGUSultai Shadow
BURGrixis Shadow
BGUSultai midrange
BRWMardu Pyromancer
BGRJund
I asked this earlier.
Can't wait to see more video on youtube about RUG twin;;
There's not enaugh of them !!
BGUSultai Shadow
BURGrixis Shadow
BGUSultai midrange
BRWMardu Pyromancer
BGRJund
I struggle hard against living end. It might be overrepresented in the online meta, but I seem to run into it a lot. Was also curious about your list, I've been running almost exactly it, I tried out the sarkhan in the board, and it didn't seem to be relevant very often, do you find it that useful?
And to me.. rug twin doesnt depend of his combo at all.
Grixis and UR have to win more game arround combo;; Rug dont need it.
BGUSultai Shadow
BURGrixis Shadow
BGUSultai midrange
BRWMardu Pyromancer
BGRJund
UR is good against all the random combo decks (remand and blood moon plus a very consistent combo finish with multiple dispels). Your BGx is at its worst.
Grixis is good against all of the control/grindy decks. You sacrifice your aggro matchups to do it though.
We alredy have a lot of interection but i fell like its not enought. The only thing i can think of is Spellskite.
yes; the best one will always be spellskite.
BGUSultai Shadow
BURGrixis Shadow
BGUSultai midrange
BRWMardu Pyromancer
BGRJund