Quote from Bigeyes1992I guess so, I just figured that more "clean" answers were better than less. I'll just put a destroy spell in instead.
I will definitely be trying out the KofRs as they look pretty sweet. Would there be any use in adding in an Arid Mesa or two? I realize that they don't specifically grab the colors that I'm wanting the most but I thought it might be good with Knight and Deathrite?
Quote from MagixYeah ofc, Its nearly the same list from a few pages back:
Bigeyes1992's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
Lands 244 Marsh Flats4 Verdant Catacombs3 Tectonic Edge2 Stirring Wildwood1 Godless Shrine2 Temple Garden2 Overgrown Tomb2 Swamp1 Forest1 Plains1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth1 Vault of the ArchangelCreatures 184 Deathrite Shaman4 Tarmogoyf4 Dark Confidant4 Knight of the Reliquary2 Scavenging OozeOther Spells 183 Inquisition of Kozilek2 Thoughtseize3 Abrupt Decay3 Path to Exile3 Lingering Souls4 Liliana of the VeilSideboard 152 Kitchen Finks2 Life from the Loam2 Stony Silence2 Aven Mindcensor1 Bojuka Bog1 Darkblast1 Thrun, the last Troll1 Path to Exile1 Batterskull1 Sword of War and Peace1 Torpor Orb
Right now I would say -1 Temple Garden +1 Horizon Canopy, -1Thrun, -1 Sword, +1 Damnation, +1 Infest/Engineered Explosves.
Oh yeah on an other note: Urborg really safed me a mulligan because my tecedge was a swamp on a black heavy hand
Also 2 activated TecEdges at the same time vs 4 lands of my opponent is really nice. Bombing him back to 2 lands and leaving him manascrewed, good job.
Quote from Magix
@Big: Probably Phyrexian Arena. Arena has the upside of being an echantment and less dependant on the curve ot the deck. So if you miss bobs there is no real reason to add some bigger creatures. On the contrary it hits the board 1 turn later where you have to tap out. One turn before combo starts to win. Also Arena has no legs to apply some dmg or block but yeh I think its stronger than stuff like Blood Scrievener or Sign in Blood.
Quote from BatHickey »be a bad sport and make fun of their deck, it is a stupid deck.
Quote from MagixYes, I would play 4 Liliana if available. This lady is just insane against Control, Combo and some aggro matchups like bogle or Soul Sisters. At worst she is a 3 Mana removal which is still on the field after you cast it. I would cut the sole Smiter for a 3rd Lili. The 4th one I dont know, probably Elspeth, Batterskull or Ooze would get the axe.
I dont like Duress Mainboard. Its simply nearly dead against Aggro. I think you want to switch them with Thoughtseize after Theros release
Your mana base lacks some Fetchlands. You want a minimum of 8 Fetchlands to have a high chance of T1 Fetch + DRS. This accelerates into great T2 plays (liliana!). Also there are too much Shocklands. I would cut 2 Overgrown Tomb and add +2 Marsh Flats. -1 Temple Garden and +1 Verdant Catacombs. Then you have to consider if you really need Gavony Township or if you would rather use Vault. In my tests both were too much and most of the time I would rather use Vault. I know Township has its upsides but I run more TecEdge instead. TecEdge safes you removal against manlands which you will appreciate in the mirror or against UWr or Scapeshift.
Sideboard looks fine, nothing too add.
Quote from iamthibArid Mesa are fine until you get the right fetches. I guess just you just have to make sure to run enough Godless Shrines and Temple Garden to make sure you do not whiff on them. And yeah Liliana should be a 4 of here. She's one of the best cards. Gotta love that moment when you go +1, they discard a action spell or threat and you discard Lingering Souls just to flashback it right away so you actually don't lose any card in the process. One of my most favorite plays. And yeah the fact that she's very good both against Aggro and against Control AND Combo makes her an MVP. And Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth makes her easy to cast.
Also don't like the Duress main deck. But Thoughseize is coming back around so getting 2 shouldn't be that much of a problem for you (: Make sure to have draw engines soon as the deck really needs the momentum given by Dark Confidant to be efficient.
Sideboard is strong, I'd try to jam a Raven's Crime instead of a Aven Mindcensor I guess. I tried it today at my fnm, God was it absolutely insane against twin. The guy just raged all the way when I went "Life from Loam, get back 3 lands, play urborg, discard 4 lands and pay 4 B to cast 4 copies of Raven's Crime" and watch him, discard all his hand
Quote from Cross BreezeWell, to be honest, when I first started piloting this deck I found Souls to be an easy card to ignore as well, and because we have so many good choices in our colors, something does indeed have to go. However, it comes down to how you want to pilot it, and what your personal meta requires for you to get the leg up on your opponents.
Personally I run 4 Souls because when combined with the KotR/Land Package(Vault and Gavony), we're talking 4 flyers with death touch, lifelink, and the ability to grow. They ruin our opponent's spot removal, synergize well with Lily's +1, and save us when we need time to chump and draw for a few more turns.
However, there is no right or wrong answer on how to build Junk outside the core of the deck. Facing control and blue decks? Maybe pack in some Voice of Resurgence or Loxodon Smiters. Combo wrecking house? Pack our entire hand disruption suite in response.
So the question you need to answer is, does removing Souls benefit your game plan more than it hurts it in your current meta?
As a side note, you probably wanna throw in a copy of Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth for mana fixing black.
Quote from iamthibThis.
The list is fine but Voice is for aggro decks. Reliquary Junk or the version we're talking about is more control-ish. And Reliquary is strictly better than Voice when it comes to control the board. The fact that you can have a land toolbox to stall the board with you Vault and Souls is quite good.
Also, Voice is largely hated in Modern with all the Pillar of Flame / Magma Spray that red decks are packing. And playing the Knight makes these spells look bad.
To finish, Voice is very good when played turn 2 and kinda looses its effectiveness in late game but Voice is a very colored spell, especially when you plan to go Liliana the turn after. You have to have a very chistmas land hand to cast the turn 1 discard, turn 2 Voice, turn 3 Liliana.
Mark my words, I'm not saying that Voice is a bad card. I'm sure his list is very good and works well. But for the meta right now, I think Knight is better. Knight, when played in combination with the lands we have (Vault or Gavony Tectonic Edge) is able to take over a game. Voice does not work that well.
What I like in his list is the sideboard. Very straightforward yet effective. 2 Linvala seems like the way to go. Sigarda is huge haaha
Quote from DakhwonI've been building a Junk deck for a while after playing against one I really liked at GP Portland. I had a great week trading, picking up 3 Bobs, 3 Thoughtseizes, and so I'm almost to the point to take this deck out for a serious competitive spin. I read Ochoa's article on his version this week, and he asked a question that I've been asking myself the whole time while building and testing it. With a deck that runs Scooze AND Deathrite, depending on your graveyards to pump Goyf seems like opposing goals. I think I'm going to go without Goyf for a while and see what I miss.
FuneralofGod's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
Lands (23)2 Forest1 Gavony Township2 Godless Shrine4 Marsh Flats2 Overgrown Tomb1 Plains3 Stirring Wildwood2 Swamp2 Temple Garden4 Verdant Catacombs1 Woodland CemeteryCreatures (20)4 Dark Confidant4 Deathrite Shaman4 Scavenging Ooze4 Voice of Resurgance4 Kitchen FinksOther Spells (17)3 Inquisition of Kozilek3 Thoughtseize1 Maelstrom Pulse2 Abrupt Decay4 Liliana of the Veil4 Path to ExileSideboard (15)2 Fulminator Mage2 Kataki, War's Wage2 Linvala, Keeper of Silence1 Maelstrom Pulse2 Obstinate Baloth2 Spellskite2 Stony Silence1 Thoughtseize1 Thrun, the Last Troll
The toughest card to leave out was Lingering Souls. I *might* go 3 voice, 2 thoughtseize, 3 path, and add 3 Lingering Souls back. I may also give Garruk Relentless a go.
Quote from MagixThanks for the feedback. Do You have any suggestion for my last mainboard slot? I think my discard package is fine, would you add a removal, a sideboard card like SoLaS / fulminator mage / linvala or a 5 mana bomb like Blood Baron or Batterskull?
Quote from MagixGP Antwerp draws near and I decided to play the deck I am the most familiar with.
First of all I will have a final test at a tournament on sunday.
I will predict that Pod, lots of BGx and Affinity will be the top contender for the GP. But as I have to play lots of games I have to opt everything and still consider UWr, Tron and Stuff like Living End, Twin, etc.
kafiltafish67's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
24 Lands4 Verdant Catacombs4 Marsh Flats4 Tectonic Edge2 Treetop Village1 Stirring Wildwood2 Overgrown Tomb1 Godless Shrine1 Temple Garden1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth1 Forest1 Plains2 Swamp17 Creatures4 Deathrite Shaman4 Dark Confidant4 Tarmogoyf3 Scavenging Ooze2 Desecration Demon18 Other Spells4 Liliana of the Veil3 Thoughtseize2 Inquisition of Kozilek2 Maelstrom Pulse2 Abrupt Decay2 Dismember3 Lingering Souls1 x
So first of all I will go with 4 Tectonic Edges. This draws my Junk deck a bit in BG Rock regions but I feel that TecEdges are a strong choice against Manlands, Tron, Affinity, 4c Goodstuff, Scapeshift and everything at a whole. As you can see I will only need 1 white Mana for everything in my mainboard so the manabase is no issue. Urborg is nice with those colorless land and is no real drawback in any game.
Secondly I predict that people will pack more grave hate after the last 2 GPs. Imo any GBx is king right now and thus I want some cards in my board that are not cold to Rest in Peace if I dont have a direct out. Furthermore I want more gravehate myself to opt for the mirror and other stuff I may face. Thus I will switch Knight of the Reliquary with Scavenging Ooze. Yes I know how strong KotR is, but I also now how stron Ooze is. Ooze is a walking toolbox like KotR and I feel that overall the gravehate + lifegain is a bit more relevant.
I fear this is very true thib. So 3 Oozes will join my party instead of the 4 KotRs.
Thirdly I decided that I want more game against decks that Mainboard Gravehate (Relic of Progenitus /Tron...), Midrange and a faster clock against Combo/Control. Thus I will add +2 Desecration Demon to my list.
I have tested him over the last weeks after seeing Willy Edel playing him at GP Detroit and man he is a beast. Let me explain:
Against Midrange we will face only value creatures. If they want to sac a Goyf, Bob, DRS, any 4-drop to stop that demon, they are welcome. Ofc they wont sac Lingering Souls tokens, they will block him, but thats fine too. He is pure pressure. He dodges Bolt, Decay, Dismember. Only Terminate, Pulse and Path get rid of him but then again they have to use it against my own Goyf, Ooze etc. too.
Against Control like Tron or UWr and Combo like Twin he is a really fast clock since most of em dont play that much creatures that they could sac and dodges Relic of Progenitus. He is only bad against Swarm aggro but I will take that risk for his upsides. Melira Pod has no removal for him most of the times since he dodges Shriekmaw and Dismember again. Only Pulse may kill him but I dont see Melira running much of those.
Now you may ask: why dont you use Abysal Persecutor? Percy has trample and no sac effect so you attack and block when you want, not your opponent! His also better against swarm aggro! While thats right I dont like his negative effect. Against any deck that doesnt uses creatures to win (kikki, melira) they can still win after you beat em to 0 LP. I will not always find that path or lili to kill my own percy. I dont want to take that risk.
Fourthly I am tinkering around with not playing Path to Exile in my mainboard. Yep you read right. I dont want to give my opponents extra lands in the first few turns while I am pressuring their resources with discard / Lili / removal / tec edges / (fulminator mages postboard). I will replace it with Dismember. Yes Dismember doesnt kill Griselbrand nor does it help against Wurmcoil or very big Oozes and Goyfs. Still I think the land is huge if you play 4 Edges and 4 Fulminator Mages postboard. I will test it on sunday, if I dont like it I will switch it again with Path.
Lastly I am opting for 1 more spot in my mainboard. Most of the times I think that 3 Lingering Souls are enough since they are not that great agains Tron and Combo. This means I can fill the 4th one up with anything I want, to make some more room in my sideboard.
Again I want a card that break a game while also dodging most removals and grave hate.
The following come to my mind: Batterskull, Blood Baron of Vizkopa or Baneslayer Angel.
Batterskull is great against any fair deck and can suck up removal and still life. However Skull is sometimes cluncky when you have to use 3 Mana to get it back to your hand and pay another 5 to drop it. I wont have always 5 Mana due to tecedges so I dont know if this is the correct choice.
Blood Baron dodges nearly every relevant removal but will die to Goyf, Ooze etc. I dont think the decks Lectrys described (besides Melira) are a thing and I still have SoLaS in my side. Agains Melira I have DRS, Ooze and Linvala, so I dunno.
Lastly there is Baneslayer Angel. The Queen of the Sky kills everything in the air that matters, Hellkites, Collonades, Cliques, Affinity Stuff without a problem. However she dies to Dismember, Pulse, Path which would make me sad after droping a 5 Manabomb.
I dont want Sigarda as she has no Lifelink and I dont want a 5 drop without that attribute due to Bob.
kafiltafish67's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
4 Fulminator Mages4 Stony Silence2 Path to Exile2 Infest1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence1 Sword of Light and Shadow1 Thoughtseize
4 Fulminator Mages to complement my TecEdges, kill Manlands while also providing an attacker and blocker. Great against any 4c deck, affinity, tron, UWr. I wont run less.
4 Stony Silence to shore up Tron and Affinity. Tron is my worst match up and I predict lots of Affinity. As Lingering Souls are not always enough I will run 4 again. Thus I have a higher chance to see it quick enough to stall those decks. Its also not bad against Pod too.
2 Infest to shore up swarm Aggro, Affinity, Pod. Infest clears those pesky swarms of tokens/small creautres which makes my demon happy. Its quicker than Damnation and my Goyfs, Oozes and Demons will still life after it. Most of the times you want a sweeper is against those swarm decks anyways so I think Infest over Damnation is the right choice.
2 Path to Exile to compliment my removal suite against those decks Dismember or Abrupt Decay will not help. Its also nice to have in matches where I dont care about giving em a free land.
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence. One of the reason I still play 4 white sources in my mainboard. Should shut down opposing Oozes, DRS, Olivia, Viscera Seer etc. pp. while also being Bolt proved and not grave dependant. Nothing bad about here.
1 Sword of Light and Shadow for those grindy matchups where you need that extra life, protection and returning bodys from your grave. I think it offers the best protection of all swords and is a great card all around. Nice to have against Melira, UWr and Midrange.
1 Thoughtseize against Combo and Control where you want that extra disruption.
This is it, any feedback is welcome