I just 3-1ed my daily tonight. I actually went back to Attended Knight for the extra dude, and the first strike really is relevant with a Bonesplitter on it. I'll be honest, I didn't get a big enough sample size with Razor Golem for me to say one way or the other.
I did a 2/2 split on Journey and Unmake, and I'm liking both in different situations. I find that Unmake helps when blue sides in Stormbound Geist. Getting past the undead version is pretty hard, and it's bad enough when you have to 2 for 1 yourself to get rid of it.
I cut both Acolytes out all together. I added one more Divine Offering and put another Unmake in the board (both for that *&%*^% 2/4 flying artifact guy and other annoying things!).
Yea Stormbound Geist is a new thing to me too. Maybe that means we're getting people's attention lol. You can still just Journey it. Or Sunlance if you have to.
I just 1-2ed a daily tonight. I beat U/B/r Post on time in game 3, but lost my next two matches to Storm. I took the Unmake from the board and added another Holy Light to increase my chances of it appearing in my opener. I find that I'm getting killed byEmpty the Warrens plus Goblin Bushwhacker as opposed to Grapeshot. I'm not sure how else to handle that matchup save for siding in the Prismatic Strand, Benevolent Unicorn, and trying to mulligan aggressively. I take out all of the point-and-click removal and maybe the Attended Knights.
Regarding Unmake, I have found it pretty helpful in the Post match when the opponent tries to get crazy card advantage through blinking shenanigans, but I do see the merits of having Journey as well. I'm going to keep running the 2/2 split for now (not enough of a sample size yet).
Congrats on the winning streak. I'm practicing so that I can get somewhat good, but it's difficult. I've never gone undefeated at a daily and I've only 3-1ed a few times.
ETA: I was looking at your comment about the Delver matchup and it jogged my memory. I've lately been running into a version of Delver that runs *literally* 20+ counters, a bunch of card draw, Spire Golem, and of course Delver of Secrets. It's a very odd deck, but it's out there now. I've been running the basic strategy of "trot out the weak stuff first", but sometimes they just have ALL of the countermagic...and oftentimes they do! So watch for that.
I just 1-2ed a daily tonight. I beat U/B/r Post on time in game 3, but lost my next two matches to Storm. I took the Unmake from the board and added another Holy Light to increase my chances of it appearing in my opener. I find that I'm getting killed byEmpty the Warrens plus Goblin Bushwhacker as opposed to Grapeshot. I'm not sure how else to handle that matchup save for siding in the Prismatic Strand, Benevolent Unicorn, and trying to mulligan aggressively. I take out all of the point-and-click removal and maybe the Attended Knights.
Regarding Unmake, I have found it pretty helpful in the Post match when the opponent tries to get crazy card advantage through blinking shenanigans, but I do see the merits of having Journey as well. I'm going to keep running the 2/2 split for now (not enough of a sample size yet).
Congrats on the winning streak. I'm practicing so that I can get somewhat good, but it's difficult. I've never gone undefeated at a daily and I've only 3-1ed a few times.
ETA: I was looking at your comment about the Delver matchup and it jogged my memory. I've lately been running into a version of Delver that runs *literally* 20+ counters, a bunch of card draw, Spire Golem, and of course Delver of Secrets. It's a very odd deck, but it's out there now. I've been running the basic strategy of "trot out the weak stuff first", but sometimes they just have ALL of the countermagic...and oftentimes they do! So watch for that.
RE Post: If the player is weak you can win on time, as you did, so make a habit of not scooping to them. Make them kill you. If you steal a game and they go long, sometimes they will time out.
RE Storm: The MU is still not great, even post-board. Just bear in mind that Suture Priest is not a great answer to Empty, because they will often just go off for 10 goblins and kill you in 2 swings. I haven't seen much Storm lately, and I haven't seen Empty in a long time, but sometimes they just get ya. It is important to put a clock on them right away, which this deck does pretty well. Force them to have it, and sometimes they don't.
RE Delver: Sometimes they just have all the counters. Their "nut draw" is pretty unbeatable. If they are heavy on counters, and are representing as such (ie not playing anything on their own turn) try to set up a turn 3 or 4 where you play two or three spells, even if it means not playing something on t2. They can't handle them all without some combination of Dazes. If you can resolve a Squadron Hawk the matchup becomes winnable.
So with the bannings what changes will be made to the deck?
Unicorn and Holy Light are definitely out. Standard Bearer is still necessary against Green Stompy and what's left of Infect. Do we still need Suture Priest? I'm thinking of having full sets of the two mana fliers instead.
So with the bannings what changes will be made to the deck?
Unicorn and Holy Light are definitely out. Standard Bearer is still necessary against Green Stompy and what's left of Infect. Do we still need Suture Priest? I'm thinking of having full sets of the two mana fliers instead.
Infect is still very good without Invigorate and Mono-Green is unchanged so Standard Bearer will be staying in my board.
I feel like the Cloudpost decks get a lot better without Storm around. We will need some kind of extra sideboard hate for them. Perhaps Guardian of the Guildpact + Lands or more artifact destruction for their Prophetic Prisms. It's a very hard matchup and I'm not looking forward to seeing more of it.
Overall I'm excited about not losing to Storm but I'm not sure the bannings actually help WW all that much.
The bannings probably hurt WW if Cloudpost takes over now as people are expecting. The Cloudpost matchup has always been dreadful and with Cloudpost able to focus more on aggro now than trying to weather the Storm (pun intended) I can't see things improving for WW.
The bannings definitely hurt WW more than helped since those two decks took care of Post and this deck had a lot of good sideboard options to handle them.
I already had 3 Guardians main and 2 Disenchants and Kor Sanctifiers in the sideboard. Any other cards that can be good against Post? And is Suture Priest necessary against other aggro decks?
The bannings definitely hurt WW more than helped since those two decks took care of Post and this deck had a lot of good sideboard options to handle them.
I already had 3 Guardians main and 2 Disenchants and Kor Sanctifiers in the sideboard. Any other cards that can be good against Post? And is Suture Priest necessary against other aggro decks?
Kor Sanctifiers is so slow though At least in going the artifact hate direction, you're boarding against Affinity and Post at the same time which is nice.
I wonder if Mana Tithe is worth a try. Could catch them tapping out for a prism or Mulldrifter early. But WW definitely wants to just jam threats not hold up for conditional counters.
The biggest problem for me by far is Capsize. Perhaps Razor Barrier to counter it.
Things look very bad for WW if the meta solidifies around UR post as most people (rightly) are expecting. You could try playing the ultra agressive version with war falcons, bone saw's and kitesail apprentice/glaivemaster but I'm still not sure it's going to be fast enough to beat post consistently because you just fold to electrickery so badly (doomed travelers do sort of help here).
Crimson Acolyte could help though Post will also have ways to deal with that.
I really want to avoid any x/1 cards since any deck that has red will immediately side in Electrickery (and Post will easily tutor for it thanks to Teachings).
I will be keeping two Standard Bearers in my sideboard as well, for the aforementioned reasons. Speaking of the board, I think we might have to put a Plains or two in the board to accommodate Guardian of the Guildpact and Kor Sanctifiers against Post. I hate to do that as a board plan, but I think that's the only way we can get a somewhat consistent path to four mana during the game.
I will be keeping two Standard Bearers in my sideboard as well, for the aforementioned reasons. Speaking of the board, I think we might have to put a Plains or two in the board to accommodate Guardian of the Guildpact and Kor Sanctifiers against Post. I hate to do that as a board plan, but I think that's the only way we can get a somewhat consistent path to four mana during the game.
I think Prismatic Strands will be coming out of my 75 altogether. Although it is pretty good against Mono Green, it doesn't do anything in any other matchup.
My first attempt will be to board into Apostle's Blessing vs Post to counter Capsize. Once that card is offline, they can't save Crusher from Journey so they have to hit a lethal Rolling Thunder to win.
If Post veers toward UB to combat itself, hexproof, and mono-green, I think WW will still be ok, and continue to fly under the radar. Electrickery is the biggest beating but I feel like decks may run less of it now that Empty is gone, UB Post may be better than UR, and aggro decks are prepared for it.
Has anyone tried Syndic of Tithes? I just put it on a whim, and found it to help grind out stalled board states.
I have also been playing him and he is performing very well for me, very good and getting Card Advantage out of everything and helps break long board stalls.
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Hey guys! So a couple big things have impacted the Pauper format, namely the bannings and the release of Gatecrash. We have seen the field shift this past month, with WW putting in work only occasionally. Where do you think the deck stands at the moment? What kind of build (if any) is ideal at this point in time?
Hey guys! So a couple big things have impacted the Pauper format, namely the bannings and the release of Gatecrash. We have seen the field shift this past month, with WW putting in work only occasionally. Where do you think the deck stands at the moment? What kind of build (if any) is ideal at this point in time?
I think WW got real hurt by the bannings ~ Infect & Grixis Storm were some of it's best MUs in terms of hate. Without that ~25% of expected games, and a solidifying around 8Post, the midrange-y tech of WW is less relevant.
Is it also an issue with the deck that the popularity of storm meant that main deck prismatic strands could be easily justified, which gave you incidential game 1 blowout potential against stompy/goblins. Now if you're packing that main board, you're playing a card which is pretty bad vs a lot of the popular decks (UR post, delver, temporal storm) which makes it harder to justify doing so?
Anyway, unless someone can come up with a WW list that has actual game vs UR post, I wouldn't want to be playing the deck in the current meta. Its declining popularity seems to be confirming that unfortunately...
I think WW got real hurt by the bannings ~ Infect & Grixis Storm were some of it's best MUs in terms of hate. Without that ~25% of expected games, and a solidifying around 8Post, the midrange-y tech of WW is less relevant.
I agree that there is less appeal from a sideboard haterade standpoint, but its midrange advantages don't really suffer. Those "banned deck" matchups weren't particularly insane, either. Just playing devil's advocate.
Is it also an issue with the deck that the popularity of storm meant that main deck prismatic strands could be easily justified, which gave you incidential game 1 blowout potential against stompy/goblins. Now if you're packing that main board, you're playing a card which is pretty bad vs a lot of the popular decks (UR post, delver, temporal storm) which makes it harder to justify doing so?
Anyway, unless someone can come up with a WW list that has actual game vs UR post, I wouldn't want to be playing the deck in the current meta. Its declining popularity seems to be confirming that unfortunately...
Strands certainly won't be exciting vs Delver/Fissure, but its usefulness vs. Post is actually pretty swingy. It goes from meh to game-winning depending on the situation. Are you this concerned about Post because you think the matchup is an auto-loss no matter what, or because you feel Post is a high enough % of the meta to deter you?
I agree that there is less appeal from a sideboard haterade standpoint, but its midrange advantages don't really suffer. Those "banned deck" matchups weren't particularly insane, either. Just playing devil's advocate.
Yup, they weren't great, but you had a lot better game than the other 'aggro' decks ~ Stompy/Goblins/Affinity (though for the Infect MU, it depended on Affinity's SB), which (for some) justified running WW over some of the faster decks, despite it's horrible UR Post MU.
While the slowing down of the format opened up space for midrange, I think it's much better taken advantage of by two/three colour decks who can play more goodstuff and appreciate the extra time to fix their mana.
Edit: the rise of Familiar/Simic Storm is also a blow against WW in it's current form, as it can't atm justify the space for SB hate, but still folds without it.
Unless I miss my guess, doesn't standard bearer just poop on bounce spells in general? I mean, unless I miss my guess, familiar storm goes for the bounce everything every turn while attacking with whatever fliers they can, right? As all of the storm copies go on the stack, they're all individual spells, which mean they all have to target standard bearer and then when he's bounced, the rest pretty much crap out.
Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
Unless I miss my guess, doesn't standard bearer just poop on bounce spells in general? I mean, unless I miss my guess, familiar storm goes for the bounce everything every turn while attacking with whatever fliers they can, right? As all of the storm copies go on the stack, they're all individual spells, which mean they all have to target standard bearer and then when he's bounced, the rest pretty much crap out.
No, Standard Bearer only affects spells that are cast. The Storm copies are created by an ability, not cast, so the copies will be able to target whatever the controller wants. It's the same reason Standard Bearer wasn't an answer to Grapeshot.
ah, bummer. I didn't see that particular clause. I guess shield of duty and reason wouldn't do much good, either. I do wager that one on your biggest guy might buy you the time to get at least one more attack in.
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Yea Stormbound Geist is a new thing to me too. Maybe that means we're getting people's attention lol. You can still just Journey it. Or Sunlance if you have to.
The only card Unmake actually answers properly in my opinion is Guardian of the Guildpact (but so does Razor Golem). It kills Ulamog's Crusher at instant speed but you're probably dead to Rolling Thunder or Capsize anyway at that point.
I don't like having "unnecessary" 3 drops in an 18 land build.
EDIT: And yes the extra offering is great against Spire Golem and Serrated Arrows
Pauper:
WW White Weenie WW
Regarding Unmake, I have found it pretty helpful in the Post match when the opponent tries to get crazy card advantage through blinking shenanigans, but I do see the merits of having Journey as well. I'm going to keep running the 2/2 split for now (not enough of a sample size yet).
Congrats on the winning streak. I'm practicing so that I can get somewhat good, but it's difficult. I've never gone undefeated at a daily and I've only 3-1ed a few times.
ETA: I was looking at your comment about the Delver matchup and it jogged my memory. I've lately been running into a version of Delver that runs *literally* 20+ counters, a bunch of card draw, Spire Golem, and of course Delver of Secrets. It's a very odd deck, but it's out there now. I've been running the basic strategy of "trot out the weak stuff first", but sometimes they just have ALL of the countermagic...and oftentimes they do! So watch for that.
RE Post: If the player is weak you can win on time, as you did, so make a habit of not scooping to them. Make them kill you. If you steal a game and they go long, sometimes they will time out.
RE Storm: The MU is still not great, even post-board. Just bear in mind that Suture Priest is not a great answer to Empty, because they will often just go off for 10 goblins and kill you in 2 swings. I haven't seen much Storm lately, and I haven't seen Empty in a long time, but sometimes they just get ya. It is important to put a clock on them right away, which this deck does pretty well. Force them to have it, and sometimes they don't.
RE Delver: Sometimes they just have all the counters. Their "nut draw" is pretty unbeatable. If they are heavy on counters, and are representing as such (ie not playing anything on their own turn) try to set up a turn 3 or 4 where you play two or three spells, even if it means not playing something on t2. They can't handle them all without some combination of Dazes. If you can resolve a Squadron Hawk the matchup becomes winnable.
Pauper:
WW White Weenie WW
Unicorn and Holy Light are definitely out. Standard Bearer is still necessary against Green Stompy and what's left of Infect. Do we still need Suture Priest? I'm thinking of having full sets of the two mana fliers instead.
Infect is still very good without Invigorate and Mono-Green is unchanged so Standard Bearer will be staying in my board.
I feel like the Cloudpost decks get a lot better without Storm around. We will need some kind of extra sideboard hate for them. Perhaps Guardian of the Guildpact + Lands or more artifact destruction for their Prophetic Prisms. It's a very hard matchup and I'm not looking forward to seeing more of it.
Overall I'm excited about not losing to Storm but I'm not sure the bannings actually help WW all that much.
Pauper:
WW White Weenie WW
I already had 3 Guardians main and 2 Disenchants and Kor Sanctifiers in the sideboard. Any other cards that can be good against Post? And is Suture Priest necessary against other aggro decks?
Kor Sanctifiers is so slow though At least in going the artifact hate direction, you're boarding against Affinity and Post at the same time which is nice.
Removal-resistant guys like Doomed Traveler and Loyal Cathar are pretty good against Post, but without a Bonesplitter they aren't very good.
I wonder if Mana Tithe is worth a try. Could catch them tapping out for a prism or Mulldrifter early. But WW definitely wants to just jam threats not hold up for conditional counters.
The biggest problem for me by far is Capsize. Perhaps Razor Barrier to counter it.
I will also be trying Unmake to remove Ulamog's Crusher.
I still feel like we just have to race them.
Pauper:
WW White Weenie WW
I really want to avoid any x/1 cards since any deck that has red will immediately side in Electrickery (and Post will easily tutor for it thanks to Teachings).
I think Prismatic Strands will be coming out of my 75 altogether. Although it is pretty good against Mono Green, it doesn't do anything in any other matchup.
My first attempt will be to board into Apostle's Blessing vs Post to counter Capsize. Once that card is offline, they can't save Crusher from Journey so they have to hit a lethal Rolling Thunder to win.
I will also be testing Doomed Traveler, since it's great with Bonesplitter and great against their removal.
If Post veers toward UB to combat itself, hexproof, and mono-green, I think WW will still be ok, and continue to fly under the radar. Electrickery is the biggest beating but I feel like decks may run less of it now that Empty is gone, UB Post may be better than UR, and aggro decks are prepared for it.
Pauper:
WW White Weenie WW
I have also been playing him and he is performing very well for me, very good and getting Card Advantage out of everything and helps break long board stalls.
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Pauper's Cage Podcast (Classic Pauper)—http://www.mtgcast.com/?cat=232
Cinemalarkey Podcast (Movie Reviews)—http://cinemalarkeycast.libsyn.com/
I think WW got real hurt by the bannings ~ Infect & Grixis Storm were some of it's best MUs in terms of hate. Without that ~25% of expected games, and a solidifying around 8Post, the midrange-y tech of WW is less relevant.
Anyway, unless someone can come up with a WW list that has actual game vs UR post, I wouldn't want to be playing the deck in the current meta. Its declining popularity seems to be confirming that unfortunately...
I agree that there is less appeal from a sideboard haterade standpoint, but its midrange advantages don't really suffer. Those "banned deck" matchups weren't particularly insane, either. Just playing devil's advocate.
Pauper's Cage Podcast (Classic Pauper)—http://www.mtgcast.com/?cat=232
Cinemalarkey Podcast (Movie Reviews)—http://cinemalarkeycast.libsyn.com/
Strands certainly won't be exciting vs Delver/Fissure, but its usefulness vs. Post is actually pretty swingy. It goes from meh to game-winning depending on the situation. Are you this concerned about Post because you think the matchup is an auto-loss no matter what, or because you feel Post is a high enough % of the meta to deter you?
Pauper's Cage Podcast (Classic Pauper)—http://www.mtgcast.com/?cat=232
Cinemalarkey Podcast (Movie Reviews)—http://cinemalarkeycast.libsyn.com/
Yup, they weren't great, but you had a lot better game than the other 'aggro' decks ~ Stompy/Goblins/Affinity (though for the Infect MU, it depended on Affinity's SB), which (for some) justified running WW over some of the faster decks, despite it's horrible UR Post MU.
While the slowing down of the format opened up space for midrange, I think it's much better taken advantage of by two/three colour decks who can play more goodstuff and appreciate the extra time to fix their mana.
Edit: the rise of Familiar/Simic Storm is also a blow against WW in it's current form, as it can't atm justify the space for SB hate, but still folds without it.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
No, Standard Bearer only affects spells that are cast. The Storm copies are created by an ability, not cast, so the copies will be able to target whatever the controller wants. It's the same reason Standard Bearer wasn't an answer to Grapeshot.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!