I'm sorry if this has been discussed, but whats the game plan against izzet post with this deck? The shop I go to has started 1$ pauper tournaments, and I build mono blue because I was playing fairyninjastill in legacy for awhile (also, because is awesome). I have crushed every pauper deck I've played against with it, except izzet post. I'm currently not running spire golems, and am considering those now, but it feels like their spells are better, their creatures are better, and everything I have dies to their burn. Even worse, my mistblades are terrible against mulldrifter and steamcore wierd.
I'm sorry if this has been discussed, but whats the game plan against izzet post with this deck? The shop I go to has started 1$ pauper tournaments, and I build mono blue because I was playing fairyninjastill in legacy for awhile (also, because is awesome). I have crushed every pauper deck I've played against with it, except izzet post. I'm currently not running spire golems, and am considering those now, but it feels like their spells are better, their creatures are better, and everything I have dies to their burn. Even worse, my mistblades are terrible against mulldrifter and steamcore wierd.
Izzet post is a pretty skill intensive matchup. You have the edge during the first few turns, as they stumble with comes into play tapped and colorless land and draw spells. Swarming them with guys backed by disruption can lead to a quick kill. During the later game, they have complete inevitability with draw spells and removal spells. If they manage to clear the board after around turn 5, you have very little chance of winning.
Ninja of the deep hours is the real wildcard in the matchup, as the card draw can really put you ahead.
I am considering a 2nd Gush, it is crazy good. Mana Leaks are replacements for Daze, because I am not willing to shell out twenty bucks on commons.
What do we think? It's a little wonky at times, but if it gets its tempo going there's just no hope for the opponent.
Your list looks fairly stock overall. Daze is entirely needed and some builds even eschew daze in favor of force spike. Preordain really needs to be a 4-of as it's one of your few defenses against flood and one of the best cards in the deck. I'd also like to see a few more creatures, as those are needed to make your tempo draws really good. Phantasmal bear is great at enabling turn 2 ninjas and spire golem/stitched drake are good for winning longer games. I'd look at possibly cutting 1-2 force spikes, 2 mana leaks, 1 brainstorm and 1 echoing truth/snap.
So this is what I will test with today, and come back with results. I am really disappointed Gush shot up to $11, the deck could really benefit from it. Also, this has turned out a lot more aggressively than the control archetype I was trying to fit into.
Curse of the bloody tome is sometimes used as a sideboard card in attrition matchups. Pretty much all of the removal in pauper only hits creatures, so curse of the bloody tome is unkillable.
I haven't played it myself, but it seems like it would be at its best against cloudpost. If it manages to stabilize, cloudpost can deal with all of delvers other threats with burn spells, card draw and life gain off of glimmerpost. Even without mill pressure, cloudpost decks are threat light and come close to milling themselves before they close out a game.
It's also a reasonable card in the mirror as the games tend to stall with neither side able to punch through spire golems/frostburn weirds. Chances are, if you plop down 2, you win. If you drop 1, the onus is on the opponent to be extremely aggressive...which makes them have to play into your counters much more.
I so recently began piloting this list on MTGO and have had a bit if success in casual rooms. I am using Bonesplinter in place of Serrated Arrows because of their cost. Post is a bit of a difficult match-up, and I recently got slaughtered by a MBC control deck in a Daily. The mirror can also be a bit of nail biter. Any suggestions with this list given the current meta? Sideboard help would be particularly well received.
I so recently began piloting this list on MTGO and have had a bit if success in casual rooms. I am using Bonesplinter in place of Serrated Arrows because of their cost. Post is a bit of a difficult match-up, and I recently got slaughtered by a MBC control deck in a Daily. The mirror can also be a bit of nail biter. Any suggestions with this list given the current meta? Sideboard help would be particularly well received.
Your deck only 58 cards?
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The Izmagnus are the most powerful members of the Izmundi
Modern: Grixis DS ; UR Phoenix ; Storm ; Burn Standard: MonoRed ; Ral Spells ; UR Phoenix ; Izzet Drakes Commander: Locust God
I so recently began piloting this list on MTGO and have had a bit if success in casual rooms. I am using Bonesplinter in place of Serrated Arrows because of their cost. Post is a bit of a difficult match-up, and I recently got slaughtered by a MBC control deck in a Daily. The mirror can also be a bit of nail biter. Any suggestions with this list given the current meta? Sideboard help would be particularly well received.
Control decks often feel like difficult matches because the games delver loses to them drag on for ages. Once a control deck has cleared delvers board and has redundant removal spells in hand, the game has been decided. The key to most control matchups is to play aggressive and connect with ninja of the deep hours as many times as you can. If you can untap with a ninja in play, you're usually pretty far ahead.
Your maindeck seems pretty solid for the most part, aside from lacking preordain. Preordain is the best cantrip in the deck by far and the best way to filter away extra lands late game. I particularly like the brainstorm and preordain combo, where you brainstorm and put two unwanted lands on top of your library and preordain them away.
In the sideboard, I can't really think of a matchup where you particularly want bonesplitter. I would consider replacing it with extra copies of another card like steel sabotage or weatherseed faeries.
I'm currently testing a more control version of this deck. I do like Ninja of the Deep Hours and its synergy with Spellstutter Faeries, but the lack of evasion can be quite infuriating.
With this deck, I have a really easy time against Infect decks unless they get an awesome draw or I make a wrong decision on mulligans.
As for Post decks, the Piracy Charms help to slow them down, and if needed, I can swap in Power Sinks to give them a headache.
TPPS is still an issue for me though, personally. It seems like almost all other Delver players feel that TPPS is an easy match-up, so I think this is more an issue of me being unable to catch the right spell to counter than anything. Thought that Power Sink is a good card to board in though, for such match-ups.
How do you guys fight enchantment aggro decks? Kinda new to Pauper and in play testing this deck is giving me fits with their horde of hexproof 1-drops and enchantments
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How do you guys fight enchantment aggro decks? Kinda new to Pauper and in play testing this deck is giving me fits with their horde of hexproof 1-drops and enchantments
Echoing truth can help by bouncing multiple enchantments upon declaring attackers. Safe your counters for their hexproofers since you have no other way of dealing with them. Curfew can be a decent sideboard option.
Thanks for the tip. I think I was just drawing bad - now I just save counters for Ancestral Mask and such. Anyone got links to folks who stream Delver Blue dailies? I'm running the Ninja/Faeries variant with no Bears. Sideboarding properly seems to be my biggest issue. Every daily I've entered the only games I won were when I was on the play.
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So what's our plan against Post? I did a test online against that deck and I felt like I was never even close to being in it.
So what's the reasoning behind the different amounts of cantrips in the deck? Personally, I love Brainstorm because I love holding up countermagic and then doing something with the mana I leave up if I don't counter anything. But I see most lists only run 2, if any. I love Preordain, too, but I don't like the sorcery speed of it. How about Ponder?
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Level 2 Judge
Currently playing:
Standard: Superfriends!
Legacy: Nic Fit / Pod
Pauper: Delvar; Tron; Flicker Stuff
Commander: Riku ("Some weird doubple spell thing happened"); Keranos ("I did a Gatherer search for 'random' and 'flip a coin.'"); Superfriends!
I've found it's all about tempo and countering the right spells. Given the chance, always counter their first Prophetic Prism. Always counter Mulldrifters. Keep the pressure on as long as possible. After sideboard, Hydroblast their creature kill spells. Take out Daze or any other counter dependant on opponent being tapped out or close to. Curse of the Bloody Tomb is nice if you can protect it, but don't rely on it killing them. Your primary goal is still to bring them to 0.
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You're right, you can't counter all their creatures. You have to counter the ones that matter the most - Bushwhacker, War Marshal specifically. Don't be afraid to trade a faerie for their Jackal Familiar. Once a Spire Golem hits you're in good shape, but sometimes you'll still just get aggro'd out. The key is just stopping the early assault then beating Dow with fliers and card advantage.
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Been doing rather well with a pretty stock list. Seems to have reasonable matchups across the board. I just got completely stomped by elfball though, is there a method to the matchup or a niche sideboard card I should know of? Seemed like maybe you just have to have a counter for distant melody.
So people have been talking about cloudfin raptor a ton, but what about hands of binding? It seems to be like the best card for delver in the new set, especially given the metagame shift post ban: in the current aggro heavy metagame, it gives delver a something that actually does work as quasi removal, along with a huge tempo swing. As a bonus, it can shut down those pesky scattershot archers. What do you guys think?
You'd have to make an argument as to how that's better than curse of chains, which is a pretty stock card that does something even if you don't have an evasive threat out.
Curse of Chains serves a different purpose and doesn't stop the Archers. That said, curse of Chains is more vulnerable to opponent flicker/self-bounce effects, and Hands would be more vulnerable to spot removal from your opponent. Pick your poison.
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Yeah, ditto on the archers. Another big downside of curse of chains is that it brings your sorcery/instant spell count down. Maintaining a high sorcery/instant count down is really important in the version of delver that runs 22-6 creatures. The fact that hands of binding can get a blocker out of the way on the turn it comes down - curse of chain only starts working on the next upkeep - , or keep an extra creature down that first turn could also prove very valuable in a race.
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Izzet post is a pretty skill intensive matchup. You have the edge during the first few turns, as they stumble with comes into play tapped and colorless land and draw spells. Swarming them with guys backed by disruption can lead to a quick kill. During the later game, they have complete inevitability with draw spells and removal spells. If they manage to clear the board after around turn 5, you have very little chance of winning.
Ninja of the deep hours is the real wildcard in the matchup, as the card draw can really put you ahead.
1 Quicksand
4 Cloud of Faeries
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Ninja of the Deep Hours
4 Spellstutter Sprite
3 Spire Golem
2 Preordain
2 Gitaxian Probe
1 Echoing Truth
4 Counterspell
4 Force Spike
4 Snap
2 Mana Leak
1 Deprive
1 Gush
3 Weatherseed Faeries
2 Coast Watcher
2 Echoing Truth
2 Steel Sabotage
2 Serrated Arrows
I am considering a 2nd Gush, it is crazy good. Mana Leaks are replacements for Daze, because I am not willing to shell out twenty bucks on commons.
What do we think? It's a little wonky at times, but if it gets its tempo going there's just no hope for the opponent.
Your list looks fairly stock overall. Daze is entirely needed and some builds even eschew daze in favor of force spike. Preordain really needs to be a 4-of as it's one of your few defenses against flood and one of the best cards in the deck. I'd also like to see a few more creatures, as those are needed to make your tempo draws really good. Phantasmal bear is great at enabling turn 2 ninjas and spire golem/stitched drake are good for winning longer games. I'd look at possibly cutting 1-2 force spikes, 2 mana leaks, 1 brainstorm and 1 echoing truth/snap.
1 Quicksand
[21] Creatures
4 Delver of Secrets
2 Phantasmal Bear
4 Cloud of Faeries
4 Spellstutter Sprite
4 Ninja of the Deep Hours
3 Spire Golem
3 Brain Storm
3 Preordain
3 Force Spike
2 Gitaxian Probe
4 Counterspell
4 Snap
1 Mana Leak
1 Deprive
1 Gush
3 Weatherseed Faeries
2 Coast Watcher
2 Echoing Truth
2 Steel Sabotage
2 Serrated Arrows
So this is what I will test with today, and come back with results. I am really disappointed Gush shot up to $11, the deck could really benefit from it. Also, this has turned out a lot more aggressively than the control archetype I was trying to fit into.
15 Island
1 Quicksand
CREATURES
4 Cloud of Faeries
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Ninja of the Deep Hours
2 Phantasmal Bear
4 Spellstutter Sprite
4 Spire Golem
3 Brainstorm
4 Counterspell
2 Daze
1 Echoing Truth
2 Gitaxian Probe
1 Gush
4 Ponder
3 Snap
2 Coast Watcher
2 Piracy Charm
2 Dispel
2 Deprive
2 Echoing Truth
2 Hydroblast
3 Serrated Arrows
Legacy Decks:
Reanimator
Merfolk
Modern Deck:
Modern Affinity
EDH Deck:
Zur The Enchanter
Pauper:
Ninja Blue
Vintage:
Dredge
I haven't played it myself, but it seems like it would be at its best against cloudpost. If it manages to stabilize, cloudpost can deal with all of delvers other threats with burn spells, card draw and life gain off of glimmerpost. Even without mill pressure, cloudpost decks are threat light and come close to milling themselves before they close out a game.
I so recently began piloting this list on MTGO and have had a bit if success in casual rooms. I am using Bonesplinter in place of Serrated Arrows because of their cost. Post is a bit of a difficult match-up, and I recently got slaughtered by a MBC control deck in a Daily. The mirror can also be a bit of nail biter. Any suggestions with this list given the current meta? Sideboard help would be particularly well received.
Your deck only 58 cards?
Modern: Grixis DS ; UR Phoenix ; Storm ; Burn
Standard: MonoRed ; Ral Spells ; UR Phoenix ; Izzet Drakes
Commander: Locust God
Control decks often feel like difficult matches because the games delver loses to them drag on for ages. Once a control deck has cleared delvers board and has redundant removal spells in hand, the game has been decided. The key to most control matchups is to play aggressive and connect with ninja of the deep hours as many times as you can. If you can untap with a ninja in play, you're usually pretty far ahead.
Your maindeck seems pretty solid for the most part, aside from lacking preordain. Preordain is the best cantrip in the deck by far and the best way to filter away extra lands late game. I particularly like the brainstorm and preordain combo, where you brainstorm and put two unwanted lands on top of your library and preordain them away.
In the sideboard, I can't really think of a matchup where you particularly want bonesplitter. I would consider replacing it with extra copies of another card like steel sabotage or weatherseed faeries.
With this deck, I have a really easy time against Infect decks unless they get an awesome draw or I make a wrong decision on mulligans.
As for Post decks, the Piracy Charms help to slow them down, and if needed, I can swap in Power Sinks to give them a headache.
TPPS is still an issue for me though, personally. It seems like almost all other Delver players feel that TPPS is an easy match-up, so I think this is more an issue of me being unable to catch the right spell to counter than anything. Thought that Power Sink is a good card to board in though, for such match-ups.
This is still pretty much a work-in-progress, and I would welcome any comments/criticisms. For what it's worth, I have 2 Gush, 3 Ninja of the Deep Hours, 2 Snap, 2 Serrated Arrows, 4 Phantasmal Bears, 3 Sea Sprites, 3 Curse of the Bloody Tome, 3 Deprive and 2 Steel Sabotages sitting pretty in the 'Maybeboard'.
16 Islands
[14] CREATURES
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Cloud of Faeries
4 Spellstutter Faeries
2 Spire Golem
[30] SPELLS
3 Brainstorm
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Preordain
3 Ponder
2 Echoing Truth
4 Counterspell
3 Daze
4 Piracy Charm
3 Dispel
3 Curse of Chains
3 Hydroblast
2 Intervene
4 Power Sink
3 Frostburn Weird
Fires :symr:f Salvation
Echoing truth can help by bouncing multiple enchantments upon declaring attackers. Safe your counters for their hexproofers since you have no other way of dealing with them. Curfew can be a decent sideboard option.
Fires :symr:f Salvation
So what's the reasoning behind the different amounts of cantrips in the deck? Personally, I love Brainstorm because I love holding up countermagic and then doing something with the mana I leave up if I don't counter anything. But I see most lists only run 2, if any. I love Preordain, too, but I don't like the sorcery speed of it. How about Ponder?
Currently playing:
Standard: Superfriends!
Legacy: Nic Fit / Pod
Pauper: Delvar; Tron; Flicker Stuff
Commander: Riku ("Some weird doubple spell thing happened"); Keranos ("I did a Gatherer search for 'random' and 'flip a coin.'"); Superfriends!
Fires :symr:f Salvation
EDH - Mirri
Mahvel: Spencer/Magz/Vergil
Fires :symr:f Salvation
Fires :symr:f Salvation