Well, by the numbers and what kind of support I'm seeing in the set for dinosaurs, this deck build is getting a bit tricky. If we run the Kinjalli's Caller on curve we'd need to be pretty sure we have white mana on turn 1. To be able to run the other dino buddy natives we'd need to have both green and red accessible by turn 2. On top of which, most dinosaurs have green in their costs, so we need to have that available and have at least two sources of green by turn 4 for Ripjaw Raptor. I think that Rhonas's Monument is the right call on being the third wheel to the deck, since it can help ramp to larger creatures while also adding some benefit to playing lower curve drops, as they all suddenly turn into 1 or 2 mana sorcery speed buffs that can grant trample to any dinosaurs that need it. Rhonas the Indomitable is a possible include if the direction is more mid-range since he can fill the same role as the monument.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Well, we have access to Unclaimed Territory to begin with. It shouldn't be that hard to build a Naya manabase for a tribal deck in the standard to come. The 3-drops you think of are very interesting.
I'm impressed how much support there is (it reminds me of Eldrazi). There's everything we need to get a T3 5-drop rather consistently. The archetype looks strong but its efficiency in the format will resume to how strong the other decks are. But I feel the tribe has so many different pay-offs that the deck should evolve and adapt to the format no matter what. It may take several weeks, while other decks will be easy to build because the better options for those archetypes will be more obvious.
I think I'll start with this draft, greedy on the land count, cutting the cute :
Right, but lets say we get Unclaimed Territory in our opening hand along with a forest, mountain, some 2 and 3 drops, and the white one drop dino discounter. To get white to cast the Kinjalli's Caller we'd have to select cleric or human for the Unclaimed Territory. That means that we have to lock out that source for dinosaurs outside colorless support, which the Kinjalli's Caller is providing via discount. I'm actually delving back into Kaladesh -> Aether Revolt for a few things because Rishkar, Peema Renegade might be deceptively good in this deck.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
In the case you describe, Territory does its job, the rest of the manabse should provide colored mana anyway. It's also where Commune with D is relevant and incredibly good in an opening hand. That will decrease the amount of mulligans. Hopefully this archetype isn't too consistent in 3 colors, it would be too easy.
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Pioneer - A bunch of stuff Modern - Humans Legacy - Grixis Phoenix / Death & Taxes
Rishkar is far better than he looks since he can basically boost a Kinjalli's Caller or Rampaging Ferocidon over bolt range. That and he can turn other creatures into mana dorks to propel the deck forward, such as playing Rishkar, adding a counter to a Kinjalli's Caller and Rampaging Ferocidon, then tap the Caller to play Savage Stomp on Rampaging Ferocidon to make it into a 5/5.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Well, we knew early on dinosaurs were gonna pushed in XLN. We just didn't know how hard. Now we kinda have an idea. As has been stated, many people see dinosaurs going in two directions: RW aggro and RG Ramp. I personally would like to see Naya dino deck going far combining the best synergies between the to. Here is my first (but not last) crack at the deck:
First off, I see a lot of people are running some graveyards hate land cards like Scavenger Grounds in your builds. Personally, I think this is a waste of time. Mono Black Zombies got neutered hard with SOI rotating out. And Mardu Vehicles won't be what it used to be without Gideon and Avacyn. So I think the correct response while the meta is developing is to go "all in" instead of weakening your manabases. What I mean is, concentrate on one powerful strategy, then fine tune your deck as the meta develops.
That being said, I went with a midrange/aggro strat. In many cases, I can get 4-5CMC big bodied dinos out as early as Turn 3. I'm also running a lot of card draw in place of removal MB so that I don't have to go into "topdeck mode" quite as much. With the Enrage mechanic, cards like Samut, the Tested becomes a powerful team player, and each of her abilities becomes useful. Huatli, Warrior Poet acts as backup, creating board stall, lifegain, and, when we're ready, a game ending alpha strike. My removal is reserved for the SB once I know what I'm up against. It's designed primarily to break the mirror, but should do well against other aggro, midrange, and tempo strats. Control is another story. I don't know how strong it will be, but I think our dino CMC reduction cards may allow us to out CA them.
If you are Kinalli's Caller you need more white sources T1. All you have are the vantages which are not enough.
Agreed. Will make the appropriate changes. Recommendations?
Well, we knew early on dinosaurs were gonna pushed in XLN. We just didn't know how hard. Now we kinda have an idea. As has been stated, many people see dinosaurs going in two directions: RW aggro and RG Ramp. I personally would like to see Naya dino deck going far combining the best synergies between the to. Here is my first (but not last) crack at the deck:
First off, I see a lot of people are running some graveyards hate land cards like Scavenger Grounds in your builds. Personally, I think this is a waste of time. Mono Black Zombies got neutered hard with SOI rotating out. And Mardu Vehicles won't be what it used to be without Gideon and Avacyn. So I think the correct response while the meta is developing is to go "all in" instead of weakening your manabases. What I mean is, concentrate on one powerful strategy, then fine tune your deck as the meta develops.
That being said, I went with a midrange/aggro strat. In many cases, I can get 4-5CMC big bodied dinos out as early as Turn 3. I'm also running a lot of card draw in place of removal MB so that I don't have to go into "topdeck mode" quite as much. With the Enrage mechanic, cards like Samut, the Tested becomes a powerful team player, and each of her abilities becomes useful. Huatli, Warrior Poet acts as backup, creating board stall, lifegain, and, when we're ready, a game ending alpha strike. My removal is reserved for the SB once I know what I'm up against. It's designed primarily to break the mirror, but should do well against other aggro, midrange, and tempo strats. Control is another story. I don't know how strong it will be, but I think our dino CMC reduction cards may allow us to out CA them.
God Pharaoh's gift decks are the reason to include graveyard hate, not zombies or vehicles.
True that. Gift doesn't make up a large part of the meta (right now) but that could always change. Great observation!
Personally, I think Kinjalli's caller is more of a limited card than a constructed playable, as I'd rather be running some early interference like Raptor Hatchling or Narnam Renegade. At least in the Lifecrafter's Bestiary version that gets extra draws. I primarily want white for answers against indestructible gods and ways to deal with Four Color energy, which is looking to be an absolute nightmare come rotation due to not losing anything.
Also you are the second person to point out how playing a one drop white creature on curve is a nightmare (first was myself ). If I'm splashing white for something, I'm probably doing it for cards that are at least 2 drops and probably with the expectation that I'm not playing those cards until possibly turn 3 or 4.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think the unsung champion for dinosaurs is going to be the green enchantment that let's you draw a card when the opponent tries to bolt or glorybringer something. Red has a ton of removal right now that hits anything 3 toughness or lower. That makes raptor hatchling a better chumper than the renegade.
Also, after doing a few test runs I'm really liking lifecrafter's bestiary. It's great for fixing draws and gives a much needed mana sink when you have some to spare. If we got a dinosaur version of rogue refiner that would be even better, but I'll take what I can get. The other option is to run samut or Chandra. Samut requires having enrage creatures out to take advantage of, while Chandra is double red.
In any case, turn 3 is pretty critical in this format and running bestiaries will mean needing to answer aggro pirates or what not effectively with two and one drops.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I am still trying to figure out the mana base, but I feel that making a deck that doesn't rely on all of the cost reduction cards is a viable build. One huge problem I see with trying to make a "ramp" deck around the cost reducers, is that once they die, your ramp is gone. You aren't casting a Rampant Growth, you're just playing a Llanowar Elves
I am still trying to figure out the mana base, but I feel that making a deck that doesn't rely on all of the cost reduction cards is a viable build. One huge problem I see with trying to make a "ramp" deck around the cost reducers, is that once they die, your ramp is gone. You aren't casting a Rampant Growth, you're just playing a Llanowar Elves
Ugh, I would so kill for a Llanowar Elves in this format. They went with an off color dinosaur only cost reducer and it hurts so much. It feels like they tried to keep the kinds of builds one can do with dinosaurs and pirates open, but in doing so they also really knee capped them at the same time. The ramp deck just does not seem viable since it has to be explosively fast to get past the red removal with getting dorks online, and then consistent enough via some form of card draw.
Now, mid-range or "upper mid range" is pretty viable. There are plenty of good stall options against red aggro via Raptor Hatchling, Narnam Renegade, and Shapers' Sanctuary. Also I really like the synergy that we get with Samut, the Tested and enrage. The fact she can give double strike to some creatures gives her a lot of utility in the deck.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
You think Oketra the True is worth trying? I've looked at her and figure she would fit more into what the vampires look like they are trying to do with the 1/1 token generation.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
-- go fast enough
-- go wide enough
-- go big enough
-- kill stuff that matters (see The Scarab God)
-- be resilient to something as simple as a Fumigate
My list does the following:
-- is resilient to sweepers
-- kills The Scarab God relatively easily
-- has a combo that wins a board stall
In all, I don't think my list is refined whatsoever. Nor do I think it is any good. However, I think it's heads and heels above what others have been posting.
In sum, there is one good Dino (Ripjaw Raptor) and probably not a whole tribe of guys worth playing. Kinjalli's Sunwing is a probably second.
It would be cool if there were a Naya Midrange deck but the 3 drop slot is severely lacking.
This is my third attempt. Going with Nissa at the top end since she can grab things from the graveyard. I agree there aren't a lot of super good dinosaurs, but there's enough of them to do something decent. Unfortunately, I do agree the meta requires having an answer for the Scarab God, which does require white or black right now.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think I want to go GW due to the caller and having a much better manabase. Reliably getting an untapped white source turn 1 in a 3-color deck seems somewhat difficult.
In practice, as long as the deck is running 4x Commune with Dinosaurs it seems like that you don't need more than 10 dinosaurs to really get those synergy bonuses going from Drover of the Mighty, and ultimately going white does give more ways to discount into big stuff as well as more reliable ways to deal with the meta right now. Cast Out is really good against mid-range and control, while Desert's Hold can be a reliable way to dispose of creatures like the Scarab God.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Decided to try this timmy deck. Very fun lol. The ramp is more consistent and less disrupted with pillar of origins. It's not as slow as I thought it would be. quite normal for t5 big papa dinos lol. However, does get hurt by boardwipes.
I think I want to go GW due to the caller and having a much better manabase. Reliably getting an untapped white source turn 1 in a 3-color deck seems somewhat difficult.
It is. I revised my list (listed on page 1 of this thread) and it still hasn't been very consistent. So I've taken a step back and have determined (from my own observations) that three different dino decks will emerge: RGw Ramp Dinos, WR/x Agrro Dinos, and/or GWr Midrange Dinos. Like you, I've chosen GW because I feel it runs the best dinos in G, but also the best dino support in W (which W is known for and is the best at). It's also offers us more removal options for bigger creatures than R does.
The main boardwipe right now is probably Hour of Devastation, which completely goes around Heroic Intervention. My white build for dinosaurs feels like pure, undiluted hatred towards my opponent right now. Angel of Sanctions does some work when the most common kill spells are red 3 damage ones. Not to mention Embalm on that thing...
Went all in on white removal packages and I'm still balancing out the rest of the cards. Ripjaw Raptor made the cut just because it's a house at 4/5 that can give free draws. I've also been pondering Rishkar's Expertise. I think with all the mana ramp we are trying to go for it might be a good option to help keep the hand full.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Like I said before, I think Naya Ramp may be the best way to go (if you really wanna get technical, it's Gwr Ramp). I went less heavy on R with this build, and I'm not running Unclaimed Territory. The reason being that all dinos are G in this setup, save the three gold card dinos MB. Because those gold cards have higher CMC's, it's not been hard to cast them at all, especially since Drover of the Mighty and Pillar of Origins act both as mana fixing AND ramp.
Well, the "Big Dinos" lists (running 8-10 ramp cards and between 4 and 8 6+ drops) certainly do go big enough - and your Enrage synergy list isn't exactly immun to Fumigate, either because destroying creatures doesn't damage them.
I don't disagree that my list is bad. It is bad.
However, these lists that plan on playing mana dorks that only ramp you into dinos, only play dino threats, and play removal spells that only deal with a portion of the format are, quite honestly, very bad midrange decks.
My list (yes, while bad) has threats that live through Fumigate are mana dumps in board stalls, and will kill through a board stall.
What do these other lists do in board stalls? Honestly? I don't really see what.
You will end up in a board stall -- these lists have 0 evasion and have 0 business trying to play trumpet blasts that do give them evasion. They aren't fast enough to beat a Torrential Gearhulk deck, can't beat a The Scarab God ever, and look weak to God Pharaoh's Gift (excluding the intelligent few packing Abrades in the MD).
These lists "go big" enough?
I find this unlikely.
Going "big" enough requires that you repeatable ways to decimate your opponents board or kill your opponent the turn you slam your threats. Dragonlord Atarka did this. Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger did this. Playing a bunch of non-impactful ramp cards so you can have a payoff that puts a bunch of vanilla bodies into play (with haste, I guess) is not relevant.
Also, Wakening Sun's Avatar looks necessary for these decks trying to go big. It's very expensive, but wrathing your opponents board seems like it's where you're going to have to be if you want to win prolonged creature MUs.
Dinosaurs are far better than they look, just we've been going at it from the wrong direction. We really want to be mostly White and green with a splash of red.
The question is how to stabilize against aggro and also how to keep the gas on like four color energy does right now. Shapers' sanctuary has been doing great work in testing against things like earthshaker Khenra.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
If Ramunap Red stays big then Dual Shot is playable. Kills their early x/1's and lets you use the enrage mechanic late game.
The rest are probably not playable but depend mostly on what sort of dinosaur deck comes out. Raptor Companion, Nest Robber, and Thrash of Raptors are all looking for a fast low to the ground Dinosaur deck. Steadfast Armasaur is a midrange-y card, but is too slow for not enough value compared to Ranging Raptors or Ripjaw Raptor. Slash of Talons is probably not playable, but will mostly depend on how fast the format is.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I'm impressed how much support there is (it reminds me of Eldrazi). There's everything we need to get a T3 5-drop rather consistently. The archetype looks strong but its efficiency in the format will resume to how strong the other decks are. But I feel the tribe has so many different pay-offs that the deck should evolve and adapt to the format no matter what. It may take several weeks, while other decks will be easy to build because the better options for those archetypes will be more obvious.
I think I'll start with this draft, greedy on the land count, cutting the cute :
4 Otepec Huntmaster
4 Drover of the Mighty
4 Kinjalli's Sunwing
4 Ripjaw Raptor
4 Regisaur Alpha
2 Raging Swordtooth
2 Gishath, Sun's Avatar
2 Abrade
2 Savage Stomp
2 Growing Rites of Itlimoc
4 Unclaimed Territory
4 Inspiring Vantage
4 Sunpetal Grove
4 Rootbound Crag
2 Plains
2 Forest
2 Mountain
I can naively anticipate aggro being über-popular, control unbeatable without dedicated slots, and annoying PWs and artifacts, so :
3 Ravenous Daggertooth
3 Carnage Tyrant
2 Shapers' Sanctuary
2 Abrade
2 Ixalan's Binding
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
5 Forest
2 Mountain
1 Plains
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Sunpetal Grove
4 Unclaimed Territory
2 Blossoming Defense
4 Commune with Dinosaurs
3 Lifecrafter's Bestiary
4 Savage Stomp
//Creatures
2 Carnage Tyrant
4 Drover of the Mighty
4 Kinjalli's Caller
2 Otepec Huntmaster
4 Rampaging Ferocidon
4 Regisaur Alpha
4 Ripjaw Raptor
3 Rishkar, Peema Renegade
Rishkar is far better than he looks since he can basically boost a Kinjalli's Caller or Rampaging Ferocidon over bolt range. That and he can turn other creatures into mana dorks to propel the deck forward, such as playing Rishkar, adding a counter to a Kinjalli's Caller and Rampaging Ferocidon, then tap the Caller to play Savage Stomp on Rampaging Ferocidon to make it into a 5/5.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Agreed. Will make the appropriate changes. Recommendations?
True that. Gift doesn't make up a large part of the meta (right now) but that could always change. Great observation!
Also you are the second person to point out how playing a one drop white creature on curve is a nightmare (first was myself ). If I'm splashing white for something, I'm probably doing it for cards that are at least 2 drops and probably with the expectation that I'm not playing those cards until possibly turn 3 or 4.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Also, after doing a few test runs I'm really liking lifecrafter's bestiary. It's great for fixing draws and gives a much needed mana sink when you have some to spare. If we got a dinosaur version of rogue refiner that would be even better, but I'll take what I can get. The other option is to run samut or Chandra. Samut requires having enrage creatures out to take advantage of, while Chandra is double red.
In any case, turn 3 is pretty critical in this format and running bestiaries will mean needing to answer aggro pirates or what not effectively with two and one drops.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
4x Metallic Mimic
3x Raptor Hatchling
3x Deathgorge Scavenger
3x Rampaging Ferocidon
4x Ripjaw Raptor
3x Regisaur Alpha
2x Burning Sun's Avatar
2x Shapers' Sanctuary
3x Abrade
2x Savage Stomp
3x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
I am still trying to figure out the mana base, but I feel that making a deck that doesn't rely on all of the cost reduction cards is a viable build. One huge problem I see with trying to make a "ramp" deck around the cost reducers, is that once they die, your ramp is gone. You aren't casting a Rampant Growth, you're just playing a Llanowar Elves
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Ugh, I would so kill for a Llanowar Elves in this format. They went with an off color dinosaur only cost reducer and it hurts so much. It feels like they tried to keep the kinds of builds one can do with dinosaurs and pirates open, but in doing so they also really knee capped them at the same time. The ramp deck just does not seem viable since it has to be explosively fast to get past the red removal with getting dorks online, and then consistent enough via some form of card draw.
Now, mid-range or "upper mid range" is pretty viable. There are plenty of good stall options against red aggro via Raptor Hatchling, Narnam Renegade, and Shapers' Sanctuary. Also I really like the synergy that we get with Samut, the Tested and enrage. The fact she can give double strike to some creatures gives her a lot of utility in the deck.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
4x Walking Ballista
4x Kinjalli's Sunwing
4x Ranging Raptors
4x Ripjaw Raptor
3x Oketra the True
4x Bellowing Aegisaur
2x Cast Out
1x Skywhaler's Shot
2x Ajani Unyielding
4x Sunpetal Grove
4x Scattered Groves
7x Forest
7x Plains
You think Oketra the True is worth trying? I've looked at her and figure she would fit more into what the vampires look like they are trying to do with the 1/1 token generation.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
-- go fast enough
-- go wide enough
-- go big enough
-- kill stuff that matters (see The Scarab God)
-- be resilient to something as simple as a Fumigate
My list does the following:
-- is resilient to sweepers
-- kills The Scarab God relatively easily
-- has a combo that wins a board stall
In all, I don't think my list is refined whatsoever. Nor do I think it is any good. However, I think it's heads and heels above what others have been posting.
In sum, there is one good Dino (Ripjaw Raptor) and probably not a whole tribe of guys worth playing. Kinjalli's Sunwing is a probably second.
It would be cool if there were a Naya Midrange deck but the 3 drop slot is severely lacking.
8 Forest
2 Hashep Oasis
2 Mountain
1 Ramunap Ruins
4 Rootbound Crag
1 Scavenger Grounds
2 Sheltered Thicket
2 Cascading Cataracts
//Spells
4 Commune with Dinosaurs
4 Lightning Strike
3 Nissa, Vital Force
4 Savage Stomp
4 Drover of the Mighty
4 Narnam Renegade
4 Rampaging Ferocidon
4 Raptor Hatchling
4 Ripjaw Raptor
3 Rishkar, Peema Renegade
3 Abrade
2 Appetite for the Unnatural
2 Carnage Tyrant
2 Heaven // Earth
2 Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
4 Shapers' Sanctuary
This is my third attempt. Going with Nissa at the top end since she can grab things from the graveyard. I agree there aren't a lot of super good dinosaurs, but there's enough of them to do something decent. Unfortunately, I do agree the meta requires having an answer for the Scarab God, which does require white or black right now.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
4 commune with dinosaur
3 savage stomp
3 magma spray
2cc
4 drover of the mighty
4 pillar of origins
3 abrade
4 ranging raptors
4cc
4 ripjaw raptor
5+ cc
4 regisaur alpha
2 Burning Sun's Avatar
1 gishath, sun's avatar
4 sheltered thicket
4 unclaimed territory
4 rootbound crag
4 mountain
6 forest
2 sunpetal grove
Decided to try this timmy deck. Very fun lol. The ramp is more consistent and less disrupted with pillar of origins. It's not as slow as I thought it would be. quite normal for t5 big papa dinos lol. However, does get hurt by boardwipes.
It is. I revised my list (listed on page 1 of this thread) and it still hasn't been very consistent. So I've taken a step back and have determined (from my own observations) that three different dino decks will emerge: RGw Ramp Dinos, WR/x Agrro Dinos, and/or GWr Midrange Dinos. Like you, I've chosen GW because I feel it runs the best dinos in G, but also the best dino support in W (which W is known for and is the best at). It's also offers us more removal options for bigger creatures than R does.
Went all in on white removal packages and I'm still balancing out the rest of the cards. Ripjaw Raptor made the cut just because it's a house at 4/5 that can give free draws. I've also been pondering Rishkar's Expertise. I think with all the mana ramp we are trying to go for it might be a good option to help keep the hand full.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Naya Dinos Midrange
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Sheltered Thicket
4 Sunpetal Grove
6 Forest
6 Plains
CREATURES 23
4 Drover of the Mighty
2 Ranging Raptors
4 Deathgorge Scavenger
4 Ripjaw Raptor
2 Carnage Tyrant
4 Kinjalli's Caller
2 Regisaur Alpha
1 Gishath, Sun's Avatar
2 Samut, the Tested
INSTANTS AND SORCERIES 6
2 Shapers' Sanctuary
4 Commune with Dinosaurs
ARTIFACTS 5
2 Pillar of Origins
2 Lifecrafter's Bestiary
1 Vanquisher's Banner
3 Abrade
2 Rampaging Ferocidon
2 Sweltering Suns
2 Savage Stomp
4 Kinjalli's Sunwing
2 Ixalan's Binding
Like I said before, I think Naya Ramp may be the best way to go (if you really wanna get technical, it's Gwr Ramp). I went less heavy on R with this build, and I'm not running Unclaimed Territory. The reason being that all dinos are G in this setup, save the three gold card dinos MB. Because those gold cards have higher CMC's, it's not been hard to cast them at all, especially since Drover of the Mighty and Pillar of Origins act both as mana fixing AND ramp.
I don't disagree that my list is bad. It is bad.
However, these lists that plan on playing mana dorks that only ramp you into dinos, only play dino threats, and play removal spells that only deal with a portion of the format are, quite honestly, very bad midrange decks.
My list (yes, while bad) has threats that live through Fumigate are mana dumps in board stalls, and will kill through a board stall.
What do these other lists do in board stalls? Honestly? I don't really see what.
You will end up in a board stall -- these lists have 0 evasion and have 0 business trying to play trumpet blasts that do give them evasion. They aren't fast enough to beat a Torrential Gearhulk deck, can't beat a The Scarab God ever, and look weak to God Pharaoh's Gift (excluding the intelligent few packing Abrades in the MD).
These lists "go big" enough?
I find this unlikely.
Going "big" enough requires that you repeatable ways to decimate your opponents board or kill your opponent the turn you slam your threats. Dragonlord Atarka did this. Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger did this. Playing a bunch of non-impactful ramp cards so you can have a payoff that puts a bunch of vanilla bodies into play (with haste, I guess) is not relevant.
Also, Wakening Sun's Avatar looks necessary for these decks trying to go big. It's very expensive, but wrathing your opponents board seems like it's where you're going to have to be if you want to win prolonged creature MUs.
The question is how to stabilize against aggro and also how to keep the gas on like four color energy does right now. Shapers' sanctuary has been doing great work in testing against things like earthshaker Khenra.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Raptor Companion, Slash of Talons, Steadfast Armasaur, Dual Shot, Nest Robber, Thrash of Raptors
The rest are probably not playable but depend mostly on what sort of dinosaur deck comes out. Raptor Companion, Nest Robber, and Thrash of Raptors are all looking for a fast low to the ground Dinosaur deck. Steadfast Armasaur is a midrange-y card, but is too slow for not enough value compared to Ranging Raptors or Ripjaw Raptor. Slash of Talons is probably not playable, but will mostly depend on how fast the format is.