Pile 1, i think that we could use that decent mana fixing, and that Dark Confidant is definitely worth splashing for, and the fume spitter can't be that bad.
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Pile 1, i think that we could use that decent mana fixing, and that Dark Confidant is definitely worth splashing for, and the fume spitter can't be that bad.
I think you're a bit late to the party with that pick. Care to take another stab at the current options?
I'm waiting to finalize on this pick until I see a few arguments in favor of one or another. I'm currently leaning to pile 2 or 3.
I'm waiting to finalize on this pick until I see a few arguments in favor of one or another. I'm currently leaning to pile 2 or 3.
Yeah, I can see arguments for taking any of piles 1, 2, and 3. However, pile 2 doesn't really go with what we have now, and pile 3 is also kind of awkward -- right now we have a lot of aggressive cards in red and some in green and black, so vindicate is basically a gamble at this point and earthquake and watery grave both seem like a bit of a long shot for our final deck, but is it worth it for the pithing needle (which will hit masticore, greaves, and whatever equipment magicmerl picks up) and a few unexciting options? Pile 1 is actually kind of good for us right now, since it contains cards that are on color acceleration with what we have now, but if we are trying to go aggro, then why are we interested in a signet and a birds? Pile 1 might still be the pick, and I think it's where I'm leaning towards right now, but it just feels so bad to take those two cards over a vindicate and earthquake... maybe if we already had a kokusho or inferno titan to accelerate into I would be happier with that pick, but as it is I'm really torn here.
Wow. Merl really is a luck sack. He turns over one good card into the pile we wanted most and leave us with a bunch of mostly terrible piles. Pile 2 is clearly out in my mind as I think all of those cards are terrible. I vote for Pile 1 because I think the good cards in pile 3 (vindicate, watery grave) look highly unlikely to make our deck.
@kcolloran:
Well, godo is fine if you have some good equipment in your deck for him to fetch, and if you do have the cards to make him good he is really good, but I agree that he isn't the best card for our deck right now. Also, hokori is basically winter orb on a 2/2, which is pretty sweet in aggressive white decks, but I don't think he's the pick for us. And no, I don't think zuran orb is the best in cube either, but all three of them are probably better than you think they are.
Also, I might as well vote for Pile 1 now, since it's probably the best one for us to take and
I can also see us moving into a more ramp-ish green deck, especially if we get a good green card or two, since with birds, 2 mana rocks, some shocklands, and a tribe-elder we will probably be able to do some splashing in our deck. I'm not sure if moving more heavily into green is worth giving up koth for, but this way we'll at least have the option to do so if we want to.
@kcolloran:
Well, godo is fine if you have some good equipment in your deck for him to fetch, and if you do have the cards to make him good he is really good, but I agree that he isn't the best card for our deck right now. Also, hokori is basically winter orb on a 2/2, which is pretty sweet in aggressive white decks, but I don't think he's the pick for us. And no, I don't think zuran orb is the best in cube either, but all three of them are probably better than you think they are.
Godo is probably ok if you have some good equipment with him, but he's hardly exciting, and the difference between Hokori and Winter Orb is humungous. None of them are uncubable, but I think they're all going to be amongst the worst cards in any cube they're in.
My current major concern is that we have no idea what kind of deck he will be fielding. Since we (foolishly) let him get so many colorless cards, he is still flexible in color and archetype. His cards appear to lean toward aggro, but he could morph to midrange at any point. Red aggro would all but make Dark Confidant terrible, which is currently 90% of the reason we are thinking about running black.
We might want to think about going WRG midrange on him (if it appears he's going aggro). We need to luck into some more fixing in those colors though.
Edit: p.s. Are *all* your spoiler tags still confidential? Or only say discussions of the current pick? (I haven't peeked at any of them but I must confess to being powerful curious).
I'm going with Pile 1 over pile 4 on this one, since I'm pretty sure that we'll end up playing at least some of the cards we get from it and its power level is much higher than the power level of pile 4. If magicmerl continues to pick up good artifacts like he has now, we'll need all the green artifact hate we can get our hands on...
@magicmerl: you can read anything I put in this spoiler and previous spoilers
If magicmerl continues to pick up good artifacts like he has now, we'll need all the green artifact hate we can get our hands on...
I can assure you, I will continue to draft artifacts, despite your wicked wicked plan to destroy said artifacts. Speaking of which, Wurmcoil Engine is an artifact, and technically I have 'baggsed' them. You should leave pile 1 for me.
Well, I would love to take that treachery, since that card is just such a beating. Stealing something AND effectively costing zero? Must-play in any blue deck. However, I honestly don't think we'll be able to support switching into blue at this point. Basically, how many blue sources should we need in able to play treachery? I would think the number would be (at least) 7 or 8 blue sources, and we already have 5 (azorius signet, sakura-tribe elder, steam vents, birds, and dimir aqueduct (which can be especially sick with treachery)), so we might be able to move into blue at this point and only play 3 or 4 islands, but then how much blue in addition to treachery can we realistically expect from our next 3 picks, and what terrible manabase would we be running, since azorius signet with terminate and hero of oxid ridge is kind of a nonbo. Sure, splashing for treachery might seem sweet, but I think it would make our deck less consistent and a bit weaker overall. Therefore, I vote for Pile 3 at the moment, since it gives us some more answers in pulse and k-grip, a great manafixer/beater, and a wasteland for value. You guys can probably come up with a good argument for taking the treachery, but right now I like just taking the biggest pile that also happens to include a bunch of cards we wouldn't be unhappy to play.
From the looks of things we need to really focus in on what it is we are doing. I think we should abandon black and blue and just go for a naya midrange deck. We have a lot of support for those three colors and I think we can pull it together. I am going pile 3 because it has some good green cards we can use. Pile 2 would have been my second pick because of accorder paladin and char.
I vote pile 2.
Edit: I agree with the argument kcollaran made so I switched from 3 to 2.
I'm coming late to this, but it looks like too much fun to miss entirely. If I can come in halfway thought and vote, I'll agree with pick redacted.
What the heck are we doing with this draft, though? The good cards are spread all over the place. Naya midrange seems the most likely, as others have said, but stuff like R/bw aggro are still possible. (Except that merl is going to keep grabbing red aggro, I guess...) And blue seems very "open", although I'm not sure what that means in a Winchester draft. Sigh.
I had gone with Pile 3, but on reading the post below retracted the pick. If we'd only play Wasteland and maybe the Grip, than I agree that Pile 2 might be better...
From the looks of things we need to really focus in on what it is we are doing. I think we should abandon black and blue and just go for a naya midrange deck. We have a lot of support for those three colors and I think we can pull it together. I am going pile 3 because it has some good green cards we can use. Pile 2 would have been my second pick because of accorder paladin and char.
I vote pile 3.
Not for merl spoiler
If you think we ought to go for Naya then the pick is pile 2. Hurricane isn't relevant and K.Grip while good isn't really that crucial to pick up. And wasteland while awesome is maybe not the easiest play for our deck. I'd rather pick up two cards that are better for that deck and also cut the best card in the pack.
If we want to play our white cards and go naya, I think we should just go all the way and play 4 color, splashing black for terminate and maelstrom pulse, since we have enough black fixing to do so. However, I'm not even sure if we can realistically play our naya cards, since we don't have the fixing necessary to play them and even 2 other colors, let alone 3. I mean, would you rather have a baneslayer and a pretty slow threat against a somewhat fast deck, or would you rather have 2 cheap-ish removal spells plus the wasteland and k-grip we would get from this pick? I say that if we pick up some sweet white fixing we should play our white bombs and just go 4 color if we need to, but I think that taking pile 3 will make for a more consistent deck on our part.
Just to comment on the way we'll be finishing this draft, we'll be picking 26 columns of picks, so I'll get first shot at the pile with the 26th column, then you guys will pick one of the three piles I rejected (without more cards added), then I take one, then you guys get the final pack.
So there will be 26 * 4 = 104 cards total drafted between us.
You guys have 3 more 'full' picks after this current one, and then the two 'leftover' picks to clean up.
I think you're a bit late to the party with that pick. Care to take another stab at the current options?
I'm waiting to finalize on this pick until I see a few arguments in favor of one or another. I'm currently leaning to pile 2 or 3.
My Cube Blog @theCubeMiser on Twitter
Yeah, I can see arguments for taking any of piles 1, 2, and 3. However, pile 2 doesn't really go with what we have now, and pile 3 is also kind of awkward -- right now we have a lot of aggressive cards in red and some in green and black, so vindicate is basically a gamble at this point and earthquake and watery grave both seem like a bit of a long shot for our final deck, but is it worth it for the pithing needle (which will hit masticore, greaves, and whatever equipment magicmerl picks up) and a few unexciting options? Pile 1 is actually kind of good for us right now, since it contains cards that are on color acceleration with what we have now, but if we are trying to go aggro, then why are we interested in a signet and a birds? Pile 1 might still be the pick, and I think it's where I'm leaning towards right now, but it just feels so bad to take those two cards over a vindicate and earthquake... maybe if we already had a kokusho or inferno titan to accelerate into I would be happier with that pick, but as it is I'm really torn here.
Well, godo is fine if you have some good equipment in your deck for him to fetch, and if you do have the cards to make him good he is really good, but I agree that he isn't the best card for our deck right now. Also, hokori is basically winter orb on a 2/2, which is pretty sweet in aggressive white decks, but I don't think he's the pick for us. And no, I don't think zuran orb is the best in cube either, but all three of them are probably better than you think they are.
Also, I might as well vote for Pile 1 now, since it's probably the best one for us to take and
Godo is probably ok if you have some good equipment with him, but he's hardly exciting, and the difference between Hokori and Winter Orb is humungous. None of them are uncubable, but I think they're all going to be amongst the worst cards in any cube they're in.
I take Pile 3.
Next pick.
Draft it on Cubetutor!
1 Wrath of God
1 Ajani Goldmane
1 Kargan Dragonlord
1 Koth of the Hammer
1 Ghitu Slinger
1 Ingot Chewer
1 Hero of Oxid Ridge
1 Pyroclasm
1 Hearth Kami
1 Wild Mongrel
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Wickerbough Elder
1 Vesuvan Shapeshifter
1 Force of Will
1 Dark Confidant
1 Fume Spitter
1 Azorius Signet
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Steam Vents
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Cloudgoat Ranger
1 Baneslayer Angel
whereas he has:
1 Jackal Pup
1 Hell's Thunder
1 Earthquake
1 Vengevine
1 Thornling
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Forbid
1 Remand
1 Kird Ape
1 Rakdos Guildmage
1 Wild Nacatl
1 Vindicate
1 Pithing Needle
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Mind Stone
1 Porcelain Legionaire
1 Mutavault
1 Ankh of Mishra
1 Squee, Goblin Nabob
1 Masticore
1 Boros Signet
1 Mox Jet
1 Watery Grave
1 Zuran Orb
1 Hokori, Dust Drinker
1 Prismatic Lens
1 Sun Titan
My current major concern is that we have no idea what kind of deck he will be fielding. Since we (foolishly) let him get so many colorless cards, he is still flexible in color and archetype. His cards appear to lean toward aggro, but he could morph to midrange at any point. Red aggro would all but make Dark Confidant terrible, which is currently 90% of the reason we are thinking about running black.
We might want to think about going WRG midrange on him (if it appears he's going aggro). We need to luck into some more fixing in those colors though.
My Cube Blog @theCubeMiser on Twitter
I do indeed take Godo in Pile 2 (with another random Mox, how lucky). There's alot of white and not alot of blue in this draft.
Your pick.
Edit: p.s. Are *all* your spoiler tags still confidential? Or only say discussions of the current pick? (I haven't peeked at any of them but I must confess to being powerful curious).
@magicmerl: you can read anything I put in this spoiler and previous spoilers
I can assure you, I will continue to draft artifacts, despite your wicked wicked plan to destroy said artifacts. Speaking of which, Wurmcoil Engine is an artifact, and technically I have 'baggsed' them. You should leave pile 1 for me.
{Shakes fist}
I reluctantly take Pile 4.
Your pick.
From the looks of things we need to really focus in on what it is we are doing. I think we should abandon black and blue and just go for a naya midrange deck. We have a lot of support for those three colors and I think we can pull it together. I am going pile 3 because it has some good green cards we can use. Pile 2 would have been my second pick because of accorder paladin and char.
I vote pile 2.
Edit: I agree with the argument kcollaran made so I switched from 3 to 2.
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I had gone with Pile 3, but on reading the post below retracted the pick. If we'd only play Wasteland and maybe the Grip, than I agree that Pile 2 might be better...
My $40 MTGO cube
Draft my cube at Cubetutor!
Not for merl spoiler
I vote for Pile 2.
So there will be 26 * 4 = 104 cards total drafted between us.
You guys have 3 more 'full' picks after this current one, and then the two 'leftover' picks to clean up.