I wanted the feedback of all the cube community and all cube owners : what do you think of 2 cards combos or adding a combo element that fits with one or more cards naturally in a cube ? Keep in mind that i allways Salomon draft my cube (allmost never booster draft it). The combos i consider are :
- Painter's Servant (which is okay wit several other cards of my cube such as REB/Pyroblast and Guttural Response) + Grindstone
- Power artefact (which is all right on his own with alot of artefacts in my cube) + Basalth monolith
- Goblin Charbelcher + Mana Severance
- Adding Zuran orb (that combo well with Fastbond and Crucible)
- Adding Juniper Order Ranger (to the persist combo theme, as kitchen flinks, murderous redcap are allready in cube, such as scrifice outlet like Mirror Entity and greater Gargadon)
- Time Vault + Ring of Brighthearth
- Umbral Mantle (good with any creature that got an activated ability on its own) to complete the Metalworker combo allready in my cube (Staff of domination)
- Protean Hulk, for the reveillark combo (Flash is good enough on its own and allready in the Cube)
- Static Orb, which is okay on its own, and combo well with icy manipulator, Glare of Subdual and Opposition (Tap it end of turn, and lock your opponent)
- Worldgorger Dragon, which combo well with Animate spells.
- Illusionnary Mask + Phyrexian dreadnought (with Stifle, Trickbind ans Voidslime allready in the Cube)
Other cards i consider adding and i'd like your opinion on, if any of you tested them :
Magus of the moon and Price of Progress, to punish multicolored decks
I'm part of Arc-Slogger's cube group, and we include a lot of the cards you have mentioned. However, you have to keep in mind that combo pieces have to be at least decent by themselves in order to include 2-3 piece combos in your cube. For example, Painter's Servant is a 1/3 for 2 mana, and it's colorless so you can play it in any deck without stretching your lands. But it's also really good with Blasts (i.e. Pyroblast etc), Protection from x color, Oona, etc. And Grindstone is a decent win-condition by itself, even if you just add it to your deck...especially considering Brain Freeze is also (very) playable in cube. So it's acceptable to use both in the cube. However, if you put Guttural Response in your cube, it's going to suck 99% of the time because Guttural Response is extremely conditional and it's already hard enough to make things like Blue Elemental Blast work.
As far as Magus of the Moon goes, I think it's pretty weak. You have to understand that Wasteland (which is an AMAZING card) is borderline-playable in cube-draft. The thing is, most draft decks in my cube have about 3-6 nonbasics, and that means Moon-Guy is not going to turn much off. He needs a critical number of non-basics on the opponent's side of the table in order to work, and it's hard to shut people off of colors when they have basics of all colors. On the flipside, Fulminator Mage and Wasteland are both solid playables in cube because LD is always useful. A lot of cube-drafting involves playing 3-5 color decks that run all the big, fat creatures and spells they can. Going for a simple, disruptive weenie plan is often all it takes to own face against the "good stuff" decks of cube.
Price of Progress--I have no idea how it works out in practicality, but it seems really hit-and-miss. Before adding it to your cube, draft your cube and think about all the times when it would be useful in your hand as opposed to a different card. Burn is important to have, but make sure it's potent or it won't get played.
In fact, the main goal of Magus of the Moon, in my mind, was not to be a denial component but more a way to deal with utility lands, such as academy ruins, Wolrath's Stonghold, Maze of Ith and Library of Alexandria. The denial part (cutting Fetchlnds and duals for a splash for example) would just be a bonus.
In fact, the main goal of Magus of the Moon, in my mind, was not to be a denial component but more a way to deal with utility lands, such as academy ruins, Wolrath's Stonghold, Maze of Ith and Library of Alexandria. The denial part (cutting Fetchlnds and duals for a splash for example) would just be a bonus.
If that's the case then it is a very easy to remove 2/2. Reminds me of how bad Raking Canopy is against faeries in standard. If you just want to shut down utility lands, play Blood Moon or Wasteland.
You have to understand that Wasteland (which is an AMAZING card) is borderline-playable in cube-draft.
I'm gonna go ahead and disagree with this statement strongly. Wasteland is a card that is HUGE disruption in our Cube, and the only reason it doesn't see more play is the fact that a lot of people don't feel as though they can have the non-colored mana source in their 3+ color decks or control decks (even though I like to count cards like wasteland and strip mine as a spell). I can't count how many times a 2nd or 3rd turn Wasteland on a bounceland wins the game.
Magus of the moon is also a fine addition, as he is at least a beater from the streeter at his worst, and a complete kick in the junk at its best. With how important non-basics can be in a deck, I've not been disappointed.
As far as other combos go, we have a lot of naturally-occuring combos in our cube (goblind welder/mindslaver, recurring nightmare/palinchron, e.g.) made up of other good cards. I try to avoid putting cards in the Cube that have no real merit on their own (or limited applications) without the complimentary combo card. For example, we have Isochron Scepter but no Chant (cause chant by itself isn't all that spectacular as a 1-of), Charbelcher but no Severence (who would draft severence w/o the belcher?), etc.
I think your cube is larger than mine, and I think that makes it even more difficult to spike the correct combo cards instead of winding up with a pile of cards that contains:
Rings of Brightearth
Orim's Chant
Mana Severence
Juniper Order Ranger
Mizzium Transreliquat
Pandemonium
Donate
High Tide
Reset
Crypt Champion
Vanilla dudes and lands
I do like Painter's Servant as a card though...hmm...
Kiki-jiki/Pestermite/Skyhussar
Palinchron/Recurring Nightmare/Lands that tap for more than 1(like academy or perhaps with a mirari's wake)
Black Lotus/Aurioch Salvagers
Palinchron/Recurring Nightmare/Lands that tap for more than 1(like academy or perhaps with a mirari's wake)
You just need 7 or more mana available from lands...palinchron triggers every time in, and only costs you 6 mana to bring back each time (2 playings of recurring nightmare, once for pali in and once for pali out). 6 mana will get you infinite creature CIPs, but for inf mana you need 7.
I couldn't agree more with Antknee42. Wasteland like Strip Mine is a huge game breaker most of the time when you are playing aggro. Hell even in control decks it can be insanely strong.
Neonico : I think there are a lot of combo's in your deck, game winning ones, and I prefer less combo's, but it's just a matter of personal taste.
I do have Reveillark combo's, Words of worship and Yawgmoth's Bargain (1:draw 4) and Time Vault + Mizzium Transreliquat.
About that last one, how does Rings works out in your cube ? I prefer Mizzium atm since it can copy any other artifact.
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Actually, from testings, the only actual use of Ring has been Double slaver lock in 2vs2 But i prefered rings because it can be used with alot more cards in the stack.
But Mezzium can't do the dual slaver lock Plus Mezzium got a color requirement that i dont really like, i wanted as many colorless combo as possible to help some mono color alternate strategies.
But Mezzium stays on my watch list and should be integrated i think.
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- Painter's Servant (which is okay wit several other cards of my cube such as REB/Pyroblast and Guttural Response) + Grindstone
- Power artefact (which is all right on his own with alot of artefacts in my cube) + Basalth monolith
- Goblin Charbelcher + Mana Severance
- Adding Zuran orb (that combo well with Fastbond and Crucible)
- Adding Juniper Order Ranger (to the persist combo theme, as kitchen flinks, murderous redcap are allready in cube, such as scrifice outlet like Mirror Entity and greater Gargadon)
- Time Vault + Ring of Brighthearth
- Umbral Mantle (good with any creature that got an activated ability on its own) to complete the Metalworker combo allready in my cube (Staff of domination)
- Protean Hulk, for the reveillark combo (Flash is good enough on its own and allready in the Cube)
- Static Orb, which is okay on its own, and combo well with icy manipulator, Glare of Subdual and Opposition (Tap it end of turn, and lock your opponent)
- Worldgorger Dragon, which combo well with Animate spells.
- Illusionnary Mask + Phyrexian dreadnought (with Stifle, Trickbind ans Voidslime allready in the Cube)
Other cards i consider adding and i'd like your opinion on, if any of you tested them :
Magus of the moon and Price of Progress, to punish multicolored decks
As far as Magus of the Moon goes, I think it's pretty weak. You have to understand that Wasteland (which is an AMAZING card) is borderline-playable in cube-draft. The thing is, most draft decks in my cube have about 3-6 nonbasics, and that means Moon-Guy is not going to turn much off. He needs a critical number of non-basics on the opponent's side of the table in order to work, and it's hard to shut people off of colors when they have basics of all colors. On the flipside, Fulminator Mage and Wasteland are both solid playables in cube because LD is always useful. A lot of cube-drafting involves playing 3-5 color decks that run all the big, fat creatures and spells they can. Going for a simple, disruptive weenie plan is often all it takes to own face against the "good stuff" decks of cube.
Price of Progress--I have no idea how it works out in practicality, but it seems really hit-and-miss. Before adding it to your cube, draft your cube and think about all the times when it would be useful in your hand as opposed to a different card. Burn is important to have, but make sure it's potent or it won't get played.
If that's the case then it is a very easy to remove 2/2. Reminds me of how bad Raking Canopy is against faeries in standard. If you just want to shut down utility lands, play Blood Moon or Wasteland.
I'm gonna go ahead and disagree with this statement strongly. Wasteland is a card that is HUGE disruption in our Cube, and the only reason it doesn't see more play is the fact that a lot of people don't feel as though they can have the non-colored mana source in their 3+ color decks or control decks (even though I like to count cards like wasteland and strip mine as a spell). I can't count how many times a 2nd or 3rd turn Wasteland on a bounceland wins the game.
Magus of the moon is also a fine addition, as he is at least a beater from the streeter at his worst, and a complete kick in the junk at its best. With how important non-basics can be in a deck, I've not been disappointed.
As far as other combos go, we have a lot of naturally-occuring combos in our cube (goblind welder/mindslaver, recurring nightmare/palinchron, e.g.) made up of other good cards. I try to avoid putting cards in the Cube that have no real merit on their own (or limited applications) without the complimentary combo card. For example, we have Isochron Scepter but no Chant (cause chant by itself isn't all that spectacular as a 1-of), Charbelcher but no Severence (who would draft severence w/o the belcher?), etc.
I think your cube is larger than mine, and I think that makes it even more difficult to spike the correct combo cards instead of winding up with a pile of cards that contains:
Rings of Brightearth
Orim's Chant
Mana Severence
Juniper Order Ranger
Mizzium Transreliquat
Pandemonium
Donate
High Tide
Reset
Crypt Champion
Vanilla dudes and lands
I do like Painter's Servant as a card though...hmm...
-AA
I use descriptive language. Assume that I'm being nice and respectful. (I'll tell you when I'm not.)
My Cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9029
Palinchron/Recurring Nightmare/Lands that tap for more than 1(like academy or perhaps with a mirari's wake)
Black Lotus/Aurioch Salvagers
You just need 7 or more mana available from lands...palinchron triggers every time in, and only costs you 6 mana to bring back each time (2 playings of recurring nightmare, once for pali in and once for pali out). 6 mana will get you infinite creature CIPs, but for inf mana you need 7.
-AA
I use descriptive language. Assume that I'm being nice and respectful. (I'll tell you when I'm not.)
My Cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9029
I do have Reveillark combo's, Words of worship and Yawgmoth's Bargain (1:draw 4) and Time Vault + Mizzium Transreliquat.
About that last one, how does Rings works out in your cube ? I prefer Mizzium atm since it can copy any other artifact.
"Everybody dies, Tracey. Someone's carrying a bullet for you right now, doesn't even know it. The trick is to die of old age before it finds you."
My
540> 360 Powered CubeBut Mezzium can't do the dual slaver lock Plus Mezzium got a color requirement that i dont really like, i wanted as many colorless combo as possible to help some mono color alternate strategies.
But Mezzium stays on my watch list and should be integrated i think.