It seems opinions on this card vary wildly. This thread goes back to 2012 and the recent discussion in the random card thread (4 years later) is more of the same.
Some cards simply have to tested, especially ones with very high ceilings/low floors like Gorf. How well they perform will be a combination of cube lists, player preferences (and in some cases skill level). I think there are some posters who assume differences of opinion are always a case of skill level / understanding. But this game is far too deep and complex for that to be true.
If Gorf were cheaper, I'd say it's a card all cubers should probably physically test out. Relying on opinions of others is going to be a poor measure of how well this card does in your group. That is the bottom line here. That said, with prices where they are, unless you proxy I personally don't think this card is worth including. Primarily because there are other aggressive cards you could run. It is not irreplaceable as an effect (even if other options technically have a lower ceiling - at the end of the day Gorf is just a big dumb beater).
As someone else mentioned in the random card thread, Sylvan Advocate does a pretty reasonable impersonation of Gorf at a fraction of the price point. It also has a much higher floor and a more predictable ceiling making it the more consistent option (even if that ceiling is a tad lower).
The way I see it is that the average non-powered cube has probably $3000ish worth of cards, depending on if the duals are CE or not. And if you look at it, most cube cards are under $25. Most cards costing more than $25 have unique effects that stand out: Liliana of the Veil, Bitterblossom, Bob, Jitte, Crucible, Survival of the Fittest, Karn, Natural Order, Sneak Attack, Snapcaster, Clique, Jace, fetches and duals, Hierarch to some extent, etc. Goyf is one of the most expensive cards in an unpowered cube, and you could sell one and buy 4+ other of the expensive, $25+ cards and shore up lots of other areas. I mean, what replaces Karn, Survival, or Bob? Whereas there are other green beaters that are 90% as good as Goyf.
So yeah, Goyf is a great and efficient card, but it's pretty low on my priority list. Actually, it's at the bottom of it. It's the last $125 I'd spend on my cube, because it's way more replaceable at the same cost than the others I've mentioned.
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It is definitely a low-priority effect to obtain because all it is ...is an efficient beater. The effect is largely replaceable because of that.
However, if you have one available, or use proxies, there's no reason not to run it, IMHO. It's still probably the most mana-efficient fixed-cost creature in the history of Magic. Even in the mid/late game, mana-efficiency is still important; especially for the decks that really want Tarmogoyf.
I ended up cutting mine for Sylvan Advocate as it was too boring. Sylvan Advocate is interesting if you are running all 10 dual-man-lands along with some of the other colorless man-lands.
Now that you can pick up a Tarmogoyf for $70ish, is there anyone who had cost issues with this card who'll now run it?
I bought one MM17 booster pack and before I opened it, though about whether I'd run Goyf if I cracked one. I concluded I'd trade it for other, much more needed cube stuff. Then I got an Extractor Demon in my pack, making the whole thing moot.
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Now that you can pick up a Tarmogoyf for $70ish, is there anyone who had cost issues with this card who'll now run it?
I bought one MM17 booster pack and before I opened it, though about whether I'd run Goyf if I cracked one. I concluded I'd trade it for other, much more needed cube stuff. Then I got an Extractor Demon in my pack, making the whole thing moot.
haha i had a similar experience today except i cracked a full box of MM and didn't get a lili, snapcaster, goyf or even a single fetch land.
I am looking to add goyf now that the price point has dropped. still hoping to crack one though, just to say i did!
Now that you can pick up a Tarmogoyf for $70ish, is there anyone who had cost issues with this card who'll now run it?
I bought one MM17 booster pack and before I opened it, though about whether I'd run Goyf if I cracked one. I concluded I'd trade it for other, much more needed cube stuff.
Well, there are a lot more important things to obtain than 'Goyf. It's probably worth trading it for truly irreplaceable effects. That being said, once those cards are obtained, 'Goyf is still good, and you'll probably wanna pick one up for the cube at some point, so it may just be easier to keep one if you open it.
I faced a similar quandary when I cracked a 'Goyf in MM15. It wouldn't have been hard to trade it off to get a Bob, a Clique, and more that were more essential cube staples. I decided to keep and run it, because although it may not be as exciting a card as some of the less expensive staples, the opportunity might not come up again for years to come if ever. 'Goyf is not an insane cube card, but it is a very good cube card as well as an iconic card that I and my players don't actually have much oppprtunity to play outside of cube drafts.
I wouldn't have prioritized it either, but since I pulled it, I'm glad I kept it.
I'm not a huge goyf fan. It's hard to fill up your GY early to make it worth the early play, and even when it lands you can't consistently protect it like you can in constructed which is part of the main strength. FWIW we don't really run a dedicated green aggro package, but even in our midrange decks it was too slow and then too plain when it hit a point where it was big enough.
Goyf slots really well into Upheaval / Wildfire decks, which is a big edge over Sylvan Advocate. I also like cheap finishers that I can cast while keeping counter mana up. Plus, being green = Natural Order fodder. Goyf is no lynchpinn, but it can fit into any green deck.
Goyf plays great for us, being a mid-game 3/4-4/5 for 1G is nothing to scoff at, even in non-aggro green decks. It's just a great power:cost ratio, which green is always happy to bolster.
We play goyf without green aggro support and the card is still strong. I think it is better in midrange than aggro actually, as goyf is often lacking on turn two.
Goyf was too finicky for me. Im not saying its a bad card, because its obviously powerful, but Sylvan Advocate does alot more IMO. It fits well in ramp list, it has synergy with man lands, advocates worst case is better than goyfs worst, and I find it easier to hit advocates best case aswell.
I don't see why. It's such an efficient beatstick and it's one of the few 2-drops that just gets better as the game goes one. But, I don't run a 360 so maybe you could cut it.
Goyf is still really strong and has got a lot more interesting with the advent of better discard outlets, new Delve cards, incidental graveyard hate and flashback/snappy effects. Even though it's just a vanilla body after all, it's got more intrigue at least than the plethora of ETB vanilla body creatures once in play.
If all you ever do in green is ramp, 'Goyf is expendable. But if any of your green decks involve using the red zone, it's still a very solid inclusion for both aggro and midrange decks.
Goyf has been pretty decent for us, a 2 mana 4/5 can be a real pain to deal with in combat and I'm usually not too annoyed if my opponent is using valuable removal on my 2 drops, especially one that isn't integral to my game plan. It's worth noting that if you play multiplayer it gets even more reliably big.
It's not the most interesting card in my cube and I could happily cut it if something more fun came along but for now I'm happy with it as an under-costed beater.
Goyf's always been a lower pick for me, but still occasionally strong enough in some decks that I considered it a staple in cube. Which is why I was surprised to see it removed from the average 360. I know people have been flirting with the idea of taking out Goyf for years now, but I didn't foresee a day when enough people would cut it to drop it out of the average cube. Green 3cmcs have definitely been improving over the last few years, which may account for that, but I feel Green 2cmcs are still fairly light on competition.
We cut goyf a long time ago. Yeah, it gets big, probably the biggest possible 2 drop in cube(?), but our green decks never wanted it outside of blue moon scenarios.
I think instead of axing one of the best green cards there ever has been you might want to start drafting a much larger Cube to get maybe more variety it's a great card but I've never seen it take over games it might let people get a amazing head start but it dies to removal like a lot of creatures do
It's not as good as it is in constructed, but it's still good in the same kinds of decks. If you play shells that function similarly to how Jund/Abzan do in constructed, 'Goyf is still a very good creature, and a worthy inclusion. But if all your green section ever does is ramp, it's expendable.
Some cards simply have to tested, especially ones with very high ceilings/low floors like Gorf. How well they perform will be a combination of cube lists, player preferences (and in some cases skill level). I think there are some posters who assume differences of opinion are always a case of skill level / understanding. But this game is far too deep and complex for that to be true.
If Gorf were cheaper, I'd say it's a card all cubers should probably physically test out. Relying on opinions of others is going to be a poor measure of how well this card does in your group. That is the bottom line here. That said, with prices where they are, unless you proxy I personally don't think this card is worth including. Primarily because there are other aggressive cards you could run. It is not irreplaceable as an effect (even if other options technically have a lower ceiling - at the end of the day Gorf is just a big dumb beater).
As someone else mentioned in the random card thread, Sylvan Advocate does a pretty reasonable impersonation of Gorf at a fraction of the price point. It also has a much higher floor and a more predictable ceiling making it the more consistent option (even if that ceiling is a tad lower).
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/modular-cube-5-colors.800/
Retro combo cube thread
http://riptidelab.com/forum/threads/retro-combo-cube.1454/
So yeah, Goyf is a great and efficient card, but it's pretty low on my priority list. Actually, it's at the bottom of it. It's the last $125 I'd spend on my cube, because it's way more replaceable at the same cost than the others I've mentioned.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
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However, if you have one available, or use proxies, there's no reason not to run it, IMHO. It's still probably the most mana-efficient fixed-cost creature in the history of Magic. Even in the mid/late game, mana-efficiency is still important; especially for the decks that really want Tarmogoyf.
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I bought one MM17 booster pack and before I opened it, though about whether I'd run Goyf if I cracked one. I concluded I'd trade it for other, much more needed cube stuff. Then I got an Extractor Demon in my pack, making the whole thing moot.
EDH: UGEdric
Pauper: UR Delver
Modern: UGR Delver
Draft my cube: Eric's 390 Unpowered
haha i had a similar experience today except i cracked a full box of MM and didn't get a lili, snapcaster, goyf or even a single fetch land.
I am looking to add goyf now that the price point has dropped. still hoping to crack one though, just to say i did!
Well, there are a lot more important things to obtain than 'Goyf. It's probably worth trading it for truly irreplaceable effects. That being said, once those cards are obtained, 'Goyf is still good, and you'll probably wanna pick one up for the cube at some point, so it may just be easier to keep one if you open it.
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I wouldn't have prioritized it either, but since I pulled it, I'm glad I kept it.
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It's not the most interesting card in my cube and I could happily cut it if something more fun came along but for now I'm happy with it as an under-costed beater.
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