If we get some more madness stuff or maybe some more BG aggro stuff this guy could be a really decent 2 drop. I love that the zombies in cube are coming together naturally.
I don't like the Hellbent mechanic design wise. When you have no business spells in hand and can't even bluff something by keeping a land/blank in your hand, you need a high impact effect to get you back into the game, not just something above average.
I would say that drawing 2 spells per turn is a high impact effect when you're hellbent.
The same argument could be made about a bunch of different cards though, it's just the nature of the game and drawing random cards. When in topdeck mode the best possible thing I can be doing is drawing cards so I have more chances of drawing what I need. On the other hand of your argument this guy doubles your chances of drawing good stuff when in topdeck mode, which happens pretty often in aggro decks, and can be manipulated to happen quite easily in black. I plan on testing this guy big time.
Plays good with the Masticores as well
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EDIT: Totally just realized his ability triggers on every draw and not just during the draw phase. That's stronger than I thought!
I'm definitely intrigued by this card, though I'm still doubtful. I do want more black 2-drops, and it interacts with a lot of existing black cards/strategies. I imagine this card's power will depend mostly on context, how it fits in with each person's black section. For someone who supports black aggro and pox, I could see this making the cut. This is definitely the type of black card I want to see them print.
2 spells per turn would be awesome, but this card only gives you ~ half a spell each turn and even less over multiple turns, since the double land draw temporarily stops hellbent.
It can. But if I can rip two lands off the top of my deck, it's still a hell of a lot batter than waiting 2 turns to draw both of those lands.
And it triggers off of draw that's not during your draw step too, which is occasionally cool.
If you draw two cards off this guy he's well worth it. That doesn't seem like an unreasonable expectation for the decks that will play him. I'll be giving him a try for sure.
When I see Healing Salve, I'm often like "Oh girl, I wish I could turn every card into this." Thanks they removed the gain life part, otherwise this would have been broken.
Also, the potential for having a card advantage engine is probably going to be a factor in about as many games as actually drawing cards will be. My masterful abuse of card advantage has caused my playgroup to paint targets on just about every CA engine I land on the table. I'm sure others here have similar experiences.
I like it when I can get my opponent to 1-1 a removal spell on my 2 drop
I'm trying to hold back from making hyperbolic statements that I might regret, but I can't see how this is any less than bonkers. I feel like people made the some of these complaints about confidant - a 2/1 for 1B card advantage engine is good enough for me to not complain about it not being 100% battle ready. Prudence be dammed, I have a lot of fun dumping my hand playing aggro decks. As mentioned before, baiting a removal spell out for it and leaving a beater alive is fine with me. I'll be making room for this in my 360 and snagging up copies of this whenever possible.
The "double land problem" increases in relevancy the longer the card stays on the table.
The first turn after you got hellbent, it does not matter at all.
The second turn, you are already only expecting to draw 0.38 spells instead of 0.5 (~25% worse).
The third turn, you are down to 0.31 instead of 0.5 spells (~40% worse).
With situational cards (like removal) or not being able to cast multiple spells because of their total amount of mana or combined color requirements, that numbers should be even worse.
Outside of Constructed you are less likely to empty your hand before turn 6 (turn 5 otp) unless there is some fast mana involved, which makes me question myself whether or not the card is even as good as Graveborn Muse for Cube.
I don't understand this reasoning at all. I empty my hand all the time in aggressive decks. How many cards do you want to draw off a 2cc 2/1 before its good?
When I see Healing Salve, I'm often like "Oh girl, I wish I could turn every card into this." Thanks they removed the gain life part, otherwise this would have been broken.
I don't understand this reasoning at all. I empty my hand all the time in aggressive decks. How many cards do you want to draw off a 2cc 2/1 before its good?
He's just saying that when people say that it's a bob that comes online and stays online after you empty your hand initially, that's not true all the time. It doesn't mean that it's not a good card.
This card is either going to be a staple or go the way of the Masked Admirers.
Pretty much this.
@Black or Red? More like Black AND Red.
Honestly though, you are rewarded to put the pedal to the metal. Dump and overextend because you'll draw back everything. If you land him AND confidant...omg card advantage.
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I mean, hell, we're all on a forum for something that most people would describe as a "children's card game"...do what makes you happy. You are never too old to enjoy yourself.
This card success hinges on how often it actually turns on. Otherwise, its a bland 2/1 for 2 that is sub-par when you play it on curve (do you really want to drop him early and follow it up with pox and braids, etc...?). If I had to guess, your going to set up his ability 10-20% of the time, casting him as your last card in hand, and most of those times he will provoke an answer (although I don't mind my opponents wasting spells on a 2 drop).
What I mean to say - needs a lot of testing. But I think its going to flop =(.
My playgroup is pretty stoked to play this guy. We've been talking about him today. A 2-power beater for 2-mana, that's a Zombie, that goes Arena mode when hellbent (which black aggro/Pox/Stax do all the time? Sweet deal. We're looking forward to seeing him in action.
I definitely think this guy warrants testing. He's a 2 CC 2 power guy (never seem to get enough of those for some reason) that has a very real potential upside. There is very little downside in this guy, unless you don't like 2 costed 2 power guys and there are times where he can run away with games.
This card success hinges on how often it actually turns on. Otherwise, its a bland 2/1 for 2 that is sub-par when you play it on curve (do you really want to drop him early and follow it up with pox and braids, etc...?). If I had to guess, your going to set up his ability 10-20% of the time, casting him as your last card in hand, and most of those times he will provoke an answer (although I don't mind my opponents wasting spells on a 2 drop).
What I mean to say - needs a lot of testing. But I think its going to flop =(.
Could also be a card that hinges upon play/draw. You want nothing in your hand with him out. Also gets dynamic with blitz aggro strategies and pairs well with, say, liliana of the veil's discard effect. Wild mongrel and even tog play well with this guy. Lots to check out.
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I mean, hell, we're all on a forum for something that most people would describe as a "children's card game"...do what makes you happy. You are never too old to enjoy yourself.
What I found after testing him yesterday is that you can't rely on your memory to reveal how often he'll trigger. Without him in your hand/deck or in play, it's never been advantageous to go hellbent. So we sandbag lands and get picky with spell timings. All of that changes when you can have a 2-power Arena beatdown dude available. In testing yesterday (which was admittedly limited) I was able to resolve him 4 times in a long best of 7 series. 2 of those times he just ate removal or traded in combat (which happens, and on a 2-drop, I don't care). The other two times he was able to go hellbent with relative ease. Once, it was too late for him to help me, and even though I drew 2 cards (1 extra one), I didn't hit my out and I lost the game (oh well, I would've lost anyways). The second time he was a topdeck in the mid-late game when I had one land and one other spell in my hand. I was able to cast my Searing Spear, play my land and resolve him hellbent. He drew me 3 cards that game before I completely buried my opponent with CA.
My verdict so far is that this guy is pretty good. If he eats removal or trades in combat, oh well. He was only a 2-drop, and dodging removal is not a hurdle they have to leap. But the rest of the time is what I was trying to pay attention to. I drew 4 cards in the 2 games that he survived in yesterday, and that's pretty bonkers for a 2-mana creature. What I wanted, was to see if he could average drawing 1 card per game in instances where he doesn't get killed in the early game. If he could do that, I felt like he would play like a 2-mana Zombie version of Phyrexian Rager, and that would be just fine with me. So far, he's played better than that. Averaging +1 CA over all his games, even those where he was killed by removal or in combat.
I am not calling Graveborn Muse a bad card, but it does not come close to the power level of Dark Confidant, which was the only card the card has been compared with so far.
Yeah this guy is no Bob, just for the pure fact you don't get the consistent card advantage, and this guy has the strong possibility of just being a 2/1 and nothing more. Bob is easier to build around due to he is more efficient based on your decks curve. This guy does need some support cards to really shine, and also depends on the current board state to empty your hand to get effect (You may have a cheap deck, but let's not lie here, you might just being sitting on a removal card in hand, and there isn't any targets just as an example.). Another problem I have with this guy is that to turn him on if you played him 2nd turn, you might find that you would be making bad plays to do so. As such this guy I see being played later on the curve than his mana alot's for. Not the biggest problem, but still should effect how you evaluate him.
Anyways, I think he shows promise, depending on his consistency in testing, but I'm not so sure about how well he will apply. If I had to hazard a guess I'm going to say that he will be just below the performance threshold that he needs to be at to garner a slot in most cubes. Sometimes he will turn on and be amazing, but most other times he's gonna be a 2/1 that stay's a 2/1,
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I would say that drawing 2 spells per turn is a high impact effect when you're hellbent.
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Plays good with the Masticores as well
Also, the art is baller.
EDIT: Totally just realized his ability triggers on every draw and not just during the draw phase. That's stronger than I thought!
Edit: also, I love the flavor text.
It can. But if I can rip two lands off the top of my deck, it's still a hell of a lot batter than waiting 2 turns to draw both of those lands.
And it triggers off of draw that's not during your draw step too, which is occasionally cool.
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I like it when I can get my opponent to 1-1 a removal spell on my 2 drop
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I don't understand this reasoning at all. I empty my hand all the time in aggressive decks. How many cards do you want to draw off a 2cc 2/1 before its good?
He's just saying that when people say that it's a bob that comes online and stays online after you empty your hand initially, that's not true all the time. It doesn't mean that it's not a good card.
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Pretty much this.
@Black or Red? More like Black AND Red.
Honestly though, you are rewarded to put the pedal to the metal. Dump and overextend because you'll draw back everything. If you land him AND confidant...omg card advantage.
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What I mean to say - needs a lot of testing. But I think its going to flop =(.
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Could also be a card that hinges upon play/draw. You want nothing in your hand with him out. Also gets dynamic with blitz aggro strategies and pairs well with, say, liliana of the veil's discard effect. Wild mongrel and even tog play well with this guy. Lots to check out.
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My verdict so far is that this guy is pretty good. If he eats removal or trades in combat, oh well. He was only a 2-drop, and dodging removal is not a hurdle they have to leap. But the rest of the time is what I was trying to pay attention to. I drew 4 cards in the 2 games that he survived in yesterday, and that's pretty bonkers for a 2-mana creature. What I wanted, was to see if he could average drawing 1 card per game in instances where he doesn't get killed in the early game. If he could do that, I felt like he would play like a 2-mana Zombie version of Phyrexian Rager, and that would be just fine with me. So far, he's played better than that. Averaging +1 CA over all his games, even those where he was killed by removal or in combat.
I have a good feeling about this creature.
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Yeah this guy is no Bob, just for the pure fact you don't get the consistent card advantage, and this guy has the strong possibility of just being a 2/1 and nothing more. Bob is easier to build around due to he is more efficient based on your decks curve. This guy does need some support cards to really shine, and also depends on the current board state to empty your hand to get effect (You may have a cheap deck, but let's not lie here, you might just being sitting on a removal card in hand, and there isn't any targets just as an example.). Another problem I have with this guy is that to turn him on if you played him 2nd turn, you might find that you would be making bad plays to do so. As such this guy I see being played later on the curve than his mana alot's for. Not the biggest problem, but still should effect how you evaluate him.
Anyways, I think he shows promise, depending on his consistency in testing, but I'm not so sure about how well he will apply. If I had to hazard a guess I'm going to say that he will be just below the performance threshold that he needs to be at to garner a slot in most cubes. Sometimes he will turn on and be amazing, but most other times he's gonna be a 2/1 that stay's a 2/1,
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