What I found after testing him yesterday is that you can't rely on your memory to reveal how often he'll trigger. Without him in your hand/deck or in play, it's never been advantageous to go hellbent. So we sandbag lands and get picky with spell timings. All of that changes when you can have a 2-power Arena beatdown dude available. In testing yesterday (which was admittedly limited) I was able to resolve him 4 times in a long best of 7 series. 2 of those times he just ate removal or traded in combat (which happens, and on a 2-drop, I don't care). The other two times he was able to go hellbent with relative ease. Once, it was too late for him to help me, and even though I drew 2 cards (1 extra one), I didn't hit my out and I lost the game (oh well, I would've lost anyways). The second time he was a topdeck in the mid-late game when I had one land and one other spell in my hand. I was able to cast my Searing Spear, play my land and resolve him hellbent. He drew me 3 cards that game before I completely buried my opponent with CA.
My verdict so far is that this guy is pretty good. If he eats removal or trades in combat, oh well. He was only a 2-drop, and dodging removal is not a hurdle they have to leap. But the rest of the time is what I was trying to pay attention to. I drew 4 cards in the 2 games that he survived in yesterday, and that's pretty bonkers for a 2-mana creature. What I wanted, was to see if he could average drawing 1 card per game in instances where he doesn't get killed in the early game. If he could do that, I felt like he would play like a 2-mana Zombie version of Phyrexian Rager, and that would be just fine with me. So far, he's played better than that. Averaging +1 CA over all his games, even those where he was killed by removal or in combat.
I have a good feeling about this creature.
Thanks for the in-depth feedback. I'm planning on trying him myself; he should fit in well with my ultra-low black curve. Being a black Silvergill Adept on average would be insane, so worse than that is still fine in my books.
What I found after testing him yesterday is that you can't rely on your memory to reveal how often he'll trigger. Without him in your hand/deck or in play, it's never been advantageous to go hellbent. So we sandbag lands and get picky with spell timings. All of that changes when you can have a 2-power Arena beatdown dude available. In testing yesterday (which was admittedly limited) I was able to resolve him 4 times in a long best of 7 series. 2 of those times he just ate removal or traded in combat (which happens, and on a 2-drop, I don't care). The other two times he was able to go hellbent with relative ease. Once, it was too late for him to help me, and even though I drew 2 cards (1 extra one), I didn't hit my out and I lost the game (oh well, I would've lost anyways). The second time he was a topdeck in the mid-late game when I had one land and one other spell in my hand. I was able to cast my Searing Spear, play my land and resolve him hellbent. He drew me 3 cards that game before I completely buried my opponent with CA.
My verdict so far is that this guy is pretty good. If he eats removal or trades in combat, oh well. He was only a 2-drop, and dodging removal is not a hurdle they have to leap. But the rest of the time is what I was trying to pay attention to. I drew 4 cards in the 2 games that he survived in yesterday, and that's pretty bonkers for a 2-mana creature. What I wanted, was to see if he could average drawing 1 card per game in instances where he doesn't get killed in the early game. If he could do that, I felt like he would play like a 2-mana Zombie version of Phyrexian Rager, and that would be just fine with me. So far, he's played better than that. Averaging +1 CA over all his games, even those where he was killed by removal or in combat.
I have a good feeling about this creature.
Thanks for the breakdown!
Am having a really hard time evaluating this guy, so apreciate a semi-scientific testing.
I know he's at least decent, but trying to figure out if he's good in the average black agro or pox deck.
You play differently with him out or in your hand/deck. So the only way to see how often his ability will matter is to actually test him out. Going hellbent is really easy when you're not trying to avoid it like usual.
Yeah its been pretty easy in my testing so far. Unless you draw all your lands. One game trying to to hellbent I hit the first 9 land drops, while running 16 lands. Sucks to topdeck 2 lands from his trigger too...
You play differently with him out or in your hand/deck. So the only way to see how often his ability will matter is to actually test him out. Going hellbent is really easy when you're not trying to avoid it like usual.
What I wonder and have to ask is, is it beneficial to try to go hellbent? Like are the plays being made beneficial, especially when he's so fragile? I can see this not being so much the case with like Liliana or Pox, or other means to bring your hand down, but in cases where it is more aggresive, are you not leaving yourself open for making "bad" plays (obviously this is objective), when the response to you getting to hellbent could be to wrath the board (or kill him in any way).
I geuss my question is that does using him as a crutch to play more freely and blow you hand leave you too vulnerable? I honestly don't know the answer, and was just looking for the answer maybe through further testing.
Oh and thanks for the current update on how he's playing, good to see some test results. I want this guy to work out really bad even if I am skeptical
Instead of sandbagging lands, you just play them. Your deck will have a low curve, so it's easy to dump it fast and keep it low/empty in the midgame. It's worth giving up free information for a 2-mana Arena on legs.
This guy was solid enough for us tonight. He was never anything amazing. For the most part he was just a 2/1. I dont believe the player ever got any cards off him but since he was an aggressive deck he said he was perfectly happy running him.
I think that, in the end, he's going to be pretty good. He's not going to be lights out but he's going to fill a good roll and there will be games that he just does amazing things. Really, what more can you ask out of a 2 drop? Yes, yes, I know we are all spoiled in the world of Bobs and Goyfs and Snapcasters but this guy is still gonna be good. Him being a zombie certainly doesn't hurt either.
im looking at this as "draw one extra card, pay 1 life" .
I prefer phyrexian arena as I can play it early and still benefit on turn 2 or 3. This card requires at least to begin activation by turn 4.
I think he is good enough to replace some of the bad two drops like Vampire Interloper. Though I imagine this can lead players to dump their hand unnecessarily, when in fact being an early 2/1 beater is good enough.
I think he is good enough to replace some of the bad two drops like Vampire Interloper. Though I imagine this can lead players to dump their hand unnecessarily, when in fact being an early 2/1 beater is good enough.
I think people are overlooking the fact that a 2/1 is perfectly fine, though not exciting. Would we include him just as a vanilla 2/1, probably not, but the fact that he has a REAL upside and that he isn't always a dead top deck makes him playable if not a staple.
It continues to do well in testing. In the second draft he was involved in, he ate a Chain Lightning once, but the other two games he drew cards. Pretty awesome.
It continues to do well in testing. In the second draft he was involved in, he ate a Chain Lightning once, but the other two games he drew cards. Pretty awesome.
Great! A two-mana creature that can add "lightning rod" to its résumé usually has a decent chance of finding employment.
I also tested it last night, and my results mirror wtwlf's to a fairly high degree. He eats more than his fair share of removal because he carries a psychological risk of you emptying your hand, and he works very well in a red deck using its looting effects - you can sculpt your hand very easily in order to go hellbent in the shortest time possible. Triggering him once only is still beneficial, because you've either hit playables and restocked your hand a bit over a couple of turns, or partially cleared a land clump. He is basically being Silvergill Adept in that case. I'd recommend him at 360 for black aggro and/or Pox fans, but certainly not to people who eschew those packages.
If he eats removal, oh well. He's a 2-drop, and that's okay to do. If he doesn't, there's a very good chance that you'll be drawing at least 1 extra card from it. And, he's a Zombie for your Gravecrawler deck. Loving this critter so far.
Maybe I'm not seeing what others are seeing, but this card seems pretty bad to me. Unless your cube has a very, very low average CMC, I would never include this at 360 and almost certainly not at most other sizes either.
Emptying your hand is not that hard in aggro or pox style decks. He is a passable beater with a relevant creature type. His upside is huge though. Draw one card and he is very good. Draw more and he just became more then great.
If you don't support black aggro or pox then I can see your point. But for cubes that do? He looks like a shoe-in.
Maybe I'm not seeing what others are seeing, but this card seems pretty bad to me. Unless your cube has a very, very low average CMC, I would never include this at 360 and almost certainly not at most other sizes either.
Do you run dark confidant? I'm not saying they're comparable in power level, but if you're not seeing any decks that could use scrivener I don't see how confidant could be seeing play.
When I see Healing Salve, I'm often like "Oh girl, I wish I could turn every card into this." Thanks they removed the gain life part, otherwise this would have been broken.
Maybe I'm not seeing what others are seeing, but this card seems pretty bad to me. Unless your cube has a very, very low average CMC, I would never include this at 360 and almost certainly not at most other sizes either.
It's a 2-power zombie beater for 2 mana that has an easily obtainable trigger that generates card advantage. Decks that play zombie beaters can easily go hellbent, especially if they're trying.
Stoked this card has been doing well in testing. If Goodking, wtwlf123, and Usman all say it's been doing good in testing, then I'm gonna have to throw it in for testing myself too.
When they printed Gravecrawler, I was stoked because it was the type of card that I think they needed to make black aggro better. I think this is along the same lines. I think I'm going to be cutting something from the higher cmc levels to make room for this guy. Probably Barter in Blood or Black Sun's Zenith.
Thanks for the in-depth feedback. I'm planning on trying him myself; he should fit in well with my ultra-low black curve. Being a black Silvergill Adept on average would be insane, so worse than that is still fine in my books.
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
Thanks for the breakdown!
Am having a really hard time evaluating this guy, so apreciate a semi-scientific testing.
I know he's at least decent, but trying to figure out if he's good in the average black agro or pox deck.
Last Updated 02/07/24
Streaming Standard/Cube on Twitch https://www.twitch.tv/heisenb3rg96
Strategy Twitter https://www.twitter.com/heisenb3rg
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
What I wonder and have to ask is, is it beneficial to try to go hellbent? Like are the plays being made beneficial, especially when he's so fragile? I can see this not being so much the case with like Liliana or Pox, or other means to bring your hand down, but in cases where it is more aggresive, are you not leaving yourself open for making "bad" plays (obviously this is objective), when the response to you getting to hellbent could be to wrath the board (or kill him in any way).
I geuss my question is that does using him as a crutch to play more freely and blow you hand leave you too vulnerable? I honestly don't know the answer, and was just looking for the answer maybe through further testing.
Oh and thanks for the current update on how he's playing, good to see some test results. I want this guy to work out really bad even if I am skeptical
My 450 Cube
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
360 Modern Cube
Cubetutor
EDH Decks
WGTrostaniWG
WURZedruuWUR
Twitter
I prefer phyrexian arena as I can play it early and still benefit on turn 2 or 3. This card requires at least to begin activation by turn 4.
Cube on Cubetutor
Come trade with Puca Trade!, the best place to get those hard to get cards no one else will trade!
I think people are overlooking the fact that a 2/1 is perfectly fine, though not exciting. Would we include him just as a vanilla 2/1, probably not, but the fact that he has a REAL upside and that he isn't always a dead top deck makes him playable if not a staple.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
"What am I looking at? Ashes, dead man."
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
I used to write cube articles on StarCityGames, now for GatheringMagic and podcast about cube (w/Antknee42.)
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
Emptying your hand is not that hard in aggro or pox style decks. He is a passable beater with a relevant creature type. His upside is huge though. Draw one card and he is very good. Draw more and he just became more then great.
If you don't support black aggro or pox then I can see your point. But for cubes that do? He looks like a shoe-in.
I feel compelled to repeat everything I hear
Do you run dark confidant? I'm not saying they're comparable in power level, but if you're not seeing any decks that could use scrivener I don't see how confidant could be seeing play.
It's a 2-power zombie beater for 2 mana that has an easily obtainable trigger that generates card advantage. Decks that play zombie beaters can easily go hellbent, especially if they're trying.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
Bloodghast
Dark Confidant
Pack Rat
Vampire Hexmage
Oona's Prowler
Nezumi Graverobber
Reassembling Skeleton
On par or a matter of taste:
Knight of Infamy
Dauthi Horror
Nantuko Shade
Dauthi Slayer
Vampire Interloper
Nether Traitor
Blood Artist
Nezumi Shortfang
Cut for Blood Scrivener:
Black Knight
Mesmeric Fiend
Thrill-Kill Assassin
Fledgling Djinn
Nightscape Familiar
Nezumi Cutthroat
Skittering Skirge
Skirsdag High Priest
Knight of Stromgald
Dregscape Zombie
Ravenous Rats
Headhunter
Hand of Cruelty
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
My 450 Cube
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 49th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from MKM!