Every color but blue would play the instant uncounterable divination.
I really dont think a 6/5 vanilla can be evaluated as a reanimation target. I wouldn't even be intimidated by a turn 2 tusker folllowed by a 3rd turn reanimation.I would be happy my opponent wasted his reanimation.
power level alone the instant uncounterable blue divination could probably make it, however blue can't just be all draw spells, which is where it might be cut. FoF ancestral recall ancestral visions etc are all better then it by a large amount.
Back on topic, I'd like to post about the Hydra. It has been the most impressive card of M14 (alongside Imposing Sovereign). Hydra has won a ton of games after it hit the board (though not always for the caster). It's been stolen/copied for the win several times while the caster lost to their own card. I'm not sure of the exact percentage but I'd say that Hydra is the game-winning card in at least half of the games where it's cast.
I knew this card was insane but it's proving to be better than that. I'm not sure where it ranks in overall power level of green 5-drop creatures but it may just be the best one. I would Cube this card at any size.
The hydra also doubles all of your other counters, so whoever said vindicate blanks it missed that even if you attack with it and it eats something post-declaration, you still get double counters on all your other stuff.
I saw my friend attacking once with the hydra and then playing Prime speaker zegana, drew Timewalk and played it and attacked with them both. Pretty absurd. He seems good, but there are enough answers to him.
The hydra also doubles all of your other counters, so whoever said vindicate blanks it missed that even if you attack with it and it eats something post-declaration, you still get double counters on all your other stuff.
Well, the Vindicate test assumes they hit it with sorcery-speed removal on their turn after you cast it. Meaning, it would never attack.
Back on topic, I'd like to post about the Hydra. It has been the most impressive card of M14 (alongside Imposing Sovereign). Hydra has won a ton of games after it hit the board (though not always for the caster). It's been stolen/copied for the win several times while the caster lost to their own card. I'm not sure of the exact percentage but I'd say that Hydra is the game-winning card in at least half of the games where it's cast.
I knew this card was insane but it's proving to be better than that. I'm not sure where it ranks in overall power level of green 5-drop creatures but it may just be the best one. I would Cube this card at any size.
I too would cube this guy at any size. So far he's been really shining in the Gruul decks where he's able to gain haste. I scooped to a turn-3 Sarkhan Vol followed by a turn-4 Kalonian Hydra. I've also seen him strapped to a Lightning Mauler. He has been kidnapped ftw too though haha (perhaps it's time to consider Lightning Greaves)!
I agree that the Terminate/Vindicate test is a valid metric to consider when evaluating creatures. However, I also believe that this Hydra sets new standards for beatsticks... What other 5-drop can end the game by swinging twice? What other 5-drop doesn't get chumped indefinitely by Squee or the plethora of weenies and 1/1 tokens found in every cube? Hydra being in the colour that can consistently push him out earlier is just icing on top. Being able to tutor him out with Imperial Recruiter is cherry on the icing.
I think there is a lack of mid-range "bombs" in cube to not only be a decent body, but threaten to kill your opponent VERY fast if unanswered.
In a format where a lot of decks do BROKEN , over the top, game warping things like upheavel, reanimating griselbrand , show and tell, sneak attack. sphinx's revelation, entreat the angels.
Mid-range needs ways to kill these decks before they go off.
Mid range vs Ramp or mid range vs control will always be a bad matchup, but when green's 5/4 drops are glutted with value creatures and answers to non-creature permanants..Those matchups are often abysmal.
Wolfir silverheart and Kalonian hydra are PERFECT for this reason.
They have 4+ toughness so dodge most monored burn spells, they block agro in a pinch, but can also win the game VERY fast.
Unfortunately they are vulnerable to spot removal and lack haste, which is why Im a HUGE fan of putting cards in cube to supplement them.
I see wolfir silverheart + vines of the vastwood + Kalonian hydra + lightning greaves + Sarkhan Vol as part of a cube "package".
These cards are no where near my chopping block at 450.
I see wolfir silverheart + vines of the vastwood + Kalonian hydra + lightning greaves + Sarkhan Vol as part of a cube "package".
I like the sound of that. A really focused Gruul Fires archetype would be awesome in cube. Ramp into hasty beaters as fast as you can. The Greaves double as protection from control magic effects.
My green based decks have been loving the greaves for a long time. Blue/Black tap out value decks and pox are just horrible matchups without additional ways for haste and protection against targeted removal.
I am shocked that many people have dropped that card as I am close to adding some of the other hexproof equipment. Yes it is vulnerable too but the control decks usually need a counterspell or they need to be splashing white to handle it once it comes down.
Natural Order only for the hydra? I like it.
I played UG last draft with natural order for SSS and the hydra. And the hydra won me every game it survived - played two times end of turn off the shelldock (and then replayed shelldock via meloku, was fun).
My green based decks have been loving the greaves for a long time. Blue/Black tap out value decks and pox are just horrible matchups without additional ways for haste and protection against targeted removal.
I am shocked that many people have dropped that card as I am close to adding some of the other hexproof equipment. Yes it is vulnerable too but the control decks usually need a counterspell or they need to be splashing white to handle it once it comes down.
It has been years since we had the Greaves in. Control Magic and removal destroys green (that's why Thrun is so awesome) and the Greaves will help. I will most definitely be including it in my next update.
Mid range vs Ramp or mid range vs control will always be a bad matchup, but when green's 5/4 drops are glutted with value creatures and answers to non-creature permanants..Those matchups are often abysmal.
The more I think about this the more I realize that this is an accurate statement about what's going on with our cube as well. Don't get me wrong, Wickerbough Elder, Acidic Slime and Thragtusk are all awesome... but you're right. They are value creatures that don't put a fast enough clock on the opponent (before they can go off and drop their bombs).
I think haste really would go a long way... as well as some sort of evasion or trample. And I really like your idea of a package...
The more I think about this the more I realize that this is an accurate statement about what's going on with our cube as well. Don't get me wrong, Wickerbough Elder, Acidic Slime and Thragtusk are all awesome... but you're right. They are value creatures that don't put a fast enough clock on the opponent (before they can go off and drop their bombs).
I think haste really would go a long way... as well as some sort of evasion or trample. And I really like your idea of a package...
The issue I have with most midrange green is just that. It is reactive and defensive. Which is fine if you are stuffing aggro, or to knock out a key piece, but I dislike making a G/X deck who plan to key people is based around ramping into thragtusk and Wickerbough.
Silvos, Rouge Elemental. I know he is not too popular but he is a faster clock than Prime time and regeneration has been key more often than the land grabbing in my group.
And when I go to 450 I will also add Swiftfoot boots for redundancy on the greaves.
Is this guy still a beast and staple 5cmc green beater? See him gone from a lot of lists sadly.
It snow balls hard, but in the end it's a Baneslayer that gains you know value. I liked Verdurous Gearhulk a lot more, but that eventually got replaced by Voracious Hydra, which I like the most of the 3.
I really dont think a 6/5 vanilla can be evaluated as a reanimation target. I wouldn't even be intimidated by a turn 2 tusker folllowed by a 3rd turn reanimation.I would be happy my opponent wasted his reanimation.
power level alone the instant uncounterable blue divination could probably make it, however blue can't just be all draw spells, which is where it might be cut. FoF ancestral recall ancestral visions etc are all better then it by a large amount.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=484979
I knew this card was insane but it's proving to be better than that. I'm not sure where it ranks in overall power level of green 5-drop creatures but it may just be the best one. I would Cube this card at any size.
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Well, the Vindicate test assumes they hit it with sorcery-speed removal on their turn after you cast it. Meaning, it would never attack.
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I too would cube this guy at any size. So far he's been really shining in the Gruul decks where he's able to gain haste. I scooped to a turn-3 Sarkhan Vol followed by a turn-4 Kalonian Hydra. I've also seen him strapped to a Lightning Mauler. He has been kidnapped ftw too though haha (perhaps it's time to consider Lightning Greaves)!
I agree that the Terminate/Vindicate test is a valid metric to consider when evaluating creatures. However, I also believe that this Hydra sets new standards for beatsticks... What other 5-drop can end the game by swinging twice? What other 5-drop doesn't get chumped indefinitely by Squee or the plethora of weenies and 1/1 tokens found in every cube? Hydra being in the colour that can consistently push him out earlier is just icing on top. Being able to tutor him out with Imperial Recruiter is cherry on the icing.
In a format where a lot of decks do BROKEN , over the top, game warping things like upheavel, reanimating griselbrand , show and tell, sneak attack. sphinx's revelation, entreat the angels.
Mid-range needs ways to kill these decks before they go off.
Mid range vs Ramp or mid range vs control will always be a bad matchup, but when green's 5/4 drops are glutted with value creatures and answers to non-creature permanants..Those matchups are often abysmal.
Wolfir silverheart and Kalonian hydra are PERFECT for this reason.
They have 4+ toughness so dodge most monored burn spells, they block agro in a pinch, but can also win the game VERY fast.
Unfortunately they are vulnerable to spot removal and lack haste, which is why Im a HUGE fan of putting cards in cube to supplement them.
I see wolfir silverheart + vines of the vastwood + Kalonian hydra + lightning greaves + Sarkhan Vol as part of a cube "package".
These cards are no where near my chopping block at 450.
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I like the sound of that. A really focused Gruul Fires archetype would be awesome in cube. Ramp into hasty beaters as fast as you can. The Greaves double as protection from control magic effects.
Edit: Just tried to draft this from my cube and came up with this: http://cubetutor.com/cubedeck/16671
A Fires of Yavimaya would be awesome. I really should put Lightning Greaves in.
I am shocked that many people have dropped that card as I am close to adding some of the other hexproof equipment. Yes it is vulnerable too but the control decks usually need a counterspell or they need to be splashing white to handle it once it comes down.
It could only happen in a cube draft...
It has been years since we had the Greaves in. Control Magic and removal destroys green (that's why Thrun is so awesome) and the Greaves will help. I will most definitely be including it in my next update.
The more I think about this the more I realize that this is an accurate statement about what's going on with our cube as well. Don't get me wrong, Wickerbough Elder, Acidic Slime and Thragtusk are all awesome... but you're right. They are value creatures that don't put a fast enough clock on the opponent (before they can go off and drop their bombs).
I think haste really would go a long way... as well as some sort of evasion or trample. And I really like your idea of a package...
The issue I have with most midrange green is just that. It is reactive and defensive. Which is fine if you are stuffing aggro, or to knock out a key piece, but I dislike making a G/X deck who plan to key people is based around ramping into thragtusk and Wickerbough.
Other ones to consider in this package are
Thornling And Craterhoof Behemoth for haste
Silvos, Rouge Elemental. I know he is not too popular but he is a faster clock than Prime time and regeneration has been key more often than the land grabbing in my group.
And when I go to 450 I will also add Swiftfoot boots for redundancy on the greaves.
This sounds good to me too!
Cheers,
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It snow balls hard, but in the end it's a Baneslayer that gains you know value. I liked Verdurous Gearhulk a lot more, but that eventually got replaced by Voracious Hydra, which I like the most of the 3.
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