I hadn't realized his ability doesn't require you to tap him. I really really really really want to play this card. Extremely tempting, he's testing how much I'm willing to stand by my love for Blightning.
Looking at wtwlf's cube as an example, I don't think this guy is better than his top-3 guild cards in terms of pure power level, but I think it's a much more fun and skill-testing card than Dreadbore. I cube peasant, but a bunch of us have removed vanilla removal spells from our guild sections just because there's plenty to go around in mono-color and it opens up slots for fun cards like Grenzo.
The one thing that makes me skeptical is the fact that Olivia Voldaren has had trouble sticking around, despite having arguably more powerful activated abilities. He's very powerful, but I think his real test will be exactly how good he is when you just cast him as a 2/2 for BR.
He definitely has great potential, though. In a cheap creature deck, he has about the same chance as hitting as Domri. He's excellent value if he even hits once, and it's possible in some decks that you just want to go Pack Rat-style and activate him as many times as possible instead of casting spells.
I think the main difference is that the 4-drop slot in general is pretty stacked, while Grenzo can come down nearly anywhere in the curve. He can be a vanilla fatty if you need something sizable, or can come in as a bear or 3/3 and start digging through the bottom of your library for additional threats if you need to go wide. The fact that his activated ability is completely colorless helps a lot too in terms of being flexible.
I do think we're probably overvaluing his activated ability a bit since you're probably whiffing 50% of the time.
The one thing that makes me skeptical is the fact that Olivia Voldaren has had trouble sticking around, despite having arguably more powerful activated abilities. He's very powerful, but I think his real test will be exactly how good he is when you just cast him as a 2/2 for 2.
He definitely has great potential, though. In a cheap creature deck, he has about the same chance as hitting as Domri. He's excellent value if he even hits once, and it's possible in some decks that you just want to go Pack Rat-style and activate him as many times as possible instead of casting spells.
At a quick glance, 64% of my Black, Red or Rakdos creatures (39 out of 61) have creatures with power 2 or less. Bumping him up to be a 3/3 with X=1 raises the percentage of his potential targets to 79% (48 out of 61).
Wow, I also misread it as the creture had to have power equal to the number of counters, and I was planning to test it anyways. The way is writen is a lot better and it can make a must-include in most cubes. I'm thinking to replace Falkenrath Aristocrat or Spike Jester for this.
It fills your curve, use it in an aggro deck as a 3-4 drop to play extra creatures like a finisher or 2x1, but it can also serve as a realiable 2-drop in case of need, and bring other 2-power creatures with it. Also, it enables reanimator in BR. I like this guy a lot!
Jester and Aristocrat are the two possible cuts for me too. That said, I'm a little sad, first to lose Olivia, then to possibly lose Aristocrat. RB is obviously an aggro color, but I do like supporting a more control-oriented build, especially when paired with blue.
I find Aristocrat more aggressive than this guy and probably still like it better. But I want to run both.
No matter how many times I force Olivia I find her dissapointing. 5 is just too much mana to activate. I can never seen to ping something the turn she comes down, and can rarely ping and grab in the same turn. Lots of times it is a 4 mana 3/3 on turn 4 that just eats a bolt or something. When I can sit and protect her she can be great but I rarely like that in cube cards. I prefer value right away or for them to be more explosive. My jund deck seemed to like something like Kalonian Hydra that can just win without dinking around.
After I spend 11 mana on Oliva I a a 3/3 flyer and a creature of have stolen. With the new goblin he is a 3/3 and activated 4 times. I think I am going with
Man, I definitely assumed it was a 0/0 when I first read it too and thought it was terrible. This guy definitely seems potent, and it's an ability we haven't really seen before. Will be great in decks that want to go hellbent and so can use the mana sink. I am super excited to try this.
Total side note but I like how people are discussing running this over itself.
Well, it has to be said that Kolaghan is clearly better than Kolaghan. Considering what BR decks usually want and how stiff the competition in this guild is, there is no way that I would run Kolaghan over Kolaghan! Kolaghan might make it in as the sixth guild card or so. Kolaghan on the other hand ranks several places below that.
It was so funny to me when they described this as a downgrade to the original Zurgo during the Pax East panel. I was thinking if this is a downgrade, they should really "downgrade" all legendary creatures. Haha.
My deck designing is quite concise at this point:
1. Come up with deck idea
2. Realize this idea is somehow fundamentally similar to another deck I have or that is commonly played in my group
3. Decide I don't want to disassemble one of my existing decks
4. Give up and do nothing
I don't see the point of this new shroud mechanic. It's strictly worse than Hexproof. Threshold is pretty bad too, Delirium is a much better mechanic and probably easier to activate.
Otherwise this card is a pretty neat guy. Dodges removal and grows into a Primal Huntbeast. 3/5
Yeah, I find myself cramming hybrid cards into monocolor sections to make room for more interesting cards. Cackler is red, redcap is black, militant is white etc. Although that's a different discussion entirely. I really want to make guild sections a reason to play those colors rather than a generic good card. This guy looks super fun, for reanimator, he fills your yard and can randomly get good stuff into play and whatever is too big you can grab with a necromancy. Or in aggro he can just be a scalable CA machine. Definitely putting him in for dreadbore (especially since I run hero's downfall) Can't wait to see how he performs.
I think a top 20 list for this set would be really weird because it would be "this card is fun for draft" for 18 cards and this card has a good power level for about 2.
Unless you included the conspiracies. Then you have some "this card is a P1P1 windmill slam" for like 3-5 other cards too. Which is why I won't be doing a top 20 for this set.
I think this guy marks the end of Shambling Remains for me. As a 3-drop, it has 1 less power and loses the Unearth, but the potential for card advantage is significant, as is the scalability.
I think this guy marks the end of Shambling Remains for me. As a 3-drop, it has 1 less power and loses the Unearth, but the potential for card advantage is significant, as is the scalability.
Yea same here. Maybe the there will be an awesome UB legend as well
I think this guy marks the end of Shambling Remains for me. As a 3-drop, it has 1 less power and loses the Unearth, but the potential for card advantage is significant, as is the scalability.
Yea same here. Maybe the there will be an awesome UB legend as well
We've seen all the new legends from this set.
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Rest in RIP My Signature, I guess. 2015-2016, we hardly knew ye.
Total side note but I like how people are discussing running this over itself.
Well, it has to be said that Kolaghan is clearly better than Kolaghan. Considering what BR decks usually want and how stiff the competition in this guild is, there is no way that I would run Kolaghan over Kolaghan! Kolaghan might make it in as the sixth guild card or so. Kolaghan on the other hand ranks several places below that.
It was so funny to me when they described this as a downgrade to the original Zurgo during the Pax East panel. I was thinking if this is a downgrade, they should really "downgrade" all legendary creatures. Haha.
My deck designing is quite concise at this point:
1. Come up with deck idea
2. Realize this idea is somehow fundamentally similar to another deck I have or that is commonly played in my group
3. Decide I don't want to disassemble one of my existing decks
4. Give up and do nothing
I don't see the point of this new shroud mechanic. It's strictly worse than Hexproof. Threshold is pretty bad too, Delirium is a much better mechanic and probably easier to activate.
Otherwise this card is a pretty neat guy. Dodges removal and grows into a Primal Huntbeast. 3/5
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He definitely has great potential, though. In a cheap creature deck, he has about the same chance as hitting as Domri. He's excellent value if he even hits once, and it's possible in some decks that you just want to go Pack Rat-style and activate him as many times as possible instead of casting spells.
Cubetutor Link
I do think we're probably overvaluing his activated ability a bit since you're probably whiffing 50% of the time.
At a quick glance, 64% of my Black, Red or Rakdos creatures (39 out of 61) have creatures with power 2 or less. Bumping him up to be a 3/3 with X=1 raises the percentage of his potential targets to 79% (48 out of 61).
Visual Spoiler
Draft!
Jester and Aristocrat are the two possible cuts for me too. That said, I'm a little sad, first to lose Olivia, then to possibly lose Aristocrat. RB is obviously an aggro color, but I do like supporting a more control-oriented build, especially when paired with blue.
No matter how many times I force Olivia I find her dissapointing. 5 is just too much mana to activate. I can never seen to ping something the turn she comes down, and can rarely ping and grab in the same turn. Lots of times it is a 4 mana 3/3 on turn 4 that just eats a bolt or something. When I can sit and protect her she can be great but I rarely like that in cube cards. I prefer value right away or for them to be more explosive. My jund deck seemed to like something like Kalonian Hydra that can just win without dinking around.
After I spend 11 mana on Oliva I a a 3/3 flyer and a creature of have stolen. With the new goblin he is a 3/3 and activated 4 times. I think I am going with
375 unpowered cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/601ac624832cdf1039947588
Actually. . . I'll just sort Cackler as a red card and cram this guy in.
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
No, I don't think so.
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My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
thats my cube
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Uril, the Miststalker RGW -- Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre C -- Vhati il-Dal BG -- Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer RW -- Animar, Soul of Elements URG
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker R -- Maga, Traitor to Mortals B -- Ghave, Guru of Spores BGW -- Sliver Hivelord WUBRG
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I'm OP_Forever. I'll be putting this in my signature for a while so everyone know I change my nickname.
Yea same here. Maybe the there will be an awesome UB legend as well
We've seen all the new legends from this set.
Since your opponent always does the last shuffling and cutting of your deck, it shouldn't be an issue.
Also, I don't cube with people that would cheat.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!