I would LOVE to replace Vedalken Aethermage with Step Through. It simply looks better - cheaper tutor and more useful when hard casting it. But the newer card isn't tutorable unless you use Brainspoil - but then you could already tutor a wizard with it. So if you're a combo freak a 2cc creature is better to be tutored with a couple tutors - imagine using Muddle the Mixture to tutor Vedalken Aethermage and use it to tutor Archaeomancer. Cast it and return Muddle the Mixture to tutor other combo piece. You can't do these fun things with Step Through so I won't use it for now (will buy 1 for the maybeboard just in case though). And unless you use a couple of other wizards 2 specific tutors seem redundant to me.
As VivienneHell said, Bone Shards is a sorcery and doesn't buy you 2 cards. IMO it's meh compared to the cards you mentioned. Revolutionist should replace Izzet Chronarch if we had any difficulty to fix blue in this deck. Hence he doesn't fit.
We have 8 islands and 5 swamps in the deck. You're right, Witch's Cottage won't be useful most of the times.
IMO Traumatic Visions is better than Mental Journey (if you look for ramp and utility). And I don't use it. Yet.
I don't know if I like Lose Focus. Maybe it or Traumatic Visions could go in the deck if I needed more counters. More maybeboard at least.
Here are some contributions given the new mana base/ramp provided by snow lands approach (that we use on Coa deck), and more protection to your main goal: Keep Muldrotha alive protecting it so you can use your swiss army knife more and more each turn providing leverage to commander beats or anything that can kill opponents
Hi guys, long time no see
I spent far too long from the upgrade options for our beloved deck. I need to tell I loved the snow duals and the new ramps that help us with those lands. And WHAT is dat Land Grant? Beautiful.
I already put my deck in the spreadsheet (will update my sig later).
Here are my main thoughts (mostly personal taste):
- no Growth Spiral for me. It's way too situational to be considered a ramp spell. Coiling Oracle is the same but can be reused more easily, and replaces itself leaving a 1/1 creature.
- no Compulsive Research for me. I simply hate the idea of discarding 1/2 cards just for the sake of digging 1 card deeper (ok, it's an instant but still). I prefer Deep Analysis, more useful in mid- and late game IMO.
- Perilous Research is in the deck since its beginning but it's kinda weak as a sac outlet because it can be countered. That's why I prefer Altar's Reap - even when it's countered, CoA blows away.
- I ditched Opal Palace and Study Hall only because they are slower and don't help to cast CoA on t4. Both are wonderful in any other aspect.
- On Jund Panorama: like Bant, fixes Forest, a splash color, and a main color. More useful than Grixis IMO but as I ditched the 2 lands above, I go with 3 Panoramas. And they filter basic lands so I can draw spells more frequently as well.
- Adding Salvager of Secrets, Peregrine Drake, and Displace because I am a combo freak
- Resculpt seems better than Angelic Purge. We lose a sac outlet but hey, it's instant, it's blue, it's cheaper. Will look for one.
Any reason you guys would see Tamiyo's Epiphany go into our decks? It's from war of spark. It's just another forsee but always nice to scry 4 and then draw..
Any reason to repeat that in our decks?
Thoughts?
I like Foresee a lot, but I din't know what I would cut to try Tamiyo's Epiphany. It's really good but, right now for me, the last section I would add redundancy would be card draw.
I am a control/combo player so I would remove Peregrine Drake, Cloud of Faeries, Brainspoil, Azorius Chancery, Izzet Boilerworks, and probably Rolling Thunder.
I would put some control redundancy, maybe things like Kami of False Hope, False Defeat, Scour From Existence, and add Reality Acid (amazing with Capsize). The two lands would be replaced by ETB untepped ones. I would prefer a 5-Panorama fix pack than the double-color ETBT ATM because aren't in a hurry, you can thin your deck, and you have more untapped lands to answer (hopefully, if you have the right colors available).
I dunno if the wizard pack with a Gray Merchant of Asphodel (and maybe Brainspoil) is worth it as a mini-combo in late game. I'd test it because this deck looks weak to win without the combo.
As some people already said, the Wizards/Flicker pack is worth running to take counters/tutors/ramp/sac outlets back to your hand.
This new expansion brought two great cards for us so far: Teyo, the Shieldmage and Kasmina's Transmutation.
I love the cheap planeswalker, gives us some protection in early game. It doesn't help us much when it comes to aggro decks but hey, we have some Wraths for that.
The enchantment is like Pongify. A nice one indeed.
Thoughts?
@Fr0sty711, what @Reaper9889 said. I would say exactly this, but not as comprehensively Thx Reaper!
@bfine70, hmm, I never saw Shade's Form as a Control Magic-like card (silly me!). That makes me like it way more - enough maybe to consider it in my sideboard. BUT, these auras' problem is that you are telegraphing the punch, and it's useless after it's used, not being recastable after you put your Archaeomancers in the battlefield. So I dislike this 'telegraphing' stuff, but both are solid choices if you don't care about this. If Kaya's Ghostform was a sorcery it would be a lighter version of Undying Evil but I'd prefer it. One can always fine tune a deck to have a stealing kit of spells. I don't see this strongly in this deck but if so, Shade's Form would be a staple.
Brainspoil - This is a tutor to fetch a combo piece (Peregrine Drake most of the time, sometimes a recurring Wizard - the easiest to cast given the color fix I got). I don't care about CoA because I can choose to put it in the commander zone. Far wanderings instead of Primal Growth: actually both are kinda weak, but Wanderings feel better for me in late game, and I already have sac outlets. But it's a draw and a kinda personal choice IMO. Traumatic Visions is an awesome tool to fix a 5c deck and a meh counter in early/mid game and a nice one in late game. A pauper toolbox/staple in this deck, considering. Reap and Sow - this is the only 1 of 3 ways to fetch a non-basic land in Pauper (Expedition Map and Crop Rotation are the others). Used to fix dat 5th color or fetch a double land to close the combo with Faeries or sometimes a Bojuka Bog to stop some GY mayhem. Foresee - Gotcha. A super Preordain. Nice in any hand after the 5th turn. Read the Bones - Another scry&draw with a grat price/performance ratio IMO.
Lack of Ponder - honestly, when you have the two cards above & Preordain, you feel anything without scry is meh. It's cheap and effective, sure, but I wouldn't know what to ditch to put it back. It's always an option. Peregrine drake - combo, redundancy with Cloud of Faeries, but the drake works with any land.
Reclaim - I think we have enough redundance in the deck. I never thought this in CoA deck because of black recursion and all the Wizards. Shade's Form - I don't miss any pump on my General. It's really nice but I dislike the 1BB cost and B to activate. For the same reason I gave up on Crypt Rats as a backup board sweep. Reaping the graves and Macabre waltz - My build normally wants to get back a creature at a time (almost always CoA) and I have 2 reusable recusrsion spells. Also some spells are really expensive so the storm is situational. Tragic slip - I never thought about this one. Seems situational because needs for someone to die to be useful. I might consider to get one signed just in case.
About your recursion spells and meta, it's always good to keep the board controlled anytime you wish.
Normally (with the tutors I have) I can easily find a way to fetch one of my reusable GY spells. I wish there was more than one reusable sac outlet.
I will replace some things to have it signed as soon as my Drake arrives. Will keep this posted.
All the best
Amazing, congrats!!!
My signed build is 97/101. I might replace some unsigned cards with slightly worse options to make it fully signed, but one of the cards has no substitute (Peregrine Drake). I will update the scans in the next few days.
Sadly, no one in my playgroup wants to give Pauper EDH a try. Either way, I'll have this decklist in my back pocket along with a secondary deck because it's a nice way to introduce EDH as a format to newer players. It'll be either a Gruul or Selesnya deck so that it plays a totally different strategy from this one.
You can always build PDH with legendary commanders (even non-uncommon ones if you stretch a little) - see my Child of Alara in my sig or the Rona deck in this link. I am finishing assembling one of these as well.
Yeah, I meant to have it in the maybeboard when in a leavy LD meta.
One shouldn't abuse of it (like Stonecloaker), it's supposed to be used homeopatically.
But this is not my meta I just help the guy above who asked about this.
Actually I am finishing my deck and it's much like your budgetless version without any $20+ card, fetches, shocks, and duals. Will post here in a few days for you guys to help me fine tuning it.
In these metas, I would rely on a couple Nevermore-like cards to avoid only the specific cards you can't answer otherwise (Telepathy helps you to see the real threats). Counter the rest and pray for the best - anyway this MLD guy will be the target. This is more needed in optimized metas, I guess.
EDIT: Life from the Loam looks amazing as well, specially if you have some deserts/cycles/fetches/Strip Mine-like lands to reuse.
Speaking of Telepathy, what do guys think about Glasses of Urza? It looks a good option to add redundancy and less threatening than Telepathy because only you see the hands, one at a time though. And it's a Beta copy so it'd increase the pimp factor
I would LOVE to replace Vedalken Aethermage with Step Through. It simply looks better - cheaper tutor and more useful when hard casting it. But the newer card isn't tutorable unless you use Brainspoil - but then you could already tutor a wizard with it. So if you're a combo freak a 2cc creature is better to be tutored with a couple tutors - imagine using Muddle the Mixture to tutor Vedalken Aethermage and use it to tutor Archaeomancer. Cast it and return Muddle the Mixture to tutor other combo piece. You can't do these fun things with Step Through so I won't use it for now (will buy 1 for the maybeboard just in case though). And unless you use a couple of other wizards 2 specific tutors seem redundant to me.
As VivienneHell said, Bone Shards is a sorcery and doesn't buy you 2 cards. IMO it's meh compared to the cards you mentioned.
Revolutionist should replace Izzet Chronarch if we had any difficulty to fix blue in this deck. Hence he doesn't fit.
We have 8 islands and 5 swamps in the deck. You're right, Witch's Cottage won't be useful most of the times.
IMO Traumatic Visions is better than Mental Journey (if you look for ramp and utility). And I don't use it. Yet.
I don't know if I like Lose Focus. Maybe it or Traumatic Visions could go in the deck if I needed more counters. More maybeboard at least.
Here are some contributions given the new mana base/ramp provided by snow lands approach (that we use on Coa deck), and more protection to your main goal: Keep Muldrotha alive protecting it so you can use your swiss army knife more and more each turn providing leverage to commander beats or anything that can kill opponents
1 Muldrotha, The Gravetide
Commander Protection (4)
1 Alexi's Cloak
1 Diplomatic Immunity
1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Protective Bubble
Recursion (7)
1 Undying evil
1 Kaya's Ghostform
1 Disturbed Burial
1 Grim Discovery
1 Soul Manipulation
1 Archaeomancer
1 Salvager of Secrets
Countermagic (7)
1 Dispel
1 Negate
1 Counterspell
1 Deprive
1 Disdainful Stroke
1 Psychic Strike
1 Faerie Trickery
Ramp/Fixing (10)
1 Expedition Map
1 Mind Stone
1 Commander's Sphere
1 Crop Rotation
1 Land Grant
1 Farseek
1 Into the North
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Cultivate
1 Kodama's Reach
Tutors (8)
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Mystical Teachings
1 Dimir Infiltrator
1 Drift of Phantasms
1 Dimir House Guard
1 Perplex
1 Muddle the Mixture
1 Shred Memory
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Preordain
1 Sign in Blood
1 Night's Whisper
1 Read the Bones
1 Notion Rain
1 Secrets of the Golden City
1 Mulldrifter
Swiss Army Knife (17)
1 Seal of Doom
1 Seal of Primordium
1 Vessel of Nascency
1 Pestilence
1 Lingering Death
1 Bottle Gnomes
1 Aether Spellbomb
1 Moonglove Extract
1 Serrated Arrows
1 Sylvok Replica
1 Executioner's Capsule
1 Spore Frog
1 Crypt Rats
1 Augur of Skulls
1 Slum Reaper
1 Winged Coatl
1 Capsize
Lands (37)
1 Woodland Chasm
1 Ice Tunnel
1 Rimewood Falls
1 Thriving Isle
1 Thriving Moor
1 Thriving Grove
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Mortuary Mire
1 Mystic Sanctuary
1 Witch's Cottage
1 Jund Panorama
1 Bant Panorama
1 Command Tower
1 Path of Ancestry
1 Opal Palace
1 Study Hall
1 Shimmerdrift Vale
1 Golgari Rot Farm
1 Dimir Aqueduct
1 Simic Growth Chamber
1 Ash Barrens
1 Terrramorphic Expanse
1 Evolving Wild
1 Strip Mine
2 Snow-Covered Forest
5 Snow-Covered Swamp
6 Snow-Covered Island
Maybeboard: Gray Merchant of Asphodel, combo (lol)
Hope you like some inputs. I will tru to build this deck IRL as soon as stores reopen here.
I found this deck pretty amazing, kudos!!!
All the best!
I spent far too long from the upgrade options for our beloved deck. I need to tell I loved the snow duals and the new ramps that help us with those lands. And WHAT is dat Land Grant? Beautiful.
I already put my deck in the spreadsheet (will update my sig later).
Here are my main thoughts (mostly personal taste):
- no Growth Spiral for me. It's way too situational to be considered a ramp spell. Coiling Oracle is the same but can be reused more easily, and replaces itself leaving a 1/1 creature.
- no Compulsive Research for me. I simply hate the idea of discarding 1/2 cards just for the sake of digging 1 card deeper (ok, it's an instant but still). I prefer Deep Analysis, more useful in mid- and late game IMO.
- Perilous Research is in the deck since its beginning but it's kinda weak as a sac outlet because it can be countered. That's why I prefer Altar's Reap - even when it's countered, CoA blows away.
- I ditched Opal Palace and Study Hall only because they are slower and don't help to cast CoA on t4. Both are wonderful in any other aspect.
- On Jund Panorama: like Bant, fixes Forest, a splash color, and a main color. More useful than Grixis IMO but as I ditched the 2 lands above, I go with 3 Panoramas. And they filter basic lands so I can draw spells more frequently as well.
- Adding Salvager of Secrets, Peregrine Drake, and Displace because I am a combo freak
- Resculpt seems better than Angelic Purge. We lose a sac outlet but hey, it's instant, it's blue, it's cheaper. Will look for one.
Edit: Witch's Cottage, anyone?
https://www.facebook.com/groups/2040520979584272/
All the best!
I like Foresee a lot, but I din't know what I would cut to try Tamiyo's Epiphany. It's really good but, right now for me, the last section I would add redundancy would be card draw.
I would put some control redundancy, maybe things like Kami of False Hope, False Defeat, Scour From Existence, and add Reality Acid (amazing with Capsize). The two lands would be replaced by ETB untepped ones. I would prefer a 5-Panorama fix pack than the double-color ETBT ATM because aren't in a hurry, you can thin your deck, and you have more untapped lands to answer (hopefully, if you have the right colors available).
I dunno if the wizard pack with a Gray Merchant of Asphodel (and maybe Brainspoil) is worth it as a mini-combo in late game. I'd test it because this deck looks weak to win without the combo.
As some people already said, the Wizards/Flicker pack is worth running to take counters/tutors/ramp/sac outlets back to your hand.
I love the cheap planeswalker, gives us some protection in early game. It doesn't help us much when it comes to aggro decks but hey, we have some Wraths for that.
The enchantment is like Pongify. A nice one indeed.
Thoughts?
@bfine70, hmm, I never saw Shade's Form as a Control Magic-like card (silly me!). That makes me like it way more - enough maybe to consider it in my sideboard. BUT, these auras' problem is that you are telegraphing the punch, and it's useless after it's used, not being recastable after you put your Archaeomancers in the battlefield. So I dislike this 'telegraphing' stuff, but both are solid choices if you don't care about this. If Kaya's Ghostform was a sorcery it would be a lighter version of Undying Evil but I'd prefer it. One can always fine tune a deck to have a stealing kit of spells. I don't see this strongly in this deck but if so, Shade's Form would be a staple.
Far wanderings instead of Primal Growth: actually both are kinda weak, but Wanderings feel better for me in late game, and I already have sac outlets. But it's a draw and a kinda personal choice IMO.
Traumatic Visions is an awesome tool to fix a 5c deck and a meh counter in early/mid game and a nice one in late game. A pauper toolbox/staple in this deck, considering.
Reap and Sow - this is the only 1 of 3 ways to fetch a non-basic land in Pauper (Expedition Map and Crop Rotation are the others). Used to fix dat 5th color or fetch a double land to close the combo with Faeries or sometimes a Bojuka Bog to stop some GY mayhem.
Foresee - Gotcha. A super Preordain. Nice in any hand after the 5th turn.
Read the Bones - Another scry&draw with a grat price/performance ratio IMO.
Lack of Ponder - honestly, when you have the two cards above & Preordain, you feel anything without scry is meh. It's cheap and effective, sure, but I wouldn't know what to ditch to put it back. It's always an option.
Peregrine drake - combo, redundancy with Cloud of Faeries, but the drake works with any land.
Reclaim - I think we have enough redundance in the deck. I never thought this in CoA deck because of black recursion and all the Wizards.
Shade's Form - I don't miss any pump on my General. It's really nice but I dislike the 1BB cost and B to activate. For the same reason I gave up on Crypt Rats as a backup board sweep.
Reaping the graves and Macabre waltz - My build normally wants to get back a creature at a time (almost always CoA) and I have 2 reusable recusrsion spells. Also some spells are really expensive so the storm is situational.
Tragic slip - I never thought about this one. Seems situational because needs for someone to die to be useful. I might consider to get one signed just in case.
About your recursion spells and meta, it's always good to keep the board controlled anytime you wish.
Normally (with the tutors I have) I can easily find a way to fetch one of my reusable GY spells. I wish there was more than one reusable sac outlet.
I will replace some things to have it signed as soon as my Drake arrives. Will keep this posted.
All the best
My signed build is 97/101. I might replace some unsigned cards with slightly worse options to make it fully signed, but one of the cards has no substitute (Peregrine Drake). I will update the scans in the next few days.
You can always build PDH with legendary commanders (even non-uncommon ones if you stretch a little) - see my Child of Alara in my sig or the Rona deck in this link. I am finishing assembling one of these as well.
One shouldn't abuse of it (like Stonecloaker), it's supposed to be used homeopatically.
But this is not my meta I just help the guy above who asked about this.
Actually I am finishing my deck and it's much like your budgetless version without any $20+ card, fetches, shocks, and duals. Will post here in a few days for you guys to help me fine tuning it.
What do you think about LftL in a MLD meta?
EDIT: Life from the Loam looks amazing as well, specially if you have some deserts/cycles/fetches/Strip Mine-like lands to reuse.
Speaking of Telepathy, what do guys think about Glasses of Urza? It looks a good option to add redundancy and less threatening than Telepathy because only you see the hands, one at a time though. And it's a Beta copy so it'd increase the pimp factor