- JonasDash
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Member for 11 years, 9 months, and 18 days
Last active Mon, Oct, 14 2019 05:08:15
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Feb 28, 2013JonasDash posted a message on Nuked from Orbitalso, Eggs is hands down the best deck now in this format.Posted in: Eepop Blog
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Feb 28, 2013JonasDash posted a message on Nuked from OrbitPosted in: Eepop BlogQuote from mrbig262my Tron deck would disagree and run all over the format...
gonna be a pretty mediocre Tron deck without access to Expedition Map and Sylvan Scrying -
Jan 3, 2013JonasDash posted a message on Sunrise Combo Primerany plans to finish the matchups section?Posted in: izzetmage Blog
also what list do you recommend currently and any sideboard decision trees would be appreciated greatly - To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
If a player is just discarding a card and passing the turn, either Nexus of Fate specifically or otherwise doing nothing until they reduce their library to only Nexus of Fate via this process of draw, discard, pass turn - am I able to call a judge to stop this tactic, and when can I do so?
I sought out and received an answer from a Level 2 judge in person:
If you feel that the player can make a play that isn't discarding Nexus, you can call a judge to confirm this.
My follow up question:
Would that include the judge requiring them to discard another card and losing the game because they are unable to draw a card for their turn?
Their response:
Correct. An exception would be if they could move the game forward, like attacking with a 1/1, and then use the Nexus discard to stay in the game.
Can I get clarification on what exactly the ruling is for loops with Nexus of Fate. Does discarding it count as a loop?
Thanks!
EDIT: So, I think the answer is - the Nexus of Fate can be discarded to prevent yourself from decking. Get your Unmoored Ego's ready!
Please let us know what the judges you ask say, because I'm still quite certain I'm correct.
Post board you're also much more likely to still be able to hide behind the Bridge against the UR Phoenix decks, since they almost always only have 2 Abrade postboard to try to stop the Bridge. Dredge sides in 6-8 ways to handle Bridges, so I often side them out (along with Orbs, IoK, and Brutality) and load up on all the removal and Surgical effects, along with Echoing Truth and Night of Soul's Betrayal.
I've found against Dredge that trying to mull aggressively to hands with Surgical and Extirpates is best G2/3 and to use them on Creeping Chill first if possible and then rely on your board wipes and removal + Crypt Incursion / Surgical effects to hit their creatures and Conflagrates.
Per a lvl 2 judge I asked specifically about the discard loophole you mentioned
Q: If a player is just discard a card and passing the turn, either Nexus of Fate specifically or otherwise doing nothing until they reduce their library to only Nexus of Fate via this process of draw, discard, pass turn - am I able to call a judge to stop this tactic, and when can I do so?
A:If you feel that the player can make a play that isn't discarding Nexus, you can call a judge to confirm this.
Q: would that include discarding another card and losing the game?
A: Correct. An exception would be if they could move the game forward, like attacking with a 1/1, and use the nexus discard to stay in.
also, Mill is probably not being played as much because people don't want to face dredge & phoenix decks because they are not the easiest and also a lot of people do not understand how to properly play against them and Standard has certainly been much more popular, along with Arena and the grind to hit Mythic probably eating into peoples play time.
Format is still fine for Mill imo, and is getting better for it each week as more people pack more graveyard hate to fight dredge and phoenix and play more midrange and control decks as a result of this need to fight the graveyard centric decks. As you're surely aware, a midrange and control uptick is very good for Mill and the natural predator for Midrange and Control is Big Mana decks and Combo decks which are also reasonably good meta matchups for Mill.
They have to do another action unless they have no choice or their action progresses the game. Simply taking another turn does nothing to progress the game. I assure you, if your opponent is doing nothing but drawing and casting Nexus of Fate (or discarding it to just draw and discard it again) then a Judge will tell them they cannot continue to do those plays and the game will end with them being unable to draw a card when they take their next turn.
"Loops may span multiple turns if a game state is not meaningfully changing. Note that drawing cards other than the ones being used to sustain the loop is a meaningful change. If two or more players are involved in maintaining a loop across turns, each player chooses a number of iterations to perform, or announces their intent to continue indefinitely. If all players choose to continue indefinitely, the game is a draw. Otherwise, the game advances through the lowest number of iterations chosen and the player who chose that number receives priority at the point they stop taking an action to sustain the loop."
Source: https://blogs.magicjudges.org/rules/mtr4-4/
Also, see this tweet specifically about Nexus of Fate from a Level 2 judge:
https://twitter.com/MaxPlaysMTG/status/1092946887949221888
The easiest is Unmoored Ego. You can also mill them until their library is only Nexus of Fate, provided that they have nothing else to advance the boardstate or otherwise win, a judge will force them to do something besides just draw and cast (or discard) the Nexus of Fate over and over.
Mostly though, there is really only 1 deck using Nexus right now and it is a very very very small metagame share. Odds are quite low you'd face it, but if you're worried about it - stick an Unmoored Ego in your sideboard.
Since we're talking about Mill decks, I've dusted off my U/W Turbo Trap mill deck as an alternate option in case the format remains very fast, very graveyard strategy focused and Burn retains its strong share of the field. It's definitely not for everyone, but it is lightning fast and is very fun to play, and as I said - since I am all but retired, I'm all about having fun
Yep, the Hunter Burton Memorial Open
Good job dude! I'm prepping for a big tournament in a few weeks, and will likely be playing my Sultai version. I think the metagame is shaping up nicely with lots of people starting to push back against the heavy burn and graveyard recursion strategies with more mid-range and control decks (which also means that if the meta continues to evolve a bit further that decks like Tron and Valakut/Titanshift are going to increase a little too) which would be a field Mill can absolutely dominate.
No KCI = more Tron and Valakut (which we dumpster) and less Infect (which is usually not too great for us; a 50/50 match usually) The metagame will swing to more aggro decks for a brief bit, which will mean we're probably going to need to lean on Bridge and Crypt Incursion a bit more for a while but then the format will settle out a bit with Midrange and Control adjusting to the field shifting to less combo and more aggro and that puts Mill back in a similar position as before.
You might want to try playing a more controlling list to begin with, as they are far superior to lists with cards like Manic Scribe, Mind Funeral, and (yikes) Startled Awake - all of which are too slow, do too little, or are just plain bad.
What it does bring is a way to to deal with large creatures that Fatal Push doesn't hit (Hollow One, Gurmag Angler, Primeval Titan) Planeswalkers (LotV, Karn, Gideon, Chandra), Artifacts and Enchantments (KCI, Hardened Scales, Search for Azcanta, etc) as well as being another form of instant speed interaction to take the pressure off Fatal Push (especially non-revolt enabled Pushes) while also enabling Archive Trap value. Being able to hit Tron lands or Valakuts is nice, but we dumpster those decks already, so it's not a big deal, but still nice to have.
The mana base is not that much worse, you play about the same number of fetchlands, you play 2 shock lands in place of Shelldocks (both enter tapped if you need to save life, thus being the same speed) and you have a basic Forest to get off Field if you want. It's a little more work and a little more pain occasionally, but the benefits outweigh the negatives in my opinion.
I hold steady that Sultai is a more robust deck with better interaction. It does play a little differently than the standard UB list that Chung has been popularizing, but I think if people give it a shot and really put in the effort, they will see the value of adding green. Of particular note right now is how little play Blood Moon is seeing, making it less of a problem to play the 3 color version.
Let me know what you think. My list is very close to this one (-4 Visions, -2 IoK, -1 Push, +3 Brutality, +1 Trophy, +1 Bridge, +1 Orb, +1 Murderous Cut) and I've been very happy. I do have the IoK on the SB. I am just more of a fan of Brutality + Bridges over Visions, in general
Trophy is the biggest draw. Unconditional removal that hits literally everything on the battlefield. Not too much out there you need Claim for that you can't already deal with, but having a couple in the board is an okay plan. If I were to consider any other green splash it would be for a Maelstrom Pulse, just for the value to hit many things at once