(and, of course, you can evoke it and bounce it with shard/portal!)
Slight nitpick, but I'd much rather just cast it and bounce it, since the trigger happens on leaving the battlefield and the evoke cost is one mana more :).
I love Reveillark as a card, but I've had some trouble putting together a good Reveillark deck - I just don't have a clear picture of what a well-balanced Lark deck with a respectable curve should look like. Not to say that my Lark decks have been all bad (they have a decent winrate), they just haven't been as extremely busted as some people's stories or my own experience with Lark in constructed. I also get the nagging feeling that the most broken things I've pulled off with Reveillark have happened in sluggish midrange matchups or games where my opponent has, for whatever reason, been just completely unable to put together a deck that's as fast and powerful as a legacy/vintage legal cube environment necessitates - not exactly situations I'd like to encourage more of. How do you people actually draft your Reveillark decks, and in what colors? I usually try WGx for the value and random Hornet Queen reanimation, WU for Venser shenanigans. It just occured to me that maybe I should try WR with Resto Angel, Kiki-Jiki, Alesha, Feldon etc.
I think we can do better than Lark though. If we have 5 lands on the field we probably don't care about recuring mana creatures. Especially since there's an abundance of great value cards at 5+ (Batterskull for instance).
Good point. I was mostly thinking about upping the amount of Duplicants and Metamorphs and maybe playing a Master of Waves (with Thirst for Knowledge to dig & bin reanimator targets), but maybe it's too cute.
I haven't tested any version of this deck yet, but it seems sweet and I'm going to build some version of it soon. I'd like to ask some of the more experienced players: many seem to run a black splash, some a full esper version. What about just a white splash for Path, some sideboard cards and Reveillark? Lark could offer recursion for the fragile combo pieces that are not artifacts and cannot be recurred with Academy Ruins or such. It could also bring back Duplicant and Metamorph. It's a nonbo with Hangarback Walker and Wurmcoil, though. The deck would probably move to a different type of grindy control deck. Would this be completely dumb or clearly inferior to the aggro/straight combo plan?
I went 3-1. I'm not gonna write much of a report, but I did run to some funny situations (mainly M2) I'd like to ask about.
M1: Ad Nauseam Unlife
2-0
First game I think he's playing some sort of budget BW tokens list, and then all of a sudden he just kills me. Check out the cards he flips, realize he hasn't got any non-black removal. Next two games gifts for Rites and Iona, gg.
M2: KCI Eggs Tron
0-2
This matchup felt miserable. Game 1 I start with a hand full of early disruption and Gifts, and die to a T4 Emrakul. I side out all of my useless Wraths and Paths and bring in the Negates etc, and once again die to an early Emmy because I simply didn't counter the right things. I had never played against this deck before or really even heard of it. I felt like it didn't even matter if I countered one KCI or whatever, he would just play Open the Vaults next turn. What is this deck's MVP and how do I disrupt their gameplan?
M3: BW Tokens
1-0, went to time.
The first game took way too long mostly due to misplays by both me and my opponent. Ended up winning by swinging with Emrakul for three times in a row at 4 life. I think this would've actually been a draw or a win for him if we'd played more quickly.
M4: Kiki Pod
2-0
I felt ridiculously confident once I knew what I ways playing against. I won Game 1 even though I made an enormous misplay by Giftsing for Elesh and Rites while he had Scooze in play and green mana open (needless to say he ate my Norn). Wrath into card draw into more Wraths into Emrakul. I felt that this line of play wouldn't be possible in Game 2, so I sided out Emrakul, Eye, some Maps and Thirts and brought in all the Twin/Pod hate and Sundering Titan. Made a misplay here, too, by slamming Gifts while he clearly had Mindcensor mana open. Won by casting a Torpor Orb he couldn't remove and attacking with Timely tokens and Colonnade.
This was my first time playing against such a wide variety of decks (been mostly playing against friends to this point). It was fun and the deck feels really powerful, but it clearly requires thinking at every step. I'm happy I bought this deck, gonna do some more testing. I'd like to thank darksteel88 for the Primer, it's been amazingly helpful.
I'm having a dilemma over which cards to choose. Ive played the Mindslaver version of this deck without Iona due to budget concerns (pretty much identical to the primer list, just with more maps) and some other brews, but now I have access to pretty much all the cards I would like to use. Now I just need to decide what to run and what to cut.
I'd like to try and play Emrakul plus Eye, so I guess that means I should drop Mindslaver as just another mana intensive wincon that demands extra slots in the deck. However, even without Mindslaver, I really like Academy Ruins in this deck because it can bring back Wurmcoils and boarded-in Sundering Titans or Engineered Explosives. Is this just too cute? Would one Eye plus one Academy within my 25 lands mean I couldn't run Supreme Verdict anymore? Also, is Snapcaster really necessary? I've never run him and never really missed him.
What would it mean for the land base or the amount of Maps if I decided to try and run both Emrakul and Mindslaver?
The Ooze Dredge Combo Primer claimed that a dredge deck shouldn't run fetchlands, because you might end up in a situation where you have a fetchland in hand all the shocks you might have fetched with it in the graveyard. Has anyone run into this problem playing this deck? I'd be intrigued to try but I really can't afford the fecthlands right now.
Honestly, at this point, flicking/bouncing mangara is awesome when it happens, but my goal to achieve anymore. Really, he's just nice to have as a monowhite vindicate to get rid of the awkward stuff and the rest is a bonus. Also, the Stonecloaker interaction is too slow imo and that's part of why I don't like him anymore. Which is also part of why I'd say I dont like the lion at all.
Agree on Mangara. I was thinking of having one bounce creature in order to help reset Finks / reuse Exarch or Spellstutter, or possibly the Splicers, if I decide to add them. I think the deck needs some way to refuel, other than a one-of Mask of Memory.
Good points on the Mindcensor, I think I'll keep him and keep testing against different decks. Adding a fourth Thalia seems like a good move too, she'll draw fire.
Finks is probably a better pick over Exarch because he's a larger creature and he sticks around.
Seems reasonable, I'll try it.
Personally, I have lost my fondness for Stonecloaker and would suggest cutting him for something else, especially in the effort to lower your curve just a bit.
How about replacing him with Whitemane Lion? And possibly ditching Mindcensor altogether, or moving him into the SB? The synchrony of Arbiter, Mindcensor, PtE and Ghost Quarter seemed really nice when I first read about it, but I usually feel Arbiter (or two) is quite enough on its own, whereas Mindcensor is a bit underwhelming, and I feel nervous playing PtE or cracking a Ghost Quarter with just him on the field. The Lion doesn't fly, though :/
Without any testing of the list, I would still say you'd be safe to switch out for 3-4 colorless lands, as 7-8 is normal for this deck even with a splash. I have personally been loving Mutavault over Tectonic, but that might be a different story here. However, I would say that Mutavault would be another fae as well. You also probably play one too many land and could stand to go down to 23.
Mutavault sounds promising, at least a lot more promising than most of the other possible faeries, plus it's "free". Will add those + Clique once I have enough cash.
And although Mangara is slow, I'd consider him in the sideboard, esp with all of the bounce effects you have.
Good point. Wouldn't removing one third of the bounce I have in the form of Stonecloakers hinder this, though?
I'm at work so this might not be optimal, but I'd say something like the following would be good:
-1 Island
-2 Plains
-1 Mystic Gate
-3 Stonecloaker
-3 Exarch
+1 Vendillion Clique
+3 Mutavault
+3 Kitchen Finks
+2 Surveilling Sprite/Oona's Gatewarden
+1 Mask of Memory
Thanks for the suggestions. I don't like Surveilling Sprite or Gatewarden (no flash), I guess I'll have to test with the additional Clique and Mutavaults before considering ditching the faeries altogether.
Wow, my first post here. A little background: I started playing MtG in 2011, got interested in Modern, gathered a bunch of staple U/W cards, got tired of playing Affinity/Tempered Steel, found this primer and loved it. I thought the Blue splash seemed interesting, because I seem to like control and because I already had the cards. That said, I'm pretty much a newb, but eager to learn.
As noted in the first post, Mangara doesn't feel quite fast enough, but the sample WU decklist still has him and many cards that seem to revolve around him. As this thread is over a 100 pages long (making searching for discussions about the WU variant hard) and to me, it seems that things change pretty fast, I don't really know what to do with my deck. I've been toying around with this build for a while:
I used to have actual counterspells, Oblivion Ring and even Day of Judgment at some point, but then came Thalia. From there, I tried to put as much as I could on legs. Gideon's Lawkeeper felt nice at first, but has often just let me down. Maybe I should give him more chances, but right now I feel I'd rather have a 1cmc bounce (Vapor Snag) than a 1cmc 1/1 that taps dudes.
To my surprise, Stonecloaker actually feels pretty good, helping me reuse my Exarchs and Spellstutter Sprites, though I wonder if I should replace them with Pestermites in order to help the Spellstutters. My experience thus far tells me I'd rather be doing more damage in the air (and recasting the Spellstutters as chumps if not else) than countering one more spell.
My sideboard would most likely have at least the following:
-Oblivion Ring to replace Thalia, if I really, really need to get rid of enchantments or planeswalkers.
-Cursecatcher, anyone, maybe? It's a 1-drop, it slows down their Bolts etc, can be vialed in, and it's even more fun with Thalia.
-Surgical Extraction - just a wild idea, saw an MTGO match where someone destroyed Tron with land destruction and this.
Any help, general suggestions or even dramatic changes to the deck are welcome. I haven't had the chance yet to play this against Pod, Tron or anything like that (my Modern-oriented friends play all kinds of annoying B/U/G control decks). Should I go back to using Mangara, backed up with the counterspells-on-sticks and whatnot? I feel that adding more colorless lands (Tec Edge) would hurt me, is this just an illusion? Should I give up on the dream of only using creatures with fun little abilities and by some Serra Avengers and Students of Warfare?
Oh, and thanks for the Primer. Reading this thread has been really inspiring.
Slight nitpick, but I'd much rather just cast it and bounce it, since the trigger happens on leaving the battlefield and the evoke cost is one mana more :).
I love Reveillark as a card, but I've had some trouble putting together a good Reveillark deck - I just don't have a clear picture of what a well-balanced Lark deck with a respectable curve should look like. Not to say that my Lark decks have been all bad (they have a decent winrate), they just haven't been as extremely busted as some people's stories or my own experience with Lark in constructed. I also get the nagging feeling that the most broken things I've pulled off with Reveillark have happened in sluggish midrange matchups or games where my opponent has, for whatever reason, been just completely unable to put together a deck that's as fast and powerful as a legacy/vintage legal cube environment necessitates - not exactly situations I'd like to encourage more of. How do you people actually draft your Reveillark decks, and in what colors? I usually try WGx for the value and random Hornet Queen reanimation, WU for Venser shenanigans. It just occured to me that maybe I should try WR with Resto Angel, Kiki-Jiki, Alesha, Feldon etc.
Good point. I was mostly thinking about upping the amount of Duplicants and Metamorphs and maybe playing a Master of Waves (with Thirst for Knowledge to dig & bin reanimator targets), but maybe it's too cute.
4 Urza’s Mine
4 Urza’s Power Plant
4 Urza’s Tower
4 Celestial Colonnade
2 Seachrome Coast
4 Hallowed Fountain
1 Island
1 Plains
1 Eye of Ugin
Creatures: 4
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Wurmcoil Engine
3 Expedition Map
4 Azorius Signet
Instants: 19
4 Gifts Ungiven
4 Thirst for Knowledge
4 Remand
4 Path to Exile
2 Condescend
1 Sphinx’s Revelation
Sorceries: 5
1 Wrath of God
1 Day of Judgment
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Unburial Rites
1 Timely Reinforcements
2 Timely Reinforcements
1 Celestial Purge
1 Disenchant
1 Ghostly Prison
1 Suppression Field
1 Torpor Orb
1 Rule of Law
3 Negate
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Spellskite
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Sundering Titan
I went 3-1. I'm not gonna write much of a report, but I did run to some funny situations (mainly M2) I'd like to ask about.
M1: Ad Nauseam Unlife
2-0
First game I think he's playing some sort of budget BW tokens list, and then all of a sudden he just kills me. Check out the cards he flips, realize he hasn't got any non-black removal. Next two games gifts for Rites and Iona, gg.
M2: KCI Eggs Tron
0-2
This matchup felt miserable. Game 1 I start with a hand full of early disruption and Gifts, and die to a T4 Emrakul. I side out all of my useless Wraths and Paths and bring in the Negates etc, and once again die to an early Emmy because I simply didn't counter the right things. I had never played against this deck before or really even heard of it. I felt like it didn't even matter if I countered one KCI or whatever, he would just play Open the Vaults next turn. What is this deck's MVP and how do I disrupt their gameplan?
M3: BW Tokens
1-0, went to time.
The first game took way too long mostly due to misplays by both me and my opponent. Ended up winning by swinging with Emrakul for three times in a row at 4 life. I think this would've actually been a draw or a win for him if we'd played more quickly.
M4: Kiki Pod
2-0
I felt ridiculously confident once I knew what I ways playing against. I won Game 1 even though I made an enormous misplay by Giftsing for Elesh and Rites while he had Scooze in play and green mana open (needless to say he ate my Norn). Wrath into card draw into more Wraths into Emrakul. I felt that this line of play wouldn't be possible in Game 2, so I sided out Emrakul, Eye, some Maps and Thirts and brought in all the Twin/Pod hate and Sundering Titan. Made a misplay here, too, by slamming Gifts while he clearly had Mindcensor mana open. Won by casting a Torpor Orb he couldn't remove and attacking with Timely tokens and Colonnade.
This was my first time playing against such a wide variety of decks (been mostly playing against friends to this point). It was fun and the deck feels really powerful, but it clearly requires thinking at every step. I'm happy I bought this deck, gonna do some more testing. I'd like to thank darksteel88 for the Primer, it's been amazingly helpful.
I'd like to try and play Emrakul plus Eye, so I guess that means I should drop Mindslaver as just another mana intensive wincon that demands extra slots in the deck. However, even without Mindslaver, I really like Academy Ruins in this deck because it can bring back Wurmcoils and boarded-in Sundering Titans or Engineered Explosives. Is this just too cute? Would one Eye plus one Academy within my 25 lands mean I couldn't run Supreme Verdict anymore? Also, is Snapcaster really necessary? I've never run him and never really missed him.
What would it mean for the land base or the amount of Maps if I decided to try and run both Emrakul and Mindslaver?
4x Vexing Devil
4x Spark Elemental
4x Lightning Serpent
3x Ranger of Eos
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Faithless Looting
4x Proclamation of Rebirth
3x Immortal Servitude
Could it work? Might it work?
Agree on Mangara. I was thinking of having one bounce creature in order to help reset Finks / reuse Exarch or Spellstutter, or possibly the Splicers, if I decide to add them. I think the deck needs some way to refuel, other than a one-of Mask of Memory.
Good points on the Mindcensor, I think I'll keep him and keep testing against different decks. Adding a fourth Thalia seems like a good move too, she'll draw fire.
Seems reasonable, I'll try it.
How about replacing him with Whitemane Lion? And possibly ditching Mindcensor altogether, or moving him into the SB? The synchrony of Arbiter, Mindcensor, PtE and Ghost Quarter seemed really nice when I first read about it, but I usually feel Arbiter (or two) is quite enough on its own, whereas Mindcensor is a bit underwhelming, and I feel nervous playing PtE or cracking a Ghost Quarter with just him on the field. The Lion doesn't fly, though :/
Mutavault sounds promising, at least a lot more promising than most of the other possible faeries, plus it's "free". Will add those + Clique once I have enough cash.
Good point. Wouldn't removing one third of the bounce I have in the form of Stonecloakers hinder this, though?
Thanks for the suggestions. I don't like Surveilling Sprite or Gatewarden (no flash), I guess I'll have to test with the additional Clique and Mutavaults before considering ditching the faeries altogether.
As noted in the first post, Mangara doesn't feel quite fast enough, but the sample WU decklist still has him and many cards that seem to revolve around him. As this thread is over a 100 pages long (making searching for discussions about the WU variant hard) and to me, it seems that things change pretty fast, I don't really know what to do with my deck. I've been toying around with this build for a while:
4x Æther Vial
4x Path to Exile
4x Vapor Snag
Creatures
3x Inquisitor Exarch
3x Stonecloaker
3x Aven Mindcensor
4x Spellstutter Sprite
1x Vendilion Clique
4x Flickerwisp
4x Leonin Arbiter
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1x Eiganjo Castle
1x Minamo, School at Water's Edge
4x Mystic Gate
3x Seachrome Coast
8x Plains
3x Island
4x Ghost Quarter
I used to have actual counterspells, Oblivion Ring and even Day of Judgment at some point, but then came Thalia. From there, I tried to put as much as I could on legs. Gideon's Lawkeeper felt nice at first, but has often just let me down. Maybe I should give him more chances, but right now I feel I'd rather have a 1cmc bounce (Vapor Snag) than a 1cmc 1/1 that taps dudes.
To my surprise, Stonecloaker actually feels pretty good, helping me reuse my Exarchs and Spellstutter Sprites, though I wonder if I should replace them with Pestermites in order to help the Spellstutters. My experience thus far tells me I'd rather be doing more damage in the air (and recasting the Spellstutters as chumps if not else) than countering one more spell.
My sideboard would most likely have at least the following:
Possible SB cards I've been thinking about:
-Oblivion Ring to replace Thalia, if I really, really need to get rid of enchantments or planeswalkers.
-Cursecatcher, anyone, maybe? It's a 1-drop, it slows down their Bolts etc, can be vialed in, and it's even more fun with Thalia.
-Surgical Extraction - just a wild idea, saw an MTGO match where someone destroyed Tron with land destruction and this.
Any help, general suggestions or even dramatic changes to the deck are welcome. I haven't had the chance yet to play this against Pod, Tron or anything like that (my Modern-oriented friends play all kinds of annoying B/U/G control decks). Should I go back to using Mangara, backed up with the counterspells-on-sticks and whatnot? I feel that adding more colorless lands (Tec Edge) would hurt me, is this just an illusion? Should I give up on the dream of only using creatures with fun little abilities and by some Serra Avengers and Students of Warfare?
Oh, and thanks for the Primer. Reading this thread has been really inspiring.